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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / July 2006Started IMRT today
I feel like I've finally begun the beginning of the end today. I'm taking 40 treatments then maybe......only maybe.....Lupron or something for a while. Got a PSA 06/30, it came back 0.04 down from 0.06 a couple of months ago, which was down from 36.8 in Feb. That one was pre-RP and pre-ADT. Also on 06/30 they gave me an implant called "ELIGARD". Has anyone taken this one? It's supposed to be like Casodex and Zolodex (which I had been on). It was in the stomach and burned alittle, but not bad. The one fly in the ointment was the Gleason's of 9's and 10's. The PA on my case had never seen them that high and with perineural invasion, but the PSA does seem to negate that (in my view anyhow). All the equipment is brand new. Just installed last week. MD Anserson in Houston has yet to get the same equipment up and running, but will have it going soon. Something about the Ultrasound and a "directed beam?" It's supposed to eliminated rectal burning and other SE's of heavy RT. I would appreciate any info on the Eligard if anyone knows about it? Thank-you David Wonderful! The newer the equipment the better. Wishing you lots of luck! Bev > I feel like I've finally begun the beginning of the end today. I'm > taking 40 treatments then maybe......only maybe.....Lupron or something [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Thank-you > David On July 11, David wrote: > I feel like I've finally begun the beginning of the end today. I'm > taking 40 treatments then maybe......only maybe.....Lupron or something [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > (which I had been on). It was in the stomach and burned alittle, but > not bad. It's Lupron by another name. See infra. > The one fly in the ointment was the Gleason's of 9's and 10's. > The PA on my case had never seen them that high and with perineural [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > heavy RT. > David's report is vague, perhaps because he did not closely question the medic. This may (or may not) be IGRT (Image Guided RT) aka tomotherapy. It is the newest form of IMRT. It is said to provide for enhanced and precise radiation application. I call it IMRT on steroids. I referred a friend to a rad onc in Scottsdale, Arizona who offered this tx. He (the friend) is delighted with his results. Another friend is presently on that same regimen with the same rad onc. Stand by..... > I would appreciate any info on the Eligard if anyone knows about it? > Eligard is leuprolide acetate, exactly the same as Lupron. See http://www.rxlist.com/ Oddly enough, Lupron is normally administered via the buttock, though the Eligard website (by the exact same manufacturer, Sanofi Aventis) recommends soft tissue such as the abdomen. I have no explanation. There is reason to believe that IMRT + complementary ADT is helpful. Regards, Steve J "Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson Thanks Steve, I going to ask the medic tomorrow. I guess I get to see her every day. Her name is Frances. > On July 11, David wrote: > > I feel like I've finally begun the beginning of the end today. I'm [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > and leave a trail." > -- Ralph Waldo Emerson David wrote: >> All the equipment is brand new. Just installed last week. MD Anserson >> in Houston has yet to get the same equipment up and running, but will >> have it going soon. Something about the Ultrasound and a "directed >> beam?" It's supposed to eliminated rectal burning and other SE's of >> heavy RT. And Steve Jordan replied: > David's report is vague, perhaps because he did not closely question the > medic. This may (or may not) be IGRT (Image Guided RT) aka tomotherapy. > It is the newest form of IMRT. It is said to provide for enhanced and > precise radiation application. I call it IMRT on steroids. Is this similar to CyberKnife, or another name for it? One was installed here on June 19th. I've misplaced the URLs, but a Google search will turn it up. Steve, You were entirely correct. It is IGRT, although the RT lady had not heard the term "tomotherapy". I have a number of friends that live in Houston and were wanting me to come there, on the premise that the therapy is very advanced. What I had heard was. however, was that they still did not have the IGRT up and running on a big scale. MD Anserson is a big hospital. In the end I guess I also did'nt want to go all the way down there and try find a new doctor. I would like some feedback to this protontherapy Curtis had informed me of. I had thought it was only in Maryland and San Diego. My friends sent this web site. If anyone has the time, could you look and give me an opinion. It seems as much as advertisement as anything to me. www.mdanderson.org/protontherapy Thank-you David > On July 11, David wrote: > > I feel like I've finally begun the beginning of the end today. I'm [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > and leave a trail." > -- Ralph Waldo Emerson >I feel like I've finally begun the beginning of the end today. I'm > taking 40 treatments then maybe......only maybe.....Lupron or something > for a while. Got a PSA 06/30, it came back 0.04 down from 0.06 a couple > of months ago, which was down from 36.8 in Feb. That one was pre-RP and > pre-ADT. That is a good response to ADT. > Also on 06/30 they gave me an implant called "ELIGARD". Has > anyone taken this one? It's supposed to be like Casodex and Zolodex > (which I had been on). I have not taken Eligard. It is an analog of Lupron and works the same way. As I understand it, it simulates the action of a hormone that acts on another hormone that acts on the testicles to prevent them from producing testosterone. The actual mechanism of action of these drugs is surprising because they stimulate the production of testosterone for a long period. After the first couple of weeks however the body becomes overstimulated and shuts down testosterone production. It's quite ingenious. Casodex is a different kind of drug that blocks testosterone uptake by prostate cells. They give it when you first start a drug like Lupron, Zolodex or Eligard in order to keep you from being negatively affected by that first burst of testosterone stimulated by the Eligard or whatever. You don't need it in this case because you are receiving Eligard as a continuation of other hormone therapy that has already suppressed testosterone. You can find out more about Eligard at: http://www.eligard.com/ Alan > Casodex is a different kind of drug that blocks testosterone uptake > by prostate cells. Then, why not just use that and avoid all the systemic effects of testosterone deprivation? There must be something else going on.  