Actually, to have our sins forgiven by GOD the Father through our faith
in GOD the Son, means to receive eternal life (John 3:16).

May you someday receive the infinite mercy and grace of GOD the Father
by receiving that which LORD Jesus Christ has freely given up on your
behalf, dear catholic neighbor whom I love, in the holy name of the
Father's one and only begotten Son.

Amen !

Laus Deo !

Marana tha !

Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,

Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit

Message for the wolves in sheepskin:

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/4f43855be1cfa795?

or
http://tinyurl.com/s3bud (awaiting the frantic foot-stomping antics of
the anti-christ)

"> To have our sins forgiven is to heal our souls, no claim was made to

Actually, to have our sins forgiven by GOD the Father through our faith
in GOD the Son, means to receive eternal life (John 3:16)."

Actually, the two are not exclusive and no where in scripture is it
indicated.  This is in rhetoric what is called a "strawman",ie. state
someother idea and refute it rather then addressing the real topic.
When on shifting sands, building attempts cause such behavior, smile.
In fact, to continue to turn to God that we might have Him turn to us,
we must continue to confess our sins that He will be quick to forgive
them and that our souls may be healed; by His stripes we are healed.

"May you someday receive the infinite mercy and grace of GOD the Father
by receiving that which LORD Jesus Christ has freely given up on your
behalf, dear catholic neighbor whom I love, in the holy name of the
Father's one and only begotten Son."

To recieve we must first and continue at all times to turn to Him that
He will be quick to forgive our sins.

Guessing as to the state of my soul and the matter of my faith and of
the
church in which I commune have not been revealed to you.  The first two
being known only to God and the last because your assertion of taoist
pagan
magical powers of perception/discernment at a distance are no where to
be
found.

Such doctrine has failed the test of measure against orthodox doctrine
of these 2000 years and the failed perception at a distance a failed
test of the invented doctrine on which it rests and of outcome. Could
the guideline given us that we should "test the spirits" apply in this
instance? We are told to turn from one who claims to be a prophet but
fails when statements don't match events, in testing spirits and
individuals should we likewise turn from them as being revealed as not
having the truth in them?

Doctrine that is false and which arises from self reference alone would
have been weeded out as a tare by consulting a spiritual advisor and
prayerfully discussing the doctrines in the light of 2000 years of
orthodox doctrine and teaching.

I pray that I may never fail myself to do so and asking you for your
continued prayer on my behalf, God's blessing and protection and peace
upon
you, God have mercy on me a sinner.

"Actually the two concepts are very different.  Your concept that one's
soul is ill until sins are forgiven is not described anywhere in the
Holy Bible.  And, for the discerning, your man-made concept is untrue.
What is written is that sin leads to eternal separation from GOD as
souls are cast into the lake of fire once it is determined their
respective names are not in the Lamb's book of Life (Revelation 20:15).
Until then, there is nothing written about souls either being or
becoming sick from sin.

My name is definitely written in the Lamb's Book of Life.

You seem not so sure about your name.

Actually what was said is that the two ideas are not mutually exclusive.
When we sin we are separated from God, when we confess our sins and He
is quick to forgive we can be drawn unto Him again.  If we don't confess
our sins and repent the sickness of the stain that separates us from God
can't be healed.

In the gospels we find, also in response to the pharisees (smile):

And when Jesus heard it, he said to them, "Those who are well have no
need of a physician, but those who are sick; I came not to call the
righteous, but sinners."

Healing is also used again by our Lord, along with the theme of being
drawn to and being united with God:

"4 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we,
being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye
were healed.

For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the
Shepherd
                       and Bishop of your souls."

Christ has been called the "great physician" and the church the
"hospital.

The status of my soul and of my faith is known only to god, as is the
church in which I'm priviledged to commune, in terms of your claims to
magical powers of remote perception/discernment derived from pagan
taoist doctrines.  We have the measure of that claim now and testing it
find it empty, as would you if you were to consult a spiritual advisor
concerning this and other doctrines you proclaim and as invented by
consulting your own understanding as a reference.  If we confess our
sins God is quick to forgive them, reliance on the vanity of our minds,
as the scriptures speak, is to almost surely to lead us away from the
2000 years of orthodox teaching and doctrine and to put us in danger of
seperation from God.

Asking for your prayers on my behalf, God's blessing and protection and
peace upon you, God have mercy on me a sinner. .

