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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / February 2007

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Tonight's dose of Capsaicin...

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Hugh Kearnley - 22 Feb 2007 20:27 GMT
Still bucketing sweat 2 hours later...
Found some "TomYum" stock cubes in my local Chinese supermarket.
Today - thinking must have some Tom Yum - a favourite food from Far East
days.
Never used these Knorr cubes before and assumed 1 cube made 3/4 pint stock -
WRONG!
(Printed in Thai - made in Thailand, Me no speaky/read Thai-talk)
So, from other things I bought at the Ch.Sup. - I had visitors tonight and
thought I'd give them some Thai food.
The Tom Yum, just three cubes with 2 & 1/4 pints water - some of
beansprouts, egg noodles, bell peppers, brocculii, sliced chicken breast,
shell-on King Prawns and the meats from a few old crab claws been in the
freezer for ages.
Then, I was STOOPID enough to put in extra chillies as garnish - right at
the end for the crispy-crunchies - and without tasting anything beforehand
or later until it was too late.
In a bit of a rush to get things ready - a stir-fry to get ready and then
some Ice Cream to flavour with Durian essence and chop fresh pineapple
through. - No time to actually taste anything beforehand - except the amount
of Durian going into the Ice Cream.
We started with Tomato juice cocktails - I 'fragranced' these ones with
lemongrass, basil and star anise, a little splash of the Green Tabasco -
Splish of vodka and bob's yer uncle - delishus! Minister's wife asked for
another small one...
Next - the soup and the Tom Yum.
My new neighbour's wife spat her's out on the table and ran for the toilet.
Neighbour himself sat looking stunned - trying to catch his breath.
The Minister and his wife (local church - they needed some food prepared for
an upcoming social and I used the occassion to introduce the new neighbours
to them) sat looking a bit stunned.
I almost spat my own out.
Rest of the meal was eaten - but I doubt if anyone tasted anything and it
was as quick as they could get away home, taking the ice cream with them in
little pots. I suspect the neighbours may not be frequent visitors! (Dinnae
go near that bastard - he'll POISON you!)

Later, I poured 3/4 of the 'stock' from the Tom Yum and filled it back with
plain water - now much more acceptable, but STILL hellishly fiery.
I ate most of it - painfully but enjoying it like the best masochists. The
rest in the fridge now for tomorrow.
One of the fieriest things I ever put over my lips. That was at 6.30 - now
just after 8 PM and I'm still sweating. (Or it's the anti-androgens...)
The Durian ice cream incidentally - Dairy free - base made from Soya 'Cream'
and well-overcooked pudding rice. Emulsified with whipped egg-whites and a
tiny amount of olive oil - started as an experiment and it works fairly
well. Durian is NOT to my taste eaten fresh, but in deserts - esp ice cream
and cold sweets, it's really very good with a totally different flavour from
the fresh onion and cat-turd scented fruit.
So - IP FREELY - you ever eaten Tom Yum?  Has anyone?  - I mean the REAL
thing - not an adapted recipe to make it more acceptable to western palates.

Next receipt will be for milder living folk.
Away to watch the football now.
Hughie.
I.P. Freely - 22 Feb 2007 22:21 GMT
> So - IP FREELY - you ever eaten Tom Yum?  Has anyone?  - I mean the REAL
> thing - not an adapted recipe to make it more acceptable to western palates.

Man, I got limits. I even pick out and discard those fiery little red
grenades out of Thai food. Ain't no way I'm eatin' something the Chinese
call HOT, other than run-of-the-mill 'Mericanzed Szechuan cooking.

I.P.
Hugh Kearnley - 22 Feb 2007 22:32 GMT
WUSS!

>> So - IP FREELY - you ever eaten Tom Yum?  Has anyone?  - I mean the REAL
>> thing - not an adapted recipe to make it more acceptable to western
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> I.P.
I.P. Freely - 23 Feb 2007 02:47 GMT
> WUSS!

