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Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / October 2004Which imaging software is best at converting x-ray films?
One more question about moving to digital x-ray. TigerView provides something called "Intelligent Scanning technology" to save a lot of hard work in scanning the films. Before I talk to the salesperson, does anyone have any experience with that? How do you convert the old x-ray films into digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. Where does the hard work come in? You just scan it on a flat bed scanner with a built in light source in the lid. If you pre-view prior to final scan, you can adjust brightness and contrast to make the image even better. It is no big deal. Don't buy any special software for this. Invest the money in a good scanner instead.  Signature~+--~+--~+--~+--~+-- Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S. Troy, Michigan, USA .................................................... This posting is intended for informational or conversational purposes only. Always seek the opinion of a licensed dental professional before acting on the advice or opinion expressed here. Only a dentist who has examined you in person can diagnose your problems and make decisions which will affect your health. ...................... > One more question about moving to digital x-ray. TigerView provides > something called "Intelligent Scanning technology" to save a lot of hard > work in scanning the films. Before I talk to the salesperson, does anyone > have any experience with that? How do you convert the old x-ray films into > digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. er......... Buy a good scanner and then buy my software - for best results! Heh ;) > Where does the hard work come in? > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >> into >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. Erm if you buy a good scanner intended for x-rays etc the software comes with it FREE. LOL > er......... Buy a good scanner and then buy my software - for best results! > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > >> into > >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. Nothing is free friend. Does yours come with real-time 3d X-ray rendering, Patient database, Intra Oral Imaging & Movie Clips and 16 X-Ray enhancement tools and an annotation suite? Possibly not. > Erm if you buy a good scanner intended for x-rays etc the software comes > with it FREE. LOL [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] >> >> into >> >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. Oh - and a site licence for 4 systems I would tell you what its called but it would only upset the Eaglesoft Posse ;) > Nothing is free friend. > [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] >>> >> into >>> >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. VCSM Signature~+--~+--~+--~+--~+-- Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S. Troy, Michigan, USA .................................................... This posting is intended for insulting purposes only. . ...................... > Oh - and a site licence for 4 systems > [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] >>>> >> into >>>> >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. >Oh - and a site licence for 4 systems > >I would tell you what its called but it would only upset the Eaglesoft Posse >;) Since it's from Patterson, consider it a Stinky Posse. >> Nothing is free friend. >> [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] >>>> >> into >>>> >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. -- W_B Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Mines nothing to do with Eaglesoft or Patterson. Its more an English Rose Posey >>Oh - and a site licence for 4 systems >> [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] > Take out the G'RBAGE > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > Oh - and a site licence for 4 systems What's a license? You mean the reg code? Just "borrow" one LOL > I would tell you what its called but it would only upset the Eaglesoft Posse > ;) [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > >>> >> into > >>> >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. Yes Shyster.............. I am sure that public advocating theft has does lots to enhance the professional standing of Dentists. I have met thieving dentists before (and honest ones). I find stolen copies of windows & office in many surgeries that I visit. Made me giggle when I got a rash of calls from surgeries when XP SP2 came out and lots of the cracked copies of XP stopped working. Did they want advice or to buy legitimate copies? No they wanted working cracks. Heh. However, to date, no cracks or serials have been successful on the current generation of my software. It is tied right into the machine and network and mutates every few days. I do hope that someone steals an expensive course of treatment from you by stolen credit card - its the same - Theft. (Not really but I was making a point) >> Oh - and a site licence for 4 systems > [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] >> >>> >> into >> >>> >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. I agree with Steve. A good scanner will last through repeated cycles and comes with scanning software that should make transparency scanning relatively easy. And you don't have to set the resolution to any super-high level to get scans good enough to archive. You can even get good digitalization of