Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / March 2005
Looking for help after Bladder/Prostate removed
|
|
Thread rating:  |
pcrider - 24 Mar 2005 03:22 GMT I'm a single, 47 year old male. I had surgery about 3 years ago. I had Invasive Bladder cancer, and the doctor told me my only option was to have it(the bladder) removed. He wanted me to have a "neo-bladder" surgery(they use a section of your colon to create a new bladder), said it would let me have a normal life after a few exercises.
The Day Before the surgery, in the hospital already on medications, was the first time he mentioned that I "MIGHT" have problems with erections after the surgery, and have to take viagra. He failed to mention at any time that removing the prostate would end ejaculation completely. He also failed to mention that I would be sterile, for lack of any ejaculation at all. He also failed to mention that he would make no attempt to save the nerves needed to have erections. In short he sold me on the operation like a bad used car salseman. Not telling me these things in time that I could have looked at the options has trully destroyed my life. There were options at the time.
The reality is that going to the bathroom has become my whole life. I have trouble doing the exercises that do seem to help with bladder control. I have always had ADD, though I was never treated for it, and I just can't seem to keep up the routine of constantly doing them.
Bowel movements are very small because of the smaller colon, and therefore frequent to the extreme. My back side gets really sore from going all the time. Often I have to stay at home until I'm sure I've got it out of the way for a while, causing me to avoid any kind of social commitments.
I can't have erections at all. Taking the oral drugs does almost nothing at all - I feel a little flushed, but thats about it. Even using the injections produces only a shadow of what I would call an erection. I could have penetration sex, but the penis is very small and deformed when using the injections. I don't have to tell you that it isn't fun to use a needle on your penis.
I am looking for ways to improve the situation. I need to at least be able to have a fairly normal erection if I'm ever going to have a normal life. Currently my motivation is about zero.
I often dream of shooting the bastard that did this to me in the back. Looking at him as he lay on the ground realizing that I just paralized him for life, and repeating those words back to him, "well it's better than being dead".
Mike Brooksher
I. P. Freely - 24 Mar 2005 04:03 GMT 1. I had both my prostate and three feet of colon removed at the same time 6 months ago. I can still have orgasms, may regain erections some day (no hope of NATURAL, unaided erections for you at 3 years out), and see minimal effect on my bowel habits (softer stool, primarily, often requiring extra paperwork, but no other inconvenience). Other than using more TP and diaper rash ointment than a year ago, my colon resection was a bump in the road. 2. I'd sue this nincompoop up one side and down the other, IF he had any other way to save your life without making you sterile and impotent. He should have informed you OF THE SIDE EFFECTS OF YOUR TREATMENT. OTOH, I'd guess he had no other options. 3. Actually you can still father a child; it just won't be as much FUN as it would have been four years ago, because your orgasms will squirt urine rather than sperm -- a given with any prostatectomy -- and because gathering your sperm will involve your doctor rather than your lover. 4. It's pretty likely that before your PC reached your bladder, it involved the nerves that control erection, in which case they were doomed anyway. 5. I don't have ADD, and it's STILL tough to remember to do my Kegels. Schedule them into any of several electronic reminders and do them by the clock. 6. You and/or your partner can still provide your orgasms -- unless maybe your doc used a cherry bomb to remove your prostate and bladder -- and there are several ways to do the same for your parner, with or without medical, surgical, and/or mechanical technology. I'd think that exploring the many alternative routes to solo or duet orgasm may take your minds off the methods that don't work anymore. 7. Vent. Get thoroughly pissed off. Chew the SOB out loudly from his crowded waiting room and inform the state medical boards for his not telling you of the SEs even if they were unavoidable. 8. Find out why removal of a small piece of colon caused your bowel problems. That doesn't seem right to me, but I'm a patient, not a doctor. This may be medically or therapeutically repairable and/or legally actionable. 9. Then concentrate on #6. You aren't GONNA have a thoroughly normal life again, but then who does . . . past, oh, about, say . . . 47? By then most of us need glasses, and many start to feel a little stiffer where we don't want to feel stiff and a little less stiff where we DO want to feel stiff.
I.P.