That, and I like peppers for their flavor, not their heat, and all I
notice in them little Thai firecrackers is heat.

Twice.

I.P.
Hugh Kearnley - 22 Feb 2007 22:41 GMT
And that does not mean YOU are a WUSS!
I suspect you IP - you gotta very high Good chili tongue.
I imagine that you and me would have a terrifically self-murderous meeting
somewhere just swapping beers and chili samples.
I think that really - you;'d leave me lying out in the desert somewhere -
simmering gently - smoke coming out my arse, ears, nose, toes....
Lottasa respect to ya IP!
BIG HUGS!
Hughie.

>> So - IP FREELY - you ever eaten Tom Yum?  Has anyone?  - I mean the REAL
>> thing - not an adapted recipe to make it more acceptable to western
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> I.P.
I.P. Freely - 23 Feb 2007 03:50 GMT
> And that does not mean YOU are a WUSS!
> I suspect you IP - you gotta very high Good chili tongue.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Lottasa respect to ya IP!
> BIG HUGS!

Not if you like those Thai guys; I'll concede THAT battler here and now.
Some are OK, but more often they set my mouth off something fierce even
back when I lived in pepper country and ate hot stuff regularly.

This one restaurant in the heart of New Mexico -- Albuquerque had
pepper-roasting rotisseries on just about every corner in peak season --
 was widely known for its *huge*, *excellent*, freaking *HOT* burritoes.
The first time we took our office's new young lieutenant there, his
shirt was almost completely soaked by the time he finished lunch.
And the second time.
And the third time.
And so it went most Fridays thereafter.
What's a little sweat when the food's THAT good?

A friend flew her central-Mexico (not NEW Mexico; the real deal) parents
 to Albuquerque for a party. They were well-known cooks, and brought
all the ingredients -- crates of authentic Old Mexico stuff from
jalapenos to freshly ground corn from which to make the tortillas --
with them for the feast they came to prepare. When they saw me heaping
jalapenos and their hand-made salsa on just about everything, they
warned me about th heat. As I kept heaping it on, they took me by the
elbow, looked me in the eye, and made really, really sure, in their
heavy accent, that I understood that this stuff was hot food, that no
gringo could stomach it.

Hee, hee . . . it was great. I doubt I even broke much of a sweat,
either. But that was decades ago, in the land of jalapeno jelly and
jalapeno ice cream.

I.P.
Hugh Kearnley - 23 Feb 2007 23:53 GMT
A couppla quick (when did I ever do anything quick?) stories about chillies
and durians for your amusement. & bugger all to do with PCa.

In UK, we have (or had) work experience programs for kids about to leave
school.
At one place I worked, we were sent a real obnoxious squirt to gain
experience of kitchen work. He was a dirty mongrel but we did try to give
him a genuine insight, despite his backtalk and attitude.
He was forever picking food up and tasting it then putting it back on the
counters - sticking his mucky fingers into something like a little pot of
Bavarois creme and licking them. He just wouldn't be told. I had thrown him
out of the walk in fridges several times for sitting on a shelf with the
food - munching the soft fruits and drinking juice cocktails.
This kid was from a deprived background and obviously some of the fresher
veggies and fruits were beyond his parent's budget - he'd gradually come out
of his shell while we were on breaks - but that attitude of his - just
negated any 'good' feelings for him. What I will say in his favour was that
he devoured information first time and asked a lot of pertinent questions -
some I had not been asked by the work experience kids - and - shown how to
Steel a Knife, to properly dice an onion, toss a pancake - he picked up like
a natch and didnt have to be shown twice. - Just that bloody cheeky attitude
and no respect.
On his last day we had just been delivered a week's supply of expensive
'exotics' - Blueberries, Rasps, Logans, Starfruits, Mangosteens,Wild
Strawberries, and so on.  We'd taken delivery too of 'exotic' veggies -
among them - a selection of fresh chillies.  Late afternoon - and he was
asking - 'whats this and whats that and can I taste them and some of those?'
Now if this had been a decent attitude kid, I'd have had no problem giving
him a shebang to take home.  To my eternal shame, I told him that the little
green and red 'things' were baby sweet peppers - and - yeah - go on - eat
one...
The poor kid (I felt real sorry afterwards) was in tears - he'd never tasted
anything like that before, Called me a selection of names and had to be
taken to the Nurse. (He'd also gone to the toilet - apparently and touched
his 'wee man' and was in serious pain.
The Kitchen brigade and I retired to the local pub at shift-change in roars
of laughter.
The following day, I recieved a written warning regarding my disgraceful
conduct. I think I made up for it with a glowing report submitted to his
school - but still managed to comment on his attitude and lack of respect.
The eventual upshot - I had to interview him as a potential employee a few
months later - and to my own surprise - gave him a job as a junior commis. I
later heard he had won 'UK Beef Chef of the Year' in 2001. His dish - an
unusual cut from the Beef shoulder, well trimmed and slow-roasted in a shell
of red bell peppers and - - - - - green chillies...!

