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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / September 2005

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AMS 800 Post Op Day 2.

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David S. - 05 Sep 2005 00:14 GMT
The surgery was Friday morning.  They did two procedures.  One was the cysto
to go in an open up the opening at the anatomists.  It was about one third
the size that it should have been.  The second procedure, of course, was the
implant of the artificial urinary sphincter.  I went in knowing that the AMS
800 does not mean complete dryness.  The surgeon told me that about one
third of his patients over the last 20 years he has been doing this do not
use any absorbent pad at all.  Most wear a liner instead of a high
absorbency pad like the Depends Guards.

The surgery went well but I came within 15 minutes of getting a catheter
because I could not urinate.  I had a spinal and the one area of my body
where I could not feel was in the genital area.  A couple hours after the
surgery the doctor told me that if I could not pee in four hours it would
mean that I needed a catheter.  Well, it took 3 hours and 45 minutes, on IV
bag number 3, and four cokes later, but Willie finally gave up the golden
fluid that saved me from another experience with Mr. Foley and gave me my
ticket home.   Home with four prescriptions.  Oxycodone for pain relief, two
antibiotics, and a stool softener (which I take anyway without any
prescription??).

I cannot say this was without pain, but I want to be careful not to scare
anyone off from having the surgery.  I have been taking the pain relief
medicine, and I suspect that is what is making me groggy and making me sleep
as much as I have.  I do not hurt just sitting or lying down.  Getting up
and down is when it hurts.  The discomfort is in the incision, between the
anus and testicles, and my right side where the reservoir was implanted.  It
looks like I have one big testicle that is black and blue.  Today I ventured
a feel down there and found the pump in the testicle sack.  The penis is
doing its turtle head routine which has made urinating a bit difficult so I
have taken to doing that sitting down.  Yesterday the urine was going all
over the place, reminiscent of post RRP days, and I definitely do not pee
like a race horse, at least not yet.

The dressings consisted of an athletic supporter with one of my Depends
Guards and some gauze placed toward the back to cover the incision area.
There was blood yesterday, not a lot, but it was there.  They warned me that
i would leak a lot more than normal, although I have not observed that so
far, but it is early.  I know what you are thinking.  tDub's experience with
going dry after having the strictures removed.  Believe me, after reading
that on Wednesday last week I wondered about that.  At Ron B's wise counsel
I did call my doctor.  I got two responses.  The first is probably obvious
and predictable, "cannot comment on the other patient's experience without
knowing all the details".  Okay, fair enough.  The main answer was that
there are more than one type of incontinence.  They said that one treatment
for overflow incontinence is removing the scar tissue in order to allow the
patient to empty the bladder when urinating.  My studies showed that I was
emptying the bladder when I urinated, so that was not my problem.  I had
stress incontinence, just getting up from a chair caused me to leak, so my
problem was due to a sphincter that was not functioning properly.  Let's
wait and see.  So far I am not leaking much.  Just trying to report the
facts here for what hopefully will be for the benefit of the next guy facing
this decision.  I think it is safe to say that it would be prudent to have
the scaring at the anatomists fixed first, and then with continued leaking
have a go at the AMS 800.

I will report in again.  Today I am starting to wean off the oxycodone and
switching to ibuprofen.  So far so good.

Thank you.

David S.
John Loomis - 05 Sep 2005 02:03 GMT
Oh my.......
I cannot add anything, but did your Mom ever tell you this would happen?

I understand....When the PP was a funny name and all the kids giggled, Now
we are much older, and trying to keep the PP from going everywher, and then
some.
Good wishes, and you are on a great direction.
Wish you had no pain, and you are a warrior.
Hang in there..
John Loomis
> The surgery was Friday morning.  They did two procedures.  One was the
> cysto to go in an open up the opening at the anatomists.  It was about one
[quoted text clipped - 58 lines]
>
> David S.
judamd@aol.com - 05 Sep 2005 19:04 GMT
Hello David S., lots of congrats on going through with the procedure.
We all hope you experience significant improvement when everything is
healed up and you start the device working.  I'm not quite ready to
take the plunge yet, still working on about one pad per day which on a
bother scale of 1 to 10 is about a 2.  If, say a year from now, your
pads are nothing but a memory and all is going well, I might consider
the procedure for myself (assuming I'm still dribbling).  Right now, I
think I would opt for a pump-like erectile device to help with the
other problem.  Of course I could implant both and then try to remember
which side has which pump.  "Oops, wrong one.  Sorry about that".
Ain't it grand?  :))

Good luck in the healing process.  I'm sure you will keep us up to
date.  

