Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / March 2007
More on ADT
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Tom Cular - 27 Feb 2007 09:27 GMT Seniors May Increase Risk of Heart Disease from Prostate Cancer Treatment
Longer they received ADT, the sooner they were likely to die
Feb. 26, 2007 - One of the most common treatments for prostate cancer - androgen deprivation therapy - may increase the risk of death from heart disease in senior citizens over age 65, according to a new study by researchers at Dana-Farber Cancer Institute, Brigham and Women's Hospital and other institutions.
Although the findings need to be confirmed in clinical trials, the study authors state that oncologists should weigh the benefits of androgen deprivation therapy, or ADT, against the risk of heart problems in older prostate cancer patients. The study results were based on data from CaPSURE, a national registry of men with prostate cancer.
The researchers presented their study at the Prostate Cancer Symposium in Orlando, Fla., on Saturday. The symposium is sponsored by the American Society of Clinical Oncology, the American Society for Therapeutic Radiology and Oncology and the Society of Urologic Oncology.
The goal of ADT is to block the level of circulating androgens (male hormones), which can fuel the growth of prostate cancers. "Androgen deprivation therapy is associated with elevated body mass index, increased body fat deposits and diabetes, all of which raise the risk of death from heart diseased," explains the study's lead author, Henry Tsai, MD, a resident physician at Dana-Farber, Brigham and Women's and the Harvard Radiation Oncology Program.
"Although our findings demonstrated that older men receiving this treatment may be at increased risk, even after taking into account other cardiovascular risk factors, a prospective clinical trial would be needed to confirm a cause-and-effect relationship."
Drawing on the CaPSURE database, Tsai and his colleagues compared the number of cardiac-related deaths among 735 men with localized prostate cancer who received ADT and among 2,901 men with the disease whose treatment did not include ADT.
After factoring in other known risks for cardiovascular disease (such as diabetes, hypertension, body mass index and smoking), researchers found that the longer patients received ADT, the sooner they were likely to die from heart disease. When the researchers analyzed the data by patients' age, the link between ADT use and death from heart disease was significant in patients over age 65, but not in those under 65. After five years, 3 percent of older men who received androgen deprivation therapy died of cardiac causes, compared with only 0.9 percent of men who did not receive the therapy.
"These findings should help oncologists determine which older patients are the best candidates for ADT," Tsai remarks. "If a patient is at high risk of cardiovascular disease, it would be advisable for an oncologist to discuss the pros and cons of ADT treatment with him before proceeding on a course of treatment."
Editor's Notes:
Co-authors of the study include Anthony D'Amico, MD, PhD, of Dana-Farber and Brigham and Women's, Ming-Hui Chen, PhD, of the University of Connecticut, and Natalia Sadetsky, MD, MPH, and Peter R. Carroll, MD, both of the University of California, San Francisco.
The CaPSURE database is a research collaboration between TAP Pharmaceutical Products, Inc., and the University California, San Francisco, Department of Urology. The study was funded in part by the CaPSURE Scholars Program in Prostate Cancer Outcomes Research.
Dana-Farber Cancer Institute (www.danafarber.org) is a principal teaching affiliate of the Harvard Medical School and is among the leading cancer research and care centers in the United States. It is a founding member of the Dana-Farber/Harvard Cancer Center (DF/HCC), designated a comprehensive cancer center by the National Cancer Institute.
Brigham and Women's Hospital is a 747-bed nonprofit teaching affiliate of Harvard Medical School and a founding member of Partners HealthCare System, an integrated health care delivery network. BWH is committed to excellence in patient care with expertise in virtually every specialty of medicine and surgery. The BWH medical preeminence dates back to 1832 and today that rich history in clinical care is coupled with its national leadership in quality improvement and patient safety initiatives, dedication to educating and training health care professionals, and strength in biomedical research. With $370M in funding and more than 500 research scientists, BWH is an acclaimed leader in clinical, basic and epidemiological investigation - including the landmark Nurses Health Study, Physicians Health Studies, and the Women's Health Initiative. For more information about BWH, please visit: www.brighamandwomens.org.
