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Medical Forum / General / Cardiology / January 2006Waiting
Dear S.M.C, My story can be found here: http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/browse_frm/thread/42f3062d1a16 d325?tvc=1 I suffer from chest pain and tachycardia, and I feel strongly, that my symptoms are of cardiac origin. My current local cardiologist thinks my situation is completely anxiety related, whereas general medicine doctors think I may have chest wall pain, GI pain ect... In addition, there is controversy over if my EKG is normal or not. Many cardiologists I've seen say it's a normal variant, while some others have said it's abnormal. At any rate, I'm working on losing weight, and following a new two pound diet with hope I can heal myself of these problems (along with the help of my family medicine doctor of course). Dr. Chung, whom is well known on the S.M.C for is expertise in the area of cardiology, also thinks I may have variant angina. Right now, I am waiting for another attack of pain so that I can call 911, and get this better documented. In the mean time, are there any suggestions on what I can do to take my mind off this? Losing weight and eating better are a great start, but I'm emotionally still scared from this whole experience. What have others done in my situation to get through the horrid symptoms and pain? Waiting seems awful... Thank you for all the support and kindness. I wish everyone well, and enjoy 2006! > Dear S.M.C, > > My story can be found here: And apparently in several other posts with different headings. Same post; different headings. Now what could that indicate? All having positive comment for Chung in virtually the same words. Almost like a macro. And other posts offering comment like, "Dr. Chung whom I've been told is one of the best), feels I may have variant angina" and "...thank Dr. Chung for is [sic] advice and wisdom in the area of cardiology." Q has been told that Chung is one of the best? Really? By whom? Is Q in the Atlanta area? And reading what Chung says here hasn't raised any questions? Give me a break. The URL's posted for "My story can be found here:" lead one to what reads like a particularly detailed offering of medical advice in a particularly detailed discussion unlikely from a 19-year-old. And all happening *without examination* - online. Much too technical a discussion for a teen-aged layman. Hey Q. Go see a doctor who is in the same room with you. This online business is foolish if you think there's something wrong with your body. I frankly find it next to impossible to believe that you've been to the ER 120 times in the past 3 years. Who's paying for it? And your other hospital and medical visits you've mentioned or implied? No insurance company will go for that. Looks like - at least - a couple hundred thousand dollars spent here. "Many cardiologists I've seen..." I love this one, "... following a new two pound diet with hope I can heal myself of these problems (along with the help of my family medicine doctor of course)." Who says "family medicine doctor? "...a new two pound diet..." Puhleeze. Looks like another Chung sockpuppet. Or an uncritical child with wonderfully detailed medical knowledge who needs to talk to an adult with psychiatric training. It's hard to imagine a 19-year-old writing the stuff and style below, particularly given the rather pedestrian writing. Don't buy it. Pastorio > http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/browse_frm/thread/42f3062d1a16 d325?tvc=1 > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > Thank you for all the support and kindness. I wish everyone well, and > enjoy 2006! Nope, I'm serious. Feel free to give me a call at 405-253-4306. > Nope, I'm serious. Feel free to give me a call at 405-253-4306. Would be interested to know if Bob does. It would be a monumental step toward his overcoming the fear he has of the truth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk >> Nope, I'm serious. Feel free to give me a call at 405-253-4306. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 >pm EST: What is this "glow" thing you always mention? Erikc (alt.atheist #002) | "An Fhirinne in aghaidh an tSaoil." BAAWA Knight (retired) | "The Truth against the World." Chung says: >Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things >like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following >this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 >pm EST: Erick asked: What is this "glow" thing you always mention? I think he's talking about masturbating. > Chung says: > >Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I think he's talking about masturbating. Your thinking is wrong. Without the LORD, things are never right. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, suffers a massive stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > Chung says: > > >Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Your thinking is wrong. No, mental masturbation seems a pretty accurate description. > Chung says: > >Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I think he's talking about masturbating. Hmmmm. Maybe it's the four-hour rapture thing you're supposed to ask your doctor about. > > Nope, I'm serious. Feel free to give me a call at 405-253-4306. > > Would be interested to know if Bob does. It would be a monumental step > toward his overcoming the fear he has of the truth. What fear? What truth? >>>Nope, I'm serious. Feel free to give me a call at 405-253-4306. >> >>Would be interested to know if Bob does. It would be a monumental step >>toward his overcoming the fear he has of the truth. > > What fear? What truth? Just more of Chung's madness speaking. He's taken so many heavy verbal shots from me that he looks for every opportunity to try to take a cheap shot. Like this. The concept of tautological statements is so far over his reduced mental capacity that he can't even see it when he's making demonstrably absurd statements like these. I did a reverse lookup today on that number. It's ostensibly in Norman, Oklahoma or environs but has no name listed for it. Looks like a wireless with a portable number, but no real person's name is