Medical Forum / General / Cardiology / January 2007
The Original Mediterranean Diet for Weight loss
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gbiqmukhsdyy@yahoo.com - 01 Dec 2006 22:49 GMT Well, let me quickly relate to my own experience where I learned that when you're busy with day to day things or preoccupied with family or friends, your weight can sometimes creep up on you without you noticing. That is, until you realize your clothes don't fit as they once did or at one brief horrifying moment, you catch a glimpse of a few excess bulges in the mirror. Most of us are going through, have gone through, or will go through the same unpleasant moment. I know this much because it happened to me so you're not alone! I became so frustrated when I tried powders and tablets because they were 'yukky' and they took away any enjoyment I ever had at meal time. I no sooner sat down to eat and all I wanted to do was leave the table almost immediately. I thought "I can't keep this up!" I was right, I couldn't. Then I tried the 'rabbit' thing. Dry uninteresting biscuits with lettuce, carrots and celery etc. I was sure my ears were growing. That didn't last long either. Finally, I relented and started one of the so called 'fad' diets. This wasn't too bad to start with but I soon became listless, my skin started to get dry and I was the very opposite to enthusiastic about anything especially exercise of any sought. I changed to another fad diet. This also had its shortcomings. Not wanting to give up, I started searching the net and libraries every spare moment I had. I approached some doctors & researchers and this led me to discover the Mediterranean Diet. With great relief, I soon found it has an abundance of supporting evidence - stacks of verification, proof, research and very pleasing outcomes. Unlike some of the diets cooked up in someones head over night, the Mediterranean diet has a long healthy history. It was only days before I started feeling vibrant again. I wanted to get out there and walk and be active so much, I thought I would burst. You can imagine the feeling after so many disappointments. My family was a little sceptical of a change in diet but now they call me during the day to see what I'm going to cook that night. Big change in my life! As a result of my weight loss and my new healthy lifestyle, many of our friends & relations have taken up the Medierranean diet as well. So now we're all swapping recipes and discovering new tastes - there are so many recipes from all over the Mediterranean that it seems endless. That's really a good thing though because there will always be something new to try. http://weightlosspb.blogspot.com/#
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD - 02 Dec 2006 08:41 GMT Wiser to simply eat less:
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit/overweight.asp
> Well, let me quickly relate to my own experience where I learned that > when you're busy with day to day things or preoccupied with family or [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > because there will always be something new to try. > http://weightlosspb.blogspot.com/# GeF - 06 Dec 2006 14:27 GMT A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ?
As I understand the process, heating the oil past 180° C causes it to oxidize and it becomes as bad for the body as trans-fats and other saturated greases.. (tell me if you know more about this). Worse of all it loses its good taste !!
I recently discovered this may be the reason why Mediterranean chefs use ovens to prepare olive oil based dishes ...even, tomato sauces. They keep an oven going at 180°. Thus they are guaranteed not to burn the oil as could happen using pans over a stove top.
A further interesting detail of the way they cook, is that they use copper pans with copper covers, thus heat transmission is fastest and most uniform (unlike dishes prepared in ceramic pans as in northern countries)
Thought you should know. Comments appreciated.
William Wagner - 06 Dec 2006 16:04 GMT > A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the > olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Thought you should know. Comments appreciated. I use a dab of butter with my olive oil once in awhile. Flavor for pasta especially squid. Most olive oil here is used raw.
Main oil for high temps at our house is Grape seed oil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grapeseed_oil
Perhaps Pastorio can weigh in ?
Stir fryer Bill who likes the oven idea !
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Bob (this one) - 06 Dec 2006 17:28 GMT >> A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the >> olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? >> >> As I understand the process, You could check it you know. Somewhere other than the place you got this nonsense to begin with.
>> heating the oil past 180° C causes it to >> oxidize and it becomes as bad for the body as trans-fats and other >> saturated greases.. (tell me if you know more about this). Worse >> of all it loses its good taste !! No. It doesn't go through all that stuff. It doesn't go through any of that stuff.
>> I recently discovered this may be the reason why Mediterranean chefs >> use ovens to prepare olive oil based dishes ...even, tomato >> sauces. They keep an oven going at 180°. Thus they are guaranteed >> not to burn the oil as could happen using pans over a stove top. I don't know where you got this misinformation, but it's dead wrong. Tomato sauces are tomato-based, not oil based. Olive oil-using cultures routinely fry stovetop with it. They saute, shallow-fry and even deep-fry with olive oil.
Sauces aren't prepared in ovens. No one keeps an oven going if they don't need to, and to make sauces, they don't need to. Energy wasteful and unnecessary steps for the dish.
