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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / March 2006Chemo & Hormone Therapy
Hello, I've been asked to partake in a clinical trial that is testing to see if Chemotherapy combined with Hormone Therapy immediately after an RRP in high risk patients (my Gleason was an 8) helps to stave off pC recurrence longer than those without the prophylactic treatment. I guess my first post op PSA test of <.1 also fits the parameters of the trial to see if this helps to stave off the Mets. I talk to the Onc next week regarding the trial so this is all the info I have so far. I'll certainly keep you all informed. In the mean time can you recommend questions to ask? Have any of you undergone this combination of therapy? What were the side effects? What were the benefits? I've done some lengthy Googling ("Chemotherapy and hormone therapy" prostate) on it so I have seen a few articles. I am conflicted about this because on the one hand it seems like a good idea on the other hand the side effects are troubling. I loathe the idea of perpitrating the medical/pharmacological industrial complex which my cynical self sees as the driving force behind all these studys. And yet, without it our life expectancy wouldn't have reached its current level and there are some altruistic researchers out there. I don't like the idea of sitting on my hands so to speak waiting for that possible inevitable day when the blood test comes back with some velocity while I sort of like the holistic steps I'm taking by a low fat/ high soy diet, selenium supps, fish oil supps, turmuric supps, visualizing the pulverization of the micro fiber pC, in my body, both refractory and independant...and on and on and on. I know, welcome to pC life. Ok I'll stop here. Thanks y'all, WhiteSoxFan PSA 4.8 on 11/15/05 @ 52 Biopsy on 12/8/05 G8&7 T1c RRP on 1/26/06 G8 T2cNOMO Pos margins PSA <0.1 on 3/1/06 I have also been asked to sign up for a similar trial that consist of 16 weeks of weekly injection of Doxorubicin and Taxotere,to be followed by 12 months of HT treatment. This would be a Phase II trial. I have recurring after EXBRT. I am also sort of apprehensive about signing up,but, what else is there? cryo,hifu? bob > Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > RRP on 1/26/06 G8 T2cNOMO Pos margins > PSA <0.1 on 3/1/06 Another question. If I start hormone therapy now, am I just giving my pC that may still be in my body, the jump on refractory resistance to the hormones? Only to find out that I've sort of 'dared' my pC into recurrence. I think Shakespeare put it best, 'To be or not to be' WhiteSoxFan > Another question. If I start hormone therapy now, am I just giving my > pC that may still be in my body, the jump on refractory resistance to > the hormones? Only to find out that I've sort of 'dared' my pC into > recurrence. I think Shakespeare put it best, 'To be or not to be' Pardon my laziness, but I'd rather just ask you than research your posts for the answer: Have you researched ADT's benefits and SEs thoroughly, including Strum's ADT Syndrome paper and the condensed summaries of that and much more that I've posted a couple of times? I think adjuvant ADT is a far tougher decision than primary surgery vs radiation. I.P. > Another question. If I start hormone therapy now, am I just giving my > pC that may still be in my body, the jump on refractory resistance to > the hormones? Only to find out that I've sort of 'dared' my pC into > recurrence. I think Shakespeare put it best, 'To be or not to be' It depends, I would think, on the purpose. If you are trying to kill it just cuz it's there, you will not succeed 100%. You will make most cells go dormant, but no more. However, if you're thinking crush the bastards under your feet and then bring in the death knell with radiation or chemo, I'd say it might work. No one knows if it will work, but it might.  SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 Non Illegitimi Carborundum > Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > done some lengthy Googling ("Chemotherapy and hormone therapy" > prostate) on it so I have seen a few articles. I have heard over the years and in reading Walsh, Strum and Scardino that this was coming. Decades ago, chemo was used on PCa without benefit and with terrible SEs. But new stuff, including Taxotere, is much, much better. One, I don't recall which doc, likened it to using a shotgun years ago and using a sniper rifle now. Furthermore, Taxotere has been successful in allowing the afflicted another 4-6 months on average. They speculate, however, that earlier use of it might extend that time out to... well, who knows? SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05, 2/06 PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 Non Illegitimi Carborundum On March 17, Steve Kramer responded to WSF: > I have heard over the years and in reading Walsh, Strum and Scardino > that this was coming. Decades ago, chemo was used on PCa without [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > another 4-6 months on average. They speculate, however, that earlier > use of it might extend that time out to... well, who knows? It would be helpful, when considering the docetaxel (Taxotere) clinical trials upon which FDA approval was founded, to consider the nature of the cohort of men who were the subjects of the trials. In essence, they were, as my med onc puts it, men who were on their last legs, who had no hope. In short, men who, knowing their conditions, volunteered to be lab rats in the hope of helping others. Such as, for instance, thee and me. They, unnamed heroes all, should be remembered with honor. And the point is that the few months that they achieved, remarkable considering their clinical states, means for those of us who have not reached that point that the results of Taxotere tx can be expected to be far better than those of the lab rats. Regards, Steve J "Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson > Hello, > > ... In the mean time can you > recommend questions to ask? Have any of you undergone this combination > of therapy? What were the side effects? What were the benefits? ... One question to ask is for the URL (the web address) of the study documentation. There will be a record in the National Cancer Institute database that should give you an abstract of the study, the eligibility criteria, details of the treatment, who is conducting it, etc. If there is a "Health Professional" version that's different from the "Patient" version, read that too. > ... I loathe the idea of perpitrating > the medical/pharmacological industrial complex which my cynical self > sees as the driving force behind all these studys. ... The documents will also tell you who the "Lead Organization/Sponsors" are. If it's being conducted by a drug company, it should say so. If it's sponsored by the National Cancer Institute or one of the Universities, that may alleviate some of your concerns. > ... And yet, without it > our life expectancy wouldn't have reached its current level and there > are some altruistic researchers out there. ... I agree. I believe that most of the doctors and scientists really do this kind of work because they believe in it. The ones who are just in it for the money are out running private clinics. They aren't working for universities or large clinics and hospitals. But of course there are cynics and exploiters in every profession. > ... I don't like the idea of > sitting on my hands so to speak waiting for that possible inevitable [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > pulverization of the micro fiber pC, in my body, both refractory and > independant...and on and on and on. ... Considering just your own future and not the future of everyone else, there is still some benefit to being in the trial. I imagine it increases your odds of a relapse free future - though of course no one knows that for sure or else there wouldn't be a clinical trial. So there are no guarantees. Being in a trial also means you'll likely get good follow up care. As to side effects, I think the important things are: 1. Learn what side effects to expect. The doctors do NOT always know. To find out, get copies of the drug labels for each drug you will get and read them. Copies should be available on the web if the doctors can't find them for you. 2. If you experience a side effect, recognize it early (which you can do because you read the label) and discuss it with the doctors early, hopefully before it becomes a severe problem. The effects may be manageable and, if not, you may be able to drop out of the trial before they get severe. Good luck. Alan National Cancer Institute - Clinical Trials: (Sorry - You'll have to copy and paste) http://www.cancer.gov/Templates/doc.aspx?viewid=CF77634E-36E7-47C2-A88E-9E7B163D 71F3&ReqUrl=%2Fclinicaltrials -Gordy I guess you won't have to copy and paste, after all. -Gordy > National Cancer Institute - Clinical Trials: > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > -Gordy Gordy's URL is clickable, but an easy-to-use alternative for posting very lengthy URLs (which often "break" when posted online) is http://tinyurl.com/. Alex |
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