connected to it. Q signs himself Nigel, but alas, no Nigel with that number. BTW, he has also posted here as Nigel. Pastorio Dear Bob, Did you mean for your feelings about Andrew to result in someone, who may be a little naive of the Internet, to publish their telephone number? In Christ's love Carol T > Dear Bob, > > Did you mean for your feelings about Andrew to result in someone, who > may be a little naive of the Internet, to publish their telephone > number? Hey moron Carol. What others do it what they do. I can't affect or control that. Stuff the guilt trip you're trying to lay on me straight up your butt. You're no better at reasoning than quack Andrew is. I wrote rather clearly what my feelings were and why I believe as I do, pity your reading comprehension is as bad as you've so often demonstrated. And, by the way, it's a welcome relief to see you not post your normal opaque fundamentalist, bible-as-convenience crap. The passive-aggressive guilt trip you're trying to lay on me is just as much crap, but at least you took only a few words and wrote them in a simple, if ridiculously loaded, sentence. Hallel... um, haillel... er, hooray. Idiot. Pastorio > > Dear Bob, > > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Hey moron Carol. If you were secure in the truth, you would have had the strength demonstrated by Carol and other Christians to resist the temptation of descending into namecalling. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > > Dear Bob, > > > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > demonstrated by Carol and other Christians to resist the temptation of > descending into namecalling. You mean like how you, with no evidence, call people liars? > > > > Dear Bob, > > > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > You mean like how you, with no evidence, call people liars? Though the LORD has given me a discerning heart so that I am able to discern the truth in the hearts of others, it remains my choice to refrain from namecalling. Nonethess, this is not about me. Instead this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider on a white horse wielding a bow: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (ie missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider on a fiery red horse wielding a sword: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, suffers a massive stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider on a black horse wielding a set of food scales: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to slay a fourth of the world's population using the world's wild animals: The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Note: The migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in article <1136964052.091372.263070@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: >Though the LORD has given me a discerning heart so that I am able to >discern the truth in the hearts of others, it remains my choice to >refrain from namecalling. >Nonethess, this is not about me. >Instead this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from >the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year >into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) You failed to discern that most Bible scholars estimate Jesus' birth to have occurred about 4BC to 6BC, so we're probably in the second decade of the third millennium.  SignatureDon Kirkman > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > article <1136964052.091372.263070@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > You failed to discern that most Bible scholars estimate Jesus' birth to > have occurred about 4BC to 6BC To discern is not the same thing as to notice. You would have known this had you been able to discern the truth. > , so we're probably in the second decade > of the third millennium. Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. If they did, they would have discerned that an omer is NOT a tenth of an ephah. For this you will remain in my prayers, dear Don whom I love, in Jesus' most precious and holy name. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > > If they did, they would have discerned that an omer is NOT a tenth of > an ephah. It's mentioned in Exodus 16:36 where it specifically says it's the tenth part of an ephah. It takes no scholarship to "discern" that an omer is a tenth of an ephah. It specifically says that in the bible, word for word. No discernment necessary. It's the absolute word of God, says Chung. Now he has decided that God's words aren't true. That the - literally - thousands of *scholars* who have worked with source materials for translations are *all wrong* every one - the whole lot is wrong and Chung is right. Oh, wait. He says above that "most Bible scholars" do not have discerning hearts. But the ones who do, by his standards, still say that an omer is a tenth part of an ephah. Logical nonsense from Chung. *NOT ONE SOURCE* says that an omer is a unit of weight. NOT ONE. The word "omer" is recognized as meaning "sheaf" or "heap" or "bundle" in Hebrew. Obviously a dry volumetric measure. But beyond that, it is an established piece of Judaism and Hebrew what the relative measures were in ancient times and what they meant. A few sources: "The law of grain offerings in Numbers 15:8-9 provides some instruction. We need to learn a little bit about Israelite measures. The smallest unit of measure is an omer. Three omers equal one seah. This seah is what is translated "measure" in Matthew 13:33, except it is in Greek — saton. There is also the ephah, which is ten omers." <http://bibletools.