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Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / March 2009

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Need dental advice

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Jim - 28 Mar 2009 21:32 GMT
My sister asked me this and I told her I'd post it here for your
feedback. It's a bit long but I am not going to edit her words.
F.Y.I.: She's 30 y.o..She said this is about the "very last tooth on
the bottom right" so I assume she means #32 unless she has had that
extracted already but I don't think so. In any case, it's now her last
tooth on the bottom right.
Thanks in advance for reading and replying:

"Over a year ago on one of my dental checkups, they noticed that the
gum on one of my teeth is way worse than all the rest of my gums. Mine
all run anywhere from 2mm to 4mm, sometimes 5 or 6 if I have a
flareup.  But this one tooth, they measured as a 9 mm pocket!  And it
happens to be the tooth that i had my first root canal on, about ten
years ago now.  The dentist wanted me to go back to the root canal
guy, to see if perhaps the root filling had become damaged/cracked
etc.  Apparently that could somehow cause your gum to be bad on that
tooth?

But I hate having my teeth worked on. So I put off making the
appointment through 3 more dentists checkups.  I FINALLY made the
appointment and went on Wednesday...

Apparently, I have carried a SLIGHT infection in that tooth ever since
the root canal! Ten years ago!! As in, the root was badly infected
which was what caused me to need the root canal in the first place.
And it just never completely healed up.  So not only has the constant
infection caused me to have a minor amount of bone loss in my jaw in
that immediate area, but it has caused the gum to stay flared up and
the pocket to grow continually larger, since it's working as a
"release" for the mucus etc to come out.

So I was told that I have 2 choices:
1) get the tooth pulled.
My first question to that was, is it going to change my bite down the
road if I get it pulled?  He said no, MOST likely not, because the
tooth in question is the VERY LAST tooth on the bottom right.  He said
that the other teeth should not drift back, and that if anything it
would feel weird only because the top tooth would no longer have
anything to hit against.  He said if it bothered me a lot, I could get
an implant.
My second question was, if the tooth is pulled, is there a guarantee
the infection would go away?  He said absolutely yes.  He said once
the root is gone, after a round or two of antibiotics it would go away
because the root is the cause of all evil. (haha ;-)

Or 2) Try another root canal.  They would remove the top filling, and
then go down into the root and remove all of the root filler.  Then
load me up on antibiotics and see if the infection went away.  It
might go away, and it might not.  He said if it didn't, then I would
have to have teh tooth pulled anyway.  And that they wouldn't charge
for the full root canal, only $250 for the first part of it.  He also
said that first time root canals have about a 90% chance of success.
Second time ones drop down to about 60%.  Not to mention that this
root is particularly difficult anyway, one of them is like a perfectly
shaped backwards "c"...which is why my dentist sent me to this
specialist to begin with.

AND, there's more!  The tooth right in front of this tooth in question
has a very large filling, and this dentist found a hairline crack in
it.  He said it HAS to be crowned, or else I am going to eventually
need a root canal in it too!  :(

The way I read my insurance.... they will pay 50% of whatever I have
done AFTER I meet my $1000 deductible!  Which just sounds insane, and
I need to look into it before I make my final decision.

But at this point, I just really don't know what to do.  Either way is
going to be time consuming and painful, and expensive.  Obviously my
first inclination is to save the tooth.  But if I still have an
infection after THIS long, I kind of think the odds of it going away
now are pretty slim.

So I'm open to any advice you have..."

So she wanted my feedback. I told her I'd probably pull the tooth
since it is way back in the back. When I got implants my dentists told
me I didn't really "need" a tooth way back there.

But as I told her, I am not a dentist. ;-) So I will refer the
question to my friendly dental usenet group. Thanks for all opinions.
Disclaimer: We fully realize you cannot accurately diagnose via
internet, so your "best guess" is okay and any further comments or
questions are welcome.
tenthmed - 28 Mar 2009 22:23 GMT
> My sister asked me this and I told her I'd post it here for your
> feedback. It's a bit long but I am not going to edit her words.
[quoted text clipped - 79 lines]
> internet, so your "best guess" is okay and any further comments or
> questions are welcome.

Well we still don't know if it is indeed #32. Seems unlikely that
anyone would try root canal treatment on a wisdom tooth. A 10mm
probing depth, in only one part of a root canal tooth, is usually
indicative of a non-treatable root fracture. In any event, this is an
endo/perio lesion. If the root is not fractured, then if it has been
contaminated for a long period of time due to a failing root canal
treatment, even if the endo treatment is re-done, it is extremely
unlikely that the 10mm probing depth will heal even with heroic
periodontal treatment. If it were my tooth, I'd invest in an implant
rather than chasing butterflies.
JuanAdams - 28 Mar 2009 23:03 GMT
> > My sister asked me this and I told her I'd post it here for your
> > feedback. It's a bit long but I am not going to edit her words.
[quoted text clipped - 90 lines]
> periodontal treatment. If it were my tooth, I'd invest in an implant
> rather than chasing butterflies.

