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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / December 2006Survey: vasectomy and prostate cancer
Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey for folks in this newsgroup. Steve K has agreed to tabulate the results. If you have PCa, have you had vasectomy in the past ? Please state approximate year and current age. Thanks. For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in 1981, and I am now 60 Great post. I have wondered about this a lot since I started having prostate problems. Vasectomy in 1980 DXed with PCa in 2006 at age 55 Mike >Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that >vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in >1981, and I am now 60 Hubby had vasectomy in 1971 at age 25. Diagnosed with PCa 6/2006 at age 59. i had vasectomy dec 1975 dxed PCa aug 2005 im 58 now > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 Vasectomy 1972 at age 34. PCa Dx in March, 2002. I will be 69 in February. Hubby never had a vasectomy. His current age is 60. > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 No vasectomy, age 57 and 4 years post surgery.  SignatureJK Sinrod www.SinrodStudios.com www.MyConeyIslandMemories.com Me neither..... John Loomis > Hubby never had a vasectomy. His current age is 60. > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >> For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in >> 1981, and I am now 60 Vasectomy 1973, age 31. PCa diagnosed in 2003, now 64. Dave Perry > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 > If you have PCa, have you had vasectomy in the past ? Please state > approximate year and current age. Thanks. No vasectomy. DX'd PCa May 2001 at age 64. Age 70 last month. Vasectomy 1980, PCa Dx 2002 PS: I've often wondered about this myself, but it will be hard to find a correlation without a scientific study group, nevertheless, let's see where this goes. Rich > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 > If you have PCa, have you had vasectomy in the past ? Please state > approximate year and current age. Thanks. No vasectomy here. I.P. > > If you have PCa, have you had vasectomy in the past ? Please state > > approximate year and current age. Thanks. > > No vasectomy here. > > I.P.I'm 68 had my prostate removed April 2006, had a Vasectomy in 1965 > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 Was there no prostate cancer before vasectomies? Mary Yes and yes. Vasectomies have been around for a long time just as birth control has been around for along time. Although castration was probably more common and I guess most of the guys survived it. I believe I read that some of the ancient Egyptians had vasectomies. I know the women back then were using IUD's Bev > > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Mary > Yes and yes. Vasectomies have been around for a long time just as birth > control has been around for along time. Although castration was probably > more common and I guess most of the guys survived it. I believe I read > that > some of the ancient Egyptians had vasectomies. I know the women back then > were using IUD's You don't look old enough :-) Maty No vasectomy here. Dx 2/04 at age 62. What are we looking for, the presence or absence of some correlation between vasectomy and prostate cancer? Post facto, ergo propter facto? "After the event, therefore because of the event???" SignatureJerryW Please respond to group; email address is not valid 2/11/04 PSA 2.6, Suspicious DRE (age 62) 2/23/04 Biopsy: Gleason 3+4=7, T2a, left lobe 5/18/04 RRP, Path: Gleason 4+3=7, T2c, both lobes Fully continent by 9/04 PSA <0.1 since > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 No vasectomy. diagnosed in 1005 at 48.5 years old surgery 2 months later just turned 50 a month ago..... sorry for type james...@hotmail.com SHOULD HAVE written: > No vasectomy. > > diagnosed in 2005 at 48.5 years old > surgery 2 months later > > just turned 50 a month ago..... sorry for typo james...@hotmail.com SHOULD HAVE written: > No vasectomy. > > diagnosed in 2005 at 48.5 years old > surgery 2 months later > > just turned 50 a month ago..... No vasectomy. diagnosed in 2005 at 48.5 years old surgery 2 months later just turned 50 a month ago..... no vasectomy RP surgery 1/2006 age 61 Colophony > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 > If you have PCa, have you had vasectomy in the past ? Please state > approximate year and current age. Thanks. No vasectomy, prostate cancer at age 57. 59 now. -kh Vasectomy in 1979, DX PCA May 2003, Age now 65. Ron S. cmdrdata wrote: >> If you have PCa, have you had vasectomy in the past ? Please state >> approximate year and current age. Thanks. Vasectomy circa 1984 @age 38, DX Pca 12/1999@age 53, RRP 3/2000, Currently 60. Of greater significance perhaps to the question of PCa: I was born a male with a prostate gland<g> > cmdrdata wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Of greater significance perhaps to the question of PCa: I was born a male > with a prostate gland<g> That does sound like a potential problem :-) Mary > cmdrdata wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Of greater significance perhaps to the question of PCa: I was born a male > with a prostate gland<g> Maybe more important than even that.... is your PSA still 0.03? I haven't heard (read) in almost a year and a half. