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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / June 2007PSA
Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature.  SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA <.1 <.1 <.1 .27 .37 .75 PSAD 0.19 years EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 PSAD .056 years Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 and every 4 months there after PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 PSAD 1.4 years Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) Non Illegitimi Carborundum > Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. Gosh, Steve; you scared me a bit, as I couldn't see the end of your message in the teensy window I have here. I know you were nervous about that 0.05 ... I'm glad it's back down where it belongs. Keep those low numbers coming! Did you do anything different in the last few months? --charlie > Did you do anything different in the last few months? I added Capsacin about 6 months ago. That's about the only thing. I recently re-started by Vitamin D. Stopping it was an oversight, but I just started again about two weeks ago. Oh, and it's nice weather here. Since April I have been back to 3-5 miles a day, 3-5 days a week. Lots of sun, too. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA <.1 <.1 <.1 .27 .37 .75 PSAD 0.19 years EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 PSAD .056 years Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 and every 4 months there after PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 PSAD 1.4 years Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) Non Illegitimi Carborundum > I recently re-started byVitamin D. Stopping it was an oversight, but I > just started again about two weeks ago. Just curious, how much Vitamin D do you take, and is it D3 or D2? Thanks, John > > I recently re-started byVitamin D. Stopping it was an oversight, but I > > just started again about two weeks ago. > > Just curious, how much Vitamin D do you take, and is it D3 or D2? Irrespective of what Steve is on NO ONE should be using D2 Ergocalciferol EVERYONE should be using D3 Cholecalciferol. The reasons why are set out here http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/84/4/694 The Case Against D2 as a Vitamin Supplement. Basically it's not as effective, packs only about a quarter the punch particularly for older people. Also it doesn't last as long in the system. You have to understand that despite the official RDA your body uses 4000iu/d approx http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/77/1/204 To raise your Vit D status 8-12nmol/L takes 400iu So in Winter when/if (depending on latitude) there is no sun you will need to use 4000iu give or take food inputs (possibly 300iu) and other supplements (possibly 200iu) If you use the cheap 5000iu capsules from one of the sources listed on The Vitamin D Council Website then it's fine to take 2-3 alternate weeks to average 2000iu say in the Summer (when you'll get some from sunshine) and 5-6 alternate weeks to average 4000iu/d Be aware that the proposed new safe upper limit is 10,000iu/d http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/85/1/6 Risk assessment for vitamin D and reading that paper makes it clear that in fact this is allowing a very generous safety margin as it would take a daily input of 40,000iu to actually cause harm, > > > I recently re-started byVitamin D. Stopping it was an oversight, but I > > > just started again about two weeks ago. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > particularly for older people. Also it doesn't last as long in the > system. Ted, Thanks for the GREAT links. They are VERY informative. Steve, You may want to increase your dose at least as much as your niece recommends. For me, I'm going even higher doses. As Ted said, it will really take 40,000 units taken for months to cause a problem. I became totally fascinated with D after watching a movie online by Dr. Reinhold Vieth. You can see it at http://www.insinc.com/onlinetv/directms13oct2005/softvnetplayer.htm. It runs about an hour, but it's one of the best hours I've ever spent on the net. If you Google Reinhold Vieth, you can learn a lot this miracle we call Vitamin D. HTH, John > You may want to increase your dose at least as much as your niece > recommends. For me, I'm going even higher doses. As Ted said, it will [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > on the net. If you Google Reinhold Vieth, you can learn a lot this > miracle we call Vitamin D. Thanks, John. I'm saving the URL for some time when I have an hour. > "JohnHace" <j...@amcoex.com> wrote in message > Thanks, John. I'm saving the URL for some time when I have an hour. You can read Vieth's answers to general vit D questions at this link. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070607.wvitaminDdiscussion0 607/BNStory/specialComment/home But do make the time to listen to the hours lecture, It puts the vitamin d issue into an evolutionary context. >> I recently re-started byVitamin D. Stopping it was an oversight, but I >> just started again about two weeks ago. > > Just curious, how much Vitamin D do you take, and is it D3 or D2? I take 400 IU of D3. It's a good time to get some input as to the opinions of my niece, a doctor of pharmacology. "I did a large amount of research on vitamin D. I was talking to [my son] about it, and I recommended that both [my son] and Uncle Steve start taking some if they weren't already. I know Uncle Steve takes fish oil, and I checked to make sure there were no contraindications to take both together. Vitamin D has been shown to both prevent the occurrence of epithelial cell carcinomas like prostate cancer, as well as slow the progression or prevent the reoccurrence of prostate cancer. We don't get near the amount of vitamin D that we need in our northern climate, especially in the winter. I would recommend that Uncle Steve be on 2000 IU units of vitamin D3 or "cholecalciferol" daily, if he isn't already." > Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) > Non Illegitimi Carborundum That's looooooooooooow. Congratulations, Steve. CPW >Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. ... >PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) >Non Illegitimi Carborundum Congrats, Steve! That's really great to see. Good on ya! > Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. > > PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) > Non Illegitimi Carborundum Way to go, Steve! SignatureJerryW Please respond to group; email address is not valid 2/11/04 PSA 2.6, Suspicious DRE (age 62) 2/23/04 Biopsy: Gleason 3+4=7, T2a, left lobe 5/18/04 RRP, Path: Gleason 4+3=7, T2c, both lobes Fully continent by 9/04 PSA through 4/2/07: <0.1 > Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) > Non Illegitimi Carborundum That looks great Steve, congratulations and keep up the good work! Fernando Awesome! Steve, Great news. Very significant reading <0.04 - undetectable. The Docs are probably elated and scratching their heads at the same time. If this were a twelve round fight - your'e in the seventh and the momentum just turned in your favor - and it looks like your headed for a knockout by the tenth as your opponent is on the ropes. The vitamin D/sun, your walking, capsacin