> I'm a single, 47 year old male. I had surgery about 3 years ago. I had > Invasive Bladder cancer, and the doctor told me my only option was to [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > Mike Brooksher pcrider - 25 Mar 2005 17:39 GMT I have just recently had a colonoscopy done, and it showed that the colon is restricted, "shrunk" at the sight where I had radiation therapy close to the anus. I am still checking into it, but so far all the doctors I've talked to say it would require another surgery to fix, and they don't recomend it.
As for "he had no other options" Please don't say that, it was never up to him. Until he is the only surgen in the world there ARE options. By not telling me he cheated me out of a descicion that was mine and only mine to make no matter what the outcome. The fact that nerve graphing was already in practice even as close as the KU Med Center where I see a Urologist now regularly.... OK you said he should have told me, your right, but NEVER give the choice to your doctor. Don't even imply that a doctor has reason, or the right to make the decision. If you allow that you will always be at the mercy of the first moron you see.
Other than that Thank you for the encouragement sincerely,
Mike Brooksher
> 1. I had both my prostate and three feet of colon removed at the same > time 6 months ago. I can still have orgasms, may regain erections some [quoted text clipped - 83 lines] >> >> Mike Brooksher I. P. Freely - 26 Mar 2005 03:28 GMT > I have just recently had a colonoscopy done, and it showed that the > colon is restricted, "shrunk" at the sight where I had radiation therapy > close to the anus. I am still checking into it, but so far all the > doctors I've talked to say it would require another surgery to fix, and > they don't recomend it. One of the main reasons I chose RP over RT.
> As for "he had no other options" Please don't say that, it was never up > to him. Until he is the only surgen in the world there ARE options. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > where I see a Urologist now regularly.... OK you said he should have > told me, your right, but NEVER give the choice to your doctor. If your neurovascular bundles were cancerous, you indeed had no options (other than a sural nerve graft, which would be highly unlikely to help if both nerves had to go).
I.P.
pcrider - 26 Mar 2005 13:22 GMT >> I have just recently had a colonoscopy done, and it showed that the >> colon is restricted, "shrunk" at the sight where I had radiation [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > I.P. It was up to me not him, particulars about the cancer will not change that. I don't understand your motives for trying to justify what he did, but I'm not going to argue about it. I just wish people were protected from doctors like the one I had.
Mike Brooksher
I. P. Freely - 26 Mar 2005 22:28 GMT "pcrider" <p_c_r_i_d_e_r@c_o_x.n_e_t> wrote >
> It was up to me, not him [to choose based on SEs], > particulars about the cancer will not change > that. . . . I just wish people were protected > from doctors like the one I had. It's left up to us patients to do that. It takes little more than a flicker of interest from a relevant listener for me to launch into a "vehement tirade" about the complexity of PC and the necessity of researching it. I don't force it on them, but if they ask a few questions in response to my opening sentence or paragraph, they're going to get some thorough answers. I don't know of any other way to help others avoid the avoidable aspects of PC -- e.g., delayed detection, advanced cancer, inappropriate treatments, SE surprises -- than pitching the necessity of reading to anyone who has a prostate or loves anyone with a prostate.
I think we have almost an obligation to offer appropriate listeners a sentence or three meant to raise their curiosity. If they respond with interest -- as MANY do -- I gradually introduce more information on the importance of early detection, PC's complexity, the need for reading up on it and selecting a special doctor and getting second and third opinions from all three PC specialties, then, if they wish, direct answers to their more detailed questions.
Who but us is gonna do this? Few doctors have the time, and not that many even KNOW some of the major SEs.
I.P.
Steve Kramer - 24 Mar 2005 09:42 GMT Though it's off topic, I'm sure in the last three years you've had occasion to research your condition; albeit too late. What did you find regarding alternatives to surgery?
 Signature PSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3bN0M0 Seminal Vesicle involvement, Neg margins PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 (4 mo), 12/03, 4/04, 09/04, 01/05 PSA .07 .05 .06 .05
non Illegitimi carborundum
> I'm a single, 47 year old male. I had surgery about 3 years ago. I had > Invasive Bladder cancer, and the doctor told me my only option was to [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > Mike Brooksher James A Honeychuck - 24 Mar 2005 13:22 GMT I hate to sound unsympathetic to someone like Mike who is really suffering. But we are living in the information age, when it takes only seconds to find anything from authoritative information to wild rumors on the Internet.