I.P. Freely - 27 Feb 2007 18:09 GMT > Seniors May Increase Risk of Heart Disease from Prostate Cancer Treatment > > Longer they received ADT, the sooner they were likely to die I'll be very curious to see how much that impact would increase when researchers add the deaths accelerated by other ADT-induced or -exacerbated SEs such as diabetes, stroke, osteoporosis, depression, chronic sleep deprivation, etc.
I.P.
Steve Jordan - 27 Feb 2007 18:42 GMT On February 27, Tom Cular posted:
> Seniors May Increase Risk of Heart Disease from Prostate Cancer > Treatment > > Longer they received ADT, the sooner they were likely to die (snip)
Before looking upwards for the falling sky, it would be well to re-read the following from this report:
> "Although our findings demonstrated that older men receiving this > treatment may be at increased risk, even after taking into account > other cardiovascular risk factors, a prospective clinical trial would > be needed to confirm a cause-and-effect relationship." Regards,
Steve J
"Digressions, objections, delight in mockery, carefree mistrust are signs of health; everything unconditional belongs in pathology." --Friedrich Nietzsche
Steve Jordan - 27 Feb 2007 19:23 GMT Further to my earlier post on this topic.
> Seniors May Increase Risk of Heart Disease from Prostate Cancer Treatment > > Longer they received ADT, the sooner they were likely to die I believe that it is always best to seek out the source of these press releases.
The abstract is entitled, "Androgen deprivation therapy for prostate cancer and the risk of cardiac mortality." ........and is to be found on the ASCO site at: http://tinyurl.com/32vg7d
A heads-up at worst. The hypothesis is unproven.
The conclusion of the abstract: "A longer duration of ADT for the treatment of prostate cancer was significantly associated with a modestly increased risk of cardiac death in men over age 65. These results support the association of ADT use and cardiac mortality, but proof of cause and effect requires prospective validation."
Regards,
Steve J
"The thing is to expect nothing in particular, but (to) be aware of the lack of enforceable guarantees or enforceable contracts with nature/god/entropy as to the condition or durability of our bodies." -- Brian Brunner, PCa survivor, December 12, 2005 on The Prostate Problems Mailing List Thank you, Brian.
Tom Cular - 28 Feb 2007 01:00 GMT Steve, I agree that this is but one very small study completed by a small group of research folks based upon a rather small group of subjects. The folks who presented the opinion seem to have decent credentials and I believe they are worth listening to (not necessarily taking what they have to say as gospel). Anecdotally; I did not have any "noticeable" cardiac issues until I had been on Lupron for about a year; obviously there were issues prior to ADT, but I'm convinced that ADT exacerbated them.
Tom
> Further to my earlier post on this topic. > [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > Mailing List > Thank you, Brian. kh - 28 Feb 2007 01:57 GMT > Steve, > I agree that this is but one very small study completed by a small group [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > on Lupron for about a year; obviously there were issues prior to ADT, but > I'm convinced that ADT exacerbated them. I'm sure it's a problem. After 5 months on Lupron, I clocked a fasting blood sugar of 300 (A1c of 11) and 800 Triglycerides. Previously my fasting sugar was in the 120-130 range and my Triglycerides were normal.
6 months after going off Lupron my Triglycerides were normal again and my fasting blood sugar (on one 850 glucophage/day) was below 120. It wobbles around but I am hoping that if I get a little more weight off and amp up my exercise, I can drop the glucophage.
With those sugars and Triglycerides pounding the liver, heart, etc, something else is bound to fail.
-kh Before they give you Lupron, get a full blood chemistry and another a few months after the shot. Compare the results.
I.P. Freely - 28 Feb 2007 03:17 GMT > I did not have any "noticeable" cardiac issues until I had been > on Lupron for about a year; obviously there were issues prior to ADT, but > I'm convinced that ADT exacerbated them. It comes as no surprise, given ADT's frequent significant impacts on such heart threats as cholesterol, triglycerides, blood sugar, blood pressure, sleep, and depression, according to . . . ahem . . . Strum.
I.P.