Durians - the size of a Rugger (Rugby) Ball and oval in shape - covered in
very sharp spikes - you daren't go near the trees in season - a lot of folks
killed by the falling fruits. Native to most of Indonesia and SE Asia.  The
fruit not allowed on the Singapore underground railway, nor on any aircraft
because of the smell - which it is very reminiscent of onions you peeled a
week ago and forgot about, mixed with sweet custard and cat poo. It really
is pretty revolting until you get used to it.  The flavour when not quite
ripe enough is really just like the smell. When more ripe, the flavour is
slightly sweeter and more oniony and a lot less Poo. When REALLY ripe, it's
character changes to a sweet sort of vanilla flavoured cream flavoured
slightly with sweet onions and hardly a trace of Poo at all.  My first taste
was as a youngster aged 8 in Malaya with my Dad who was in the Army. I puked
for a long time even at the memory of it. Dad loved the stuff and now I have
a place for it too. Malays and Indonesians call it "The KING of Fruits"
Anyway - I used to vacation a lot to Peninsular Malaysia - East Coast -
long - incredibly long deserted beaches that my wives and kids just loved to
frolic on - look back after walking a mile and all you saw were your own
footprints... Terriffic beach casting for fishermen too... lots of free
fish-caught meals and where I got my liking for Chilies in food as a child.
I digress - as usual - sorry!
At that same place I worked described above, we had a very - VERY rotund
book-keeper. She was extremely efficient and able to work wonders with the
accounts when we had the odd slack times. Her heart was solid gold and she'd
do anyone a favour if she was able.  Because she was SO overweight - I
mean - a beachball with legs and arms - she had difficulty with personal
hygeine - also troubled by incontinence. Her troubles were self inflicted
mostly - with the firm almost since leaving college, she'd started off as a
slim attractive girl, but greed for the wrong foods got her the way she was.
She also had no sense of smell - which may explain why I did what I did with
iniquity!
I had brought back with me from one vacation, a box of 10 bottles of Durian
Extract - not essence (which is a cheap synthetic) These worked out at £14 a
bottle in 1998. On the morning I started back at work, the weather had been
particularly Glasgow - wet, windy, cool with rain coming down in sheets.
The book-keeper had arrived in her usual state - breathless but before
everyone else - very sweaty and drenched - not just from the rain - but
she'd wet her knickers too - and was drying them at her feet with an
electric fan-heater. The office stank with the smell of pishy drying
knickers. (This was not an unusual thing) Office co-workers - a huge open
area - just had to get on with it and wear a handerchief over their noses -
this lady was too much of an asset to either upset or lose.
My wickedness surfaced - I went into the office with two bottles of this
Extract, screwed off the tops and left them close by her heater.  Within
minutes, the entire office stank like the worst public toilet you ever
entered.
Office workers called their Union Official and a lot of talk was going on. I
had to furtively regain the bottles and recap them! (Corner and sous chefs
causing a distraction at the other end of the kithens - Yup - they were ALL
in on it)
Although it was wintertime, the ventilator & extractor fans were turned to
Max to clear the fumes.
I was VERY lucky to get away with that one.
Backshot of it was that I had to leave the extract at home for six months
before experimenting with it in the workplace for sweets and puddings -
among which - Ice Cream takes the extract very well - turning out an Ice
cream with a superlative 'Orange & Mango' taste - muted with 'something
mysteriously nice'  Horrible in savouries!