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/treatment/bladder/Patient/page4
Surely there's an on/off topic lesson to be learned here. Don't go under the knife passively, **seek out** full information on what the doctor is offering.
jimhoney
> Though it's off topic, I'm sure in the last three years you've had occasion > to research your condition; albeit too late. What did you find regarding > alternatives to surgery? Clarence Crow - 24 Mar 2005 21:27 GMT >I hate to sound unsympathetic to someone like Mike who is really >suffering. But we are living in the information age, when it takes only >seconds to find anything from authoritative information to wild rumors >on the Internet. <snip> (excerpt from previous reply) /begin Exactly! Both my Rad Onc and PC Physician (GP), guffaw loudly when I espouse anything I've gleaned from the net, albeit a kosher website or a usenet group. They just say the net's full of misleading crap!
So I asked them each, did they reserve the right to mislead me and feel their positions were under threat?
Just more GUFFAWs from each of them, and "Gerroutofheah" or I'll bill you for a double appointment! /end
-- Reader to complete... -- Please reply to this ng as my email adress is fake:
-- Regards
-- CC
I. P. Freely - 24 Mar 2005 22:05 GMT Don't these docs realize that "the net" includes all the major research universities and hospitals, the entire alphabet soup of cancer agencies, pros and cons of meds from A33 monoclonal antibodies to Zoloft, the contents of worldwide trials, peer-reviewed studies and meta-studies of many of those trials, Quackwatch, and countless other reliable resources? It's those docs who should be laughed at, at least once a patient demonstrates the ability to distinguish facts from opinions from BS. Mine give me homework assignments now, such as, "Go read up on this med and that protocol and tell me what you find."
The funny part is when I come back with, "Nobody knows. It's all still guesswork, with clinical trials TBD", to which the doc knowingly smiles and says, "Just thought I'd let you find that out for yourself, and hoped maybe you'd find something useful we'd not seen yet."
I.P.
>>I hate to sound unsympathetic to someone like Mike who is really >>suffering. But we are living in the information age, when it takes only [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Just more GUFFAWs from each of them, and "Gerroutofheah" or I'll bill > you for a double appointment! pcrider - 25 Mar 2005 18:10 GMT You are really kidding yourself! There is a lot of information out there, thats the problem. Finding information that applies to you when you know only what your doctor tells you leaves you at his/her mercy. You think its as simple as typing in "bladder cancer" at google? Knock yourself out, now go tell your doctor you know it all, and see what happens.
> I hate to sound unsympathetic to someone like Mike who is really > suffering. But we are living in the information age, when it takes [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >> occasion to research your condition; albeit too late. What did you >> find regarding alternatives to surgery? pcrider - 25 Mar 2005 18:04 GMT > Though it's off topic, I'm sure in the last three years you've had > occasion to research your condition; albeit too late. What did you > find regarding alternatives to surgery? First off it was bladder cancer, not prostate cancer. The prostate was removed as a side effect. Second there was no alternative to surgery. I am sure of that. I've talked to people who have had bladder resections done, removing only part of the bladder, and leaving normal usage. What other treatments actually apply to me I can't say. I have only his diagnosis to go by, the bladder/prostate is gone I can't get a second opinion.
My biggest gripe is I could have at the very least had the nerve graphing done, so I could have a normal relationship. Also although I am not thinking about it now, I was at the time still hoping (though only a little) that I might have another child. Whether it ever happened or not, I could have at least done a little sperm banking so I could have the choice should the opportunity arise.
Mike Brooksher
I. P. Freely - 26 Mar 2005 03:23 GMT The sural nerve graft helps the odds of potence VERY little, if any, if the neurovascular bundles must be removed, and your doc should have discussed all that long before treatment. This is why several of us harangue people about researching before choosing.
I.P.
