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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Cancer / March 2007

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For Giuditta

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Caz - 17 Mar 2007 13:33 GMT
Hi Giuditta.

I have been reading all your posts, and I'm so sorry for the situation
you are in. I know how unbearable it is to watch the one you love
suffering, knowing there is nothing you can do to ease their pain. My
son had cancer, they never did locate the primary. He had adenocarcinoma
(sp)  It ended up in his bones, and the pain that boy suffered, well I
can't even find the words to describe it. He had enough meds to take an
elephant out. I don't even know how he knew his own name, but mentally
he functioned just fine. Anyway the reason for my post is, doesn't Don
have a portacath? Scott (my son) had two lots of chemo via a vein in his
arms. The first time it burnt his vein so bad, the second one in the
other arm wasn't so bad. After that he had a portacath put in his chest.
It was so much easier, plus they could take blood from it and give him
some of his other meds through it I believe. No more poking for veins.
Although I don't think they could give a blood transfusion through it
though.

Best wishes to you and your family.

Caz.
Scott's mom
Giuditta - 17 Mar 2007 19:02 GMT
> Hi Giuditta.
>
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
> Caz.
> Scott's mom

Hi Scott's mom,

How horrid to have a child in pain like that. I am so so sorry. As a mom, I
feel your pain. Thank you for writing me and sharing your child. I often
wonder if experiencing those we love in pain prepares us for that place,
that I do believe in, where no pain exists.

My hands are shaking so exucse any typos. It breaks my heart to hear what
you've been through with your son. Are you okay?

We've heard patients at the cancer clinic speak highly of their port-a-caths
(sp?). I think Don needs one, it would be easier on him. When his vein was
flushed with salt water yesterday, it burned like hell, and he had that done
to him four times, once for each transfusion. He hasn't complained about any
pain yet from the chemo line so maybe that's why they haven't done the
portacath...

Yesterday, the nurse at the CC said they were going to do another type scan,
and if everything looked significantly improved, they would let him sit a
few weeks before starting any other chemo that wouldn't be carboplatin
because she said that it was bad about attacking the bone marrow.

I wasn't aware that they were considering more chemo this soon. It seems to
be killing him little by little. But it's his choice, according to the
oncologist.

I see him walking and wonder how he's doing that with such a low blood
count. He's pale with dark circles around his eyes. I don't know what's
going on because when I ask, all they say is that it's normal...

Thanks about the info, and I will check it out.

God bless,

Giuditta
Caz - 17 Mar 2007 19:53 GMT
>> Hi Giuditta.
>>
[quoted text clipped - 53 lines]
>
> Giuditta

I have good days and bad days, unfortunately the bad ones last a lot
longer than the good ones. Scott died on the 24/12/05 at 4:20pm I
remember it like it was yesterday. I don't know if 4:20 means anything
to pot smokers there, but it does to a lot of people my son included. I
think he chose his time!I will never accept my sons death or get used to
it. I look at his pictures with his beautiful smiling face and wonder
how it can be possible.I can't begin to describe the things he went
through due to the side affect of all the meds he was on, but then I'm
sure you know from what you see Don going through. His legs and feet
swelled so much that his feet would weep, he ended up with stretch marks
from his knees to his toes, it just broke my heart to watch this, and
still does to think about it. I try not to think about it because as
soon as I do, I feel a blackness coming over me, so I have to try and
push it away. When he did try to sleep he had to be sitting up, because
he couldn't lay down because the pain in his back was so bad. He went
from a strong 23 year old to a old frail man in 6 months, then he was
gone. And how very sad does this sound, but as soon as he left his body,
he looked at peace, all the pain gone from his face.

I'm sorry I didn't mean to go on like that. Please do find out about a
portacath though, it really was an enormous help for my son, versus
having needles poked in him all the time.

You know you never have to feel bad about venting, especially here. I
wished I had known about this place when my son was going through it. It
is a good place with a lot of good people.