We are well advised to consult a spiritual advisor that we may avoid
error in the sand of self reference only.  Thanking you for your
continued prayers on my behalf, God's blessing and peace unto you, God
have mercy on me a sinner.

Your "chi" magical powers claimed from pagan doctrine to discern from a
distance fails as only God knows the state of my soul and your guesses
about in which church I commune has failed multiple times now.  Even if
by chance you should now guess correctly, the test is done and your
powers found empty.  Are we not protected from the powers of darkness if
we turn to God?  Now to the discussion at hand:

"When Adam confessed his sin, was GOD quick to forgive and draw Adam unto
HIM again?"

Actually you should know this, not until Christ had died and risen was
the healing of the stain of Adam's sin possible and be open to have the
separation from God removed.

"Actually, GOD can heal anything. Laus Deo ! Morever, because HE knows
everything in our hearts, our confessing to others is done for others and
not for HIM."

In truth God does not force His healing upon us, when we turn to Him He
will then turn to us.  That is the nature of our free will. We are directed
in no uncertain terms that we are to confess to God that He will be quick
to forgive 70 X 70 times.  As in the scripture given we were directed in
fact to do it one to another that God may forgive us. In reflection of this
and as understood as such, confession in the early church was done in
public and in the presence of those gathered to worship and break bread.

"Yes, and as a physican  (smile) and not a pharisee, LORD GOD Almighty has
given me authority in this discussion and in this world on the topic about
what makes people sick and how to heal those who are sick.

Are you mindful about what GOD has taught you about submitting to the
authority HE has established in this world through HIS Word (Romans 13) ?"

In truth, you have no other authority or power aside from that any
christian might have with the grace of God.  Your self described authority
based on pagan doctrine of"chi" powers has been tested and found empty. The
degree to which we resemble the pharisee is not by self proclamation, how
pharisee in nature that, but as measured by the scales Christ gave us in
the many examples of them.

"The healing here is not from sickness but from death that comes as
**payment** for sin for it is written that the wages of sin is death and
not that the illness of sin upon the soul leads to death."

Payment is not healing. You finally get something partially right, we
were delivered from death, spiritually we were healed by His stripes
just as the scripture said quoating our Lord and as He proclaimed his
role to be to the pharisees.

"Neither Shepherd nor Bishop implies a healing of sick souls."

Another strawman, this was mentioned above as how both healing from death
by His stripes was also connected with reunion with God in the same
passage, the shepherd calls His sheep to join them to His flock. In the
church the bishop has the role of the shepherd under the authority of
Christ and by the direction of the Holy Spirit.

"> Christ has been called the "great physician"

HE did heal sickness afflicting mortal bodies:"

And he can heal us from death.

"> and the church the "hospital.

Where is this in the Holy Bible?"

Nowhere, nor was it so claimed, all was prefaced by "it has been said".
It is a well known analogy of Christ the physician as healing us from
death by His actions and of the hospital being the church where we
commune within the community of christians as we turn to God for
spiritual healing and forgiveness of sins by so doing as we confess and
repent.  In part it is by the correction of that community that we avoid
straying from the flock by false doctrines of self invention as we
measure our thinking with orthodox doctrine of these 2000 years..

This thread, as the one before it can now conclude as my work is
accomplished.

We saw again that invented false doctrine fails the test of measure with
orthodox doctrine.  We saw that the selfclaimed pagan "chi" magical
powers that provide the discernment to know things at a distance failed
in testing also.  We saw that substituting "Holy Spirit" in place of
"chi" interchangably did not help but only mired the devine with
paganism.  Is this a blasphemy?  We see that "chi" powers said to
provide greater insight into scripture has by test proven only of the
kind where the vanity of the mind leads to the mondain. We see by
testing, as scripture says we should do that claims are empty.

If one consults a spiritual advisor as a reference outside of ones own
flawed self reference all such can be avoided.  That again was my work
in this thread, it is the "give a man enough rope ..." matter all over
again. It serves as an example to others as to the folly wrought when
one assumes to be ones own spiritual advisor.  It illustrates why a mind
in isolation is prone to failure and why we are directed to be in
christian community and not be lone cowboys anserable only to ourselves.

I have no special powers nor am I a reference nor am I an example to
emulate because I know my weaknesses and whatever grace I might possess
comes from the mercy of God.  It is by measure of 2000 years of orthodox
teaching that any single person and new doctrine must be understood.

If I have offended anyone, please forgive me.

Thanking all for your continued prayers on my behalf, God's blessing and
protection and peace unto all, God have mercy on me a sinner.