Statin induced memory loss is very like normal memory loss; that is
exactly why it is often overlooked by the person experiencing it,
health care practitioners and others. There isn't some new variety of
memory loss which only happens with statins.

I don't think it's wise to supplement with folate without talking it
over with one's physician. Folate supplementation may not be innocent;
it can mask a B12 deficiency, and there is no one-size fits all for how
much or what to take to circumvent that.

Below, a discussion with David Rind on the issue of Folate
supplementation:

"Zee wrote:

Hard to know from this study, but the results are at least mildly
concerning. Others have worried that folate can promote cell turnover
and so could increase the risk of tumors. I would guess we'll see a
series of other articles looking at long term outcomes after trials of
folate to see if there's evidence of increased cancer risk. These
current data are very preliminary.

--
David Rind
d...@caregroup.harvard.edu"
~~~~~~~~~~~~~

In the absence of definitive evidence (like a large randomized trial of
folate supplementation for primary prevention of heart disease) we're
all left with making our best guesses about what does or does not make
sense to do. Personally, if my only risk factor for coronary heart
disease were an elevated homocysteine level, I would not take high dose
folate supplementation.

And, in general, if I thought my risk for coronary heart disease were
too high because of some series of risk factors, I would take a statin
whatever those risk factors actually were. That's because my
interpretation of the various evidence is that just about everyone can
expect around a 25 percent reduction in their risk of coronary disease
by taking a statin. This relative reduction translates into a pretty
small absolute decrease in people at low risk and a pretty large
absolute decrease in people at high risk, but it's there for just about
every group of people that has been studied. (People on dialysis are
probably an exception to this.)

I suppose it could turn out that statins increase the risk of cancer,
but there's certainly no strong evidence in that direction currently.
In
fact, there's some weak evidence to suggest that they decrease the risk
of various cancers. In any case, in the large trials of statins overall
mortality has been pretty consistently reduced. So if statins have bad
side effects, they do not seem to be large enough to overwhelm the
favorable effects of statins on mortality, at least in people at
increased risk for coronary heart disease.

--
David Rind
d...@caregroup.harvard.edu

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Juhana Harju wrote:

Maybe. But even if the analysis in the above study is correct, it's
possible that you could be decreasing the risk of strokes but
increasing
the risks of cancer. This is not to say that I think a daily supplement
with 400 mcg of folate is a bad idea -- just that we really don't have
strong evidence on the issue the original poster raised as to whether
folate supplementation could have harmful effects.

I added a B complex that contains the above.

Sun!! :)

Bill

Yes, I check for safety before leaving the house.  To make sure
the oven is not on, for one.  Luckily we have an iron that shuts
itself off within a short period of time.  Before I made it an
iron clad rule to check everything, I would find myself halfway
down the block and need to return.  Once I found water boiling on
the stove and that did it.

While small memory glitches can happen at any age, pervasive memory
loss is not normal in one's 40s and 50s or even 60s and 70s.

Efforts to minimize the seriousness of statin induced cognitive adverse
effect is typical of what those taking statins and injured by them did,
until it was too late.

Do not attribute memory problems to aging or allow your physicians to
do that. This is not only ageist but dangerous.

Memory loss is a symptom not a joke. And brain damage from statins may
be irreversible.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Doug Peterson has not recovered from his statin induce brain injury. He
is  much worse than depicted here, January 2004, and has been diagnosed
with damage to his cerebellum.

LIFE AFTER LIPITOR: Is Pfizer product a quick fix or dangerous drug?

Residents experience adverse reactions

By Melissa Siig, Tahoe World Staff

At first glance, Tahoe City resident Doug Peterson looks like he is
recovering from a stroke.

His speech is slurred, he has difficulty walking in a straight line,
and he can't sign his own name. By afternoon, he is so fatigued he has