SignatureGlowing in the Dark >> Casodex is a different kind of drug that blocks testosterone uptake >> by prostate cells. > > Then, why not just use that and avoid all the systemic effects of > testosterone deprivation? There must be something else going on. Casodex has been used as a monotherapy, and also as a combination therapy with LHRH agonists (Lupron, etc.) in double or triple (with finasteride) androgen blockade. Some doctors will alternate Lupron and Casodex on the theory that they have different side effects and the patient gets a holiday from one of the side effect groups while taking the other drug. However it does appear that most doctors are only giving LHRH agonist drugs. There was a study in England if I remember correctly that found that high doses of Casodex over a long period produced some nasty health risk, but I don't remember what it was. Maybe that's why, or maybe LHRH drugs have been shown to be more effective, or maybe it's drug company advertising. I don't know. Alan Eligaard is not available in the USA right now. I took it for two years. I preferred it rather than Lupron. Major raeson were that side effects were few and most important, the injection went in the arm and not the hip. That has to do with Lupron need more fatty area for the injection. The makers of Lupron sued and got a restraining order back in February. Hopefully they will quit fighting. Eligaard, in my opinion was a much better product. GD >I feel like I've finally begun the beginning of the end today. I'm > taking 40 treatments then maybe......only maybe.....Lupron or something [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Thank-you > David Eligaard is not available in the USA right now Mas, I was given Eligard on 06/30/06 in Lubbock, Tx. It may have been from an old stash, but I got it for sure. It was in the abdomen with a much smaller needle than they used with Zolodex or other abdominal shots I've had since diagnosis of PC. > Eligaard is not available in the USA right now. I took it for two years. I > preferred it rather than Lupron. Major raeson were that side effects were [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Thank-you > > David You're right. They settled. I found out today. I was told tha it has only been available in the last 3-4 weeks. And I agree, it is a much better product once you get past the sting, lol gd > Eligaard is not available in the USA right now > [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] >> > Thank-you >> > David Eligaard, in my opinion was a much better product. MAS, now, after 17 days, I agree that it's better than Casodex and Zolodex. I've never had LUpron, so can't really comment on it. Most posts and people I've talked with claim worse SE''s than I'm feeling right now ( hardly any). I'm scheduled for 36 more RT's. If my PSA is still low in late Sept. I'm going to request stopping all tx. Sometimes I feel it was all a big mistake, and I'm already tired of fooling with it. > Eligaard is not available in the USA right now. I took it for two years. I > preferred it rather than Lupron. Major raeson were that side effects were [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Thank-you > > David Dave, you might re-think that. Just because the PSA is low does not mean that you whupped the bastard. Very likely when you stop the Eligaard, your PSA will rise. I have had very little SE's with Eligaard. For example almost zero hot flashes. With Lupron, I averaged 10 a day....... This whole PCa thing is a waiting game until better treatment comes along. The long you can hold out the better it will be. You might think of it as ten years instead of four.... Keep hanging in there. GD > Eligaard, in my opinion was a much better > product. [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] >> > Thank-you >> > David > MAS, now, after 17 days, I agree that it's better than Casodex and > Zolodex. I've never had LUpron, so can't really comment on it. Most [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I feel it was all a big mistake, and I'm already tired of fooling with > it. I remind you, your PSA was about 40 and your Gleason was 10. The fact that your Stage was not T4 is already pretty close to a miracle. But, it was not. That means you have a slim chance of beating the most potent prostate cancer known to man. And if you beat it, you're going to do it this year! You've been gutted, irradiated and temporarily emasculated. But, so far, while you were supposed to be at the Alamo, you seem to be meeting the bastard at San Jacinto. Don't let the bastard grind you down!!! SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06, 6/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 Casodex added daily 07/06 Non Illegitimi Carborundum BTW, MD Anderson in Houston zapped their first person on July 2, 2006. Houston Business Journal - July 3, 2006 The University of Texas M.D. Anderson Cancer Center has started treating patients at a new $125 million proton therapy center. The 94,000-square-foot center is the first National Cancer Institute-designated comprehensive cancer center to offer the treatment, and only the fourth such treatment facility in the country. ... GD >I feel like I've finally begun the beginning of the end today. I'm > taking 40 treatments then maybe......only maybe.....Lupron or something [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Thank-you > David |
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