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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / October 2003

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Well, its off to see the wizard .... er, surgeon. Was "Mind if I stay a while"

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JimBob - 28 Oct 2003 15:00 GMT
Hey all from JimBob,

About 6 weeks ago I posted my diagnosis , PSA 4, Gleason 6 ( 3+3 ),
stage T1c, biopsy positive in 5% in 1 of 12 samples and reasonably good
health at 57 years of age.

Have not posted much but kept lurking and getting info. My wife and I
met with my uro-doc about 2 and a half weeks ago to talk about treatment
options and came to the following decision ( also based on consults with
several other medical specialists ).

Radiation ( all forms ) ..... Once you do it, you'll never go back,
except to radiation. That was the biggest turnoff as far as RT was
concerned. I did recently respond to a poster questioning which way to
go treatment wise with the "you can't put a scrambled egg back together
again and do surgery on it". Even the radiation oncologists tend to
agree, however reluctantly. Although RT is a viable first option in many
cases, just not mine !!

Surgery ..... As I live in the NE ( mid Atlantic ) my primary doc wanted
me to go to Hopkins in Baltimore for the RP. Could have done it but the
family logistics and related stuff was a real barrier. During the
consult with my uro-doc he advised that if I was not going to Hopkins he
strongly suggested that I stay with his practice of 6 surgeons, all with
10-20 years experience in RP's among the other urinary stuff.

When I suggested a couple of the large teaching hospitals in the "big
city" near us ( I will leave unnamed to avoid fire-fights ) he said that
he had "grown-up" in those facilities and that they were the last place
to have RP's done. Why, I asked ..... turns out that in many cases the
surgery is done by surgical residents without the level of experience
necessary to minimize side-effects ( incontinence is one of my biggest
concerns ).  In my uro-docs practice they have a rule that every RP is
carried out by the patients primary Uro-doc/surgeon in the practice and
that there is *never* any surgery caried out unless another one of the
surgeons from the practice is "table side" as the assisting ( no interns
or first year residents in this crowd ). He also confided that a number
of the practice's patients are from the "teaching hospitals" that
performed less than stellar surgical procedures. I was also reassured by
all the other consults that this urology practice was "best in show" in
my particular neighborhood.

When I questioned their long term results he said that their survival
and side effect success rate was very comparable to the regional cancer
centers due to their level of experience and technique. I asked about
giving blood prior to surgery cause I read that some of the guys here
were doing it and he pretty much poo-poo'ed the idea as it was almost
unheard of for any of their patients to need blood. I'll take the chance !

So tomorrow I show up at the short procedure unit at 9:30 for "slice and
dice", get introduced to Mr. Foley and then go home Friday PM. If it was
not for the surgery I would be looking forward to a few days on my butt.
It never occurred to me all the stuff around the house that needed doing
before I'm on "restricted activity" for a while. Man I'm tired from the
last week of fixing, fetching and preparing.

So I'll be back a-postin' with my surgical diary of sorts Saturday
morning. Thats if I can get past the guard ( my wife ) to the computers
on the third floor.

Bye for Now,
JimBob
Leonard Evens - 28 Oct 2003 15:35 GMT
> Hey all from JimBob,
>
[quoted text clipped - 55 lines]
> morning. Thats if I can get past the guard ( my wife ) to the computers
> on the third floor.

I pretty much did the same thing.  Due to HMO restrictions, going to
Hopkins was never an option.  I went to the urologist my primary care
physician recommended.  I did check his qualifications, and he seemed to
be well trained, and the level of medical care on the North Shore of
Chicago is generally pretty high.  Also he regularly had done the
procedure.  In my case, the hospital was a teaching hospital, but my
doctor performed the surgery.   He was assisted by a resident in
training at Northwestern Memorial and Evanston hospital, but I was
assured the resident wouldn't do any significant part of the surgery.
In any case, he turned out to be a former student of mine who had taken
calculus from me as a freshman at Northwestern.  I would have given him
an A+ at the time, except that we don't have that grade, so I figured I
was in pretty good hands as far as the resident was concerned.