to sit down for the rest of the day. When asked his age, Peterson says
he is 52. His wife Karla, standing nearby, corrects him. He is 53.

Doug has never had a heart attack, and until the onset of the symptoms
almost three years ago, was an active skier, biker and scuba diver. Now
he is limited to walks on the treadmill. Doug traces his problems to a
drug he started taking almost three years before his health began
deteriorating - Lipitor. Two other Tahoe City locals have also
experienced negative side effects from taking Lipitor or other statins,
the name for a family of cholesterol-fighting pills.

While there is no concrete evidence linking Doug's health problems to
Lipitor, after doing years of research, meeting with doctors and
talking to other statin sufferers all over the world online, he and
Karla are convinced of the connection. Pfizer, the maker of Lipitor,
claims the drug is effective in lowering cholesterol and has minor
side-effects. But as Doug and others would ask, is it worth it?

WONDER DRUG OR DANGEROUS PILL?

Doug, who has hereditary high cholesterol, was first prescribed
Mevacor, a statin made by Merck, in 1998. Six months later, his doctor
had him switch to Lipitor, which comes in higher doses, and upped his
dosage from 10 to 20 mg. His cholesterol dropped from 285 to a low of
160.

"The doctor was very pleased," said Doug, "but meanwhile the symptoms
started."

In the fall of 2000, Doug began having restless sleep patterns. His
twitching and flying arms got so bad that Karla had to sleep in another
room. One time, Doug even fell out of bed. The couple didn't think
anything was seriously wrong until a few months later when Doug started
slurring his words. This was followed by a loss of balance and the
beginning of what Doug calls the "statin shuffle" - a slow, wobbly walk
across a room. Next to slide was Doug's fine motor skills. It took him
five minutes to write four words, much of which was illegible. Finally,
he tired easily and his cognitive memory processing diminished. He had
trouble following books with complex plots.

Confounded by Doug's illness, over the next two years the Petersons
traveled all over California meeting with neurologists, internists and
acupuncturists. Doug had MRIs, brain scans and neurofeedback tests
done. Last February, Doug's doctor suggested he go off Lipitor to see
if the drug was causing his health problems. After three weeks, the
symptoms persisted, so the doctor put Doug back on the pill. Since Doug
wasn't exhibiting the most common side effect, muscle cramps, and his
liver function tests came back normal, the physician was doublly sure
that Lipitor was not to blame.

Finally, last spring, a doctor in Pasadena suggested Lipitor could be
the culprit. Doug went off the drug in May, and since then his symptoms
have stopped their downward spiral and his health has slowly started to
improve. According to Karla, his mind is sharper, his balance is better
and his speech is more clear in the mornings, before he gets tired. But
he still has a long way to go.

"Before, I was a good father and family person," said Doug, who has two
children with Karla. "At this point, I can't do that much."

A former Navy diver and owner of Sierra Tahoe Computers, a repair and
service business, Doug has had to cut down his work schedule because of
his fatigue and loss of hand coordination. He is considering going on
disability, but Karla remains optimistic.

"We are hoping he is going to get better. That's our number one goal,"
she said. "Anger is a waste of energy at this point. We are trying to
recover and get the word out."

DID PFIZER DO ENOUGH STUDIES?

Since Parke-Davis (later acquired by Pfizer) developed Lipitor in 1997,
it has become the number one prescribed cholesterol-lowering drug in
the United States, with more than 18 million Americans having been
prescribed the drug. New York City-based Pfizer, the world's largest
pharmaceutical company, derives a quarter of its $32 billion in annual
sales from Lipitor, according to an article in SmartMoney. With sales
expected to top $10 billion this year, Lipitor is poised to become the
largest-selling pharmaceutical in history, surpassing Pfizer's other
wonder drug, Viagra.

Lipitor is proven to lower total cholesterol by 29 to 45 percent. As
with any prescription, it comes with a list of possible side effects,
such as muscle pain or weakness and liver dysfunction. Pfizer's Web
site states, "The most commonly reported side effects are gas,
constipation, stomach pain and indigestion. They are usually mild and
tend to go away." In a nine-month study of 2,502 patients, Pfizer found
