Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Prostate Cancer / May 2004
Finding a good surgeon, San Antonio, TX
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Randy - 18 May 2004 21:28 GMT Just been diagnosed: 1 core out of 13 had 1% positive. (Had 2 rounds of biopsies last year--13 cores, no hits but 2 high PIN hits) Gleason 6, latest psa 4.7, age 58. I'm seriously considering RP. My urologist is a surgeon & does about 20 RPs a year. I don't know how to find out if he is good or how to identify other good surgeons in San Antonio, TX. Thanks for any info.
Steve Kramer - 19 May 2004 00:37 GMT Welcome to the club, Randy, that no one wanted to join. Though it sounds like you spent a considerable time in our application process.
First, you need to find out all that is available to you and make an informed decision as to treatment. At 58 with your numbers, you have the pick of the lot. There is nothing that you can choose that is all that more effective than anything else. Knowing what I know about it, if I were 58 and healthy, especially if I lived in Texas, I would choose Robotic Laproscopic Radical Prostatectomy (RLRP). But, Bev, et al., will give you very good reasons to consider seeds and/or external radiation.
You can post your questions here, but the first best place to find some answers is to by Dr. Patrick Walsh's Guide to Surviving Prostate Cancer. It's getting a little dated and you won't find robotic LRP in it, but it is a great resource. Also check out www.Phoenix5.org, the premier website for prostate cancer.
Regarding 20 surgeries a year? I think not. Find a more experienced surgeon. You have a good uro. He found your cancer while it was in its infancy. Thank him for that and get someone else to cut on you. You need a specialist who knows his way around a prostate if you ever want to have sex again.
 Signature Prostate Cancer Survivor (so far), not a doctor PSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Erection 05/12/2003 @ 48 HTbegins 07/21/2003 @ 48 PSA .07 .05 Lupron 7/03, 8/03, 12/03, 4/04
> Just been diagnosed: 1 core out of 13 had 1% positive. (Had 2 rounds of > biopsies last year--13 cores, no hits but 2 high PIN hits) Gleason 6, latest > psa 4.7, age 58. I'm seriously considering RP. My urologist is a surgeon & > does about 20 RPs a year. I don't know how to find out if he is good or how > to identify other good surgeons in San Antonio, TX. Thanks for any info. Beverley - 19 May 2004 04:37 GMT Twenty a year? Ok, he might be wonderful doing those 20 but I think I'd like to have someone who does a whole lot more. This is a field that has changed quite a bit in the last few years and so has the equipment they use. You want someone using the latest greatest equipment who has been trained on that equipment. Do some research and decide how you want the prostate cancer to be treated. TX is a big state but it has some great doctors and hospitals. Don't be afraid to search the internet for doctors and hospitals near you. Hang around here and you'll discover some of the treatments for PC. Bev
> Just been diagnosed: 1 core out of 13 had 1% positive. (Had 2 rounds of > biopsies last year--13 cores, no hits but 2 high PIN hits) Gleason 6, latest > psa 4.7, age 58. I'm seriously considering RP. My urologist is a surgeon & > does about 20 RPs a year. I don't know how to find out if he is good or how > to identify other good surgeons in San Antonio, TX. Thanks for any info. Cox SMTP west - 20 May 2004 02:48 GMT Randy,
I'm 9 weeks post op and also 58 with same , 2 biopsies before the found the Pca, Dx Gleason T1c etc. The uro who made Dx did only 20 a year also. I faced the same dilemma of trying to find the surgeon who did the most RP's. Actually considered traveling to a bigger burg than Tucson (approx 800,000 in the metro area)
Suggestions: See if there is an USTOO http://www.ustoo.com/ support group in SA, attend meetings. My local guys are great (2 groups in town and a 3rd at the university) Try the department of urology at the U of T San Antonio.