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Topical.show/RTD/CGG/ID/3593/Omer-.htm> "omer (= 1/10 ephah; also called issaron)" <http://tinyurl.com/dyj6u> "Omer (an ancient dry measure, and the Hebrew word for "sheaf")" <http://www.jhhrn.org/sn05-2004.html> "from '`amar' (6014); properly, a heap, i.e. a sheaf; also an omer, as a dry measure:--omer, sheaf." Strong's Hebrew Dictionary <http://www.sacrednamebible.com/kjvstrongs/STRHEB60.htm> "The homer was the standard unit of dry measurement. It was equal to approximately ten baths, or anywhere between 3.8 and 6.524 bushels. An ephah is one-tenth of a homer, or about 3/8 to 2/3 of a bushel. An omer is one-tenth of an ephah. [...] "Systems varied from country to country. Therefore, though there was much similarity, there were a variety of standards and lack of honesty and judgment came to be associated with measurements in some cases. This is why the "Talmud contained strict regulations for the business world concerning honesty of measurements." <http://www.mustardseed.net/html/tweightmeasure.html> KJV Ex. 16:22 And it came to pass, that on the sixth day they gathered twice as much bread, two omers for one man: and all the rulers of the congregation came and told Moses. Ex 16:32 And Moses said, This is the thing which the LORD commandeth, Fill an omer of it to be kept for your generations; that they may see the bread wherewith I have fed you in the wilderness, when I brought you forth from the land of Egypt. Ex 16:33 And Moses said unto Aaron, Take a pot, and put an omer full of manna therein, and lay it up before the LORD, to be kept for your generations. Ex 16:36 *Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah.* And those who assembled the English translation for the King James version were without "discernment" according to Chung, then the translators for all these bibles were also "undiscerning" because they all rendered the words identically but one. And that one still maintained the facts. Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah. (WEB) Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah. (ASV) Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah. (BBE) Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah. (DBY) Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah. (KJV) Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah. (WBS) Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah. (JPS) and the omer is a tenth of the ephah. (YLT) Some information about bible translations: <http://tinyurl.com/79al4> But Chung's real fixation is to force absurd definitions so he can assert that an omer is two pounds. He has contorted and distorted his words to try to make that view seem to endorse his Two Pound Diet which he now says isn't a diet. He thinks that *saying* that an omer is two pounds will show that God has endorsed the diet. He asserts that the 625,550 Jews wandering in the desert ate only an omer of manna and all prospered and were healthy eating what he says is the perfect amount of food for everybody under all conditions. Of course, no biblical passages refer to that dietary issue or supports it; he has made it up whole cloth. And manna, or "bread" in some translations, wasn't all they ate. They also had, specifically mentioned, quail. And even in the desert, there are things a gatherer can find to eat. KJV Ex 16:8 And Moses said, This shall be, when the LORD shall give you in the evening flesh to eat, and in the morning bread to the full; Ex 16:12 I have heard the murmurings of the children of Israel: speak unto them, saying, At even ye shall eat flesh, and in the morning ye shall be filled with bread; and ye shall know that I am the LORD your God. Ex 16:16, 17, 18 16This is the thing which the LORD hath commanded, Gather of it every man according to his eating, an omer for every man, according to the number of your persons; take ye every man for them which are in his tents. 17And the children of Israel did so, and gathered, some more, some less. 18And when they did mete it with an omer, he that gathered much had nothing over, and he that gathered little had no lack; they gathered every man according to his eating. The point was that the whole thing was a miracle. Each one gathered "some more, some less," not the same amount each. And the fact that everyone had the correct amount for him meant that it had to have been miraculous, and therefore not responsible to the gossamer logic of Chung. Everybody *didn't* consume an omer of manna. It was "every man according to his eating." Not every man ate the same amount. And they ate "meat in the evening" in addition to the manna of each morning. By no logic and by no scholarship, not even by inference, does Chung have even the most remote factuality behind his assertions on this subject. He's just dead wrong. Period. Pastorio > > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > It's mentioned in Exodus 16:36 where it specifically says it's the tenth > part of an ephah. For the NIV, this verse is in parentheses indicating that it was not part of the original text. May the LORD give you a discerning heart, someday, dear Bob whom I love, in Jesus' most precious and holy name. Amen. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, suffers a massive stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk >>>Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. >>> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > For the NIV, *ONE* translation of the bible out of all the ones I cited, you decide to use as your entire rationale for rejecting the fact that *every* English translation has the same verse in it, with all the authority that conveys... > this verse is in parentheses indicating that it was not > part of the original text. <LOL> Nice try, Andrew. But somehow that verse got into *every* English translation from *all* sources used in translating to all languages. Are you saying that *all* those translators working in 2500 languages decided to add the same thing to their translations even though it wasn't part of the original text? Maybe some sort of translational telepathy...? Obviously you haven't looked at the history behind the NIV. There was no single "original text" for any of the translations. They used the Masoretic text and many others including the Dead Sea Scrolls to arrive at the best translations in their eyes. Fascinating reading, you ought to take a look. And if you look at Hebrew versions of Exodus 16, there it is, big as the hole in your argument. <http://tinyurl.com/7hpu4> Or if you'd like to hear Exodus 16 read in Hebrew from the Masoretic text from a different source. Fairly easy to follow along with the reader. Adonai is God, Yisra-el (phonetic - Israel), Moshe - Moses, Ah-Ron - Aaron... And wait till you hear how clearly the reader pronounces "omer." You'll love it. <http://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt0216.htm> It's in the Septuagint: <http://tinyurl.com/7hpu4> The Vulgate has it: "gomor autem decima pars est oephi" Says that an omer is the tenth part of an ephah. <http://tinyurl.com/7hpu4> I know you'll be smiling with a heart full of gladness about the final truth about what an omer is, especially since you like the NIV bible translation for what you think permits you to weasel out of reality. Here, on the official NIV website, it says that an omer is a tenth of an ephah. And it gives a table of weights and measures that I'm sure you'll want to agree with, given your deep scholarship on the subject. <http://www.ibs.org/niv/table_measures.php> Andrew, you have not one source supporting your erroneous position that an omer is a unit of weight. Not one. In fact, every source that defines it as any kind of unit says it's a measure of volume; many give linguistic origins and meanings for the era when the bible was written with modern equivalents. Not one source supports your assertion. "I discern it" isn't a valid assertion to inform. Your "discernment" has been demonstrated to be faulty too many times for any credibility. Pastorio > >>>Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > >>> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > <LOL> Your despair will only grow deeper. > Nice try, Andrew. But somehow that verse got into *every* English > translation from *all* sources used in translating to all languages. Are > you saying that *all* those translators working in 2500 languages > decided to add the same thing to their translations even though it > wasn't part of the original text? No. I have written plainly. > Maybe some sort of translational > telepathy...? No. > Obviously you haven't looked at the history behind the NIV. Actually, I have. > There was no > single "original text" for any of the translations. The LORD is the single "original text" for HE is the living WORD. > They used the > Masoretic text and many others including the Dead Sea Scrolls to arrive > at the best translations in their eyes. Fascinating reading, you ought > to take a look. Actually, I have. > And if you look at Hebrew versions of Exodus 16, there it is, big as the > hole in your argument. > <http://tinyurl.com/7hpu4> Thank for the link. Would suggest you use the "compare" feature of the web site that you cite to line up all the translations of 16:36 to see that the indeed many translations have recognized the untruthfulness of 16:36 by either adding parentheses just like those in the NIV or dropped the verse altogether. The LORD promises woe to those who would either attempt to add to or propagate unauthorized additions to the Holy Bible. For this, you remain in my prayers, dear Bob whom I love, in Jesus' most precious and holy name. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, has suffered a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk >>>>>Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > No. I have written plainly. No. You haven't, actually. Starting with "text" which is written material, in the context. This nonsensical sentence, "The LORD is the single "original text" for HE is the living WORD" destroys your assertion since no one can translate that sort of "original text." How does one "translate" the lord? Nonsense. >>Maybe some sort of translational >>telepathy...? > > No. But no explanation why, since it's in old Hebrew texts, it's included in all translations. Still another weaseling. >>Obviously you haven't looked at the history behind the NIV. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > The LORD is the single "original text" for HE is the living WORD. <LOL> That's a mocking laugh, Andrew, so there's no mistaking it with your "discernment." >>They used the >>Masoretic text and many others including the Dead Sea Scrolls to arrive >>at the best translations in their eyes. Fascinating reading, you ought >>to take a look. > > Actually, I have. Then if that "original text" from which translations are made, well, I'm sure you see how you've figuratively painted yourself into a logical and linguistic corner. All those translators worked from *documents. That's what "original text" means. >>And if you look at Hebrew versions of Exodus 16, there it is, big as the >>hole in your argument. >><http://tinyurl.com/7hpu4> > > Thank for the link. Would suggest you use the "compare" feature of the > web site that you cite This is another cuteness of Chung's. So just because Andrew is such a snugglebunny, I did. Picked the first 5, and then the next 5, and the next 5, until all were compared. ... <http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=exodus%2016:36;&version=49;65;45;51;9;> <http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=exodus%2016:36;&version=47;46;50;48;8;> <http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=exodus%2016:36;&version=15;16;74;77;53;> <http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=exodus%2016:36;&version=73;64;74;77;53;> They all included the verse. The Hebrew "original text" adds, "An omer is one tenth of an ephah." In the CEV " omer" is usually translated "two quarts." Other translations offer different words, but every one has essentially the same idea derived from "original text" documents. And the commentary said, "But those who ate manna, hungered again, died at last, and with many of them God was not well pleased..." So much for the 625,550 who prospered eating manna. > to line up all the translations of 16:36 to see > that the indeed many translations have recognized the untruthfulness of > 16:36 by either adding parentheses just like those in the NIV or dropped > the verse altogether. So let me see if I understand this. The bible is the absolute word of God, correct in every thought because he guided its creation and expression. Thousands of scholars have worked on translating it in the various versions and *every one of them did it wrong if they included Exodus 16:36*. People working from many, many documents from Hebrew sources and even compared with Dead Sea Scrolls which document the later copies as valid. Chung now says that