Oh well - not a food recipe - but recipes for potential dismissal offences!

Hey IP - email me with a returnable email addy if you would like to see the
project (63 pages and just under 4 Mbytes) so far and say if you want to see
it as an MS Word doc, in rich text or as a pdf. I reckon I need a lot of
input from you. (and other folk if interested) - see next post. (If rich
text - will lose all the illustrations)
Goodnight!
Hughie.
J - 24 Feb 2007 00:50 GMT
> A couppla quick (when did I ever do anything quick?) stories about chillies
> and durians for your amusement. & bugger all to do with PCa.
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> The Kitchen brigade and I retired to the local pub at shift-change in roars
> of laughter.

You sure make me laugh, Hughie, with your shenanigans.
Burned my mouth many years ago with something hot and Mexican.
I thought they meant hot (as in hot/cold)...I was last seen running for some
water, eyes bulging and in pain.

Just a word of warning. Capsaicin has blood thinning properties.
Cancer patients are prone to blood clots and/or bleeding, so too much capsaican
can be a problem.
Or combining capsaicin with any blood thinner can be a problem.
Many (not all) "over the counter " (OTC's) pain medicines contain aspirin.
Some of us are more prone to bleeding; I've had to go for GI tests, count ' em
(6) to try to find the cause of bleeding and in retrospect, I believe that the
pain medications I was taking at the time contributed, so capsaicin is not for
me.

http://www.luhs.org/health/kbase/htm/mdx-/amci/0058/mdx-amci0058.htm (shows some
blood thinning medicines)
"combined with capsaicin possibly leading to easy bruising and bleeding"

Word to the wise.
j
Hugh Kearnley - 24 Feb 2007 01:29 GMT
Hi 'J'

I take a daily dose of two 75 mg junior Aspirin in the AM because of an
existing Cardiac condition.(Blood thinner)
I DON'T take any supplemental Capsaicin.
My Capsaicin comes from directly ingested chilli fruits.
My GP Doctor (an admitted NON-Cancer area of expertise doctor) has
nonetheless 'assured' me that chillies eaten fresh - will have no effect on
blood clotting - and HE is my CARDIAC Doctor specialist -  UNLESS I start to
commit all sorts of Hari-Kari by consuming more than half a pound per day of
the fresh fruits (thereby setting my Guts to an inextinguishable Texas
Oil-Rig inferno - I couldn't get near a quarter pound without a serious
anasesthetic - unless that is - I had a constitution like IP!) so - not any
realistic chance - thank f.ck!
Cheers!
Hughie.

> Just a word of warning. Capsaicin has blood thinning properties.
> Cancer patients are prone to blood clots and/or bleeding, so too much
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
> Word to the wise.
> j
callalily - 24 Feb 2007 01:43 GMT
Dear J,

> Cancer patients are prone to blood clots and/or bleeding, so too much capsaican
> can be a problem.

What did you mean by that? All ca patients?  Ones undergoing a certain
tx?  And why?

This interests me, because right after my husb had his surgery, the
doc came out and asked me if J. had a bleeding problem.  I said,
"No."  Then he asked me again:  "Did he ever bleed and it took a long
time to clot..?"  I said, "Not that I know of".

Then, when we saw him in the office, he said that ca apparently bleeds
like a pig, and when he saw during the op that there was a lot of
bleeding, he knew there might be more of the ca than he'd thought.