I resorted to calling the 3 largest hospitals head surgical nurse and asking which doctors did the most RP's and I got names, but not numbers of RP (don't you just love this litigious society we live in - sorry attorneys!) and then I just started calling and asking their front desks. Before I found my surgeon I remembered that we had worked for a gynecological oncologist some years back so I called him and he turned me on to the local guru.
I guess the bottom line is network, make calls, talk to fiends who may have friends who are doctors or have good relationships with doctors. Once I got past the initial frustration I found I had people (sometimes strangers and doctors of friends) calling me with recommendations and once the vote was in my surgeon was the most recommended. Your surgeon is out there. Once you find him/her the battle is over the rest is a walk in the park, even with Foley!
Also in that everybody is different get a second opinion from your surgeon and talk to a radiation guy also. There are many paths.
Good luck keep us posted.
Tony in Tucson
> Just been diagnosed: 1 core out of 13 had 1% positive. (Had 2 rounds of > biopsies last year--13 cores, no hits but 2 high PIN hits) Gleason 6, latest > psa 4.7, age 58. I'm seriously considering RP. My urologist is a surgeon & > does about 20 RPs a year. I don't know how to find out if he is good or how > to identify other good surgeons in San Antonio, TX. Thanks for any info. Alan Meyer - 20 May 2004 03:41 GMT > Just been diagnosed: 1 core out of 13 had 1% positive. (Had 2 rounds of > biopsies last year--13 cores, no hits but 2 high PIN hits) Gleason 6, latest > psa 4.7, age 58. I'm seriously considering RP. My urologist is a surgeon & > does about 20 RPs a year. I don't know how to find out if he is good or how > to identify other good surgeons in San Antonio, TX. Thanks for any info. Alan Meyer - 20 May 2004 03:48 GMT > Just been diagnosed: 1 core out of 13 had 1% positive. (Had 2 rounds of > biopsies last year--13 cores, no hits but 2 high PIN hits) Gleason 6, latest > psa 4.7, age 58. I'm seriously considering RP. My urologist is a surgeon & > does about 20 RPs a year. I don't know how to find out if he is good or how > to identify other good surgeons in San Antonio, TX. Thanks for any info. Here's one resource for finding physicians. It gives a number of suggestions for people to ask and places to look.
http://cis.nci.nih.gov/fact/7_47.htm
As for 20 per year, I don't know whether that's good or not. It's a little less than one every two weeks. For some doctors, that's probably enough to maintain high proficiency. For others it may not be.
Some doctors doing 20 RPs per year may also be doing a hundred other surgeries - so their surgical skills are very high and in constant use. Others might be doing just RP and no other surgeries - so they are, maybe, less into it.
If you really like the doctor otherwise, perhaps 20 per year is not a problem. If you have doubts about him for other reasons, perhaps 20 per year adds to those doubts.
I know that's not helpful, but I'm not sure what else to say.
Alan
ron - 20 May 2004 18:59 GMT Hi Randy...On Don Cooley's website, he has a page with contact names of men with PCa listed by city / state. I saw 2 for San Antonio when I took a look. The page also describes their stats and Tx. They can probably give you some good info on docs in your area. The starting page is at
http://www.phcagroups.org/grushl.htm
Judging by your stats, you certainly have low-risk disease and may have what is termed low-voulme ar "insignificant" disease. If so WW may be something to at least consider in the mix of other Txs you are considering. It's been shown that maybe 25% of the men with low-risk disease don't progress, the number would be higher amongst those with low-volume disease. Active WW would involve changes in stress level, diet, exercise, etc, along with frequent monitoring. You'd probably also want a good color doppler early on to make sure that none of the PCa is close to escaping the prostate. WW, while free of the morbidities associated with more traditional Tx, has it's own side effects. They are primarily psychological. Just like some people have an "I want it out" mind setand select surgery, it takes a certain kind of mind set to practice WW, knowing that there is cancer present. The question, "if I start with WW and switch to treatment later on, have I lost anything" has yet to be answered. Experiments are in progress and hopefully data will appear in the next few years. I am not advocating WW, just its consideration along with the other Txs, I had RP myself...Best wishes and good health, Ron
> Just been diagnosed: 1 core out of 13 had 1% positive. (Had 2 rounds of > biopsies last year--13 cores, no hits but 2 high PIN hits) Gleason 6, latest > psa 4.7, age 58. I'm seriously considering RP. My urologist is a surgeon & > does about 20 RPs a year. I don't know how to find out if he is good or how > to identify other good surgeons in San Antonio, TX. Thanks for any info. Mmhf - 20 May 2004 23:28 GMT Randy:
I'm new to this group (about 20 minutes new). But, I too am in San Antonio, and have also just been diagnosed with PC. (PSA - 12.3; Gleason - 6 (3+3); T1c).