current xray films just by using an ordinary digital camera. I have had excellent results with a simple 5MP, off-the-shelf consumer-level still camera. Just put the films on a light box and shoot the picture. (The dentist who gave me this idea scotch-tapes the xray film to an office window instead of using the xray film viewer. No kidding!) Here's a sample of what I take with the ordinary consumer-style camera. This picture is downsized for posting on the net . . . the original has much higher resolution. Cut and paste this into your browser: http://tinypic.com/bha9c - dentaldoc > Where does the hard work come in? > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > have any experience with that? How do you convert the old x-ray films into > > digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. Good job! Joel >I agree with Steve. A good scanner will last through repeated cycles >and comes with scanning software that should make transparency [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] >> > have any experience with that? How do you convert the old x-ray films into >> > digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. These answers are all very interesting............... BUT They did not answer the question in the topic did they? > Good job! > [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] >>> > into >>> > digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. >These answers are all very interesting............... BUT > >They did not answer the question in the topic did they? DID THEY what??? Joel >> Good job! >> [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] >>>> > into >>>> > digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. > These answers are all very interesting............... BUT > > They did not answer the question in the topic did they? Let's see: "How do you convert the old x-ray films into digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help." I would have to conclude that information on digitizing existing xray films by using a digital camera, and another writer's recommendation of a good scanner, do indeed answer the question. Thanks, -dentaldoc > > Good job! > > [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > >>> > into > >>> > digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. Easy isn't it? Signature~+--~+--~+--~+--~+-- Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S. Troy, Michigan, USA .................................................... This posting is intended for informational or conversational purposes only. Always seek the opinion of a licensed dental professional before acting on the advice or opinion expressed here. Only a dentist who has examined you in person can diagnose your problems and make decisions which will affect your health. ...................... >I agree with Steve. A good scanner will last through repeated cycles > and comes with scanning software that should make transparency [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] >> > into >> > digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. > Here's a sample of what I take with the ordinary consumer-style > camera. This picture is downsized for posting on the net . . . the > original has much higher resolution. All the jpg's I've posted here have been done in exactly this way. It does help to have a close-up lens, as you can really fill up the picture space in the shot. My chip is only 1.2 Mp.... I can really see the difference. Good job. SP SignatureNot a real Addy, yet > > Here's a sample of what I take with the ordinary consumer-style > > camera. This picture is downsized for posting on the net . . . the [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Good job. > SP Thanks. Actually 1.2MP can be enough, depending on how much detail you want and what file size you want. Often I cut the file size down to far less than 1.2MP anyway. However, starting with the larger file sizes can give you more flexibility in adjusting the image. I'm glad you mentioned the close-up lens. That will greatly affect what you can do with a digital camera. Most of the newer models have built-in close-up capability. My camera was brand new in October 2003, which means it's an "older" camera now! I was so pleased with its close-up capability that I bought another of the same model on eBay -- for only about $95. It works great. For speed, and for volume, if you're trying to convert a lot of films to digital with excellent quality, Steve's suggestion of a good scanner is the best method of large-scale conversion. -dentaldoc >> Here's a sample of what I take with the ordinary consumer-style >> camera. This picture is downsized for posting on the net . . . the [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >Good job. >SP My digital camera has a 'macro' mode. 5.0Mp -- W_B Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > My digital camera has a 'macro' mode. > 5.0Mp > -- > > W_B Uh huh... 'cept YOU don't need much of a digital camera, as you already have an IntraOral camera. I'm doing double duty with my digital camera plugged into a small TV. Still, the image is good enough to show the patient details of the mouth and enlargements of his B/W's. essSPeee SignatureNot a real Addy, yet >> My digital camera has a 'macro' mode. >> 5.0Mp [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >patient details of the mouth and enlargements of his B/W's. >essSPeee I can't take stills with my I/O camera and GD Patterson will not come to fix it. PDCO sucks. I don't care what Mancuso says. Willing to bet their software is as crappy as their service. </rant> -- W_B wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Take out the G'RBAGE > I can't take stills with my I/O camera and GD Patterson will not come > to fix it. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > </rant> I think you have every right to rant about shitty service. I feel the same way about the local Ash-Temple jerks who sold me the Laser (though I'm not forgetting that I'm the jerk who bought it...). OTOH, Roy gets a good deal with his rep from them up the T.O. way... As DrSteve said: his rep is really out of the ordinary... That is why he stays with them. I don't know, but I think that is more important than the actual company. WRT your I/O camera: One of the guys up here told me I should take the Laser with the Ash/Temple logo on it and send it out into the waiting room... That would create a buzz... You might want to try that... Another thing: any independant technicians in your area? That'll fix Patterson's a.s good... 'specially if you send them the bill... Just an idea... SP SignatureNot a real Addy, yet I don't really get good deals, I get taken care of. Asking for a new rep because you would prefer not to deal with your current one goes a long way in getting attention. SignatureRoy DotSeaEh is .ca . OTOH, Roy gets a | good deal with his rep from them up the T.O. way... | SP Have you taken the problem to the district manager? Signature~+--~+--~+--~+--~+-- Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S. Troy, Michigan, USA .................................................... This posting is intended for informational or conversational purposes only. Always seek the opinion of a licensed dental professional before acting on the advice or opinion expressed here. Only a dentist who has examined you in person can diagnose your problems and make decisions which will affect your health. ...................... > >>> My digital camera has a 'macro' mode. [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > Take out the G'RBAGE >Have you taken the problem to the district manager? Yes I talked to that MF on the phone. All they want is money and do not provide any service. If you can correct this situation, I would be indebted to you. PDCO is angry with me and the feeling is more than mutual. Perhaps you can do something that would correct this situation. Patiently waiting, -- W_B wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Take out the G'RBAGE Send me an email with the particulars and the name of the person you dealt with. I can pass it on to the district manager over here. Hopefully, he will run it through the channels. I am going to a CEREC owners' dinner Thursday, and he will be there. Steverino >>Have you taken the problem to the district manager? > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > >Patiently waiting, >> My digital camera has a 'macro' mode. Excellent for taking pictures of MACROni n' cheeze ...... >> 5.0Mp >> -- [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >patient details of the mouth and enlargements of his B/W's. >essSPeee My software (KI-Lite and all versions upwards) is optimised for intraoral camera with X-Ray Lots of noise comes from the fluorescent lamps in the lightbox - and from the camera sensor. I made it strip to Grayscale and do a significant noise reduction on it by multisampling the XRAY film Reduces noise 9:1 This is all automatic. You can download a trial and try it for free. Be my Guest John Chewter www.keyneimage.co.uk >>> My digital camera has a 'macro' mode. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >>patient details of the mouth and enlargements of his B/W's. >>essSPeee I appreciate your offer, however my I/O is not hooked to a computer. It is wired directly to a television monitor. S-video and composite outputs are available. My statement stands: "Patterson Dental Company sucks [insert profane target here]" Will D/L and check it out, maybe Tues. next week. >My software (KI-Lite and all versions upwards) is optimised for intraoral >camera with X-Ray [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] >>>patient details of the mouth and enlargements of his B/W's. >>>essSPeee -- W_B wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Take out the G'RBAGE If the camera has an X-ray Attachment that will help steady the camera and reduce external light problems > I appreciate your offer, however my I/O is not hooked to a computer. > It is wired directly to a television monitor. [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com > Take out the G'RBAGE > If the camera has an X-ray Attachment that will help steady the camera and > reduce external light problems What is meant by an xray attachment? 10-Q SP SignatureNot a real Addy, yet Some intra-oral cameras (eg SpectraVU) come with an attachment that slides over the tip of the camera. It is like a black plastic hood You put your x-ray on a lightbox and the camera with attachment over it. It ensures that the camera is perpendicular to the film, held steady and cuts out reflections and incident light from the room. I usually find these in a cupboard somewhere because the dentist forgot that one was shipped with the camera. You might have one. >> If the camera has an X-ray Attachment that will help steady the camera >> and [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > 10-Q > SP > I usually find these in a cupboard somewhere because the dentist forgot that > one was shipped with the camera. > > You might have one. OK, thanks, I'll remember that... No I don't have one b/cs I don't have