Best wishes and ((hugs))

Caz.
Scott's mom
Alayne - 18 Mar 2007 11:25 GMT
> I have good days and bad days, unfortunately the bad ones last a lot
> longer than the good ones. Scott died on the 24/12/05 at 4:20pm I remember
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> Caz.
> Scott's mom

Hi Caz,

I've just read your post and wanted to send you a Warm Hug to help ease your
grief.  I know it's very cliche and probably seems impossible to you right
now, but time is a great healer and although the pain never completely
disappears it certainly becomes more manageable.  One day the memories of
your son will evoke smiles rather than tears.  I lost my husband to a brain
tumour when he was 40, we'd been together 20 years and I thought life would
be unbearable without him, there is still a hole but I know that he would
not have wanted me to grieve forever.

Warm Hugs

Alayne
Caz - 18 Mar 2007 11:35 GMT
>> I have good days and bad days, unfortunately the bad ones last a lot
>> longer than the good ones. Scott died on the 24/12/05 at 4:20pm I remember
[quoted text clipped - 42 lines]
>
> Alayne

Thanks for the hugs Alayne. Today is a bit of a tough day. I lay awake
most of last night thinking about my son, and try as I might to smile at
the happier memories all they bought were tears.

Best wishes.

Caz.
Scott's mom
Alayne - 18 Mar 2007 17:09 GMT
>>> I have good days and bad days, unfortunately the bad ones last a lot
>>> longer than the good ones. Scott died on the 24/12/05 at 4:20pm I
[quoted text clipped - 50 lines]
> Caz.
> Scott's mom

It's still early days for you Caz, I'm in my fourth year now and whilst I
still have the odd moment, it's nothing like it was.

More Warm Hugs

Alayne
Giuditta - 18 Mar 2007 14:29 GMT
>>> Hi Giuditta.
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 87 lines]
> Caz.
> Scott's mom

Hi Scott's MOM again,

God love your little heart, girl. So, Scott left at 4.20 ... I know what
that is, and I'm not a pot smoker. I see Scott as having a sense of humor, a
unique quirkiness, a young man whose aura is missed by many.

I can't imagine losing a child, but I feel your pain. Is Scott your only
child? Was he healthy until he was 23? What was Scott like before he got
sick? Does it make you feel better to talk about him? My husband says the
newspaper reporter surfaces, and that I can get info from people quicker
than he can say hello, but it's not just having a nose for facts. People
intrigue me.

As I read about Scott, I envisioned him, and I hope this doesn't sound crude
or too off-topic, but you're quite a gifted writer even though the subject
matter is painful to you. This tragedy could help others in similar
situations through a book about your Scott. Have you thought about it?

When parents lose children, no, they're never quite the same. Who would be?
You've experienced pure hell, you know hell intimately. Scott's life and
experiences could be a vessel for others to find some sort of peace, knowing
they aren't alone in their pain.

Non-fiction, especially stories of this caliper, sell better than fiction
and the most purchased are self-help books. Maybe you could do this with the
goal of raising funds for research. You could turn tragedy into triumph in
Scott's name. You have the passion, motive and the talent.

Think ... what would Scott want. I wrote a book about my best friend, a guy
I grew up with, who died of AIDS a few years ago. While writing, it was like
he came back to me, and I remembered so many fun times we had as I made my
main character him, Michael. I found myself sitting at the computer laughing
and crying ... it overpowered the pain of losing him ... almost ...which was
the beginning of my healing process.

Just a suggestion. You're good at description, so a character-driven
personal account would suit your writing style. Let the reader get to know
Scott through his growing-up years then get to the nut of the story, grab
them with that. Go on Oprah and tell the world that research is needed ...
do it for Scott and others.

Just from reading you, I know you can do it. You have a free editor/proof
reader right here. The book will sell itself.

Two friends of mine have lost children, and they struggle every day. One
child was nine when a tree branch fell on him, splitting his aorta. He would
be 14 now, and his mom will always blame herself. Another mom lost her
teenager to suicide after he got off into hard drugs, and now she works with
a suicide prevention group, raising money for that organization ...