>> A further interesting detail of the way they cook, is that they use >> copper pans with copper covers, thus heat transmission is fastest >> and most uniform (unlike dishes prepared in ceramic pans as in northern >> countries) Who's "they" that have all this copper available? And what northern countries cook predominately in "ceramic pans?" This is a whole string of incorrect statements, a mishmash of misinformation.
Olive oil is perfectly fine for frying stovetop. Ovens work best for baking or roasting. Braising. Not sauce making.
>> Thought you should know. Comments appreciated. Don't go back to this source for culinary information. It's very bad.
> I use a dab of butter with my olive oil once in awhile. Flavor for > pasta especially squid. Most olive oil here is used raw. Mixing olive oil and butter helps with the scorching of the butter and adds a nice flavor boost.
> Main oil for high temps at our house is Grape seed oil. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grapeseed_oil > > Perhaps Pastorio can weigh in ? This oven business is not a good approach and isn't in general currency anywhere I know of.
Pastorio
GeF - 06 Dec 2006 20:04 GMT >>> A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the >>> olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] > > Pastorio If you say so.. ;)))))
Bob (this one) - 07 Dec 2006 22:20 GMT >>>> A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the >>>> olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? [quoted text clipped - 60 lines] > > If you say so.. ;))))) Y'know. For somebody who knows squat about the subject, you sure know squat about the subject. I am especially envious about that talent for not doing any research or reading, you know, a book or something.
I really admire your ability to form whole bodies of opinion without cluttering them with, like, facts or pragmatic knowledge. No empirical data to obscure and complicate the vista. Nothing from a reliable source to muddy the waters. No sir. Just content-free yips and empty-barrel hooting based on thoughts more gossamer than a cloud.
Brilliant show.
Pastorio
GeF - 06 Dec 2006 19:59 GMT >> A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the >> olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Stir fryer Bill who likes the oven idea ! Thanks Bill.. actually, my use of olive oil is often two-fold. First, as a means to provide contact between the pan and the stuff being cooked. Then a dab of the oil, raw, for the flavor.
Incidentally, the medical advice concerning cooking oils varies widely. Some allow peanut and/or sunflower. Others don't.
Joe Doe - 06 Dec 2006 19:11 GMT > A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the > olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > saturated greases.. (tell me if you know more about this). Worse > of all it loses its good taste !! This is debunked here:
http://www.oliveoilsource.com/cooking_olive_oil.htm
> I recently discovered this may be the reason why Mediterranean chefs > use ovens to prepare olive oil based dishes ...even, tomato > sauces. They keep an oven going at 180°. Thus they are guaranteed > not to burn the oil as could happen using pans over a stove top. One technique to not let olive oil reach too high a temperature is to roll the food like say fish in the oil to lightly coat it and then fry without any oil in the pan. The food will release water which keeps the temperature down. This is obviously not the equivalent of frying but is probably a healthier practice (In true frying the temperature of the oil will be much higher than the boiling temperature of water which is the purpose of deep or pan frying).
Roland
GeF - 06 Dec 2006 19:54 GMT >> A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the >> olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > Roland Thanks for the very informative link. It certainly cuts across what I thought I knew.
Perhaps french chefs use ovens simply for the control such cooking allows (as opposed to stove top cooking which requires twiddling knobs or shifting the position of the pan over the flame)
Bob (this one) - 07 Dec 2006 22:13 GMT >>> A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the >>> olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > Thanks for the very informative link. It certainly cuts across what > I thought I knew. You guessed at every bit of it. Cobbled together bits of randomly collected misinformation.
> Perhaps french chefs use ovens simply for the control such cooking > allows (as opposed to stove top cooking which requires twiddling knobs > or shifting the position of the pan over the flame) I'm a French-trained chef. This stuff is nonsense. Clearly - I mean very, very clearly - you have no idea what a French chef does or doesn't do. You aren't any sort of cook yourself if you think "stove top cooking [...] requires twiddling knobs or shifting the position of the pan over the flame." You seem to think that cooking is a process that demands 100% concentration and attention. Silly you.
All your "perhaps" comments show it to be guesswork. Buy a cookbook. Check a reliable source. You clearly - I mean very, very clearly - haven't done the most rudimentary looking.
All of Julia Childs' books will give you clear explanations of French culinary technique. In English. When you're done with them, let me know, I'll give you a couple hundred more to look at.
Pastorio
GeF - 08 Dec 2006 00:05 GMT >>>> A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning the >>>> olive oil used in frying fish, meats, onions, etc.. ? [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > > Pastorio So you feel attacked in *the marrow of your self-hood*, hé, Pastorio ? I thought so as I read your aggressively pompous pap.
By the way, I'm not a cook. Mais je suis Français. And the info I related in my original post was taken from a documentary narrated by one of the Troisgros brothers showing him utilising a 180°C oven as described, using copper pans and covers, as described, making a tomato sauce, as decribed.
