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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / November 2005New Member-Needs Advise
PSA 3.1 2/1/2000 PSA 2.7 1/2/2002 PSA 6.4 10/1/2003 PSA Free % 17 Biopsy 12/1/2003 Negative Biopsy 3/1/2004 Positive Gleason 6 (3+3) Stage T1C Age: 64 EBRT 7/15/2004 PSA 1.1 1/1/2005 PSA 2.7 9/1/2005 PSA 2.7 11/1/2005 DRE New Nodule Detected. My Ero from rural W.Virginia Stated "he has done all he can". I am not a candidate for salvage surgery due to heart condition. He suggested that I try to find someone to help and he does not know where to send me!!!!!I wish I had I known that this Ero could not give me total care. What a idiot. I am about two hours from the Baltimore and Washington area. Any advise or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I am truly in a fix. Bob me total care > PSA 3.1 2/1/2000 > PSA 2.7 1/2/2002 [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Bob > me total care You're not far from Johns Hopkins in Baltimore - go there. JH is one of the premier prostrate cancer hospitals in the US. Others will chime in with additional advice. Good luck, Sandy K. RRP @ age 47 almost 18 months out - PSA's < .01 Yes, heading for Hopkins is a no brainer. And yes, "what an idiot" indeed! I would seriously consider reporting that guy to the medical society. > > could not give me total care. What a idiot. > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > RRP @ age 47 > almost 18 months out - PSA's < .01 Bob...Dr Charles "Snuffy" Myers is a highly regarded oncologist who specializes in PCa. He's got PCa himself and he lives in your neck of the woods. His work with PCa patients is widely discussed on the major PCa discussion lists. He knows what he's doing. Given that you have a recurrence, an oncologist would be a good place to start...Best wishes and good health, Ron Charles E. Myers, MD Director American Institute Diseases of the Prostate Earlysville, Virginia 22936 434-964-0212 http://www.prostateforum.com Snuffym@aol.com First, while coexisting with such an ignorant urologist has almost certainly pushed you towards panic mode, try to relax. You're still converting oxygen and carbon dioxide and will likely continue to do so for years to come. Second, the next treatment is obvious; hormone therapy. However, the need for more treatment is not so obvious. Feeling a nodule is far from diagnosing residual cancer. And your PSA indicates you have no cancerous mets (but that is just a hunch of an untrained, non-medical cancer patient). However, some believe that a post-treatment PSA of > 2.0 is sufficient to warrant additional treatment. Take your time. Read about prostate cancer. Pick yourself another urologist, or oncologist. Find out if the nodule can be biopsied. You new man will likely start you on Lupron, but may ask you to wait until February for another PSA.  SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05 PSA .07 .05 .06 .05 .08 non Illegitimi carborundum > PSA 3.1 2/1/2000 > PSA 2.7 1/2/2002 [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Bob > me total care JOHN HOPKINS........ GREAT ADVICE. DO NOT BE SHY, GET A VISIT, TAKE YOUR LAB WORK WITH YOU. GET ALL YOUR LAB MATERIAL FROM YOUR DR. THAT IS YOUR INFORMATION. You will do fine, and salvage surgery is not usually done unless the Dr. you see thinks it can be done. There are other avenues at the present. Sorry for your troubles, and best of all. John Loomis RRP 1999 (age 50) > PSA 3.1 2/1/2000 > PSA 2.7 1/2/2002 [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > Bob > me total care (snip) > My Ero from rural W.Virginia Stated "he has done all he can". I am not a > candidate for [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Any advise or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I am truly in a fix. Robert is beginning a no-quarter war with a merciless killer. The more he does to prepare himself, the better will be the result. I recommend that Robert: First: try to relax a bit. The record does not indicate an aggressive tumor. Second: Study, Learn, and Take Charge! A good start is reference to the website of the Prostate Cancer Research Institute (PCRI) at: http://prostate-cancer.org/index.html This will give Robert detailed, authoritative and, most important, *objective* information. Third: take the advice given elsewhere and consult at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore. But be aware that the treatment that will probably be recommended will be surgery, because he will be dealing with urologists, who are surgeons. There are other txs that might be more appropriate for Robert's case. Fourth: at a minimum, consult with oncologists, doctors who specialize in treatment of cancer. Generally, there are medical oncs and radiation oncs. PCRI lists such specialists. The objective is to avoid being pressured into a particular tx mode that will enrich the medic but may not be