The urologist I'm seeing, says he does does 1-2 RPs a week. But as much as I like the guy, I'm still seeking a second opinion. Besides, I'm still researching this stuff and trying to compare the different treatment options.
Fortunately, my brother is an OR nurse here and knows some of the local docs and has a good contact network.
Chuck
Steve Kramer - 21 May 2004 01:55 GMT Chuck,
As you may have read in other posts, the best thing you can do is research. Find out all the side effects of each choice and make a decision regarding what is best for you. Then, and only then, find the best doctor you can in the field. If you choose surgery, and his record is good, 1-2 a week seems good.
Resources you cannot miss are Dr. patrick Walsh's Guide to Surviving Prostate Cancer and www.phoenix5.org.
 Signature Prostate Cancer Survivor (so far), not a doctor PSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46 Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c RRP 12/15/2000 PSA .1 .1 .1 .27 .37 .75 EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47 PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 Erection 05/12/2003 @ 48 HTbegins 07/21/2003 @ 48 PSA .07 .05 Lupron 7/03, 8/03, 12/03, 4/04
> Randy: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Chuck Alan Meyer - 21 May 2004 20:57 GMT > Randy: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Chuck Chuck,
I always think someone seeing a surgeon should seek a second opinion from a radiation oncologist, and vice versa.
If you decide that surgery is the way to go, another consideration is RP vs. LRP. If your surgeon does RP you might want a second opinion from one who does LRP, or vice versa.
Finally, a second opinion on your pathology slides can be a good idea. I got three different evaluations from three different labs - 3+3, 3+4, and 4+3. The last (4+3) was from a lab that I had the most confidence in and had the highest reputation. It convinced me that I needed aggressive treatment and needed to get it soon.
Best of luck to you and Randy.
Alan
olfart - 21 May 2004 22:25 GMT > > Randy: > > [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > Alan Might also suggest that you see an Oncologist MD. The one I saw had my slides reread and then went over all the options that were available to me - and considering my age, my physical condition and the results of all my PCa tests made the recommendation of IMRT plus Seeds. He wasn't "pushing" any particular treatment over any other because he was neither a RadOnc or a Uro. I felt more comfortable with my decision after seeing him. As it turned out my prostate swelling and "lackapee" started about halfway through the 25 IMRT treatments and it was considered too risky to do the seeds. Before I gave the OK to do 42 IMRT's and no seeds I again consulted Dr. Nash for his opinion. Age - 69 8/12/02 - PSA 3.7 10/13/03 - PSA 4.69 11/11/03 - PSA 4.8 11/18/03 - Biopsy - 10 cores one core-25% of core-Gleason 4+4=8 all other cores benign tissue 12/10/03 - Consult - Oncologist 12/16/03 - Consult - Radiation Oncologist Treatment Plan - Northeast Ga Cancer Center HT - started 12/17/03 - Eulixen & Lupron (2nd 4 mo Lupron-4/26) 2/10/04 - Started - Flowmax and Megastrol Radiation - IMRT to begin 3/30/04 - 42 treatments
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