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Medical Forum / General / Dentistry / July 2008NTI continued
Well, the MRI i had last week didnt show any abnormalities, at least according to the patient scheduler at a neurologist office. Does that conclusively rule out tmj, or is all the popping, grating and pain all bruxism related,and are there other studies I should be having that might reveal something that the MRI could possibly miss? Or, do I just take this as concrete against a tmj problem and try to relax. Sheesh, now im really feeling like a nut. As has been mentioned on the ng for years, "TMJ" is simply the abbreviation for the temporo-mandibular joint. *Most* people have two of their own <sorry Webby>. Problems with the TMJs has been tossed into a naming game TMJD (TMJ dysfunction), TMJS (TMJ syndrome), or just I have TMJ. Anyway, the MRI just shows (but not proves) that the structures of the joint look pretty normal. This gives more credence to the idea that your symptoms are based mainly in the parafunctional activity area, and not joint derangement. I'd be experimenting with some different vertical openings with the NTI, but Jim is *the* NTI expert and it would be pretty silly for me to second guess what he's doing. D > Well, the MRI i had last week didnt show any abnormalities, at least > according to the patient scheduler [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > MRI could possibly miss? Or, do I just take this as concrete against a > tmj problem and try to relax. Sheesh, now im really feeling like a nut. > As has been mentioned on the ng for years, "TMJ" is simply the > abbreviation for the temporo-mandibular joint. *Most* people > have two of their own <sorry Webby>. Yes, well I have a couple of "my own" and they cost a whole bunch of money amongst a whole bunch of other "stuff". Just hope they don't "fail me" before I'm finished with this body. Thanks for offering this post. I knew it needed to be written but I didn't want to be the one to do it. Webby > Problems with the TMJs has been tossed into a naming game TMJD > (TMJ dysfunction), TMJS (TMJ syndrome), or just I have TMJ. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > MRI could possibly miss? Or, do I just take this as concrete against a > > tmj problem and try to relax. Sheesh, now im really feeling like a nut. > As has been mentioned on the ng for years, "TMJ" is simply the > abbreviation for the temporo-mandibular joint. *Most* people [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > MRI could possibly miss? Or, do I just take this as concrete against a > > tmj problem and try to relax. Sheesh, now im really feeling like a nut. I'm sorry for using the Tmj misnomer; I didn't realize it was so offensive or irritating(im just a patient). I wasn't offended. Just offering a little educational material along the way. :-) D >>As has been mentioned on the ng for years, "TMJ" is simply the >>abbreviation for the temporo-mandibular joint. *Most* people [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > I'm sorry for using the Tmj misnomer; I didn't realize it was so > offensive or irritating(im just a patient). It gets offensive when I try to explain to my medical insurance plan-people that I don't "have TMJ".... Arrrrrgghhhhhhhhh. Webby > I wasn't offended. Just offering a little educational material > along the way. [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > I'm sorry for using the Tmj misnomer; I didn't realize it was so > > offensive or irritating(im just a patient). In article <fcbb2a05-557c-407d-9019-5992c48eeba5@r37g2000prm.googlegroups.com>, > I'm sorry for using the Tmj misnomer; I didn't realize it was so > offensive or irritating(im just a patient). Now that you know "better", what is the name for what ails you? Webby > In article > <fcbb2a05-557c-407d-9019-5992c48ee...@r37g2000prm.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Webby hmmmm........maybe Tmd?.........maybe just clenching......my head is what ails me though. > As has been mentioned on the ng for years, "TMJ" is simply the > abbreviation for the temporo-mandibular joint. *Most* people [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > MRI could possibly miss? Or, do I just take this as concrete against a > > tmj problem and try to relax. Sheesh, now im really feeling like a nut. It really seems like my jaw muscles and neck are just hopelessly in spasm, and thinking about adding another drug. Does anybody know anything about neurontin? I had tried it a while back and i really slept alot more peacefully, although the side effects were horrible. Not a pharmacologist by any means. My basic opinion is that you may be on too many drugs already. I am not suggesting that you stop any that you are now taking, but I just don't think you are likely to find a medication to solve your difficulties. JMO, D >>As has been mentioned on the ng for years, "TMJ" is simply the >>abbreviation for the temporo-mandibular joint. *Most* people [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > back and i really slept alot more peacefully, although the side > effects were horrible. > Not a pharmacologist by any means. > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >>that your symptoms are based mainly in the parafunctional activity > >>area, and not joint derangement. As much as id like to believe in the MRi its pretty hard for me to believe nothing is going with my joint, or whatever hurts on the side of my face. Is there any ligament or other structure near the TMj that i may have injured that could be causing my pain? Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. > >>I'd be experimenting with some different vertical openings with the > >>NTI, but Jim is *the* NTI expert and it would be pretty silly for me [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > back and i really slept alot more peacefully, although the side > > effects were horrible. I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are 'uninjured'. If you sprain an ankle or twist a knee, it needs *rest* and *time* to heal itself. Going to sleep and continuing the clenching allows no healing time for your jaw. It's like running a marathon every day on an injured knee/ankle. Even an NTI cannot eliminate all activity. Steve > As much as id like to believe in the MRi its pretty hard for me to > believe [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > injured that could be causing my pain? > Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. > I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows > the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Steve Hi Steve, So, if im still clenching to the point that im making it difficult for the NTI, what would be helpful, valium or some other drug? Thanks for the replies, and I apologize for wearing everyone out with all these posts. You know, although im still dealing with pain, there is some difference. before the NTI i could feel and hear a clunk when jutting my jaw forward,that motion although still stiff, is much smoother. Man, this tajik girl in class today told me in her broken english, that I didnt act all happy and talkative like the rest of the class, but "like ima gonna keel myself". I guess im grimacing......... Jerm > > As much as id like to believe in the MRi its pretty hard for me to > > believe [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > injured that could be causing my pain? > > Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. You know, although im still dealing with pain, there is some > difference. before the NTI i could feel and hear > a clunk when jutting my jaw forward,that motion although still stiff, > is much smoother. In a previous post, I mentioned that it is a bad idea to keep moving your jaw around while awake just to see if the noises and pain are still there every day. I wasn't joking. D > You know, although im still dealing with pain, there is some > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > D Im not moving it around to find pain, im trying constantly to find a place where im not in pain. > > You know, although im still dealing with pain, there is some > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Im not moving it around to find pain, im trying constantly to find > a place where im not in pain. The results of my Mri are: Impression 1.Very limited forward translation of the mandibular condyle upon mouth opening bilateraly. 2. MRI examination of the temporalmandibular joints is otherwise unremarkable. Of course my jaw didnt snap during the opening for the Mri. I guess im just imagining all of this. > > You know, although im still dealing with pain, there is some > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Im not moving it around to find pain, im trying constantly to find > a place where im not in pain. I lost my appliance yesterday which is lower NTi. I have an upper from earlier in the year that I had tried briefly,but had caused me to much pain to wear. Would there be any harm in using for now, if I can sleep with it?. My first available appointment with Jim isnt until July 30. > I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows > the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Even an NTI cannot eliminate all activity. \ So, what is there really no solution, or healing as long as I may still be clenching out of control? maybe a 3 month course of xanax or something would help, who knows. > Steve > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > injured that could be causing my pain? > > Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. > I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows > the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Even an NTI cannot eliminate all activity. Does that mean I am clenching beyond the NTI's ability to suppress my clenching, or would more adjustments make a difference? Or am I fated to a big bottle of valium somewhere in Tijauana? Thanks, Jeremy > Steve > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > injured that could be causing my pain? > > Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. > I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows > the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Steve Are you saying that I am clenching beyond the NTI's ability to relax my jaw and heal the joint, or that things might take more time? Or are you saying that Im probably a hopeless clencher that doesnt have a chance. I dont mean to put words in your mouth, its just I thought the NTI was for clenching and Tmd, and where does that place a difficult case like I seem to be in the equation? Thanks, jeremy > > As much as id like to believe in the MRi its pretty hard for me to > > believe [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > injured that could be causing my pain? > > Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. > > I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows > > the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Does an MRI really mean anything?.........just today my jaw snapped so loud my roomate could hear it and I dropped my sandwich. its like once a week the thing pops and grates and then feels better and looser, for about an hour, and then starts to stiffen up and get sore, then the next day the headache is back in full effect, with the same side cramping up. I dont know what the hell is wrong with me, the things that are supposed to be my only hope arent working. > > > As much as id like to believe in the MRi its pretty hard for me to > > > believe [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > > injured that could be causing my pain? > > > Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. Also, avoid any activities which would require you to open your mouth WIDE.  Signature/ Amatus / > On Jul 2, 7:10 pm, Steven Fawks <tuthjoc...@myturbonet.