> My biggest gripe is I could have at the very least had the nerve > graphing done, so I could have a normal relationship. Also although I am > not thinking about it now, I was at the time still hoping (though only a > little) that I might have another child. Whether it ever happened or > not, I could have at least done a little sperm banking so I could have > the choice should the opportunity arise. jhlms - 26 Mar 2005 04:00 GMT I.P. Woulda, Shoulda, Coulda............ My God, man...I'm sure pcrider is real impressed with you opinions of what he SHOULD have done, but right now he SEEMS to be looking for support from a group that touts support, but only offers advise on what he should have done. Not a lot of support there, pilgrim. The damage has been done. It's been three years, and our friend is still suffering, and you choose to explain what he should have done to prevent (or at best mitigate) his loss..........?????? That's not support. That's bullshit !!! If we REALLY want to support our comrade, we'll put away the shoulda, coulda's and give this man at least a freakin' hug................ Damn!!!!!!
jh
> The sural nerve graft helps the odds of potence VERY little, if any, if > the neurovascular bundles must be removed, and your doc should have [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >> not, I could have at least done a little sperm banking so I could have >> the choice should the opportunity arise. I. P. Freely - 26 Mar 2005 06:19 GMT I suggested to him that the nerve graft he wishes he had gotten would not have helped him, so maybe he can stop agonizing over it. That factoid should last years, whereas a hug lasts for minutes.
Then I gave him a fact he can use as rationale for switching doctors or confronting this one: the doc was wrong in not discussing all this in advance.
Then I put his justified misery to good use as an example, motivation, and encouragement for others to do more homework and for him to do more next time.
So in one short paragraph, I gave him a reason not to second-guess his treatment, gave him specfic cause to fix his doc or change docs, and tried to help him and others appreciate the necessity of research.
You toss the guy a fish stick; I'll do my best to bake him some salmon, teach him how to catch more, suggest that the only REAL flaw in his treatment may have been in its discussion rather than its execution, and point out to him and others that they can avoid much of this worry, and sometimes real mistakes, by research. After all, pcrider has more treatments ahead; knowledge then will do him a lot more then than a hug now.
You do it your way: I'll do it mine. I try to solve problems, not cover them up.
I.P.
"jhlms" <jhlms@sbcglobal.net> wrote..
> I.P. > Woulda, Shoulda, Coulda............ [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >>> not, I could have at least done a little sperm banking so I could have >>> the choice should the opportunity arise. pcrider - 26 Mar 2005 14:56 GMT On 25 Mar 2005, you wrote in alt.support.cancer.prostate:
> I suggested to him that the nerve graft he wishes he had gotten would > not have helped him, so maybe he can stop agonizing over it. That > factoid should last years, whereas a hug lasts for minutes. It makes sense to stop agonizing over it. Thanks for that. I am still considering the nerve graphing though, its just to bad I couldn't have done it when the odds were in my favor.
> Then I gave him a fact he can use as rationale for switching doctors > or confronting this one: the doc was wrong in not discussing all this > in advance. I asked what he did to save the nerves after the operation, since he didn't talk about it before the operation. He said "nothing, I just took it out." That was the last time I saw him.
> Then I put his justified misery to good use as an example, motivation, > and encouragement for others to do more homework and for him to do > more next time. You really should have said that in the first place instead of trying to justify what the doctor did.
> So in one short paragraph, I gave him a reason not to second-guess his > treatment, gave him specfic cause to fix his doc or change docs, and > tried to help him and others appreciate the necessity of research. Your right people should do research, but they should have a guarenteed legal right to be informed. Anything less should be treated as criminal. Law suits only drive up the cost of health care. If they mutilate you by not telling you the whole story, treat them like any other criminal. A used car salesman can go to jail for selling you a crappy car, but a doctor can destroy your life, and you can't touch him, because "he had reason". Thats not right.
Personally I think a law should be passed requiring a doctor to provide a written list of what he/she proposes to do, including all known side effects, AT THE TIME THAT HE/SHE PROPOSES SURGERY. To be dated, signed, and witnesed in a formal fashion. Otherwise you will have no recourse after the fact.
You were asked to fill out tons of papers to protect the hospital/doctor, not one of those papers was to protect you.
Trust me, once its done EVERYONE will be trying to justify what he/she did. The first response you get from anyone even people who have no clue what happened will be, "but he had to, it was cancer". Its usually followed by "cancer is bad cuz my grandma had it and...". Until they are held accountable they will go on doing whatever they feel like, and getting away with it.
Its to late for me, but a LOT of people would definately benefit from such a law.