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum >> cmdrdata wrote: >>>> If you have PCa, have you had vasectomy in the past ? Please state [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Maybe more important than even that.... is your PSA still 0.03? I haven't > heard (read) in almost a year and a half. It's been awhile since my Uro and Dianon have used the ultra sensitive PSA assay. At least 3 years IIRC. At any rate, I just had my semi-annual checkup/test and it's still <0.10 ng/ml or undetectable. He just told me to start scheduling the PSA's and exams on a YEARLY basis as there is no indication (fingers STILL crossed) of recurrence. Thanks for asking. BTW, recently spoke with Beth who's SO, Bill, had his RRP shortly before me. She hasn't hung out or dropped by since dumping her Webtv "computer" and switching to a MAC. Anyone recommend a good Mac newsreader and where it can be downloaded? I'll pass it along. "Unquestionably Confused" <puzzled2@ameritech.net> wrote in message news:ahJjh.11616$ > BTW, recently spoke with Beth who's SO, Bill, had his RRP shortly before > me. She hasn't hung out or dropped by since dumping her Webtv "computer" > and switching to a MAC. Anyone recommend a good Mac newsreader and where > it can be downloaded? I'll pass it along. Is Beth the veternarian who lives in Florida? She was real helpful to me after my RP in 2002. If so, please say hi for me, and that I'm still grateful to her. Claude > "Unquestionably Confused" <puzzled2@ameritech.net> wrote in message > news:ahJjh.11616$ [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > after my RP in 2002. If so, please say hi for me, and that I'm still > grateful to her. Claude Yeppers, the same. She was/is helpful to many of us here. Tried to respond privately but your e-mail addy is munged and neither Beth nor I could respond off-group. By now you - an all her other old friends (and likely some new ones) can see that "Sheeeee's Back" as bsbk13@comcast.net Welcome back Beth, don't be such a stranger. >> "Unquestionably Confused" <puzzled2@ameritech.net> wrote in message >> news:ahJjh.11616$ [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Welcome back Beth, don't be such a stranger. So, how's Bill. Haven't heard since June 2003. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum > It's been awhile since my Uro and Dianon have used the ultra sensitive PSA > assay. At least 3 years IIRC. At any rate, I just had my semi-annual > checkup/test and it's still <0.10 ng/ml or undetectable. He just told me > to start scheduling the PSA's and exams on a YEARLY basis as there is no > indication (fingers STILL crossed) of recurrence. Almost six years and no hint of recurrence. I'd say you're done with the bastard. Congratulations, Bob! SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum Ron had vasectomy in 1982 at age 50. Diagnosed in March 2003 at age 70 and is now 74. Heather > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 yes, i had a vasectomy. december 1990 age 35 diagnosed pca june 2005 age 50 rrp september 2005 curently 51 years. > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 Based on the data I have so far, 55% of all prostate cancer victims had vasectomies. Of those, on average, they had the vasectomy at Age 31 and caught cancer 29 years later. Interestingly, it looks as if getting a vasectomy, on average, helped guys live 3 years longer before catching cancer. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum > Based on the data I have so far, 55% of all prostate cancer victims had > vasectomies. Of those, on average, they had the vasectomy at Age 31 and > caught cancer 29 years later. > > Interestingly, it looks as if getting a vasectomy, on average, helped guys > live 3 years longer before catching cancer. Spouse had a vasectomy in 1969, aged 29*, is now 67 (diagnosed at 67) so that skews the average somwewhat :-) Mary * after we had five children in seven years and everything else let us down Vasectomy in 1978 age 31 Dx PCa 2002 age 55 For your information, Vasectomised April 1986 Now aged 64, British, white, married, early retirement after multiple heart attacks, Type Diabetic treated by Metformin and diet. Diagnosed PCa April this year. Gleason 8 (4+4), PSA12 Surgery not an option due to damaged heart. Treatment started 5th May Flutamide 250mg for 28 days. Zoladex started 19th May, ongoing. Radiotherapy started 22nd August Normal 3D-conformal, 32 factions followed by 5 high intensity factions ( Consultant later referred to as Radical Radiotherapy Treatment, similar to Radical Prostatectomy). They took Blood for PSA the last time I saw the Consultant but I won't get the results until 17th Jan 2007. I hope the above is some use to you. I have found great comfort in this newsgroup and hope to enjoy it for some time to come (especially the humor) Bill, Blackpool, England > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 > For your information, > Vasectomised April 1986 [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > humor) > Bill, Blackpool, England Welcome to the NG, Billy. January 17!!! That's a hell of a long time to wait. I get my results in 3 days, sometimes 2. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum Owen of Portland, Me. Vasectomy - 1975 age 25 Dx'd Pca - 2003 age 53 It is getting kind of interesting. 20+ posters tallied. 55% went unleaded on average at about Age 34 and waited until 26 years later for a cancer diagnosis. What I find interesting is that with all the added data, unleaded men (cancer at 59) are still outlasting leaded men (cancer at 56) by 3 years when it comes to prostate cancer. I really would have thought that figure would draw even. I know, Leonard, it's not statistically pure -- but, it is interesting. SignatureShould have gotten a vasectomy @ 34 PSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum > Owen of Portland, Me. > > Vasectomy - 1975 age 25 > Dx'd Pca - 2003 age 53 > It is getting kind of interesting. 20+ posters tallied. 55% went unleaded > on average at about Age 34 and waited until 26 years later for a cancer [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > would draw even. I know, Leonard, it's not statistically pure -- but, it is > interesting. Donno about Lenny but you might turn the numbers around and look at them from another direction. What percentage of guys HAVE Vasectomies? 20%? 70%? I'm guessing that they are not that common but I don't know. Are they over or under represented in the exclusive prostate cancer club membership? I know 4 guys who had vasectomies. 1 was happily married, he and his wife were raising a family, a boy and a girl and didn't want more children. 1 had not had children, didn't want any; he was single. 2 were older guys who had had children, were divorced and wanted to play the field with no paternity issues. Oh wait, there was a fifth guy. He was married, his wife had her tubes tied. Then he started seeing another woman.... "kh", he asked me, "do you think my wife would notice if I got a vasectomy. You see, there's this gal, and, well, the condoms are getting on our nerves." Yes. I think she'd notice. -kh >> It is getting kind of interesting. 20+ posters tallied. 55% went >> unleaded [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > me, "do you think my wife would notice if I got a vasectomy. You see, > there's this gal, and, well, the condoms are getting on our nerves." In my work environment, it seems that most married couples get fixed either with tubal ligation or vasectomy. Rarely have I seen a man do it for extra-marital activity, but I have seen it. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum > It is getting kind of interesting. 20+ posters tallied. 55% went unleaded > on average at about Age 34 and waited until 26 years later for a cancer > diagnosis. ... > I know, Leonard, it's not statistically pure -- but, it is > interesting. It is a volunteer sample, so you'd not want to conclude anything from this. Is there some reason to believe that there might be a connection between vasectomies and prostate cancer? > Is there some reason to believe that there might be a connection > between vasectomies and prostate cancer? Pure folly. But it doesn't cost anyone anything. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum > Is there some reason to believe that there might be a connection > between vasectomies and prostate cancer? When it comes to our bodies, there are still many unknowns about how they changed. For example, we know that vasectomy stops the travel of sperm to the prostate where it meets with the prostatic fluid to become viable semen. What else is no longer mixed with this fluid? We don't know. Perhaps, a certain protein or maybe hormone generated in the testes or lack of it caused prostate cells to mutate over time. Of course this does not explain why those without vasectomy also get prostate cancer. Just look at the recent news on HRT, where the incidence of breast cancer went down dramatically when many women stopped taking hormone therapy. It could be that the answer is male hormone issue, too much or too little of it. Snipped in 1984 at 37, DX'd in 2002 at 56. > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 Bob from Boothbay,Me. No vasectomy; DX'd 6/05; LRP 8/05; now age 75. Vasectomy 1985 Diagnosed PC 5/2005 Age now 67 Rich H > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 Vasectomy - 1977 age 27 Dx'd Pca - 1999 age 49 Current age 57 cil > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 >> Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that >> vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey No vasectomy, dx'd at age 62 in 02. Tom ... > If you have PCa, have you had vasectomy in the past ? Please state > approximate year and current age. Thanks. ... I had no vasectomy. I was diagnosed with PCa in August of this year. I am 51. --charlie Vasectomy 1978 Age 32 PCA diagnosed Feb, 2006 Age 60 > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 I had vasectomy in the early 1980's and diagnosed with PCa in 1996 when I was 49 and am now just about to turn 60. I've read the same things but always had some belief that it is related. As a scientist, I have to believe null findings (that there is no relationship) to a degree, but it all depends on sampling. It will be interesting to see what this group has to say. Tom > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 >I had vasectomy in the early 1980's and diagnosed with PCa in 1996 when I >was 49 and am now just about to turn 60. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > interesting to see what this group has to say. > Tom Is this your first post, Tom? If so, welcome. And, please let us know how you've beat the bastard. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum I was 27 when I had a vasectomy. I had RP in Nov 2005 with a PSA of 4.1 and a Gleason of 3 +3. Pre surgery biopsy showed only 1 core ( with 5% of that core with cancer) out of 16 with cancer. I was 68 when I had the surgery. Today my PSA is <0.01. Roy Benson in Winston > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 I had a vasectomy about 30 years before DX'd with PC Vas in my 40s, PC in my 70s. > I was 27 when I had a vasectomy. I had RP in Nov 2005 with a PSA of 4.1 > and a Gleason of 3 +3. Pre surgery biopsy showed only 1 core ( with 5% of [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > > 1981, and I am now 60 Hope it's not too late to assist science. Husband: no vasectomy (running on premium, not unleaded) Jonathan James Age: 55 diagn. 8/05 @ 53, RLRP 10/15/05, NY Hosp., Dr. Tewari PSA: 10 GL: 4+3 = 7 I know I should have all this other info but I am clueless. I think he was due for another psa test in Nov. but I am not going to remind him. Therapy: pom juice, heaping platters of spaghetti w/sauce and lots of garlic. Leah > Hope it's not too late to assist science. > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > I know I should have all this other info but I am clueless. I think he > was due for another psa test in Nov. but I am not going to remind him. Leah, I know you know that the best way to track and be prepared for recurrence is a regimen of collection of PSA. Why would you (pl) no avail yourselves of the opportunity? BTW, I don't think you've reported his previous PSAs (assuming they've been quarterly) since his surgery. How is he doing? SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum > > Hope it's not too late to assist science. > > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > BTW, I don't think you've reported his previous PSAs (assuming they've been > quarterly) since his surgery. How is he doing? Thanks for giving me a push, Steve. I didn't want to nag my husband about these things -- it took a heck of a lot of work just getting him to adopt the pca "diet" and I felt bad afterwards bec. I thought I had scared him to death in the process. But I did ask J. the other day when was his last psa test and he said a couple of months ago (I think in was in August) but J. also said at that time he was told to come back in 6 mos. J. had had RP in Oct. '05 so I'm wondering if it is standard procedure to go to twice yearly testing that early. As far as the numbers I don't know about the first couple of psa tests because the nurse just told J. on the phone that everything was OK. The last one, in August, I received in the mail from a different doctor and I believe it said the psa was < .01. Anyway, J. has followed up by calling the doctor's office to inquire about the status of his testing but he hasn't gotten an answer yet (so far it's been two days). I asked J. to ask the doc for the full path report in case there is some useful info. we should know. I don't want more info just for the sake of scaring us...only if it can be helpful in some way. I know that his margins were negative, no involvement of nodes as far as we know. The truth is that after reading stuff in these groups for a couple of months I have concluded that the patient himself, have to be on top of things yourself you have to be your own doctor to a certain extent. A lot of useful info was given to me here and not by the "medics", as someone calls them. I am going to read up on the ultrasensitive test vs. the regular psa test -- what is your opinion about that. Also, I am not thrilled with his GL.. score and I'm wondering if you know of any cases where a patient has been advised to do any kind of "proactive" treatment to forestall a possible recurrence. He is going to call the doctor for the 3rd time today to try to get his clinical info. If you think there is something particular that we should ask for please let me know. Thanks again for the help and support. Leah. > it took a heck of a lot of work just getting him > to adopt the pca "diet" and I felt bad afterwards bec. I thought I had > scared him to death in the process. Unless he now likes it, consider letting him eat what he wants until and unless the diet is proved, item by item, to help. > it is standard procedure to go to twice yearly testing that early. Nope; quarterly, especially in the first few years post-op. > I don't know about the first couple of psa tests > the nurse just told J. on the phone that everything was OK. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > to get his clinical info. If you think there is something > particular that we should ask for please let me know. Simple: Every single bit of data and opinion the doctor has. Leah, a) every bit of data and educated opinion is vital when making decisions about PC, b) virtually every PC pt has more, even tougher, decisions to make after his first tx (see below), and c) data are useless when we don't have them at our fingertips, in print, and even somewhat organized. Otherwise our fate is in the hands of a gaggle of relative strangers with often different objectives than ours. > A lot of useful info was given to me here and not by the "medics", > as someone calls them. That's been shown by many studies and lamented by many PC authors. Of course, the flip side of that coin is the amount of BSD online. Wear your hip boots. > I am going to read up on the ultrasensitive test vs. the regular psa > test -- what is your opinion about that. Google it in this forum. It's been discussed to death here. > Also, I am not thrilled with > his GL.. score and I'm wondering if you know of any cases where a > patient has been advised to do any kind of "proactive" treatment to > forestall a possible recurrence. Virtually EVERY PC pt was advised or ordered after his initial treatment to accept proactive/ preemptive/ just-in-case/ what-the-hell/ it's-your-body-not-mine-so-what-do-I-care/ only-heartbeat-counts adjuvant (additional) tx. It took me only a couple of hundred hours of intense research to make my decision, partly because the forum archives didn't address that issue significantly. That began to change two years ago. I.P. > Thanks for giving me a push, Steve. I didn't want to nag my husband > about these things -- it took a heck of a lot of work just getting him [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > back in 6 mos. J. had had RP in Oct. '05 so I'm wondering if it is > standard procedure to go to twice yearly testing that early. I can see where discussions of diet might scare someone. It makes the assumption that cancer is present. If the prostate is gone and the cancer is gone, there is no need for a PCa diet. Of course, you and I know that is a big "if". It's hard enough to get someone to change their lifestyle of eating based on reality, let alone an "if." I'd back off that one if I were you. PSA testing, however, can be proposed to J. based on, "just in case." And really, we are not looking at "just in case" there is a reccurrence. We know it's not really a recurrence. It's just in case the RLRP didn't get all the cancer. One nice thing about surgery is one always has a second chance at a cure. If the RLRP didn't get it all, then radiation can be directed to the spot where it is most likely to remain - the prostate bed. And, the success of that depends largely on how fast it is known that the cancer is still there. Which brings me to frequency of PSAs. The more PSAs you have, the faster you can determine if there is a rise sufficient to warrant radiation. That said, my numbers were PSA 16 (6 more than J.) and Gleason 7 (albeit, mine was 3+4). And, while I had positive margins, my seminal vesicles were involved. My doc put me on a regimin of quarter PSAs for a year and semiannually for two years and annually thereafter. But, by my 'last' quarterly PSA, my numbers were rising. Eventually, I had to go through the radiation. In my case, that was not enough. C'est la vie. As to J., his PSA 10 and Gleasonof 4+3 would be enough to cause me (now that I know what I know) to relish quarterly PSAs for a year or two. But, then, if the last result was < 0.01, well, it just don't get much better than that. Maybe the doc figured that is such a good score, that his 'last' quarterly PSA isn't necessary. It seems, anecdotally, that recurrence is most likely about 1½ years. His next PSA is scheduled for February. That'll put him at about 1¼ years. I'd say that's a good time. > I asked J. to ask the doc for the full path > report in case there is some useful info. we should know. I don't want > more info just for the sake of scaring us...only if it can be helpful > in some way. Absolutely! I waited years to get mine. It is a fact that YOU, with all the research you've done, probably are ahead of his doctor in learning of the newest studies, strategies, etc., unless he specialises in prostate cancer. This is a very complicated disease and knowing all about it doesn't help you a twit with J. unless you know all about him. > I am going to read up on the ultrasensitive test vs. the regular psa > test -- what is your opinion about that. There is quite a debate about how much is enough and how much is counterproductive to the human spirit. My (and only my) opinion is that in the first 1½ years after surgery (not radiation) the assay should be ultrasensitive. That gives the patient/doctor a quicker knowledge of rising PSA. But, for radiation patients and for patients who have survived a couple of years by whatever means, I think triple sub-decimal digit numbers vary too much for the human psyche. > Also, I am not thrilled with > his GL.. score and I'm wondering if you know of any cases where a > patient has been advised to do any kind of "proactive" treatment to > forestall a possible recurrence. No, not really. If he is sitting at less than 1/100th of a nanogram, there just isn't enough cancer (if he still has cancer) so show up on any scan that I know of. There are, as I understand it, new blood and urine tests being developed, but I dont' know how good they will be either at such low levels of PSA. > He is going to call the doctor for the 3rd time today to try to get his > clinical info. If you think there is something particular that we > should ask for please let me know. It's one of the reasons I love the midwest. I was in my doc's office one day getting a Lupron shot and I said, how can I get a copy of my records. My doc got up, looked out the door and said, "Jeannie, can you make a copy of Steve's records for him? .... Yeah .... before he leaves." I said that I didn't need them quite that fast and he looked out again and said, "Jeannie, nevermind, whenever you have time today and mail them to him." > Thanks again for the help and support. Not at all, that's what we are here for. I hope you know, and if not I'm here to tell you, and you really should tell Jonathon.... His post operative score 10 months after surgery of less than 0.01 is really a good sign that he might be completely cured and that the cancer part of this is behind him. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum Sorry for the late reply. No vasectomy. Dx'd July 06 at 57. Turned 58 in August. Iodine seeds 10/23. Had 33rd of 35 IMRTs this morning. > I can see where discussions of diet might scare someone. It makes the > assumption that cancer is present. If the prostate is gone and the cancer > is gone, there is no need for a PCa diet. That's not the way I see it. I'll be on a PCa diet from now on. I don't care how far down I've beaten the bastard, I'm not going to give it a chance to come back. Besides, a prostate healthy diet is also a heart healthy diet. Happy New Year, John > Besides, a prostate healthy diet is also a heart healthy diet. With the exception, alas, of flaxseed oil and arguably other healthy oils. I.P. > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 My wonderful Bill had a vasectomy c. 1977, prostate cancer diagnosed 1999. Celebrated our 30th anniversary last night. Merry Christmas, y'all, and my apologies for not keeping in touch like I should....any/all old friends welcome to reply! Hugs...Beth >> Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that >> vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Merry Christmas, y'all, and my apologies for not keeping in touch like > I should....any/all old friends welcome to reply! Hugs...Beth We're all very happy for your anniversary, Beth, but we thrive vicariously on numbers. How's Bill's PSA? SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum P&E Hi Beth!, Happy Holidays!!! ((((HUGS)))) Bev > > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Merry Christmas, y'all, and my apologies for not keeping in touch like > I should....any/all old friends welcome to reply! Hugs...Beth > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 I had a vasectomy 06/1995 was diagnosed PCa 02/06 >> Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that >> vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > I had a vasectomy 06/1995 was diagnosed PCa 02/06 Hi Dave!!! Damned happy to see you again. I thought you had given up on us. How did the IGRT work for you? SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum Hey Steve, Thank-you for the warm welcome back. I've been back at work driving over the 48. I have a co-driver so the fatigue is more manageable and I'm not as lonely. I guess the igrt worked fine. They hit me 42 times with it. Then two weeks later I went back to work. I do get tired easily, but the company Dr. that ok's my med permit said he thought I was doing great on being fit, considering the surgeries, ADT, chemo implants, rads etc....etc....lol...you guys have all been there. Actually, except for the sexual extinction I feel maybe 90% of how I felt in 2005 ( before dx and anxiety etc). My laptop bit the dust so getting on-line has been a prob, I'm home and using my mom's puter. You sure put a smile on my face:) Dave > >> Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > >> vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > PSA <0.04 > Non Illegitimi Carborundum > I've been back at work driving > over the 48. That's great! Last we spoke there was no hint that you'd be hitting the road anytime soon. > They hit me 42 times > with it. Then two weeks later I went back to work. I do get tired > easily, Mine was 35 and I tired easily for a long time. Maybe as much as a year. I didn't realize it at the time, though. Just thought I was getting old. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 forgot the age, vasectomy in 1995 age 43 dx'd PCa 2006 age 54 I had a vasectomy at the age of 30. I was DX'd with PCa about a year ago at the age of 59. Please post the results under a separate heading. David Vasectomy in 1982, dx'd 9/2005, I'm 59. > Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that > vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > For the record, I was DXed with PCa in 9/ 2006, my vasectomy was in > 1981, and I am now 60 Vasectomy around 1993....Dxed with PCa in 3/2005....now 54. Don >> Most journals and internet searches that I've encountered said that >> vasectomy does not cause prostate cancer. So here's an informal survey [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Don You got me, Don. Are you Don Smith, Don W., Don Wheeler, Don Andon, Don C., Don Coon, or WebDon? Or another Don of which I was previously unfamiliar? SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 PSA <0.04 Non Illegitimi Carborundum
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