Medical Forum / General / Cardiology / March 2006
Scared 49 Year Old (Female)
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violetvache@yahoo.com - 17 Mar 2006 14:03 GMT I've searched Google for ways to calculate cholesterol ratios, and either I'm calculating wrong or I'm misundestanding the ways to calculate. For that matter, I don't understand how a total cholesterol level of 279 can be arrived at by adding HDL at 73 and LDL at 168. My triglycerides were 191. I added 191 to 73 and 168 and divided by 5, and-- Well, I don't know what I'm doing.
I'd also like to know if anyone on this group has any links with good articles about the relationship between high cholesterol, low heart rate, light-headedness, and depression. I'm seeing a new cardiologist on Monday and thankfully have completely normal blood work, with the exception of slightly elevated thyroid levels and the stunning 279 lipid panel--stunning for a 20 year vegetarian. Carotid doppler (and I assume Vertebrobasilar studies) were normal. In fact, the technician performing the ultrasound said my carotids were "excellent." A MRI showed brain lesions my neurologist claims are more characteristic of someone in their late 50's or early 60's.
I'm going from specialist to specialist with the specific complaint of "near syncope" (diagnosed by my neurologist, who claims to be clueless). I've called the condition vertigo, but the neurologist claims vertigo and near syncope are two different conditions.
But I've been reading articles on this newsgroup about the relation between cardiovascular disease and depression, and aside from non-quantifiables like personal psychological problems, I'd like to know if there might be any reason for the extent of depression I'm experiencing in regard to my heart.
Thank you for any responses.
James216440@yahoo.com - 17 Mar 2006 17:15 GMT > I've searched Google for ways to calculate cholesterol ratios, and > either I'm calculating wrong or I'm misundestanding the ways to > calculate. For that matter, I don't understand how a total cholesterol > level of 279 can be arrived at by adding HDL at 73 and LDL at 168. My > triglycerides were 191. I added 191 to 73 and 168 and divided by 5, > and-- Well, I don't know what I'm doing. 73 + 168 = 241
191 / 5 = 38 this corrects triglycerides to cholesterol equivalents
241 + 38 = 279 total cholesterol
> I'd also like to know if anyone on this group has any links with good > articles about the relationship between high cholesterol, low heart [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Thank you for any responses. I suggest before you panic you go to the Harvard Risk calculator and figure out what your actual risk is based on many factors. That 279 by itself means relatively little. Here is the link:
http://www.yourdiseaserisk.harvard.edu/hccpquiz.pl?func=start&quiz=heart
violetvache@yahoo.com - 18 Mar 2006 11:50 GMT First, thank you, Bill, and Robert. I did take the Harvard test and came up with a low risk of heart disease, and I was particularly interested in whichever of you wrote that high lipid levels, by altering viscosity, can alone cause "vertigo."
Again, thank you all, very much.
> > I've searched Google for ways to calculate cholesterol ratios, and > > either I'm calculating wrong or I'm misundestanding the ways to [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > http://www.yourdiseaserisk.harvard.edu/hccpquiz.pl?func=start&quiz=heart Robert - 18 Mar 2006 21:31 GMT > First, thank you, Bill, and Robert. I did take the Harvard test and > came up with a low risk of heart disease, and I was particularly > interested in whichever of you wrote that high lipid levels, by > altering viscosity, can alone cause "vertigo." Your lipid values are not high enough to cause hyperviscosity syndrome. Some of these symptoms are visual changes, vertigo, ataxia, and changes in mental status.I was referring to those cases in which it would be possible to have such symptoms. We have come across cholesterols in the greater than 2000 and such case would require a test for serum viscosity. Funduscopic exam should show dilated, segmented, and tortuous retinal veins, resulting in a "sausage-link" appearance.
One of the hypothesis is that more heart attacks happen after a fatty meal because of the increase sluggish viscosity.
violetvache@yahoo.com - 19 Mar 2006 13:53 GMT > <violetvache@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > I was particularly > > interested in whichever of you wrote that high lipid levels, by [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > show dilated, segmented, and tortuous retinal veins, resulting in a > "sausage-link" appearance. Can folk with autoimmune disorders (in my case thyroiditis) have a lower..."threshold" for sensitivity to serum viscosity? I didn't know people could have cholesterol as high as 2000 and still be in the land of the living.
> One of the hypothesis is that more heart attacks happen after a fatty meal > because of the increase sluggish viscosity. My 66 year old father, three weeks past a seven bypass surgery, ate a steak dinner and died that night of a pulmonary embolism. Until then his diet had been modified and his appetite dictated by his post-surgical depression, and several people suggested it was the steak dinner that killed him.
hawki63 - 19 Mar 2006 17:43 GMT > > <violetvache@yahoo.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > post-surgical depression, and several people suggested it was the steak > dinner that killed him. highly unlikely...more likely that his need for SEVEN bypasses indicated that his heart arteriess were in sad shape for sure...
plus...with all those grafts..and narrowed arteries...not that unusual for a clot to break off and lodge in the lungs..ie PE
my hubby has steak pretty regularly...5 years post MI..and 3 years post CABG...without incident
oh..except for the malignant polyp found in his sigmoid colon...which takes him to surgery in 2 days..guess one never knows...
sorry for your loss...