the best for Robert. Fifth: do *not* select a tx based upon the uninformed opinions of Internet amateurs. That way lies disaster. The more Robert learns to help him make an *informed* decision, the better his outcome is likely to be. Knowledge is life. Regards, Steve J "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle." --Sun Tzu, "The Art of War" Earlier, I replied to Robert's first request for help. Review of his post reminds me that he has had radiation therapy, although he does not specify the mode. I will assume until corrected that it was IMRT. If such be the case, surgery may be out of the question. As I understand it, radiotherapy makes salvage surgery very difficult and hazardous. I have heard that there are a few surgeons who are sometimes willing to undertake it, but the risk is substantial. The cancer may be systemic, though whether it is metastatic is not clear. Therefore, local txs are, according to the literature, ineffective.. It may well be that androgen deprivation therapy (ADT) and/or chemotherapy would be appropriate. A medical oncologist should be able to answer that question. Robert may have read the dire warnings posted by someone on this NG about the, according to him, inevitable, awful, unbearable, nasty and generally uncomfortable side effects (SEs) of ADT. Fear not. Men might experience some, none, or all of the possible SEs. What Chicken Little fails to report is that something can be done to alleviate such SEs as may be experienced. Another source of information, which I found to be absolutely invaluable, is the Patient to Physician website. There a patient posts his PCa Digest for review by some of the best PCa specialists on the planet. It is likely that at least one will respond. This information is pure gold. In my case, I received responses from three PCa specialists and my entire course of tx has been guided thereby since January 2005. The website is at: http://www.prostatepointers.org/p2p/ Regards, Steve J "We must tailor the treatment to the nature of the disease. We must listen to the biology." -- Stephen B. Strum, MD > Robert may have read the dire warnings posted by someone on this NG about > the, according to him, inevitable, awful, unbearable, nasty and generally > uncomfortable side effects (SEs) of ADT. Fear not. Men might experience > some, none, or all of the possible SEs. What Chicken Little fails to > report is that something can be done to alleviate such SEs as may be > experienced. For what Chicken Little (Steve means me) REALLY said, Robert, make sure you read my dialogue with Steve in the thread on PSA Noise. I don't care if Steve considers himself better informed than some of the world's foremost PCa researchers, but his denial of the following facts to newbies is both inexplicable and, IMO, unconscionable: 1. Strum's treatise on the ADT Syndrome, 2. other leading authors' support thereof, 3. the 95% dramatically negative poll results of ADT pts in this forum, 4. studies which showed that the vast majority of PC pts prefer watchful waiting or even death to ADT's most likely severe SEs, 5. the concurrence of an entire university and VA teaching hospital oncology staff with my SE summary, 6. his own slate of ADT SEs would be considered devastating by many people, and 7. At least one of the meds we need to reduce one of ADT's most severe and certain SEs is medically contraindicated for a large minority of the population, and the primary med needed to fight another virtually universal ADT SE makes many people suicidal. This is why, Robert, we need to make our decisions based on self-examination of the conclusions of research based in turn on large population statistics -- just as I did -- and not on what I CLAIM I read in scores of expert sources and what Steve CLAIMS is alarmist BS. Without doing your own research, you'll have a hard time figuring out whom to believe. But . . . I've listed my references many times; they're all familiar names to us here. Steve has never told us where his counterclaims originate, nor why he continues to misrepresent what I pass to this group from my board-reviewed ADT SE research summary. I.P. (snip ad hominem attack) With some pretty wild and factually unsupported statements and accusations. That's putting it in the nicest way that I can. I'll not bother with point-by-point rejoinder, as such would simply set off IP on another tirade and accomplish nothing of benefit to anyone. Besides, we're supposed to be trying to help a fellow PCa patient. That's why I didn't identify Chicken Little by name. Regards, Steve J "I am under no obligation to respect your beliefs. Respect is earned; it is not an entitlement..." -- Lionel Shriver >>Robert may have read the dire warnings posted by someone on this NG about >>the, according to him, inevitable, awful, unbearable, nasty and generally [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > > I.P. > On November 