(snip)
> I am going for my psa on Feb. 22-08 On my last
> visit to the Uro. the physicians asst. said if your psa
> is o.1 the Dr. will recommend stopping H.T. with
> monitoring the psa. He said all the doctors here
> stop H.T. at a psa of o.1 & have been on H.T for 1 yr. There are 8
> or 10 doctors at this office.
(snip)
So Art is depending upon a surgeon, which is what a urologist is, to
treat him for a condition that is not treatable via surgery.
That won't work. Urologists are usually not qualified to treat any
illness of the genito-urinary system (nor any other system) that is not
amenable to treatment by surgery.
I most earnestly recommend that Art seek the advice of a genuine cancer
specialist, a medical oncologist. Preferably one who is well-qualified
in treatment (tx) of prostate cancer (PCa).
Some of those specialists are listed through this page of the
authoritative website of the Prostate Cancer Research Insititute (PCRI):
http://prostate-cancer.org/resource/find-a-physician.html
Regards,
Steve J
"We must tailor the treatment to the nature of the disease. We must
listen to the biology."
-- Stephen B. Strum, MD
Medical Oncologist
Art,
I see a medical oncologist that specializes in PCa. I asked him about
stopping Eligard. His response was simple yet firm. "Do you want your PSA to
go up?"
I wish you success in your fight.
Gourd Dancer
I have been on Eligard since May 2004.
> Hi, The last time I asked for help on when to start
> H.T. I started H.T. when my psa was about 4 or 5
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
> group. I would not be able to make it through this mess if it weren't
> for all of you. Thanks, Art
I.P. Freely - 23 Feb 2008 03:22 GMT
> Art,
>
> I see a medical oncologist that specializes in PCa. I asked him about
> stopping Eligard. His response was simple yet firm. "Do you want your PSA to
> go up?"
My next comment would be, "PSA is a number on a piece of paper. QOL and
longevity are *real* and tangible. Which of those would be affected, and
by how much, by stopping my Eligard?"
I.P.
Art,
I'll begin with the standard disclaimer. I'm not a doctor and
can't credibly play one on the Internet.
I'll follow that with nods to the other three posters:
1. Steve J. suggests a visit to a medical oncologist specializing
in prostate cancer. That's good advice, much better than any I
can give you.
2. Gourd Dancer says that he was told that PSA will go up when
you stop HT. I'm sure that's true.
3. I.P. says PSA is a number. It is not a direct measure either
of quality of life or of longevity. That's also very true.
And now for Alan Meyer's two cents - or maybe it's only worth one
cent:
There have been a number of studies of intermittent hormone
therapy vs. continuous HT. You need to check these out for
yourself because my recollection may be faulty, but I seem to
recall that intermittent therapy works for patients who achieve a
low PSA on HT. Their longevity is not reduced and may be a
little increased, and their quality of life is improved.
Now for another penny's worth:
There are different ways to do intermittent therapy. You can set
a target PSA and go back on when you reach it. I would think
you'd need a regular schedule of PSA tests to find out when you
hit the target. Different doctors probably recommend different
target PSAs.
You could take other drugs during the off period. Some docs use
finasteride or dutasteride - which provide some anti-cancer
capability with fewer side effects.
IIRC Strum gives triple ADT (an LHRH agonist like Lupron, an
anti-androgen like Casodex, and a 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor
like dutasteride.) Then, if the patient reaches 0.05 PSA for
some period of time, they stay on dutasteride alone until the PSA
goes back up.
To sum up, I think that what your urologist is offering you is
probably good, but you could maybe do it better, or more
precisely, if you were able to consult with a real expert in this
stuff - which was Steve's original recommendation.
Best of luck.
Alan
Steve Jordan - 23 Feb 2008 23:52 GMT
On February 23, Alan Meyer replied to Art, in pertinent part:
> To sum up, I think that what your urologist is offering you is
> probably good, but you could maybe do it better, or more
> precisely, if you were able to consult with a real expert in this
> stuff - which was Steve's original recommendation.
Thanks for the vote of confidence.
Few in this gang would be surprised to know that it just drives me
bonkers to see my brothers undergoing treatment from medics who are not
qualified by education nor training to give it.
Would you have your dentist perform an RP?
Of course, there's that oft-told lie that medical oncologists (med oncs)
invariably prescribe "drug" treatments (txs) notwithstanding the
allegedly awful consequences and notwithstanding that there are other
txs available. Lawn fertilizer.
Well, kids, I believe that med oncs all too often first see patients who
present with advanced disease, having been maltreated by uros and
sometimes other medics. What's to be done? Usually, it's the next line
of defense: drugs. There is nothing left to the patient.
Anecdote: I fired by written notice a rad onc who refused even to read
what Strum had to say about my case, and who refused to consider
bringing aboard a med onc. Overboard he went. Splash. Glub. :-)
Regards,
Steve J
" ... The Universe is what it is, and it never forgives mistakes--not
even ignorant ones ... "
--Robert A. Heinlein
Arthur Johnson - 25 Feb 2008 01:08 GMT
Alan,
Thanks for your well thoughtout reply. I agree with everything you have
stated in your post. The info.
on Dr. Strums prescribed H.T. treatment was very
helpful.
Thank you Alen, your help is most appreciated.