But I thought that was just a one-time thing.  That when they got the
neoplasm out, everything would go back to normal.

I have never heard anything since then about J. having a blood problem
of any sort.

Just curious.

Leah
Hugh Kearnley - 24 Feb 2007 21:03 GMT
On Blood-Clotting. . . . . but PCa unconnected.
In kitchens I've seen some pretty nasty accidents that involved copious
bleeding.
I was shown (by a very old, retired gentleman who supplemented his income by
doing pot-washing) after a nasty one where a young commis ripped his palm
open while boning a particularly difficult almost frozen Pheasant (Silly
arse had been told to let it defrost first, but was trying to impress with
his efficiency)
Blood was literally jetting out and the poor lad was on the verge of passing
out.
The old fella rushed to a flour bin, scooped up a handful and plastered it
on the open wound - the flow subsided almost magically. He'd been a cook in
the Merchant Navy during WW2 and this apparently - was a well-known 'first
aid' measure.
Got the lad to hospital and all was eventually fine. (sort of...)
I've always used that since - FLOUR - as a 'first-line' dressing to stem
bleeding.
It MIGHT be worth remembering if something nasty happens in your own kitchen
at home and you got no bandages handy. Corned Beef tins are the worst
offenders.
I looked for info and asked a doctor - but it's just another of those
mysterious 'things'
TOP that - my Dad was a Signwriter - he swore by VARNISH as a blood-stopper!
AND - it does work. Try it next time you rip yourself doing a DIY or other
decorating job.
OK - Funnies time...
Dad suffered most awesomely from Haemorroids. I think it was the constant
sitting in cold places associated with his craft.  He had a book of his own
Mum's called "Consult Me" that had been passed down through the family.
This book has info on everything known to the world when it was first
published in 1798 (I have that book now - not in quite immaculate condition,
but a 1st edition nonetheless) It tells about how to cure the 'ague' - how
to pickle a whole hog - how to dye cloths with herbiages - a method to stop
barnacle encrustation - and what concerns us here - a 'cure' for
haemorroids. He was out of the Army and we were back home by this time - I
was 10 - I think.
As I said, my dear old dad had a hellish time with his 'piles'  The severity
of them made him quite unwell for days at a time. It doesn't embarass me to
say that many nights I would be asked to apply chilled wet cloths to him -
give some relief and shrink them enough so they could be pushed back (He'd
NEVER ask my mum - it was either Uncle Jim - his older brother who lived in
the same rambling big house - or myself that was asked to provide the
comfort.) Doctors had given creams and potions - none of which worked and
he'd been advised to have an operation - always refused.
He discovered this 'cure' in the "Consult Me" book and very weird it was
too... I quote:
'Pick of garden leeks on a frosted morn at dawnbreak, perhaps a short peck.
Carve in small sections and put in an enamel crock. Pour over fresh boiled
water and leave alone for a time. Let the vapours arising touch the affected
parts for a time. In this way and repeatedly the affliction will be cured'
I have NO idea how many leeks are in a peck.
However, Johnny went and picked his leeks with the aid of myself and a
pitchfork at dead of night - a great adventure indeed! The planet Venus was
low on the horizon - at least - I think it was Venus he pointed out to me...
Inside - a cup of tea made from the boiled kettle after the leeks had been
chopped up, stuck in an enamel basin and the boiling water poured on. I was
sent to bed after that, so Dad could expose his backside to the steam from
the leeks. I didn't lie for very long and neither did anyone else in the
house. Shreiks and screams of agony got us all rushing out of bed.
Poor dad had slipped on the carpet - his backside landing right into the
boiling leeks. His arse was slightly 'poached' and he was unable to walk for
over a week.  There was a gap of several years before my next siblings came
along - but the 'cure' sure worked. he was NEVER bothered with haemorroids
again.
BYNOTE:  Dad had a real resemblance to Peter Sellers in the "Pink Panther"
films - we were NOT allowed to watch them as kids. The white coat and the
hat - the moustache - all VERY Johnny.  I still can't watch a Pink Panther
film without seeing my dear old Dad. Memories - Marvelous ain't they?