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > Does an MRI really mean anything?.........just today my jaw snapped so > loud my roomate could hear it and I dropped my sandwich. its like once a week the thing pops and grates and then feels better and looser, for about an hour, and then starts to stiffen up and get sore, then the next day the headache is back in full effect, with the same side cramping up. I dont know what the hell is wrong with me, the things that are supposed to be my only hope arent working. > > > As much as id like to believe in the MRi its pretty hard for me to > > > believe [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > > injured that could be causing my pain? > > > Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. > Also, avoid any activities which would require you to open your mouth WIDE. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > /" > Thanks for looking out. Should I even be doing any chewing, like pasta even? Im wondering if its a good idea to just start drinking my diet. In article <d08a9873-718c-43e7-adcc-ebae94b19f6f@b1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, > > Also, avoid any activities which would require you to open your mouth WIDE. > > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > even? Im wondering if its > a good idea to just start drinking my diet. Hey, jerm. Do you remember that I asked you a while back about your diet? For one reason or another, a discussion never developed. In my opinion, discussing what to eat and how to eat ... are mighty important topics for people who have difficulties with jaw function. Even is a person is just plain tired... it can be that "eating" just isn't high on the priority list. A day here and there of feeling like that is likely within the norm ... but if a person finds more days spent not knowing what to eat or how to eat a healthy diet because meal time is just "a royal pain" ... well..... that's not such a good thing. Pasta. Pasta is not necessarily such a simple food to eat. You have to be selective about which pasta and its preparation before deciding if it is one of those simple to manage meals. Often times, it isn't. I have decades of experience trying to figure out what to prepare myself for mealtime. If you want to know anything from my experience, I'd be more than happy to share my thoughts with you. In the morning, I'll be mostly away from my computer for at least a week. But if you post about this subject, chances are there are others with ideas to help you while I'm away. Obviously, a bowl of "guac" now and then as a "meal" isn't going to hurt anyone. But there are *many* options for you if you are interested. So.... while I'm away, maybe you and the others can discuss this and when I return, I'll put in my two-cents'. Webby > In article > <d08a9873-718c-43e7-adcc-ebae94b19...@b1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] > > Webby Thanks Webby, that would probably be very helpful. Im just really at my wits end with this, and unfortunately 2 months back with the NTI I cant say for sure if im any better or actually worse. > Also, avoid any activities which would require you to open your mouth WIDE. > > -- > / Does that mean not to do these stretching exercises?.....not that ive done any, in fact im contemplating putting everything in the blender from here on out. avoid activities which force you to open wide. Signature/ Amatus / On Jul 7, 8:52 am, "Amatus Cremona" <Nic...@sottovocce.com> wrote: > Also, avoid any activities which would require you to open your mouth > WIDE. > > -- > / Does that mean not to do these stretching exercises?.....not that ive done any, in fact im contemplating putting everything in the blender from here on out. Did Jim recommend any stretching exercises? D >>Also, avoid any activities which would require you to open your mouth WIDE. >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > ive done any, in fact im contemplating > putting everything in the blender from here on out. > Also, avoid any activities which would require you to open your mouth WIDE. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Does that mean i shouldnt do the tmj stretching exercises?.....not that im doing that, in fact im contemplating putting all food in a blender from here on out. Jermy > I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows > the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > no healing time for your jaw. It's like running a marathon every day on > an injured knee/ankle. Even an NTI cannot eliminate all activity. > Does that mean that I need more time, or that Im clenching too much for the NTI? Steve > > As much as id like to believe in the MRi its pretty hard for me to > > believe [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > injured that could be causing my pain? > > Thanks btw im only on elavil at this point. > I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows > the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > > Does that mean Im clenching too much for the NTI, or that I need more time to heal? I keep reading that snapping and popping of the joint is indicative of a displaced disk, my jaw makes a nauseatingly loud pop and grates, should'nt this have showed up on an accurate study? In article <ee504257-e707-4309-8d82-33170c8fc23c@y22g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, > > I didn't say 'nothing is going on in your joint'. The MRI shows > > the structures are basically normal. It does not say they are [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > should'nt this > have showed up on an accurate study? So how's the photography class coming along? What camera/s do you use? Webby > In article > <ee504257-e707-4309-8d82-33170c8fc...@y22g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > Webby Hey Webby, Im squeaking through it. Its a basic black and white class using manual canon film cameras. It sure would be alot more fun without the clench, but oh well. Im gonna try to get down to the beach today. What are you doing for the 4th? In article <dcd4b2a4-e0bb-4e00-8a97-208bc476814f@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, > > In article > > <ee504257-e707-4309-8d82-33170c8fc...