that more serious side effects, such as facial paralysis, colon
inflammation and gallbladder pain, occurred in less than 2 percent of
those treated.

Pfizer was unable to commment on reported adverse side effects in time
for the Tahoe World's deadline.

The problem, say the Petersons, is that Pfizer has not conducted any
long-term studies. Doug's health issues didn't start for two and a half
years after he started taking Lipitor. Similarly, Tahoe City
psychologist John Altrocchi, 75, was on Mevacor for around three years
when he started to develop calf pain that became so severe he could
hardly walk. He also experienced a case of temporary memory loss called
transient global amnesia (TGA), which has been linked with statins. A
day after watching the 1998 Super Bowl game, Altrocchi had no memory of
the event.

"There's no way you could prove that Mevacor was responsible for the
TGA, but it's very possible," said Altrocchi, who stopped taking the
drug about three years ago and convinced his brother, a retired
neurologist, to go off Lipitor. "Especially for older men, I think it's
wise to get off statins right away. There is very little evidence they
do much good."

While most symptoms seem to start after a few years, Ed Ontiveros of
Homewood began having physical problems within 30 days of taking
Lipitor. After experiencing muscle aches and weakness for a few days,
the 75-year old fell in the bathroom and didn't have the strength to
get up. Since going off the drug, he's had no problems.

"It [reduced cholesterol] is not worth it with the side effects," said
Ontiveros. "You may not live as long, but you sure don't want to die
earlier."

Doctors are quick to prescribe Lipitor, says Karla, because they
perceive it as a magic bullet in the battle against cardiovascular
disease, the leading cause of death for Americans, and it's easier than
prescribing a long-term regime of healthy diet and exercise. But the
evidence that high cholesterol leads to heart disease is not
conclusive, said Altrocchi, and there is even speculation that
cholesterol provides protection for the brain and spine.

THE ROAD TO RECOVERY

The Petersons say Pfizer is too powerful to take on alone, but would
consider joining a class-action lawsuit against the company. However,
lawyers have told them a lawsuit is only possible if Lipitor gets
recalled by the Food and Drug Administration. (Another statin, Baycol,
was recalled by Bayor in 2001 after 31 people died of kidney failure
while on the drug.) The Petersons filled out a complaint on the FDA Web
page and encourage other Lipitor sufferers to do the same.

Frustrated by doctors who doubt the connection between Lipitor and
health problems, the Petersons are awaiting the results of a study
being conducted by Dr. Beatrice Golomb, a neurologist at the University
of California-San Diego, on the effects of statin drugs. As reported by
the Wall Street Journal this week, Golomb found that 15 percent of
statin patients developed some cognitive side effects. In the meantime,
the couple is focusing on Doug's recovery and staying positive.

"At this point, I consider myself lucky I'm not in a wheelchair," said
Doug, who is currently in phsyical therapy. "There are no guarantees in
life. Your birth certificate doesn't come with a warranty."

Yes I saw the first two as well, and couldn't even pronounce (make a
habit of not posting what I can't pronounce...).

As the study I posted up-thread mentioned (and that is not the
study/author I referred to regarding a private e-mail caution re
folate) there is cause for concern about supplementing, for everyone.

There may be justified application in certain cases, but I'll now wait
for the evidence.

I find it disturbing that many women will take the advice of a male
poster just because he's male. I have seen it happen over and over, to
the detriment of one who 'listened' last year, and now has disabling
peripheral neuropathy and mitochondrial myopathy from her 'recommended'
statin. I think this plays a role in many women's statin injury; they
are too quick to defer.

Zee
(sans defer)

Elevated homocysteine is a marker for folate and or B12 deficiency. They
might be more sensitive than an actual B12 blood level as different
compartments have different concentration levels. You may have normal blood
B12 levels but be deficient in the CNS.
Taking a vitamin pill may or may not do the trick. B12 absorption involving
intrinsic factor and normal gastric function.
Sublingual or shots with high doses are really needed before one can make
any conclusions on the nature of homocysteine elevation.