> Dear J,
>
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
>
> Leah
Steve Kramer - 24 Feb 2007 23:34 GMT
> Just a word of warning. Capsaicin has blood thinning properties.
> Cancer patients are prone to blood clots and/or bleeding, so too much
> capsaican
> can be a problem.
> Or combining capsaicin with any blood thinner can be a problem.

I am up to 3 capsules a day (100,000 scoval units) and I also take daily
aspirin.  You think maybe I should cut the aspirin?
J - 25 Feb 2007 10:33 GMT
> "J" <nexsw@nvalid,anon> wrote in message
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> I am up to 3 capsules a day (100,000 scoval units) and I also take daily
> aspirin.  You think maybe I should cut the aspirin?

Complicated, Steve
Aspirin or blood thinners claim to remove the "stickiness".
Clotting and tests are mentioned here
http://www.patient.co.uk/showdoc/27000450/

Medicines can interfere with the clotting
Some (not comprehensive0 are mentioned here
http://medicalcentereast.client.web-health.com/web-health/topics/GeneralHealth/g
eneralhealthsub/generalhealth/cardiovascular/blood/clotting%20tests.html


   For the patient, the clotting assay is just a routine  blood test (from
a vein, usually at the elbow).  The only thing that makes it different from
a regular blood draw is that:

       * Because the condition being diagnosed is impaired blood clotting,
there is a small concern that the needle puncture could trigger an unusual
amount of bleeding.
       * Clotting tests can also be conducted at home with a lancet like
those used for testing blood sugar.

   [Alert: Be aware that certain medications affect blood clotting tests.]

   Which medicines affect the test?

        The following medications interfere with clotting, thus increase
assay time:

         o Warfarin
         o Heparin
         o Antibiotics
         o Aspirin
         o Cholesterol-Lowering Medications (for instance colestipol)
         o Antacids (the acid reduction type, cimetidine)
         o Antihypertensives (used to lower blood pressure) (namely
methyldopa)
         o Certain Antifungals (specifically griseofulvin)
         o Drugs Used to Treat Hyperthyroidism (propylthiouracil)
         o Medicines for Gout (allopurinol)

        The following medications promote clotting, thus decrease assay
time:

         o Antihistamines (namely diphenhydramine)
         o Estrogen (i.e. birth control pills, too)
         o Anti-Arrhythmia Medications (digitalis)
         o Anabolic Steroids
----------------------------------------------------
That does not cover it all.
If cancer spreads, (some of) the cells may be rejected by the immune system.

Others, like seeds, implant themselves somewhere and seek food.  Like seeds
feed locally off the earth (in the body off local tissue or blood sources),
while their roots (seeds seek water) seek more sources of blood, in order to
grow.

One of our fav's was taking 28 medicines (prescribed and his fav theory type
alternative meds), along with chemo and pounding it into the ground. His
liver tumor(s) had shrunk, his CEA had lowered, but he would not lay off; he
was seeking cure; he died of a brain hemorrhage, not cancer, unless a met
had seeded itself in his brain.
He was in a clinical trial, so I assume they were checking his blood, on a
fairly regular basis.

Talk to your doctor (about what you're taking) and as to whether they want
to cut your ear or arm or prick finger to check clotting time or do
bloodwork, if it's not done on a regular basis.

Healthy people who just do capsaicin containing foods probably can't eat
enough daily to do damage. After the last bleed, I was told to steer clear
of aspirin containing medicines.
J
callalily - 24 Feb 2007 01:29 GMT
Dear Hughie,

On Feb 22, 3:27?pm, "Hugh Kearnley" <hughkearn...@btinternet.com>
wrote:

> Next - the soup and the Tom Yum.
> My new neighbour's wife spat her's out on the table and ran for the toilet.
> Neighbour himself sat looking stunned - trying to catch his breath.
> The Minister and his wife sat looking a bit stunned.
> Later, the 'stock' from the Tom Yum and filled it back with
> plain water - now much more acceptable, but STILL hellishly fiery.