They run one of the most famous 3 star restaurant in all of France.
Bob (this one) - 08 Dec 2006 16:13 GMT >>>>> A detail concerning the "Mediterranean diet" : how to avoid burning >>>>> the [quoted text clipped - 51 lines] > > So you feel attacked in *the marrow of your self-hood*, hé, Pastorio ? No. I feel like Don Quixote tilting at windbags.
> I thought so as I read your aggressively pompous pap. Your psychology is every bit as good as your culinaria. Nearly.
I am put off by specious twaddle with no real bearing on daily kitchen operations that are offered as realistic. I'm disturbed by grossly incorrect statements that might lead others to reach the same impractical conclusions. I'm distressed by lazy research and incompetent assertion as results of it.
> By the way, I'm not a cook. No. Really? I believe I said that, but it was no brilliance on my part. Your words exemplified the concept of "res ipsa loquitur."
> Mais je suis Français. All the more shameful, given the resources available to you. You've absorbed nothing from what is arguably the culture with the most advanced and detailed culinary tradition on earth.
> And the info I > related in my original post was taken from a documentary narrated > by one of the Troisgros brothers showing him utilising a 180°C oven > as described, using copper pans and covers, as described, making a > tomato sauce, as decribed. I'm not sure I believe you. Most upscale French restaurants cook in copper. Most French homes - as you should well know - don't use so much copper cookware.
Which Troisgros was it? Let's see, there's Pierre who makes tomato sauce this way: "In a large saucepan, combine 1 tablespoon of the olive oil and the onion, cover the pan, and sweat the onion for about 10 minutes over medium-low heat. "Add the tomatoes, thyme, bay leaf, garlic, 1 tablespoon of the vinegar, the honey and 1 additional tablespoon of the oil. Simmer, uncovered, over medium heat, until much of the liquid has evaporated, about 15 minutes. Discard the bay leaf, and season to taste with salt and pepper. "Put the entire mixture into a food processor and puree. Put through a fine sieve."
Or maybe - probably - you misunderstood this from Marie-Pierre and Michel: "Cooking / The tomato "The tomato represents part of my roots, an ingredient that was essential in developing my sense of taste. Before using tomato, I often roast it for a long time to further concentrate its flavours, give it more acidity, bring out the sweetness and firm up its flesh." [...] "Finally, and perhaps most surprisingly, I also use tomatoes in classic sauces and compotes. In this case it’s a matter of drawing on what might be called “the spirit of the tomato,” that surprising mix of sweetness and acidity combined of course with its flavour. This is the case, for instance, in the “Derrière de lapin à la mauresque” (Moorish-style rabbit legs), where the tomato, as in many traditional cuisines, serves as an acidic binder that “carries” the herbs and spices."
Or maybe the recipe for "Tart Tomatoes" "Peel the tomatoes by dipping them in boiling water to loosen the skin. Cut each tomato into 4 “petals,” removing the seeds, and line them up on an oiled baking sheet. "Salt, pepper, and sprinkle lightly with sugar. Drizzle with olive oil and roast very slowly in an oven at 100 C (225 F, gas 3-4) for 3 to 4 hours. The longer they cook the more wrinkled they will become and the more their acidity will be accentuated. "Store them in a covered container, with olive oil to cover."
Interestingly, that last instruction isn't a good one. Botulism is a distant possibility.
So, having watched a documentary you're unequipped to understand, you extrapolated to *all* cooks what this man does. So you talked about ceramic pans from other European cultures. So you concluded erroneously about what was going on. So you took *one* source as *all* the information there was about it? You're not a cook, to be sure; you're not a logician, either.
> They run one of the most famous 3 star restaurant in all of France. <LOL> I've eaten with them a few times over the years, last maybe 15 years ago. They also have claimed to have invented many new techniques, some of which stand scrutiny. They were last at the popular forefront with Cuisine Minceur, and that's a long time ago.
In parting, here's a tasty recipe from them: Sweet-and-sour cherry tomatoes Match these tomatoes with pan-fried foie gras or veal liver with bitter orange sauce. Be sure to keep the liquid from the marinade, which can be used again. It’s so flavourful that you can use it as a dressing for a salad of beetroot, carrot or cabbage. I also like to contrast these tomatoes with ewe’s or goat’s cheese. 60 cherry tomatoes 500 g acacia honey (1 lb 2 oz) 40 cl sherry vinegar (1 2/3 cups) 3 garlic cloves 1 sprig rosemary 1 vanilla pod 3 tbsp extra-virgin olive oil Salt, pepper 60 coriander seeds Dip the tomatoes in boiling water for a few seconds to loosen their skins and peel them. Place them in a heatproof dish, tightly packed. Season with salt and pepper. In a saucepan, boil the honey until lightly caramelised. Add the crushed garlic, a slit and seeded vanilla pod, rosemary, coriander seeds and olive oil. Pour this mixture over the tomatoes to cover them well and bring briefly to a boil. Add the vinegar off the heat, cover and leave to cool on the table. Set aside in a cool place for at least 24 hours, to allow the tomatoes to soak up all the flavours.