etc., attitude - will only help - more than what current research reports. Believe Dave P > The vitamin D/sun, your walking, capsacin etc., attitude - will only > help - more than what current research reports. > > Believe Thanks, Dave. I cannot help but believe. Considering my age, aggressiveness of the cancer, failure of RRP and SRT and, for all intents and purposes, Lupron, it seems to be unlikely that I would have a year of undetectable PSA. Assuming God is not wasting a miracle on me, it's got to be one of the things I'm doing, or a combination. Hi Steve, Interesting result that supports the use of an antiandrogen in patients with biochemical failure after localized treatment. Did you ever get your adrenal androgen output and testosterone/DHT measured before adding the AA? That would be an important piece of information to explain the increase in PSA in spite of hormonal suppression. Wish you many more UD PSAs and best of health! RalphV pcainaz.org/phpbb > Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. > Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 and every 4 months there after > PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 PSAD 1.4 years > Casodex added daily 07/06 > PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) > Non Illegitimi Carborundum > Hi Steve, > Interesting result that supports the use of an antiandrogen in [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > information to explain the increase in PSA in spite of hormonal > suppression. No, that's something I keep forgetting to ask for. I'm going to send this to my PDA so I don't forget next time. > Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. > Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 and every 4 months there after > PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 PSAD 1.4 years > Casodex added daily 07/06 > PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) Looks like you'll be around for a LoooOOooooOOoooOOOng time. Tell you what, I'll put aside some change every month and when they come up with a silver bullet cure, after the lupron flushes from our system, we'll go to one of those "gentlemen's" clubs they have in the big cities. My treat. -kh woohoo. Whoo Hoo!!! Way to go. :o} Jean & Larry > Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. Steve, after a year undetectable do you plan to go off ADT? You deserve it! What does your onc say? Bill Denton RP 2/12/02 PSA 1.5 Memphis > Steve, after a year undetectable do you plan to go off ADT? You > deserve it! What does your onc say? I asked for a consult during my next appointment. The nurse was going to ask the doc if he wanted to add it to the appointment time or a separate meeting. I want a half-hour with him. Haven't really had a good consult since my initial diagnosis in 2000. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA <.1 <.1 <.1 .27 .37 .75 PSAD 0.19 years EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 PSAD .056 years Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 and every 4 months there after PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 PSAD 1.4 years Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) Non Illegitimi Carborundum > PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) > Non Illegitimi Carborundum Hey Steve, Although late on this thread the drop your PSA is MAGIC - super news! My PSA is going supersonic (143) 18 month post RT when it was down to 0.1. Still on Zoladex. (3 months on cosodex as well as Zolodex made no difference.) Mets have "escaped" to lymph nodes and I am now on 2nd hit of 10 Chemos. As a result I am very interested to know what you consider are the contributing factors? TIA Cheers Bernie > My PSA is going supersonic (143) 18 month post RT when it was down to > 0.1. Still on Zoladex. (3 months on cosodex as well as Zolodex made no [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > As a result I am very interested to know what you consider are the > contributing factors? Welcome to the NG, Bernie (or at least I don't recall seeing your handle before). I firmly believe the most important aspect of my success is my doc's insistence on changing treatments every time I have a couple of rises. In hitting it early, my PSA has never been over 0.75 in the 6½ years since surgery. Obviously, that is not good news for you at 143. What have I tried? I walk. I walk a lot. 3-5 miles a day, 3-5 days a week. I walk in the sun, which is supposedly good for Vit. D. and for cancer of several sorts. I still work. Up until January, I was working 50 to 60 days a week. It sometimes wasn't easy, but I think that pushing myself through it helped a lot. Of course, I.P. and others will tell you that retiring and playing is what's doing it for them. Who knows? I take some selenium, 1000 gm Vit C, 400 gm Vit E, 200,000 SU Capsaicin, some lycopene, and green tea extract every morning. In the last few weeks, I've been packing a lot of fruits and vegetables when I go to work, but I haven't seen the effects of that yet. My children, in the last three years, has sired or bore for me five grandchildren. That certainly gave me another purpose. And, while I do not pray for myself, I somehow think that God has had a hand in it. personally, I think I'd be a waste of a perfectly good miracle, but I do not discount the possibility. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA <.1 <.1 <.1 .27 .37 .75 PSAD 0.19 years EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 PSAD .056 years Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 and every 4 months there after PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 PSAD 1.4 years Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) Non Illegitimi Carborundum Thanks Steve - Appreciated :-) Cheers Bernie Hi Steve - only just saw this this morning - I've been distracted by other things... Fantastic news for you and long may you have figures like that. You're an inspiration my friend. Thankyou. Hughie. >> Steve, after a year undetectable do you plan to go off ADT? You >> deserve it! What does your onc say? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > meeting. I want a half-hour with him. Haven't really had a good consult > since my initial diagnosis in 2000. > Hi Steve - only just saw this this morning - I've been distracted by other > things... Glad to hear it, Hugh. Tell her I said, "hi". > Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. ... > PSA <0.04, <0.05, <0.04 (06/12/2007) > Non Illegitimi Carborundum Steve, I'm jumping in late to this thread but want to add my congratulations and good wishes. I think you're right to focus attention on the last line as well as the next to last. In the years I've been following this group I've never seen you let the Illegitimi grind you down. You've fought it every possible way and kept up a strong spirit throughout. I don't know if any "miracles" occurred in your case, but I believe that, if they did, they weren't wasted. Good luck. Alan >> Please focus your attention on the last two lines of my signature. > ... [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > I don't know if any "miracles" occurred in your case, but > I believe that, if they did, they weren't wasted. Thanks, Alan. I could have waited months for a message like that.
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