an I/O camera. SP SignatureNot a real Addy, yet > My software (KI-Lite and all versions upwards) is optimised for intraoral > camera with X-Ray [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > John Chewter www.keyneimage.co.uk 10-Q John, but it won't work on a Mac, unless I'm missing something. If I might suggest: if you can port your stuff to a UNIX platform, the Mac cats running OS X (ten) will be able to run it. This is because MacOS X is a true UNIX OS. I'm still on MacOS 9, so for me it's knackered from the start. Cheers SP SignatureNot a real Addy, yet This is correct. - my software will not work on a MAC because it is DirectX based. I have no plans to port it to Mac/Unix/Linux. largely because of the poor 3D support (compared with DirectX9) which I use in the X-ray analysis part of my software suite. When OpenGL2 has got its act together it may be a different story. In the UK I have seen no Macs in surgery use, whatsoever. >> My software (KI-Lite and all versions upwards) is optimised for intraoral >> camera with X-Ray [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > Cheers > SP > This is correct. - my software will not work on a MAC because it is DirectX > based. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > In the UK I have seen no Macs in surgery use, whatsoever. OK, got it... thanks SP SignatureNot a real Addy, yet >> This is correct. - my software will not work on a MAC because it is DirectX >> based. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >OK, got it... thanks >SP Yep, Mac's suck. Crapintosh. -- W_B Take out the G'RBAGE wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com >>> My digital camera has a 'macro' mode. > >Excellent for taking pictures of MACROni n' cheeze ...... It actually makes it while you wait. Darn, those manufacturers are brilliant ! -- W_B wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Take out the G'RBAGE > It actually makes it while you wait. > Darn, those manufacturers are brilliant ! > > -- > W_B Do you have any Am sauce with that?...... ;-) SP SignatureNot a real Addy, yet Thanks for all the great input! I know need you guys' expert opinions before I buy in their sales pitch! I was talking about the technology mentioned in the following link. TigerView is able to automatically cut the x-ray films out of a big scan and adjust their orientations. Is it a big deal to you? So you just scan a group of x-ray films and view them as a big image? http://www.televere.com/ist.htm > One more question about moving to digital x-ray. TigerView provides > something called "Intelligent Scanning technology" to save a lot of hard > work in scanning the films. Before I talk to the salesperson, does anyone > have any experience with that? How do you convert the old x-ray films into > digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. >Thanks for all the great input! I know need you guys' expert opinions before >I buy in their sales pitch! I was talking about the technology mentioned in >the following link. TigerView is able to automatically cut the x-ray films >out of a big scan and adjust their orientations. Is it a big deal to you? So >you just scan a group of x-ray films and view them as a big image? QUESTION: Wouldn't that be around one billion Mb filesize? Joel >http://www.televere.com/ist.htm > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> have any experience with that? How do you convert the old x-ray films into >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. The software which comes with your scanner should be able to that. [FREE with purchase of scanner]. Looking at the web-site you provided the link to....... quickly,,,,,, what goof would place a bunch of film on a scanner like that picture? One would often just leave them in the mounts out of laziness. I find that reduces image size ever so slightly, so I always take the film out of the mounts prior to scanning. HOWEVER, it is not hard to line up the film against the upper part of the glass plate so they are all straight and plumb. Whoever does the scanning has to be smart enough to place them on the glass with the raised dot facing down. How much more effort is involved to push the film together and against the edge of the glass so they are straight and you can scan them as one image? Just crop to size with your TWAIN software. As far as setting contrast,,,,,, a good TWAIN program will have an automatic setting which optimizes these settings for you each time. Once in a while you will have a film which is too dark or too light, and then you must do it manually. That would be the case (probably) even with Tiger's stuff. The process of scanning 18 film (same patient, same date) takes about 2 minutes tops. Tiger is just being a "salesman". Got to go bond some porcelain, post back with any questions. Signature~+--~+--~+--~+--~+-- Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S. Troy, Michigan, USA .................................................... This posting is intended for informational or conversational purposes only. Always seek the opinion of a licensed dental professional before acting on the advice or opinion expressed here. Only a dentist who has examined you in person can diagnose your problems and make decisions which will affect your health. ...................... > Thanks for all the great input! I know need you guys' expert opinions > before [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >> into >> digital images? What would you recommend? Thanks for your help. |
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