Steve Jordan - 28 Feb 2007 03:47 GMT On February 27, Mike Freely wrote:
Quoting Tom Cular:
>> I did not have any "noticeable" cardiac issues until I had been on >> Lupron for about a year; obviously there were issues prior to ADT, but >> I'm convinced that ADT exacerbated them. Mikey mooed:
> It comes as no surprise, given ADT's frequent significant impacts on > such heart threats as cholesterol, triglycerides, blood sugar, blood > pressure, sleep, and depression, according to . . . ahem . . . Strum. As usual, Mike Freely carefully omits mentioning the various things that can be done to alleviate such SEs as a particular patient might experience. They are laid out by...ahem...Strum.
My source is http://www.prostate-cancer.org/education/sidefx/Strum_ADS.html
What's his?
Not a surprise; he would then be giving a full report. Such would be adverse to his position that ADT is awful awful and his decision to decline the tx is validated. Can't have that, dontcha know. That's what it's all about: validating his choices.
Meanwhile, he misleads the new folks.
Ho.
Also Hum.
Regards,
Steve J
"His simple word is worthless; and to embellish it with his oath would merely make it picturesque, not valuable." --Mark Twain
kh - 28 Feb 2007 14:09 GMT > Meanwhile, he misleads the new folks. > > Ho. > > Also Hum. As I'm in this thread, I should clarify my point. Lupron is powerful stuff.
The good news is that it drove my PSA to undetectable levels. The bad news is that it ran my fasting blood sugar to 300 and Triglycerides to 800. I had other side effects, joint pain, dizziness, all well documented.
My doc's didn't prep me for it. A full-up blood panel before the shot as a baseline and regular full-up panels would have caught my problems early.
I may have to go back on Lupron. If so, I will do so reluctantly but with a better understanding of the side effects. I will ask for a full blood panel and if my insurance won't cover it, I'll pay for it myself.
If any chemistry goes berzerk, I'll be at the docs and we'll work out a solution.
The problem is that those numbers 300 and 800 aren't just numbers, they are vitals, those chemistries slam your organs and if allowed to persist, cause cascading failures.
As long as the docs are watching the chemistries, then you and they can make an educated trade-off. "We'll go with the Lupron for 12 months and manage the sugars or whatever by other means."
As for the joint pain, hot flashes, those are a nit compared to a 300 fasting blood sugar.
-kh
I.P. Freely - 28 Feb 2007 17:26 GMT > If any chemistry goes berzerk, I'll be at the docs and we'll work out > a solution. I chuckled when at first I presumed "be at" had an accidental space in it.
> The problem is that those numbers 300 and 800 aren't just numbers, > they are vitals, those chemistries slam your organs and if allowed to [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > As for the joint pain, hot flashes, those are a nit compared to a 300 > fasting blood sugar. Your docs should have been all over your blood sugar from Day One, because they were forewarned by your pre-ADT warning level of 115.
I.P.
kh - 05 Mar 2007 00:48 GMT On Feb 28, 12:30 pm, "I.P. Freely" <fuhgheddabou...@noway.nohow> wrote:
> > If any chemistry goes berzerk, I'll be at the docs and we'll work out > > a solution. > > I chuckled when at first I presumed "be at" had an accidental space in it. That is funny!!!! For many situations, I am tempted by violence and direct solutions. I don't give in to those thoughts though.
> Your docs should have been all over your blood sugar from Day One, > because they were forewarned by your pre-ADT warning level of 115. pre-Lupron, my primary care doc was starting to explore diabetes treatment. The first step was a recommendation that I lose 30 pounds.
The Lupron-sugar connection was not understood by any of the docs. The Uro who gave me the shot, the rad-doc who laid out the treatment, nor my primary care doc who pulled out his PDR when I asked about Lupron and sugar.
I keep harping about this because I explicitly asked all three about the connection and they didn't think there was one. I also asked the two nurse-educators at the Diabetes school and they did not think there was a Lupron-sugar connection.
-kh
I.P. Freely - 05 Mar 2007 03:06 GMT > I keep harping about this because I explicitly asked all three about > the connection and they didn't think there was one. I also asked the > two nurse-educators at the Diabetes school and they did not think > there was a Lupron-sugar connection. I'd demand these people cite the data they believe opposes the field of oncology. I'd also ask them if they've heard of such modern inventions as computers, the Internet, the PDR, patient information sheets, or books. I'd also find different doctors. Let me guess . . . they're VA docs.
I.P.
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