> You do it your way: I'll do it mine. I try to solve problems, not > cover them up. > > I.P. I apreciate your trying to help IP, hugs are a nice sentiment, but I was really looking for treatment options. Drugs, surgeries, devices, you name it.. Whatever it takes to get back to as close to normal as possible. I'll be starting/looking for threads on vacum devices, and any other ideas I hear of. I have seen the effects of implants, and I am really put off by it. If there is no other option I may never recover. I have gotten a few ideas.
Mike Brooksher
I. P. Freely - 26 Mar 2005 22:08 GMT "pcrider" <p_c_r_i_d_e_r@c_o_x.n_e_t> wrote >
> I.P. wrote >> Then I put his justified misery to good use as an example, motivation, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > You really should have said that in the first place instead of trying to > justify what the doctor did. I really meant to EXPLAIN, not JUSTIFY, the doc's actions and lack of discussion. I don't feel there is ANY justification for not telling you everything. In fact I think no treatment should be performed until the patient can prove he has carefully read at least one of a short list of top PC books, unless the pt flat refuses to do so after being strongly advised to do so. The first uro surgeon I talked with was good, but no way did he have the time to give me a course in PC 201, without which patients with average IQ and options should not proceed, IMO.
>> So in one short paragraph, I gave him a reason not to second-guess his >> treatment, gave him specfic cause to fix his doc or change docs, and >> tried to help him and others appreciate the necessity of research.
> Your right people should do research, but they should have a guarenteed > legal right to be informed. Yup. I Googled some "Patients Bill of Rights", and was stunned that not even the CANCER Patients Bill of Rights includes the right to be informed in detail of al the (realistic) options and the primary and side effects of each.
Sorry I'm not much on hugs, guys. I never had any as a kid -- not one that I can remember -- and learned to place my faith in temporary and/or permanent solutions to problems, rather than palliation, when a choice exists.
I.P.
David S. - 24 Mar 2005 13:22 GMT I would seek out a new doctor in order to explore what may help you have a more normal life. It does not sound right to me that the bowel surgery should result in what you describe. You can also find a urologist that specializes in the penile implant surgery. That may give you a more satisfactory sex life, but you must realize that it will never be the same as before. I had RRP almost two years ago now, and I am still impotent and incontinent, so you are not alone in that department. Just yesterday the ED specialist told me that there is really no chance for me to have a return to normal sexual function, so I am still trying to digest that idea. The uro that did the RRP told me last November that my incontinence will never get better, so I have started looking into the artificial sphincter, although to be honest at this point I do not think I will opt for further surgery. Enough about me; this is suppose to be about you.
On the doctor that did this to you, I would suggest getting an opinion from another physician knowledgeable about the cancer. It could be that the surgery that you had was necessary, and that the problem is not really medical malpractice as much as a failure of giving proper informed consent. That does not make it right, but it is a different situation from having been mutilated by an incompetent surgeon. As to lawyers and law suits, I'll leave that up to you. I would concentrate on getting better and having a more normal life, i.e., try to stick with the positive. Revenge may be sweet, but it won't give you an erection.
Good luck to you.
Thank you. David S.
> I'm a single, 47 year old male. I had surgery about 3 years ago. I had > Invasive Bladder cancer, and the doctor told me my only option was to [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > Mike Brooksher pcrider - 25 Mar 2005 18:31 GMT > I would seek out a new doctor in order to explore what may help you > have a more normal life. I am talking to doctors as much as I can afford.
It does not sound right to me that the bowel
> surgery should result in what you describe. Again I'm talking to doctors as much as I can afford. Recently had it looked at, so far it doesn't look good, but time will tell.
You can also find a
> urologist that specializes in the penile implant surgery. That may > give you a more satisfactory sex life, but you must realize that it > will never be the same as before. I do. I'm not looking into implants at this time. I take it you do not have the implant? Are you thinking about it?
I had RRP almost two years ago now,
> and I am still impotent and incontinent, so you are not alone in that > department. Just yesterday the ED specialist told me that there is [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > started looking into the artificial sphincter, although to be honest > at this point I do not think I will opt for further surgery. artificial sphincter? Do you know where I can get more info on that? I'll check on it along with everything else.
Enough
> about me; this is suppose to be about you. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > informed consent. That does not make it right, but it is a different > situation from having been mutilated by an incompetent surgeon. I'm not going to comment on this again at this time. I get to angry.