Take care,
Dave Perry
David S. - 06 Sep 2005 20:24 GMT
Hi Dave:
  I am beginning to get back on track here.  Been sleeping a lot lately and
not totally with it even when awake.  Can you believe that my wife wanted me
to go shopping with her today!  I knew I should have done my recovery at
work (ha).
  All the time I was on one pad a day I was not really doing that good.
What I mean is that I was maxing out the Depends Guard.  When people started
telling me that I needed to change more frequently I found that I was using
three per day routinely.  In the last 8 to 10 months I also was noticing
that I was leaking more.  I still do not know why, but it was clear that I
was leaking more.  Coming out of this surgery it is a dramatic change.  The
pads I throw away are soiled, some of that being blood, but there is no
weight to the pad at all.  I just do not seem to be leaking at all.
However, I also do not have a strong stream when I go, so I think things in
there are still swollen.  There is still significant swelling on the
outside.  So, I will have to wait for everything to heal to find out where I
stand.
  Good luck to you.  I hope you are able to get there without needing the
surgery.  As to the AMS 700 penile implant, at this point I do not think I
will do that.  The Rejoyn pump is in the bathroom closet, and after I heal
up from this adventure I will pull it out and give it a try again.  Who
knows, maybe there still is a chance that I can have a return to natural
function.
  Take care.
David S.

> Hello David S., lots of congrats on going through with the procedure.
> We all hope you experience significant improvement when everything is
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> Take care,
> Dave Perry
Ron B - 06 Sep 2005 23:24 GMT
David S.,

I think that it's so early in your recovery that you'll notice new
things all the time.

I'm the same way.

You'll analyze things to try and get a better handle on them.

The thing that you said which rang a bell is that your pads are lighter
now.

That's good.

Always reminds me of I.P.'s phrase about a  "wet cat" when we think of
heavy pads.

Keep resting and getting better.

Ron B.

Chicago
Tdub - 05 Sep 2005 22:29 GMT
It's been a week and a half since a substantial change took place for
me (i.e., sudden reduction in leaking, and substantially less than
pre-op) after bladder neck work 7/11/05. It needs to change a lot more
before I would forego the ams800 surgery I have scheduled for 11-3-05.
Even though it seems to work better and more natural (now some natural
accumulation in the bladder standing up) the sphincter needs to get a
lot stronger to hold a significant amount of fluid with little or no
leaking. Right now I use 2 pads (Depends/day, a bit smaller one evening
thru night) a day, which don't get but 1/5 or so wet. I look at my odds
of needing a sphincter as 50/50. David S.: I'm glad you didn't forgo
the procedure Friday, although I can't imagine how you can get away
without Mr. Foley after the de-constriction procedure. My doc says the
big risk is that the thing might reconstrict, and it could happen
months later. I had to wear Mr. Foley 4 days after the de-constriction
procedure. I still have substantial pain in the perenium and urethra
area from the 7/11 procedure (although it has subsided), so I am hoping
this is "good pain", i.e., reconstruction activity taking place. The
thing that gives me the most encouragement is the ability to now
(post-procedure) feel when fluid starts its way down the urethra, which
gives me a chance to momentarily put another (conscious) level of
pressure on the urethra. The sphincter is so weak right now that I
can't stand up and walk to the head without substantial leaking if I
have more than an 1/8 cup or so in the bladder. (My low pad usage is
due to the head being closely located to where I am for most of the
day.) As with David S., I hope these plumbing discussions help others
in the future.
Tdub - 05 Sep 2005 23:43 GMT
BTW, with regard to "one treatment for overflow incontinence is
removing the scar tissue in order to allow the patient to empty the
bladder when urinating" . . . I never had a problem with emptying the
bladder . . . all my ultrasound tests showed it emptying (in fact I
resisted the test on one occasion 'cause I knew it was empty by the way
it felt, and it seemed to me it was an easy procedure for them to
collect another $350 from my insurer, or me if I hadn't used up my
deductible that year) . .
Bob C - 10 Sep 2005 01:53 GMT
David, you are past the hard part now.  I had the AMS800 implanted 6 months
ago and am glad I did it.  I did not realize just how much the incontinence
and pads affected my everyday activities until I was free of it all.  I was
only using one pad a day if that day was spent at the desk, but easily up to
5-6 pads if I had a real active day.  Exertion, a good cough, many things
would  produce a dribble or even a squirt.  There were a few glitches in
learning how to use the device, and more than one fumble fingered accident
when I waited too long and really really really hadda go.  Nowadays I wear
either a very light pad for security or go without.  I went without any pad
whatsoever for four months but a few close calls convinced me that a light
one for safety might not be so bad.  Lots of luck to you, and I hope we both
get to put the devices to use for many many years.

Bob C
> The surgery was Friday morning.  They did two procedures.  One was the
> cysto to go in an open up the opening at the anatomists.  It was about one
[quoted text clipped - 58 lines]
>
> David S.
David S. - 10 Sep 2005 20:19 GMT
Bob:
   Thank you for the words of encouragement.  I am anxious to get this
thing working now that I feel better.  Sorry for the delayed response.  I am
still playing catch up on emails, the ng, etc.
   Best of luck to you.
David

> David, you are past the hard part now.  I had the AMS800 implanted 6
> months ago and am glad I did it.  I did not realize just how much the
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
> Bob C
 
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