Hi, thanks for the response.
Here's a follow up question:

Let's assume it's #31 for now. (I have sent the question to my sister
and will confirm but I do think it's #31 now that I think about it.)
Being that it is the last tooth on the bottom, is an implant
NECESSARY? (She doesn't really have the money to afford one.)  Can she
just get it pulled and NOT replace it? If not getting an implant is
very bad, then I'm sure she can borrow the money, but she'd surely
rather not get one unless it's really really important.
tenthmed - 29 Mar 2009 14:57 GMT
> > > My sister asked me this and I told her I'd post it here for your
> > > feedback. It's a bit long but I am not going to edit her words.
[quoted text clipped - 101 lines]
> very bad, then I'm sure she can borrow the money, but she'd surely
> rather not get one unless it's really really important.

To be honest, in a dental "triage" situation, when  #30 is present and
#31 needs root canal treatment, the patient has finance constraints,
and there are other dental issues that need to be addressed on teeth
other than second molars, many times, in looking at the "whole"
patient and the prognosis of the remaining teeth,  the second molar
has to be sacrificed and not replaced.  As far as implants are
concerned, I always urge the patient to have a first molar, like #30
replaced, but only will recommend a second molar implant if the
patient absolutely feels a need to have the second molar replaced. In
most situations, we want to salvage a 1st molar occlusion. Having a
second molar occlusion is, of course, ideal, however in the real world
there usually has to be a compromise. So if this tooth is #31 and #30
is missing, I would place an implant in the #30 area and remove #31.
If this tooth is #32, then extract it and, if  #30  and #31 are
missing, place an implant in #30 position.
Amatus Cremona - 29 Mar 2009 17:08 GMT
She most likely will need one extraction, one crown (or onlay) and and
TI  --- ASAP.

On Mar 28, 6:03 pm, JuanAdams <jimso...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Mar 28, 1:23 pm, tenthmed <tenth...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 105 lines]
> very bad, then I'm sure she can borrow the money, but she'd surely
> rather not get one unless it's really really important.

To be honest, in a dental "triage" situation, when  #30 is present and
#31 needs root canal treatment, the patient has finance constraints,
and there are other dental issues that need to be addressed on teeth
other than second molars, many times, in looking at the "whole"
patient and the prognosis of the remaining teeth,  the second molar
has to be sacrificed and not replaced.  As far as implants are
concerned, I always urge the patient to have a first molar, like #30
replaced, but only will recommend a second molar implant if the
patient absolutely feels a need to have the second molar replaced. In
most situations, we want to salvage a 1st molar occlusion. Having a
second molar occlusion is, of course, ideal, however in the real world
there usually has to be a compromise. So if this tooth is #31 and #30
is missing, I would place an implant in the #30 area and remove #31.
If this tooth is #32, then extract it and, if  #30  and #31 are
missing, place an implant in #30 position.
JuanAdams - 30 Mar 2009 00:02 GMT
> She most likely will need one extraction, one crown (or onlay) and and
> TI  --- ASAP.
[quoted text clipped - 126 lines]
> If this tooth is #32, then extract it and, if  #30  and #31 are
> missing, place an implant in #30 position.

Thanks for this, tenthmed.
Yes, it is #31, not #32 that needs pulling or fixing, And 30 is in
fine shape. I checked that with my sister.

So, then, in this triage mindset, with financial restraints, you would
probably recommend that she go ahead and have #31 pulled and not
replace it with an implant, just leave it missing. Right?

Thanks for your - and all others' - replies!
tenthmed - 30 Mar 2009 01:05 GMT
> > She most likely will need one extraction, one crown (or onlay) and and
> > TI  --- ASAP.
[quoted text clipped - 139 lines]
>
> Thanks for your - and all others' - replies!

Genau.
JuanAdams - 30 Mar 2009 06:09 GMT
> Genau.

Eh? What is Genau?
JuanAdams - 30 Mar 2009 09:16 GMT
> > Genau.
>
> Eh? What is Genau?

Means "Right!"?
WDYJSS!?
JuanAdams - 30 Mar 2009 00:03 GMT
> She most likely will need one extraction, one crown (or onlay) and and
> TI  --- ASAP.
Amatus, what does TI mean? Tooth implant?

So do you think it is absolutely necessary to replace #31 with an
implant, or can she do fine with no tooth in that space?
Amatus Cremona - 30 Mar 2009 00:52 GMT
Typo

Should have been "NTI"

Signature

/

Amatus

/

On Mar 29, 8:08 am, "Amatus Cremona" <Mic...@sottovoce.net> wrote:
> She most likely will need one extraction, one crown (or onlay) and and
> TI --- ASAP.
Amatus, what does TI mean? Tooth implant?

So do you think it is absolutely necessary to replace #31 with an
implant, or can she do fine with no tooth in that space?
Tin@ - 29 Mar 2009 00:51 GMT
> My sister asked me this and I told her I'd post it here for your
> feedback. It's a bit long but I am not going to edit her words.
[quoted text clipped - 79 lines]
> internet, so your "best guess" is okay and any further comments or
> questions are welcome.

$1000 deductible doesn't sound right.  A lot of plans have a $1000
max, but I have never, in my 14 years in the field seen a $1000
deductible.
 
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