William Wagner - 19 Mar 2006 20:11 GMT > > > <violetvache@yahoo.com> wrote in message > > [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > > sorry for your loss... Hope all goes well ! We never know still it ...........
Bill
 Signature Located In S Jersey USA Zone 5 Shade This article is posted under fair use rules in accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, and is strictly for the educational and informative purposes. This material is distributed without profit. Vision Problems? Look at http://www.ocutech.com/ ~us$1500
Robert - 19 Mar 2006 19:45 GMT > > <violetvache@yahoo.com> wrote in message > Can folk with autoimmune disorders (in my case thyroiditis) have a > lower..."threshold" for sensitivity to serum viscosity? I presume you are talking about hypothyroidism and not hyperthydroidism but neither is assoicated with hyperviscosity. There are other causes of hyperviscosity such as elevated protein levels but as you mentioned your labs were normal so I would seriously doubt that you have hyperviscosity. It causes problems during testing that would flag it as such.
The autoimmune disorder, Meniere's Disease , can cause vertigo. It is unclear whether you have vertigo or not.
"Vertigo is the most dramatic and distressing symptom of Meniere's; it is described as a sudden loss of normal balance or equilibrium. The room may suddenly begin to spin and rotate at high speed. Focusing is difficult, and if the vertigo continues, nausea and vomiting may occur. Vertigo is commonnly caused by acute labyrinthitis (a viral inflammation of the inner ear), benign positional vertigo (a condition due to abnormally floating crystals in the inner ear that stimulate the nerve endings of the inner ear), delayed symptom of head injury, or result of cervical spine problems. Ten to 15 percent of cases resembling Meniere's Disease may be the result of an immune disorder of the body, the system producing antibodies which attack the inner ear. Cholesteatomas (cystic growths) and other infections of the middle ear can also produce symptoms similar to Meniere's."
http://www.earsurgery.org/meniere.html
I didn't know
> people could have cholesterol as high as 2000 and still be in the land > of the living. Usually hypertriglyceridemia can cause pancreatitis. Cholesterolemia by itself without a high triglycerides is colorless and non-milky and is not assoicated with complications of hyperviscosity or pancreatitis and thus no need for lipid plasmapheresis in order to get rid of it rapidly.
Bill - 18 Mar 2006 04:21 GMT > I've searched Google for ways to calculate cholesterol ratios, and > either I'm calculating wrong or I'm misundestanding the ways to [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Thank you for any responses. You might want to take a look at this:
Bill
___________________________
Brief Aerobic Exercise May Improve Mood, Well-Being in Major Depression CME
News Author: Laurie Barclay, MD CME Author: Charles Vega, MD, FAAFP
Complete author affiliations and disclosures, and other CME information, are available at the end of this activity.
Release Date: December 29, 2005; Valid for credit through December 29, 2006
Credits Available Physicians - up to 0.25 AMA PRA Category 1 continuing medical education credits for physicians ; Family Physicians - up to 0.25 AAFP Prescribed continuing medical education credits for physicians
All other healthcare professionals completing continuing education credit for this activity will be issued a certificate of participation. Participants should claim only the number of hours actually spent in completing the educational activity.
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Dec. 29, 2005 - A single 30-minute bout of aerobic exercise or quiet rest improves mood in patients with major depressive disorder (MDD), according to the results of a randomized study reported in the December issue of Medicine and Science in Sports and Exercise. However, only exercise benefited measures of positive well-being and vigor.
"There is a growing recognition and acceptance of chronic exercise as a useful treatment modality for depression," write John B. Bartholomew, MD, from the University of Texas at Austin, and colleagues. "The number of acute exercise bouts needed to produce a therapeutic effect is unknown; however, exercise training interventions have effected a substantial improvement in symptoms in only a few weeks."
In this study, 40 individuals who were receiving treatment for MDD were randomized to exercise at 60% to 70% of age-predicted maximal heart rate for 30 minutes or to a 30-minute period of quiet rest. There were 15 men and 25 women, all of whom completed both the Profile of Mood States and Subjective Exercise Experiences Scale (SEES) as indicators of mood 5 minutes before, and 5, 30, and 60 minutes after their experimental condition.
Although both groups reported similar reductions in measures of psychological distress, depression, confusion, fatigue, tension, and anger, only the exercise group reported a significant increase in positive well-being and vigor scores.
Study limitations may include those inherent in the survey instruments, low variability in baseline scores for the well-being subscale, failure to find an effect for the fatigue subscale of the SEES, lack of generalizability to the clinical population, and failure to assess levels of ongoing clinical depression.
