PSA going down!

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---MIKE--- - 08 Apr 2005 23:37 GMT

I had seeds seven years ago after four months of Lupron. My PSA has
been slowly climbing until it reached 3.39 12 months ago. Then 6 months
ago it was 3.36 and this week it was 3.04. I "blame" the supplements
for controlling this. Either that or it was one hell of a bump! One of
the supplements is a cup of heated tomato juice every afternoon with a
dollup of margarine added. I also take Gamma E with selenium and D3.

---MIKE---

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Alan Meyer - 09 Apr 2005 15:18 GMT

>I had seeds seven years ago after four months of Lupron. My PSA has
> been slowly climbing until it reached 3.39 12 months ago. Then 6 months
> ago it was 3.36 and this week it was 3.04. I "blame" the supplements
> for controlling this. Either that or it was one hell of a bump! One of
> the supplements is a cup of heated tomato juice every afternoon with a
> dollup of margarine added. I also take Gamma E with selenium and D3.

That's fabulous news Mike. Keep up the diet and keep us
informed. My own PSA has been climbing after radiation and
I'm always keen to hear success stories about that.

I have some questions for you:

Why do you heat the tomato juice?

What is the margarine for? I've never heard of that one.

What is your source for the Gamma E, selenium, and D3? I ask
that one because there's so many vitamin and supplement sellers
and I never know which ones are reliable and which ones are
just selling garbage.

What does your doctor say about all this? Did he recommend
the supplements or did you just decide on your own based on
your reading?

Had you considered hormone therapy and, if so, at what PSA
point had you decided to do it?

Thanks.

Alan

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Clarence Crow - 09 Apr 2005 19:06 GMT

<snip>

> My own PSA has been climbing after radiation..

<snip>
Care to tell us your progressive path reports on a timeline after Rad
and did you have HDRB?

We have a guy at our Clinic who's had both and now experiencing a PSA
rise in 6 mths after a nadir of 0.04. His last test was 0.06.

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---MIKE--- - 09 Apr 2005 20:14 GMT

Alan, I get the Gamma E/Selenium from http://www.vitaglo.com and the D3
came from http://www.thevitaminbin.com. My urologist says there is no
need to consider any therapy as long as the PSA is not rising. Why mess
with QOL? He feels that there is enough of the prostate left to produce
the PSA. The tomato juice is heated because that makes i tomato soup.
I've heard that some oil with the tomato makes it work better. The
margarine tastes better than olive oil. I also take Boron, Magnesium
and Licorice.

---MIKE---

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Alan Meyer - 10 Apr 2005 00:14 GMT

> Alan, I get the Gamma E/Selenium from http://www.vitaglo.com and the D3
> came from http://www.thevitaminbin.com. My urologist says there is no
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> margarine tastes better than olive oil. I also take Boron, Magnesium
> and Licorice.

Thanks for the info.

Keep up the diet and good luck.

Alan

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---MIKE--- - 09 Apr 2005 20:21 GMT

Clarence. your friends PSA rise could be the infamous "bump". Google
"prostate PSA bump" for more information.

---MIKE---

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Alan Meyer - 10 Apr 2005 00:13 GMT

> <snip>
>> My own PSA has been climbing after radiation..
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> We have a guy at our Clinic who's had both and now experiencing a PSA
> rise in 6 mths after a nadir of 0.04. His last test was 0.06.

Anything below .2 is great for radiation. I wouldn't call a rise of
.02 a bounce. It's more just a blip. There is still a prostate and
it is usual for some PSA to continue to be produced after radiation.
I've read that day to day variations of up to 30% are common.

But I'm afraid I'm doing a lot worse than that.

I had 4 months of Lupron with 2 HDR brachytherapy procedures
and 25 sessions of EBRT.

My 1 and 3 month PSAs were <.2, but that was apparently due
to the Lupron.

Following that I had:
Month PSA
6 .8
9 .6
12 .9
13 .8
14 1.8

At 12 months the doc put me on a monthly test so he could see
more about what was going on.

The .9 and 1.8 could be bounces, or could be a recurrence.
We just don't know yet. The last jump is a big one for a
bounce, but bounces that high and even much higher are not
unknown. So I won't be doing anything about it unless and until
the evidence for recurrence becomes much stronger.

Alan

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Clarence Crow - 10 Apr 2005 01:05 GMT

<snip>

>I had 4 months of Lupron with 2 HDR brachytherapy procedures
>and 25 sessions of EBRT.
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
>unknown. So I won't be doing anything about it unless and until
>the evidence for recurrence becomes much stronger.

<snip>
My PSA progressively stepped down from 21.0 to 0.13 in 18wks, on dual
modal ADT (Androcur & Lucrin) for 10 wks and back to single modal
Lucrin just prior to commencing 23 fractions of EBRT of which I've
done 13 so far, concluding 26 April, 2005.
I have another 3 mthly PSA test 18 April, 2005, pending.
I go for 3 fractions of HDRB on 11 July, 2005, but still remain on
Lucrin till end December 2005.
I believe Androcur is like Flutamide and Lucrin is like Lupron.
Will stay in touch.

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Tom Cular - 10 Apr 2005 01:15 GMT

Alan,

How soon after your last Lupron was your first PSA test? I ask this because
my Drs. wanted to wait a while to test, in order to minimize any Lupron
effect on PSA testing. My last 4 mo. shot was 6 mos. ago, I just had the
first PSA within this week.

Tom

> > <snip>
> >> My own PSA has been climbing after radiation..
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
>
> Alan

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Alan Meyer - 10 Apr 2005 03:13 GMT

> Alan,
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Tom

My last Lupron shot, 22.5 mg, was around Nov. 30, 2003. The
two undetectable PSAs were at the end of January and April,
2004. So the Lupron induced low PSA reading lasted at least
5 months after the end of the "3 month" Lupron injection.

The first high PSA reading occurred 8 months after the
last Lupron injection.

If your experience is like mine, your recent PSA test will still
show the influence of the Lupron. If they also took a Testosterone
reading that would show whether the Lupron has worn off or
not. My testosterone was beginning to come back 5 months
after the last injection, but it was still below normal.

Also, if you were on Lupron for more than 4 months, it might
take longer for it to wear off than mine. I had 4 months total.

Alan

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Tom Cular - 10 Apr 2005 03:21 GMT

We're thinking along the same lines. Based on the hot flashes and low
libido, there is definitely som Lupron influence remaining.I'm still pleased
with the <.1, now we wait for the next one.
Tom

> > Alan,
> >
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
>
> Alan

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