16, I. P. Freely wrote: > > (snip ad hominem attack) Show us one word of ad hominem, Steve, lest YOUR statement be the only ad hominem here. > With some pretty wild and factually unsupported statements and > accusations. Taken straight from Strum's and Jordan's own written words and further supported by the prestigious PC authors and institutions revered in this forum. > Besides, we're supposed to be trying to help a fellow PCa patient. Then stop lying to him. > That's putting it in the nicest way that I can. That's putting it the nicest way I WILL. I'm getting fed up with people who rely on word games rather than rational discourse, who attack by accusing others of attacking, who tell newbies that PC treatments can be free of SEs, and who contradict large bodies of research and agonized anecdotal cries without defending their position. I.P. On November 17, I. P. Freely replied to my last: (snip rant) IP has gone off the deep end again. Let him argue with himself. I am finished with this. Regards, Steve J "Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone says anything back, *that* is an outrage." --Sir Winston L. S. Churchill I am sorry for causing such discernment. thanks to all who gave me advise and encouragement. Have appointment at John Hopkins on December 6. will keep the group posted. Bob > On November 17, I. P. Freely replied to my last: > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > what they like, but if anyone says anything back, *that* is an outrage." > --Sir Winston L. S. Churchill > I am sorry for causing such discernment. No apology necessary. There are some folks here who have rather short fuses. I could be considered to be one of them, I reckon. > thanks to all who gave me advise and encouragement. > Have appointment at John Hopkins on December 6. will keep the group > posted. Who's the medic? Some here might have had experience with him. And good luck! Study, Learn, Take Charge! Knowledge is life. Regards, Steve J "We must tailor the treatment to the nature of the disease. We must listen to the biology." -- Stephen B. Strum, MD The referral gal at John Hopkins has me set up with two doctors for my first visit, One name is "Hammers" the other is "M.Carducci". Hope they are worth the trip into the big city of Baltimore for a 8am appointment. Regards, Bob >> I am sorry for causing such discernment. > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > to the biology." > -- Stephen B. Strum, MD Bob, See http://urology.jhu.edu/about/directory.php http://urology.jhu.edu/about/faculty.php?id=61 Dr. Carlucci is conducting clinical trials, and is interested in cancer at the genetic level. Sounds like state-of-the-art treatment. Dr. Hamper does not have a biography posted, but she is a Professor of Radiology and related things, and has probably published a lot of scientific papers. She is on the editorial board of a medical journal, so she critiques scientific papers before they get published. http://eu.wiley.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-JCU,descCd-editorialBoard.html If you're not familiar with Baltimore, be sure you know exactly where you are supposed to go, as Johns Hopkins has several locations. Plan on traffic delays inbound from Frederick or on I-95 in the morning. Hope it all goes well. jimhoney cured at Johns Hopkins, 2002 > The referral gal at John Hopkins has me set up with two > doctors for my first visit, One name is "Hammers" the other is "M.Carducci". [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] >>to the biology." >>-- Stephen B. Strum, MD Thanks James for the info on my two new medics. I feel better now that I know that they are not "newbees". They are also sending me detailed info on how to get there, and where to go. Regards, bob > Bob, > [quoted text clipped - 52 lines] >>>listen to the biology." >>>-- Stephen B. Strum, MD You had nothing to do with this, Robert. I.P. "Robert J Caron" >I am sorry for causing such discernment. No need to be sorry Robert. Since you're new to the group and since you may want to be a participant for many years to come, you will soon discover that more than a few of us have our favorite axes to grind. One of mine is the bloated cost of care in the good old US of A when compared to other countries. Another is the whiner "why me" people. I say "Why not you"? I.P.'s is hormone therapy and the SEs. In addition, Leonard keeps us in line with statistics and Curtis provides the latest studies. You'll discover a lot of others who focus on one thing or another. Sometimes things get hot and heavy but so far no punches thrown, as far as I know. Welcome to the group. Lots of luck in Baltimore. You'll be in the best hands. Dave Perry Bob, You did not cause it. And, if you did, so what? While in-forum antics are sometimes injurious to the purpose, they just as often provide considerable fodder for thought. I learn more each time I.P. squares off against someone, including when that someone was or is me. And Steve Jordan is no piker when it comes to putting facts on the table. So, if you caused anything (and you didn't), what you caused was beneficial, albeit painfully so. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05 PSA .07 .05 .06 .05 .08 non Illegitimi carborundum > I am sorry for causing such discernment. > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > what they like, but if anyone says anything back, *that* is an outrage." > > --Sir Winston L. S. Churchill > PSA 3.1 2/1/2000 > PSA 2.7 1/2/2002 [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Bob > me total care Check out Urology Clinic of Winchester, P.C 540 667-1712 and Winchester Medical Center, Winchester, Va. RRP 10-14-03 at Winchester Medical Center. Great Results, Great People. Feel free to contact me. Best of Luck. Research 1-800-PROTONS.... Keith Lundy/So. California 40 Proton Beam Radiation Treatments Loma Linda Univ.Med Ctr..3/03-5/03 If the recurrence is local (which the DRE would suggest), I wonder if you can simply have another round of radiation (from a more skillful centre)? I don't know if this is generally done for PCa, but it is routine for some other tumours. SignaturePeter Headland Robert, As you can see, there are many conflicting opinions on this site. I'm glad you took the advice to go to John Hopkins. Contrary to some opinions. It is not a Urology only medical facility. It also uses oncology as a treatment option. As long as you go to a Nationally recognized cancer center you won't be steared wrong. Memorial Sloan Kettering of New York believes that if your cancer is still confined that salvage surgery has the same results as RRP patients ; 70% cure rate after 5 years if the PSA is less than 10ng/ml. The problem that many patients have is by the time they determine that they have recurrence, the cancer has spred outside the prostate. In your case, the uro found it by DRE and with the low PSA, there is a good bet yours is still contained. Radiation didn't work for you the first time and I doubt it would work a second time. Contrary to what many on this forum believe, I've seen no credible evidence that radiation is effective in curing prostate cancer. I've only seen speculation. I see more failed radiation treatments than cures. But I also understand that people are looking for what they believe is an easy way out of there mess and believe all the hipe about radiation. Ron S. ronju99 wrote...snip... > Contrary to what many on this forum believe, I've seen no credible > evidence that radiation is effective in curing prostate cancer. I've only > seen speculation. Ron S...Perhaps I'm totally misunderstanding, but there are an incredible number of studies that show that RT has a curative effect on PCa. As an example, SI+EBRT as practiced at RCOG has cure rates at 10 years that are similar to those from Hopkins for RP. Search "Critz" in PubMed and you'll get many references to this point...Best wishes and good health, Ron "ron" <wrote > there are an > incredible number of studies that show that RT has a curative effect on > PCa. As an example, SI+EBRT as practiced at RCOG has cure rates at 10 > years that are similar to those from Hopkins for RP. Search "Critz" in > PubMed and you'll get many references to this point. Duly noted; will dig. Thanks. I.P. I've read most of what all of you have read over the past 2 1/2 years including Dr. Critz. It's just that I come away with a different conclusion than most. I'm not going to elaborate on the subject as I can only two finger type and my left index finger has severe muscle wasting. Of these studies, most talk about possible this possible that and projected cure rates, etc. They have cure rates of 5, 7 and 10yrs. projected. Most studies are not supported by fact. It still comes down to the FACT that there is no cure for prostate cancer. The only way to save a person from the deliberating effects is to remove the prostate while the cancer is contained inside. Obviously that is the million dollar question. Which ones have the cancer contained. It's at best a guess based upon a few markers. For the ones that are not contained, then it's what treatment option are you willing to go with to try and suppress the growth and at the same time tolerate the side effects. I've seen on this forum and in people I know that have had either surgery or radiation and for the most part, the surgery patients usually survive for there regularly expected life expectancy while the radiation patients at best may make it to the 10 or 12 year period. I checked my records. Of the seven people who have checked into the NG after 12 years, regardless of surgery or radiation, none still have a PSA of less than 0.10. I cannot tell you the slap in the face that fact just caused me. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05 PSA .07 .05 .06 .05 .08 non Illegitimi carborundum > I've read most of what all of you have read over the past 2 1/2 years > including Dr. Critz. It's just that I come away with a different [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > for there regularly expected life expectancy while the radiation patients > at best may make it to the 10 or 12 year period. > I checked my records. Of the seven people who have checked into the NG > after 12 years, regardless of surgery or radiation, none still have a PSA of > less than 0.10. (snip) Um, I don't follow; I'd appreciate clarification. Does Steve refer to seven people who have checked in in the last twelve years who now have a PSA <0.10 or seven people in the last twelve years who have checked in with a PSA <0.10 or seven people who have checked in with a record of twelve years post-tx who do not have a PSA <0.10, or something else? Thanks! Regards, Steve J Allow me to rephrase... Since I have been here (3½ years) seven people have posted who had their initial treatment prior to 1994 (ergo, 12 years or more). None of the seven have reported less than 0.1 PSA as of their last posting. Considering the 500+ that have been here since I joined, I am amazed that only 7 started their voyage 12 years or more ago. I also understand that 7 is not a huge number on which to base a theory. But, it is unnerving. SignaturePSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05, 5/05, 10/05 PSA .07 .05 .06 .05 .08 non Illegitimi carborundum > > I checked my records. Of the seven people who have checked into the NG > > after 12 years, regardless of surgery or radiation, none still have a PSA of [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Steve J On November 19, Steve Kramer aided me: > Allow me to rephrase... > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > only 7 started their voyage 12 years or more ago. I also understand that 7 > is not a huge number on which to base a theory. But, it is unnerving. Thankew. I have doubts whether the cohort on which Steve K bases his figures is a valid statistical universe, but of course I'm not the expert in that field. As we know, it's the PSADT and PSAV that are markers of possible recurrence. When I stop my ADT in April, assuming continued 0.01 PSA results, it is possible that the PSA will remain stable. But pessimist that I am, I expect it to rise. If it rose to 0.1 and stopped, I'd be one happy kid. If it rose beyond that point in a year, I'd have to give serious consideration to beginning chemotherapy. AIUI, others say let it rise to 1.0 or so. My question is: why? I see no reason to sit around foolishly watching my PSA rise 100x the baseline without taking steps. Regards, Steve J "There is nothing sadder than the brutal murder of a beautiful theory by a gang of ugly facts." --Francois, Duc de la Rochefoucauld > On November 19, Steve Kramer aided me: > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > I have doubts whether the cohort on which Steve K bases his figures is a > valid statistical universe, but of course I'm not the expert in that field. Nor was it inferred. That's why it's unnerving and not suicide-provoking. :-) "Steve Kramer" ...wrote > Considering the 500+ that have been here since I joined, I am amazed that > only 7 started their voyage 12 years or more ago. I also understand that > 7 > is not a huge number on which to base a theory. But, it is unnerving. And a bit irritating that so many uros/oncs/etc. blanche, shudder, or wag their fingers when we say, 'The people on the prostate cancer forum said . . . ". We can all think of several things we've seen here that the medical profession should really look into. You know damned well that if the internet had been established in 1980, we'd have been INSISTING that there's probably a nerve or something that controls potency, and that someone should try to find it and, you know . . . SPARE it if it isn't already toast. Now, docs . . . about that pee pee nerve you ain't spotted yet . . . I.P. Acronyms! You guys drive me crazy LOL. Must be the Zoladex. I don't understand what you're talking about half the time. Ben Nov. 17 2003 DRA not enlarged @ 65(Family Doctor) Nov. 20, 03 PSA 43 Feb. 3 2004 PSA 38 (Urologist) Feb. 4, 20 04 Bone scan neg. Feb. 26 biopsy Stage T1c Gleason 7 3+4 Right 2 of 3 pos. 50%; left 1 of 3 pos. 5 - 10 % Mar. 31 start Cipro 7 days +14 +14 Apr. 8 Psa 40 Apr. 19 Psa 31.5 May 31. Start radiation 35 days June 1. First Zoladex needle - Sept. Nov. Jan 05, May 4 Jun. 1 Psa 18 June 19 Ofloxacin for infected seminal vessel for ten days. July 19 Last radiation treatment Sept. Psa .1 May 4 2005 PSA .1 I'm sorry. I lost you at "LOL". > Acronyms! You guys drive me crazy LOL. Must be the Zoladex. I don't > understand what you're talking about half the time. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > Sept. Psa .1 > May 4 2005 PSA .1 Very clever Steve Further followup to the above post: One cannot compare surgery to radiation. It's like comparing apples to oranges. Removal of the prostate is not a treatment. Radiation is a treatment. Removal of the prostate does not deal with the cancerous tumor. Radiation (what ever form), attempts to destroy the tumor and cancer cells within the prostate and in some cases outside the prostate. You notice I said ATTEMPT. Until they develope a cure, I believe we should not mislead newbies into thinking there is a real cure. When one comes to the forum they often want to hear what others have gone thru in there dealing with this curse. As I've said many times before, removing the prostate when the cancer is contained and if the procedure is done by an expert is the only proven "Cure" if that is what we want to call it. Everything else is managing the cancer. And yes it can be managed quite well until they find a cure. KenA, I'm not misleading you, I'm just quoting the surgeon who saw my PSA was undetectable 90 or 120 days after surgery with clear margins, and called that "cured." jimhoney > Further followup to the above post: One cannot compare surgery to > radiation. It's like comparing apples to oranges. Removal of the prostate [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > "Cure" if that is what we want to call it. Everything else is managing the > cancer. And yes it can be managed quite well until they find a cure. "James A. Honeychuck" wrote> > I'm not misleading you, I'm just quoting the surgeon who saw my PSA was > undetectable 90 or 120 days after surgery with clear margins, and called > that "cured." And we know that brands him as a pie-eyed, igorant Polyanna, right? That description fits me at a year, and there's not a GOOD doctor in the house who would say I'm cured. I.P. > KenA, > > I'm not misleading you, I'm just quoting the surgeon who saw my PSA was > undetectable 90 or 120 days after surgery with clear margins, and called > that "cured." I bet he didn't also tell you to go away and forget about regular PSA tests. If he did, he is medically incompetent. If he didn't then he is being condescending by not leveling with you are what the future may have in store for you. That could be psychologically imporant and also in a few cases make a difference in actual life choices. My experience is that few physicians are perfect, and I am willing to put up with a certain amount of nonsense if other things are done properly. But I must admit that I might drop a urologist who told me three months after surgery that I was cured. > jimhoney > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >> the >> cancer. And yes it can be managed quite well until they find a cure. Hell, that urologist said he'd cure me in the same sentence in which he told me I had cancer. The uro never said to forget about PSA tests. The GP orders the PSA tests, and I get them. I never saw the uro again after the catheter was pulled. So Ken, this thread is all for your benefit. What do you think, are you gonna be cured or not? jimhoney >> KenA, >> [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] >>> managing the >>> cancer. And yes it can be managed quite well until they find a cure. Hi James! In this sub-thread, I believe you thought your were responding to my comments, but were actually responding to ronju99's comments... But to answer you question, I feel I'll be as 'cured' as the woman with breast cancer, or the person with lung cancer is after their surgery/treatment... I'm more interested in trying to live long enough so I can see my 7 yo daughter and my 10 yo son both graduate from high school (and maybe college, if I'm that lucky). I also realize I can get hit by a bus or die in a car crash on my way to work tomorrow morning. There are no guarantees in life. Ken ===== > Hell, that urologist said he'd cure me in the same sentence in which he told me I > had cancer. [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] >>>> "Cure" if that is what we want to call it. Everything else is managing the >>>> cancer. And yes it can be managed quite well until they find a cure. > Contrary to what many on this forum believe, I've seen no credible > evidence that radiation is effective in curing prostate cancer. I've only > seen speculation. I see more failed radiation treatments than cures. But I > also understand that people are looking for what they believe is an easy > way out of there mess and believe all the hipe about radiation. Wow! Please tell me more. I've not researched RT in depth yet, but will probably have to some day, as my uro suggests it if my PSA goes up again. I had the impression that it is almost on a par with RP. I don't expect you to write a lengthy rehash, but could you suggest some favorite references for this to save me some time when and if I must start digging again? Do I simply need to read further into the newer books, or is this only in recent trials data? I.P.
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