Exodus 16:36 is "untruthful" and that must mean that thousands of diligent scholars were all led astray in the same direction, over centuries and many countries. People who had little or no contact with each other. Not just the English versions, but *all* versions include that verse in its stark rebuttal to everything Chung is trying to foist off with his two pound diet. Passages in the bible that are "untruthful." Amazing... But, funny thing, all the translations accessed - *all the translations* - have that verse. That's truly funny in a chilling sort of way. Now Andrew is dropping verses of the bible that disagree with his demented view of it. <LOL> That's genuinely funny. Chung edits the bible to suit his diet. What could be funnier? Chung the biblical critic. Bwah... > The LORD promises woe to those who would either attempt to add to or > propagate unauthorized additions to the Holy Bible. "...unauthorized...?" So now Chung is deciding what's "authorized" in the bible. <LOL> It gets curiouser and curiouser... Here's some translator instruction for Chung, even though he claims to know Chinese and should know about the different kinds of translations. Look at this page for a moment to see what the intentions of the different translations were: <http://www.zondervanbibles.com/translations.htm> Note that they had different agendas for the different translations. The NIV that Chung is so fond of for this case is described thusly: # The NIV is literal where possible and "thought-for-thought" where necessary to help the reader understand # The NIV is the best balance between accuracy and readibility # Reading Level: 7.80 Seventh grade reading level. The King James, OTOH, is described this way: # Reference Support Material: High # Number of Translators: 54 # Translation Philosophy/Format: Word-for-word # Reading Level: 12.00 Note the "word-for-word" description. Exodus 16:36 is translated "word-for-word" from "original text" documents. It says, "Now an omer is the tenth part of an ephah." Period. Chung is now saying that at least one part of the bible is untruthful, in direct and absolute contradiction to his earlier positions. It opens the door to looking at other verses, chapters, even whole books and saying that they're "untruthful" as well. So now Chung can tailor the bible even more to suit his febrile dementia than he does now. Not just ignore passages, but strike them as he will. Could anyone take this sort of lunacy seriously? This is a new sort of madness from him. Editing the bible... truly astonishing. Pastorio > >>>>>Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > assertion since no one can translate that sort of "original text." How > does one "translate" the lord? Nonsense. Those who have chosen to walk with Christ are learning directly from HIM, Who is the living WORD. The omer is an amount of manna specified by the LORD. For this reason, the omer is a unit measure that has no peer so that it most certainly is a weight measure that is not subordinate to a volume measure such as the ephah as suggested by "(An omer is one tenth of an ephah)" which as an included verse of Exodus 16:36, stands out as a non sequitur, betraying it as a failed human addition to the WORD. Those who have discerning hearts will know this. May the LORD give you a discerning heart, someday, dear Bob whom I love, in Jesus' most precious and holy name. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, suffers a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > > > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the NIV, this verse is in parentheses indicating that it was not > part of the original text. "Not part of the original text." That's funny, considering how the bible was cobbled together. > > > > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > > > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > "Not part of the original text." That's funny, considering how the > bible was cobbled together. The LORD is the living WORD... the "original text." Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, has suffered a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > > > > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > The LORD is the living WORD... the "original text." Interesting. So where, exactly, can we find the original "the LORD" written down, so we can compare that to what we have now? If it's living, what does it eat and excrete? What does it breathe? How does it reproduce? How long does it live? You're really getting twisted up, Andy. > > > > > > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Interesting. Infinitely. > So where, exactly, can we find the original "the LORD" > written down, so we can compare that to what we have now? We can't. > If it's > living, what does it eat and excrete? The LORD need not do either. > What does it breathe? The LORD need not breathe. > How does > it reproduce? The LORD need not reproduce. > How long does it live? The LORD is forever. > You're really getting twisted up, Andy. The LORD continues to guide me in everything I say, do, and write. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, has suffered a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > > > > > > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. > > > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > We can't. Ah. So you were lying when you said "For the NIV, this verse is in parentheses indicating that it was not part of the original text." > > If it's > > living, what does it eat and excrete? > > The LORD need not do either. Please name one real living thing that doesn't eat and excrete. > > What does it breathe? > > The LORD need not breathe. Please name one real living thing that doesn't breathe. > > How does > > it reproduce? > > The LORD need not reproduce. Please name one real living thing that doesn't reproduce. > > How long does it live? > > The LORD is forever. Please name one real thing that lives forever. > > You're really getting twisted up, Andy. > > The LORD continues to guide me in everything I say, do, and write. You're lying to yourself. It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in article <43C4FEBF.6B34098F@heartmdphd.com>: >> > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. >> > If they did, they would have discerned that an omer is NOT a tenth of >> > an ephah. >> It's mentioned in Exodus 16:36 where it specifically says it's the tenth >> part of an ephah. >For the NIV, this verse is in parentheses indicating that it was not >part of the original text. And how did you "discern" that "truth"? No commentary that I found in a Google search say that; one suggests that v. 36 should immediately follow v. 18, but none suggest that the words are not in the Hebrew text. Parenthesis are to enclose incidental comments, not to expunge something from a text. >Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th >chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the >third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) Following your principle, the words "we are now in the 6th year into the third millennium after the birth of the Son of Man" cannot be part of your original text. SignatureDon Kirkman > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > article <43C4FEBF.6B34098F@heartmdphd.com>: [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > And how did you "discern" that "truth"? The LORD has given me a discerning heart for this purpose. May the LORD give you a discerning heart, someday, dear Don whom I love, in Jesus' most precious and holy name. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, suffers a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in article <1137052672.556160.10710@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: >> It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in >> article <43C4FEBF.6B34098F@heartmdphd.com>: >> >> > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. >> >> > If they did, they would have discerned that an omer is NOT a tenth of >> >> > an ephah. >> >> It's mentioned in Exodus 16:36 where it specifically says it's the tenth >> >> part of an ephah. >> >For the NIV, this verse is in parentheses indicating that it was not >> >part of the original text. >>And how did you "discern" that "truth"? No commentary that I found in a >>Google search say that; one suggests that v. 36 should immediately >>follow v. 18, but none suggest that the words are not in the Hebrew >>text. Parenthesis are to enclose incidental comments, not to expunge >>something from a text. >>>Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th >>>chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the >>>third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) >>Following your principle, the words "we are now in the 6th year into the >>third millennium after the birth of the Son of Man" cannot be part of >>your original text. >The LORD has given me a discerning heart for this purpose. SignatureDon Kirkman > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > article <1137052672.556160.10710@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > >>And how did you "discern" that "truth"? <attempt to alter my response snipped> > >The LORD has given me a discerning heart for this purpose. May the LORD give you a discerning heart someday, dear Don whom I love, in Jesus' most precious and holy name. Amen. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, suffers a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in article <1137056661.465695.319930@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>: >> It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in >> article <1137052672.556160.10710@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: >> >> It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in >> >> article <43C4FEBF.6B34098F@heartmdphd.com>: >> >> >> > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. >> >> >> > If they did, they would have discerned that an omer is NOT a tenth of >> >> >> > an ephah. >> >> >> It's mentioned in Exodus 16:36 where it specifically says it's the tenth >> >> >> part of an ephah. >> >> >For the NIV, this verse is in parentheses indicating that it was not >> >> >part of the original text. >> >>And how did you "discern" that "truth"? ><attempt to alter my response snipped> No, my original statement restored, your dishonesty notwithstanding. >>And how did you "discern" that "truth"? No commentary that I found in a >>Google search say that; one suggests that v. 36 should immediately >>follow v. 18, but none suggest that the words are not in the Hebrew >>text. Parenthesis are to enclose incidental comments, not to expunge >>something from a text. >>>Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th >>>chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the >>>third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) >>Following your principle, the words "we are now in the 6th year into the >>third millennium after the birth of the Son of Man" cannot be part of >>your original text. End of restoration SignatureDon Kirkman > > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > > article <43C4FEBF.6B34098F@heartmdphd.com>: [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > The LORD has given me a discerning heart for this purpose. Did "the LORD" delude you for that same purpose? >> Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > It specifically says that in the bible, word for word. No discernment > necessary. Of course "discernment" is required. I mean, if you define "discernment" to mean "make it mean whatever I want it to mean." SignatureMark K. Bilbo -------------------------------------------------- Charity hospital closes for good http://makeashorterlink.com/?F3D51207C A city on hold http://makeashorterlink.com/?Y3E55207C If Katrina was a "judgment," god hates poor people and churches but loves a good party... http://www.nola.com/mardigras/ "Everything New Orleans" http://www.nola.com > > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > > article <1136964052.091372.263070@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > To discern is not the same thing as to notice. You would have known > this had you been able to discern the truth. Nice dodge; you completely avoided addressing the point. > > , so we're probably in the second decade > > of the third millennium. > > Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. You're more discerning about the bible than actual bible scholars? Golly, how vain and arrogant. You think "the LORD" doesn't want bible scholars to figure out it's little book for some reason? > > > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > > > article <1136964052.091372.263070@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Nice dodge Was not a dodge. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, has suffered a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > > > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > > > > article <1136964052.091372.263070@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Was not a dodge. http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/dodge Main Entry: 1dodge Pronunciation: 'däj Function: noun Etymology: origin unknown 1 a : an artful device to evade, deceive, or trick You evaded the point (and poorly, at that). Hence, you dodged. Therefore, you're now lying. Keep it up. > > > > > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > > > > > article <1136964052.091372.263070@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > Etymology: origin unknown > 1 a : an artful device to evade, deceive, or trick Thank you for showing that writing truthfully is not a dodge. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, has suffered a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > > > > > It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in > > > > > > article <1136964052.091372.263070@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > Thank you for showing that writing truthfully is not a dodge. On the contrary, what I've shown is that you used a device to evade the point. You're now doing it again; why are you afraid to acknowledge that "most Bible scholars estimate Jesus' birth to have occurred about 4BC to 6BC"? Is it because that would make you wrong about "(we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man)"? Let me guess, you also think this fictional character was born on December 25th? It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in article <1136968320.932173.277450@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>: >> It seems to me I heard somewhere that Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote in >> article <1136964052.091372.263070@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: >> >Nonethess, this is not about me. Bwhahahah! >> >Instead this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from >> >the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year >> >into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man): >> You failed to discern that most Bible scholars estimate Jesus' birth to >> have occurred about 4BC to 6BC >To discern is not the same thing as to notice. You would have known >this had you been able to discern the truth. No matter; you've neither discerned nor noticed the truth that lies around you in the real world. >> , so we're probably in the second decade >> of the third millennium. >Moreover, most Bible scholars, like you, do not have discerning hearts. Thank you for acknowledging, however unartfully, my possession of a discerning heart. >If they did, they would have discerned that an omer is NOT a tenth of >an ephah. But they have discerned that your assertion of the timing is based on the faulty calculations and assumptions of the good Bishop Usher and the manuscripts available to him in the 16th century, whereas the scholars now have better manuscripts as well as a better understanding of the historical Jewish/Hebrew culture and idiom than the bishop did. They, unlike Bishop Usher, do not believe the universe was created in 4004BC. Since you have rejected evolution may we assume you believe the universe was created a little over six millennia ago? The scholars also have discerned that the Jewish people know more about the meaning of Hebrew words than you do, including the measure of an ephah and an omer.. I much prefer discernings that make a difference, not vapid mutterings. SignatureDon Kirkman > > > > > Dear Bob, > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > discern the truth in the hearts of others, it remains my choice to > refrain from namecalling. So when you accuse people of being liars with no evidence to back up your assertions, that isn't namecalling, but when people accuse you of being dishonest and hateful, with evidence to back up their assertions, that is namecalling? Perhaps you could explain the difference, but I bet not. And on top of all that, you claim to know what's in another's heart; that's called LYING, Andy. > > > > > > Dear Bob, > > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > being dishonest and hateful, with evidence to back up their assertions, > that is namecalling? I have written plainly enough to obviate any need to answer your untruthful question. > Perhaps you could explain the difference, but I > bet not. The truth requires no explanation. > And on top of all that, you claim to know what's in another's > heart; No, the LORD has not given me HIS gift of clairvoyance in addition to the discerning heart. > that's called LYING, Andy. It remains my choice to continue writing truthfully. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, has suffered a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > > > > > > Dear Bob, > > > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > I have written plainly enough to obviate any need to answer your > untruthful question. So now you're claiming you HAVEN'T called others liars? And yet my question is somehow "untruthful"? That's a neat trick. I'd ask you to explain it, but I can discern your answer. > > Perhaps you could explain the difference, but I > > bet not. > > The truth requires no explanation. Looky there, a lying dodge. > > And on top of all that, you claim to know what's in another's > > heart; > > No, the LORD has not given me HIS gift of clairvoyance in addition to > the discerning heart. "the LORD has given me a discerning heart so that I am able to discern the truth in the hearts of others" So which is it? > > that's called LYING, Andy. > > It remains my choice to continue writing truthfully. Oops, another