As to
> lawyers and law suits, I'll leave that up to you. I would concentrate > on getting better and having a more normal life, i.e., try to stick > with the positive. Revenge may be sweet, but it won't give you an > erection. Your right, it is time to get past that. I am looking at everyway to return to as close to normal as possible.
Thanks David, and good luck to you too. Let me know if you find out anything,
Mike Brooksher
> Good luck to you. > [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] >> >> Mike Brooksher judamd@aol.com - 24 Mar 2005 18:51 GMT Mike, my cousin's husband just had exactly the same surgery you had - bladder removal due to bladder cancer, prostate gone (don't know about nerves), piece of colon used to reconstruct a functioning bladder. He's only about 6 weeks post-op so there is no telling what his ultimate side effects will be but he's enduring quite a bit right now what with an infection, self-catheterization, a midnight run to the emergency room, mucus in his urine, etc.. I'm sure you know all about this and then some.
I'm appalled at the bed-side manner of your doctor who told you all the side-effects at the last minute although I doubt the outcome would have been much different if he had told you earlier. What were the other options available at the time? Bladder cancer is bladder cancer and it has to come out. If he actually botched the surgery you could sue for malpractice but short of that you can't sue him for being an a.shole. Looking for something positive, when I was searching for a surgeon for my prostate cancer, I happened onto a doctor who specializes in urinary reconstructive surgery - he fixes botched surgeries, accident cases, etc.. He's at UCSF but I'm sure there are others around the country. Perhaps you could consult with one of these to see if there is anything that could be improved in the voiding departments. I doubt there is much that can be done for erections that you haven't already pursued.
Dwelling on "killing the bastard" won't help. I wanted to kill a bastard who was a bit of a torment during my high school years. But then I learned just recently his wife died early on and he had to raise three children alone and then he recently died of MS. Now I feel badly that I felt that way all those years. He wasn't that big a bastard.
Anyway, check out the possibility of some reconstruction or other treatment. Good luck to you. Dave Perry
pcrider - 25 Mar 2005 18:35 GMT judamd@aol.com wrote in news:1111686676.137014.280250 @o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com:
Thanks Dave I am looking into as much as I can. One of the bigest problems I have is that doctors seem to have this, "you just have to deal with it" attitude. Eventully I will get through to them though.
Thanks again Mike Brooksher
> Mike, my cousin's husband just had exactly the same surgery you had - > bladder removal due to bladder cancer, prostate gone (don't know about [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > treatment. Good luck to you. > Dave Perry smu53@aol.com - 25 Mar 2005 01:01 GMT Mike, Your story is very sad. I have no experience with bladdder cancer/removal, but I have a lot of experience with penile injection following RP. Have you tried the small needles? I use #31 gauge needles that are only 5/16th inched long. Mosquitoes are better endowed!They hardly hurt at all. If you use Caverject Impulse system, those needles are like harpoons. Has your doc tried changing the dose? Or tried different meds like bimix or trimix? I thinkthe injections are massively under-used and under appreciated. They work great for me. It does take some work to get the dose right, but it is worth it! Steve U
pcrider - 25 Mar 2005 18:46 GMT smu53@aol.com wrote in news:1111708896.573646.326980 @l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:
This is something I'll look into. The needles I have are 1/2" 30 guage, I'll ask for smaller ones. So far I have only used one drug - I'm reading from the label, ALPROSTADIL DILLUTION. I had already thought about asking for a different type I'll bring these up next time I see him. Have you ever used any other type of therapy to increase bloodflow etc..?
Thanks Steve it helps,
Mike Brooksher
> Mike, > Your story is very sad. I have no experience with bladdder [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > does take some work to get the dose right, but it is worth it! > Steve U smu53@aol.com - 26 Mar 2005 01:50 GMT Mike Brooksher, I like alprostadil the best, but I was on bimix for several months, and it is good too. Depending on insurance it might be cheaper because it is composed of two drugs with no patent protection. They are papaverine and phentolamine. The three pills (Viagra/Levitra/Cialis) work well for me but I still like the shots better because I can adjust the dose exactly, they work fast, the erections are perfect, and they last. Plus they are covered by my insurance! SteveU
|
|
|