There's your ticket, Hughie.  Invite people over, give 'em a taste of
HELL, and they'll Sin No More!  And then you can take the credit and
get a free pass to heaven.

Only problem is, the Minister will be out of a job.

Leah
Hugh Kearnley - 24 Feb 2007 03:42 GMT
BIG problem Leah, Honey!

ANY action of mine or someone else that (May attempt to)  influence someone
else -through prayer or whatever else mode,  is a deliberate act of the most
awesome self-destruct - unless the aim of the prayer is to ask for someone
else - NOT yourself. I think you already understand that concept? (SMILE for
goodness sakes...)

The enitire Presbyterian attitude to PRAYER  as a fulfilling and rewarding
experience - vastly different from the Roman Catholic teachings - 'say a
hail mary and put $10 in the box - your sins are forgiven'.... In
Presbyterian  belief - you profess to CHRIST in prayer. Roman Catholics
believe in what they may. They have NOT professed to Christ.
Only CHRIST - CAN forgive sin. GOD Himself can't do it - it NEEDS - YOU to
believe that that muscular and well built Carpenter - not your blue eyed
white-man Jesus in pretty robes - but a rather huge industrial carpenter, -
big hairy f.ck - used to carrying huge timbers about and eating very basic
rubbish meals - really - a BIG guy - and the historical reality of how my
HERO may have lived - was born at the instructions of the deity I believe
was the creator of my universe. Don't cost a PENNY - just TIME to think up
to him.
Chosen LONG before his birth to be the Saviour - Emmanuel - The Prince of
Peace.  I MEAN! - Can you imagine a blue eyed white robed Jesus full of yer
meek and mild being seen as a threat to the Roman Empire? NO Fucken Chance -
as Marcus Janius Cerus recorded in his diaries going back to Rome at that
time. The real threat came from the Provincial Governor - Pontyius Pilate
(another Scotsman - for goodness sakes) - who was willing to forgive anyone
that didn't pose an obvious "washed hands" threat.
Pilate didn't see Christ - a poor Carpenter and preacher - as a threat to
the Roman Empire - and he was partially correct.  - Except that -
Christ wasn't that threat. Christ was the ULTIMATE threat, JUDGE & Jury.
No-one thought anything sillier!  A Joiner from where? - King of Heaven? -
Ha-a-shreik!  Well - they are all better educated now.
PRAY to whatever God you believe in and ask for any favours  - for OTHERS.
DO things prayerful for other people - never for yourself.
BE concerned for OTHERS
and in all these ways - show LOVE for your fellows.

In your own case Leah  -O! you gotta lotta stuff shouted up at heaven from
my end. I PROMISE.
Goodnight and hoping for a sense of serenity for you, Lassie.
SHUGGIE (Loadsa HUGS)

Mebbe I'll send you a private email about my own beliefs
Alex - 24 Feb 2007 06:01 GMT
"Hugh Kearnley" <hughkearnley@btinternet.com> wrote in message
[snip]
> it NEEDS - YOU to believe that that muscular and well built Carpenter -
> not your blue eyed white-man Jesus in pretty robes - but a rather huge
> industrial carpenter, - big hairy f.ck - used to carrying huge timbers
> about and eating very basic rubbish meals - really - a BIG guy

Given the waves of immigrants that had entered Canaan/Israel up to Christ's
time, it's likely that Jesus had a mix of Arab, Berber, Roman, Greek,
African, Iranian and/or Indian ancestry. A descendent of these folks would
certainly not be blue-eyed or fair-skinned.
Memo to Hollywood: for your next Bible epic, cast Denzel Washington,
Laurence Fishburne or Ice-T.
callalily - 24 Feb 2007 17:07 GMT
Dearest Hughie,

> The enitire Presbyterian attitude to PRAYER as a fulfilling and rewarding
> experience - vastly different from the Roman Catholic teachings

Stick to playing the organ, Hughie -- in church.:-)

You may know that I love movies, and the Catholics have given us
several very good entries in the "Inspirational" category, for which I
am grateful.  Praise the Lord.