whopper. > > > > > > > > Dear Bob, > > > > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > So now you're claiming you HAVEN'T called others liars? Truth is not a claim. > And yet my > question is somehow "untruthful"? It is. > That's a neat trick. Truth is not a trick. > I'd ask you to > explain it, but I can discern your answer. It is clear that you are unable to discern the truth. > > > Perhaps you could explain the difference, but I > > > bet not. > > > > The truth requires no explanation. > > Looky there, a lying dodge. Truth is not a dodge. > > > And on top of all that, you claim to know what's in another's > > > heart; [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > So which is it? Both statements are truthful. > > > that's called LYING, Andy. > > > > It remains my choice to continue writing truthfully. > > Oops, another whopper. You remind me of the blind man who would feign vision among the seeing. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, has suffered a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk > > > > > > > > > Dear Bob, > > > > > > > > > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Truth is not a claim. Yes, in fact it is. Are you now admitting you've called others liars? > > And yet my > > question is somehow "untruthful"? > > It is. How can a question be "untruthful," Andy? > > That's a neat trick. > > Truth is not a trick. What you're spouting isn't the truth. > > I'd ask you to > > explain it, but I can discern your answer. > > It is clear that you are unable to discern the truth. I've discerned the truth of your delusions and dishonesty. > > > > Perhaps you could explain the difference, but I > > > > bet not. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Truth is not a dodge. Then why did you dodge? > > > > And on top of all that, you claim to know what's in another's > > > > heart; [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Both statements are truthful. That's called "a contradiction," Andy, when you claim both "A" and "Not-A." > > > > that's called LYING, Andy. > > > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > You remind me of the blind man who would feign vision among the seeing. You remind me of the man so desperate to protect himself from the harsh reality of the world his lies to himself become progressively more complex and tenuous. >> > > > Dear Bob, >> > > > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Though the LORD has given me a discerning heart Funny that it doesn''t work for seeing yourself. >Nonethess, this is not about me. No, it is precisely about you and the damage you are doing to your own cause. jim > >> > > > Dear Bob, > >> > > > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Funny that it doesn''t work for seeing yourself. It seems you have confused the LORD's gift of a discerning heart with HIS gift of vision. > >Nonethess, this is not about me. > > No, it is precisely about you You have the free will that the LORD has generously given you to believe what you choose to believe. > and the damage you are doing to your own > cause. The LORD continues to guide me in everything I say, do, and write so that HIS purpose for my informing people is realized. Please consider yourself so informed. The 4 horsemen are now here to convince everyone that heeding the information that has been provided is wise. For this you will remain in my prayers, dear Jim whom I love, in Jesus' name. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, has suffered a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic: http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp (4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth": The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic is here: http://tinyurl.com/amj4a Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the earth. Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/12/2006) from 6 to 7 pm EST: http://tinyurl.com/cpayh For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how the LORD has reshaped me: http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt Prayerfully in Christ's love, Andrew http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk >> >> > > > Dear Bob, >> >> > > > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >It seems you have confused the LORD's gift of a discerning heart with >HIS gift of vision. I have confused nothing. You haven't a clue. >> >Nonethess, this is not about me. >> >> No, it is precisely about you > >You have the free will that the LORD has generously given you to believe >what you choose to believe. Truth hurts you a bit doesn't it, like when I started something very accurately about you and you compared it to a slap in the face. That says it all. >> and the damage you are doing to your own >> cause. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >yourself so informed. The 4 horsemen are now here to convince everyone >that heeding the information that has been provided is wise. You falsely believe this. You are the only one ignorant of that fact. >For this you will remain in my prayers, dear Jim whom I love, in Jesus' >name. Thanks for the commendation to hell. jim > >> >> > > > Dear Bob, > >> >> > > > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > I have confused nothing. Without the LORD, there is only confusion. May the LORD help you with your confusion someday, dear Jim whom I love, in Jesus' most precious and holy name. Amen. Now this is about the works of the four riders on horseback from the 6th chapter of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third millenium after the birth of the Son of Man) (1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse: "See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine. (2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse: Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east, suffers a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon. (3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse: The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the 2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates with growing worldwide concerns |
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