Au revoir...
Pastorio
GeF - 08 Dec 2006 17:00 GMT Primitive.
Bob (this one) - 08 Dec 2006 17:33 GMT > Primitive. <LOL> And people think that Chung slip-slides away...
Pastorio
GeF - 08 Dec 2006 20:16 GMT Pauvre con !
Bob (this one) - 09 Dec 2006 04:51 GMT > Pauvre con ! Elegant.
Departee. Like repartee, but shouted over the shoulder on the way out the door because they person has nothing reasonable to say. So they say *something* anyway.
You know, GeF, you get to look more and more silly with each empty note. In French and in English.
Pastorio
GeF - 09 Dec 2006 19:28 GMT >> Pauvre con ! > > Elegant. no comment ;)
Bob (this one) - 10 Dec 2006 06:16 GMT >>> Pauvre con ! >> >> Elegant. >> > no comment ;) Even when you comment, there's no real comment.
Pauvre fou...
Pastorio
GeF - 10 Dec 2006 09:44 GMT > Pauvre fou... enfin ;)
Bob (this one) - 10 Dec 2006 21:43 GMT >> Pauvre fou... > > enfin ;) Seulement pour vous, cher ami...
Pastorio
GeF - 10 Dec 2006 22:52 GMT >>> Pauvre fou... >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Pastorio Faites attention à votre pression, cher Bob..
Bob (this one) - 10 Dec 2006 23:13 GMT >>>> Pauvre fou... >>> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Faites attention à votre pression, cher Bob.. Bas. Bien a bas. Vous?
Pastorio
GeF - 10 Dec 2006 23:27 GMT >>>>> Pauvre fou... >>>> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Pastorio parfois 80/140 parfois 90/150 mais parfois encore plus :-(
Bob (this one) - 12 Dec 2006 13:52 GMT >>>>>> Pauvre fou... >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > parfois 80/140 parfois 90/150 mais parfois encore plus :-( Dommage... restez bien.
Pastorio
William Wagner - 12 Dec 2006 16:04 GMT > >>>>>> Pauvre fou... > >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Pastorio Sat.
Bill
............
Aside any good smoked eel suggestions or providers you like for holiday table ?
............. P.S. Sat.
sat ADJ 9 9 X X X POS sat ADJ [XXXCO] enough, adequate, sufficient; satisfactory;
sat ADV POS sat ADV [XXXCO] enough, adequately; sufficiently; well enough, quite; fairly, pretty;
Not that I'm that smart but the Mac program "Latin Words" hides my ignorance well.
 Signature S Jersey USA Zone 5 Shade http://www.ocutech.com/ High tech Vison aid This article is posted under fair use rules in accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, and is strictly for the educational and informative purposes. This material is distributed without profit.
Bob (this one) - 12 Dec 2006 17:14 GMT >>>>>>>> Pauvre fou... >>>>>>> enfin ;) [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Bill Bill, I must confess to virtually never understanding your posts - two of them showing up at the moment. Like this one. Using whole sentences, could you say what this means? Do you think some word above means "sat?" Do you think it's Latin?
Are you asking me about smoked eel?
Pastorio
> ............ > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > Not that I'm that smart but the Mac program "Latin Words" hides my > ignorance well. GeF - 12 Dec 2006 23:55 GMT > Aside any good smoked eel suggestions or providers you like for holiday > table ? I second the request... wanted : a provider of dutch "gerookte paling"...!
GeF - 13 Dec 2006 00:00 GMT >> Aside any good smoked eel suggestions or providers you like for >> holiday table ? > > I second the request... wanted : a provider of dutch "gerookte paling"...! En als bonus kun je in Zierikzee een palingbroodje kopen :-))
sherry - 30 Jan 2007 05:34 GMT Hi Everyone, there seems to be a new development in the field of "Low carb diets" . I was reading about it on http://www.medical-health-care-information.com/Health-living/crab- diets/index.asp
which says 'Limit carbohydrates to no more than 10 percent of your daily calorie intake'.
1) Eat only allowed foods. 2) Eat NO foods that contain sugar or white flour. 3) Be aware of "hidden" sugars and carbohydrates. 4) Cut out caffeine. 5) Take fiber supplements. 6) Take vitamin and mineral supplements. 7) Drink LOTS of water.
> Well, let me quickly relate to my own experience where I learned that > when you're busy with day to day things or preoccupied with family or [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > Mediterranean that it seems endless. That's really a good thing though > because there will always be something new to try.http://weightlosspb.blogspot.com/#
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