The Passion of Joan of Arc *****

"Simply one of the greatest films ever made.  Unsurpassed in emotional
intensity". (Porter and Martin).  Based on actual transcripts of the
trial.

"The consequence of Joan's conviction -- her burning at the stake --
allows Dreyer to hammer home his exquisite visual motif balancing
erotic corporeality with transcendent spirituality." (imdb)

Therese **** 1/2

"Breathtakingly beautiful film is the story of St. Theresa of Lisieux,
who entered a Carmelite nunnery in the late 1800's and died there of
TB eight years later." (P&M)

"Her devotion to Jesus and her concept of "the little way" to God are
shown clearly, using plain modern language. A sense of angelic
simplicity comes across without fancy lights, choirs, or showy
miracles."  (imdb)

Monsieur Vincent ****

"Winner of a special Academy Award, this is a moving, beautifully
photographed biography of St. Vincent de Paul, patron saint of social
workers.  Worth seeing for the performance of Pierre Fresnay, one of
France's greatest actors."  (P&M)
________

*And, to give equal time: for the nonbelievers, you will love anything
by Bunuel.*  Comedy and religion mix fabulously -- and irreverantly.

Get some popcorn and enjoy.

> BE concerned for OTHERS and in all these ways - show LOVE for your fellows.

Can't argue with that.  And you do do that, Hughie.  Sharing recipes
is a very nurturing thing.  Not to mention the funny stories you
share. . . maybe you should write a memoir rather than a cookbook.

> In your own case Leah -O! you gotta lotta stuff shouted up at heaven from
> my end. I PROMISE.

I am very grateful for that, Hughie. Need all the help I can get.
Will try to direct some good cosmic energy in your direction as
well.

> Goodnight and hoping for a sense of serenity for you, Lassie.

And so to us all.  Amen.

> Mebbe I'll send you a private email about my own beliefs.

If you haven't been tippling , , , but am afraid I won't be of much
help in that dep't.

Love,

Leah

P.S.: Give Tiger a hug from me.  IMO, the best way to save money on
healthcare, based on what I've read here, is to get everyone a pet.
Preferably a dog, but a cat will do.  Dog love is more powerful than
any medicine in the world.
Hugh Kearnley - 24 Feb 2007 04:00 GMT
Classic reply to a misogynist.... Screw my pals up so someone can start
re-arranging the furniture?
and hey - there are NO free passes to anywhere - no free lunches - anytime.
Like the sentiment though!
Fancy some Broccoli soup?
BIG HUGS!
Hughie. - and HOY! - I'm NO 'holy willie' - just a VERY soft vulnerable
laddie trying to keep faith with what he believes since boyhood, and right
now remembering my old grandmamama - tears goiung down. very daft tonight.
sorry.

> There's your ticket, Hughie.  Invite people over, give 'em a taste of
> HELL, and they'll Sin No More!  And then you can take the credit and
> get a free pass to heaven.
Hugh Kearnley - 24 Feb 2007 19:45 GMT
My apologies for the later nonsense and rubbish last night - I dont know
what was going on.
Two - ONLY - small glasses of whisky and somewhere I lost the plot
entirely... maybe alcohol doesnt mix with all the other sh.t and pills.
Don't even remember going to bed.
Sorry!
Embarrassed now...
Hughie
J - 24 Feb 2007 19:41 GMT
> My apologies for the later nonsense and rubbish last night - I dont know
> what was going on.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Embarrassed now...
> Hughie

???? You did nothing wrong.
J
 
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