"Although this would not be expected to have an impact on the underlying mental disorder, a single bout of exercise does appear to be a useful method for patients with MDD to regulate their mood in the short term, with a particular effect on positive moods," the authors write. "Given the debilitating symptoms of depression, a respite such as this is potentially invaluable to those who suffer with MDD. This is especially true because the time course of pharmacologic treatments require at least 2 - 4 weeks and can exceed 6 - 8 weeks before providing significant relief of depression."
Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2005;37:2032-2037
Learning Objectives for This Educational Activity Upon completion of this activity, participants will be able to: a.. Compare an exercise program, antidepressant medications, or a combination of the 2 therapies in the treatment of older patients with depression. b.. Identify the immediate benefits of brief exercise among patients with depression. Clinical Context The treatment of depression may be limited because of adverse effects of antidepressant medications, particularly in older adults. Therefore, simple treatments with a low rate of possible adverse events are attractive therapies for depression. Blumenthal and colleagues compared sertraline, a program of aerobic exercise, or both among a cohort of older adults with depression. The results, which were published in the October 25, 1999, issue of the Archives of Internal Medicine, demonstrated that all treatments were similarly effective in improving the degree of depression for 16 weeks. However, patients receiving medication alone had the fastest initial response.
There is less research regarding the immediate impact of exercise among patients with depression. The authors of the current study examine different emotional domains in a randomized, controlled trial of brief, moderate-intensity aerobic exercise.
Study Highlights a.. Patients eligible for study participation included adults between the ages of 18 and 55 years old who were diagnosed as having MDD within 2 weeks prior to study entry. Subjects had not received other treatment for depression prior to randomization. MDD was diagnosed according to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Disorders, Fourth Edition, criteria. Patients who reported regular exercise more than twice per week or who had concomitant psychiatric diagnoses along with MDD were excluded from study participation. b.. Study subjects were randomized to either an exercise or control group. The exercise group completed 30 minutes of exercise on a treadmill at 65% to 70% of their predicted maximal heart rate. The control group's intervention consisted of 30 minutes of quiet rest. c.. Study outcomes included measures of psychological distress, depression, confusion, fatigue, tension, anger, positive well-being, and vigor. These factors were measured 5 minutes prior to the study intervention as well as at 5, 30, and 60 minutes after the intervention. d.. 15 men and 25 women participated in the study. The mean age was 38.1 years. Baseline data on the domains measured was roughly similar between study groups. e.. In general, all outcomes measured (except fatigue) improved with time in both treatment groups. There was little difference in the effects of exercise vs quiet rest on these outcomes, although superior scores were noted for positive well-being and vigor at 5 and 30 minutes in the exercise cohort compared with the quiet-rest group. Pearls for Practice a.. Previous research has demonstrated that antidepressant medications, aerobic exercise, or a combination of both treatments can improve depression to a similar degree in older adults. b.. In the current study, exercise was associated with an improvement in short-term measures of positive well-being and vigor when compared with quiet rest in a cohort of patients with MDD. However, 6 other emotional domains were unaffected by randomization to exercise vs quiet rest.
Robert - 18 Mar 2006 10:27 GMT > I've searched Google for ways to calculate cholesterol ratios, and > either I'm calculating wrong or I'm misundestanding the ways to > calculate. For that matter, I don't understand how a total cholesterol > level of 279 can be arrived at by adding HDL at 73 and LDL at 168. My > triglycerides were 191. I added 191 to 73 and 168 and divided by 5, > and-- Well, I don't know what I'm doing. Total cholesterol = HDL + LDL +VLDL (triglycerides/5)
> I'd also like to know if anyone on this group has any links with good > articles about the relationship between high cholesterol, low heart > rate, light-headedness, and depression. Just off the top of my head with some of these. Very high cholesterols in the 2000 mg/dl range as can be seen in Lipoprotein X cholestasis can cause light-headedness due to hyperviscosity. that certainly isn't in that range. Depression can be associated with hypercortisolism and lipid abnormalities. Depression is a metabolically hyperactive condition in this regard to stress hormones. Thyroid disease can impact your lipid levels also.
I'm seeing a new cardiologist
> on Monday and thankfully have completely normal blood work, with the > exception of slightly elevated thyroid levels and the stunning 279 I should have read the entire thing but what the heck. Hypothyroidism can certainly elevate your cholesterol. I am referring to TSH greater than 3. Depression won't respond to the normal antidepressants if your TSH is elevated. Your thyroid needs to be treated first. Depression itself can alter your thyroid pituitary axis and alter some values. Medication for certain types of depression can also alter your thyroid hormones so those are usually monitored. Take a look at the TSH and see if it's high or low.
> lipid panel--stunning for a 20 year vegetarian. Carotid doppler (and I > assume Vertebrobasilar studies) were normal. In fact, the technician [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Thank you for any responses. Here's one link
http://www.mental-health-matters.com/articles/article.php?artID=319
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