At three years I have undetectable PSA, I was continent within a month
of the catheter coming out, and I am able to have erections, often
without any aids at all, easily with viagra.   Since at age 67 my odds
of retaining erections was at most 50 percent anyway, I figure I did
pretty well.   It did take 18 months, but we managed with a pump during
that time.  So all told, my surgeon did a good job on me.

I hope/expect you will do as well, except I hope you don't have to wait
18 months for an erection.

> Bye for Now,
> JimBob
John Loomis - 28 Oct 2003 15:58 GMT
Hello Jim,
   Sounds like you made an informed decision.
I did go to a University Med Center.  Stanford.  When the Dr. looked at me
and said he can help me, I had this electrical feeling that he could.  Yes
they did have many students in and around the Hospital, but Dr. James D.
Brooks was the surgeon.  The students removed the bottles that drained the
incision area.  They also got all the parts and pieces for study.  You can
give those for medical studies!
I was continent the day the cath was removed.  Maybe a tiny drip.......but
that went away the next day.
I did provide 2 units of blood.  No big deal.  It was very rich from being
told to eat certain foods prior to donation, and I believe they used one
unit.
It took me about 2 years to get an erection since they removed one set of
nerves.  The Dr. helped me with injection medication, a pump, and finally
things sprang up. Amazing!
I was 49 in 1999 and had surgery Nov. 99  I so far have undectible PSA. and
do thank the creator for getting me so far!
Good wishes to you and your speedy recovery.
Get a recliner.......Walk.........
John Loomis

> Hey all from JimBob,
>
[quoted text clipped - 58 lines]
> Bye for Now,
> JimBob
JimBob - 28 Oct 2003 16:55 GMT
> Hello Jim,
>     Sounds like you made an informed decision.

.... snip ....

> Good wishes to you and your speedy recovery.
> Get a recliner.......Walk.........

Got one, have been and will be. We have one of those old 2.5 story tudor
style houses from the twenties. From my workshop in the basement to the
computers on the third floor ( attic ) is about 4 flights of stairs. So
I have to get back in shape to go between the two areas that I really
care about ( with stops in the kitchen of course ).

> John Loomis
Steve Kramer - 28 Oct 2003 23:40 GMT
Steps were no problem for me after my RPP.  Took them slowly, of course.

Signature

Steve Kramer
PSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46
Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c
RRP 12/15/2000
PSA  .1  .1  .1  .3  .4  .8
EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47
PSA  .3 .2  .2  .2 .3
Erection 05/12/2003 @ 48
Begin Lupron 07/21/2003 @ 48
PSA  .1

>
> > Hello Jim,
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> > John Loomis
c palmer - 28 Oct 2003 16:47 GMT
hi jimbob - it sounds like you did your home work and you've made your
decision and are not looking back.  that is the way to do it.  and on
that note, i will say the best of luck.  all that is left is jumping up
on the table and having a bit of slice and dice.  

you seem to have a great sense of humor and that will probably carry you
farther in your healing process that all the meds combined.  

you did not mention nerve sparing, but i'm assuming from your stats,
that it is on your list of things you would like done.

there is one comment that you said that i would like to address.  the
blood loss.  when they cut the main artery above the prostate, that is
usually where the main blood loss comes from.  unless they got a special
procedure, you will loss the "usual" amount of blood.  whether or not,
it is enough to need a unit or not, i can't say.  i can tell you this.
in my case, i did not give blood and they said that when they were done
with me, that i had lost quite a bit of blood and that they thought
about it, but said that they did not give me any blood because the loss
of blood decreases the chances of getting blood clots that you hear
about after the surgery.  

i wish you the best and although you won't sleep well tonight, i can
honestly tell you that by this weekend, when you are back home that you
will say that a great weight has been taken off of you and in six
months, you will look back and it will be like a speed bump of life.

see ya on the flip side. :)

~ curtis

knowledge is power - growing old is mandatory - growing wise is optional
MH - 28 Oct 2003 22:58 GMT
Good luck to you, Jim!!!
Soon you'll be able to tell us *all about it*..
Take care... all will go well, I'm sure!

MikeH :)

> Hey all from JimBob,
>
[quoted text clipped - 58 lines]
> Bye for Now,
> JimBob
 
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