@y22g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > but oh well. Im gonna try to > get down to the beach today. What are you doing for the 4th? Your class sounds interesting. Are you a professional photographer? We're getting together with family and friends in (their) cul-de-sac for group BBQ and a little firework display for the kids of all ages. It will be ~~*warm*~~ but once the sun drops behind the mountains, it feels at least 15 degrees cooler here in the desert. Most people agree that evenings in the desert are the best part of summer. Of course, we have the fire extinguishers ready! Enjoy the 4th, jerm!! Webby :-) > In article > <dcd4b2a4-e0bb-4e00-8a97-208bc4768...@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > > Your class sounds interesting. Are you a professional photographer? its alright, although im not sure Im gonna be able to finish it, my heads in spasm. No professional here, just an almost middle aged student. Desert sounds like a nice lifestlyle, as long as youve got AC! > We're getting together with family and friends in (their) cul-de-sac for > group BBQ and a little firework display for the kids of all ages. It [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Webby :-) > In article > <dcd4b2a4-e0bb-4e00-8a97-208bc4768...@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > Webby :-) Sounds fun webby, I hope it was. for me things didnt go so well. Had a nice joint snap last night, and now today right on its weekly schedule,every muscle in my skull is in spasm and my MRI justified jaw is letting out more pain than i ever remember. Why the hell am i getting worse? > In article > <dcd4b2a4-e0bb-4e00-8a97-208bc4768...@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > Webby :-) Sounds fun webby, I hope it was. for me things didnt go so well. No bbq for me, although the carne asada sure looked good. Had a nice joint snap last night, and now today right on its weekly schedule,every muscle in my skull is in spasm and my MRI justified jaw is letting out more pain than ever. I wish I had some hope. > In article > <dcd4b2a4-e0bb-4e00-8a97-208bc4768...@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > Webby :-) for me things didnt go so well. No bbq for me, although the carne asada sure looked good. Had a nice joint snap last night, and now today right on its weekly schedule,every muscle in my skull is in spasm and my MRI justified jaw is letting out more pain than ever. I wonder what the......... In article <f34956f1-184e-4f56-bc5b-86227208b305@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com>, > for me things didnt go so well. No bbq for me, although the carne > asada sure looked good. So... what did you eat?? > In article > <f34956f1-184e-4f56-bc5b-86227208b...@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > So... what did you eat?? Lol........a bowl of guac. > > In article > > <f34956f1-184e-4f56-bc5b-86227208b...@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Lol........a bowl of guac. ut once the sun drops behind the mountains, it feels > at least 15 degrees cooler here in the desert. That sounds like it would make a great photograph! > > > In article > > > <f34956f1-184e-4f56-bc5b-86227208b...@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > > Lol........a bowl of guac. Dr.Boyd returns email while on vacation-good stuff. , my jaw makes a nauseatingly loud pop and grates, > should'nt this > have showed up on an accurate study? What are you doing when the popping occurs? D > , my jaw makes a nauseatingly loud pop and grates, > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > D usually opening to take a bite of something that might be a little big. The old joke about "It hurts when I do this" and the Dr. replies, "Then DON'T DO THAT!" is sometimes appropriate. D >>, my jaw makes a nauseatingly loud pop and grates, >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > usually opening to take a bite of something that might be a little big. > The old joke about "It hurts when I do this" and the Dr. replies, > "Then DON'T DO THAT!" is sometimes appropriate. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > > usually opening to take a bite of something that might be a little big. makes sense, but at times it has made the pop when opening to take a bite of something normal, like a fork full of scrambled eggs. The gnawing pain in my jaw muscles is just unrelenting. > > The old joke about "It hurts when I do this" and the Dr. replies, > > "Then DON'T DO THAT!" is sometimes appropriate. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > pain in > my jaw muscles is just unrelenting. My next appointment isnt until July 30 and my opening is closing down and im in a ton of pain. If anybody has any suggestions as what I could do now, well that would be great. thanks. > , my jaw makes a nauseatingly loud pop and grates, > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > D Also, im going to have the radiology report from my Mri in hand in the next couple of days. Maybe I can relay the results here. > As has been mentioned on the ng for years, "TMJ" is simply the > abbreviation for the temporo-mandibular joint. *Most* people [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > NTI, but Jim is *the* NTI expert and it would be pretty silly for me > to second guess what he's doing. He actually has talked about some " tooth-to-tooth contact irregularities that are triggering atypical neuralgia-type responses" in an email, not that i know what that means exactly, but I thought somebody here would. > D > > Well, the MRI i had last week didnt show any abnormalities, at least > > according to the patient scheduler [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > MRI could possibly miss? Or, do I just take this as concrete against a > > tmj problem and try to relax. Sheesh, now im really feeling like a nut. He actually has talked about some " tooth-to-tooth contact irregularities that are triggering atypical neuralgia-type responses". |
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