You're right about this being a good place to vent and that good people are
here, so you shouldn't apologize for venting either.

I pray that you have a blessed and peaceful day. You are on my heart and in
my thoughts.

Big warm hug,
Giuditta
Figgertoes - 18 Mar 2007 17:43 GMT
> As I read about Scott, I envisioned him, and I hope this doesn't sound
> crude or too off-topic, but you're quite a gifted writer even though
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
> Just from reading you, I know you can do it. You have a free
> editor/proof reader right here. The book will sell itself.

Giuditta, I think you're on to something.  Maybe some could write
individual books, but what about...

Do you know of any books that are compilations of cancer stories?  I can
see including Penny's story, which could be taken partially from her blog
& from her family.  We have posts to look back on too.  Annie is a gifted
writer too (her son is living with CML) as is Caz & you.  There are
others.  Include a variety of treatment options & outcomes.  It could be
a catharsis for the writers as well as a help to others beginning the
journey.

Certainly, this would not be a book about choosing treatments but more of
the human side.  The common element is asc & how people come together to
get/give support, sometimes simultaneously.  What do you think?

Fig
Giuditta - 19 Mar 2007 11:57 GMT
>> As I read about Scott, I envisioned him, and I hope this doesn't sound
>> crude or too off-topic, but you're quite a gifted writer even though
[quoted text clipped - 46 lines]
>
> Fig

Fig,
I think you had a great idea here...why not compile a book of stories,
remembrances ... why can't everyone in this newsgroup contribute that wants
to...a collective effort.

Think about people out there that don't even have computers and don't have a
support group or access to newsgroups because they don't even know about
them. If I didn't have you all, honestly, I don't know what I would do for
support, understanding, empathy.

You and others on here have great writing skills. Why not? We all have the
passion because of the people we love, and we're living through a kind of
hell that just keeps on destroying people we care about. I know there's an
awareness about cancer but knowing the intimate side of the monster needs to
be related.

Maybe I'm a dreamer, but the whole world needs help. I wonder about places
like Iraq, Iran, Korea. Does cancer tear these folks lives apart, too. Is
there some common ground where people from all over begin to relate in love
instead of war. Couldn't love overpower hate?

Could some good come from this loss we share? How many people don't have
coping skills, no one to vent to, no one to turn to ... thousands I'm sure.
Just like me ... I have a huge family, but I can't talk to them about this
like I can here...they're too afraid and just tell me that "Dad's gonna be
okay, don't worry."

But Dad's not okay. Fig, you really are on to something. What do you think?
We all have our stories, we can help others, we can fund more research and
bring more awareness to the intimate side of this...we're not just numbers,
statistics; we're human beings with pain and heartbreak...

Mentioning pain, Don's is worse. He had two units of blood and two
platelets, but yesterday he could not get warm. He had on a hoodie over his
head, an electric throw over him and a quilt. He's been up all night in pain
even though he has a ton of pain meds. I wouldn't leave him for our
grandson's birthday party, but now I have to leave him for work and am even
contemplating not going there. I want to go to his blood check today because
I have a feeling that he might have to be admitted to the hospital for more
blood today.

I'm scared for him and for all of us. How can I be at work, knowing he's
going through this. Mimi will take him, and I know she'll take care of him,
but I also know he needs me with him. He thinks the blood transfusions are
causing the pain to be worse. I think the nurse mentioned that could
happen...that's what he said. Is that true?

He looked so pale and weak yesterday. This hurts too bad doesn't it?

Giuditta
J - 19 Mar 2007 12:22 GMT
> Maybe I'm a dreamer, but the whole world needs help. I wonder about places
> like Iraq, Iran, Korea. Does cancer tear these folks lives apart, too.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2005-09-13-caregivers_x.htm
More than 1 million children in the USA take care of sick or disabled relatives,
shopping, feeding, dressing, medicating and even changing adult diapers, a
government-financed study finds.

But child caregivers largely have remained hidden and often stay silent because
they fear being separated from parents.

Most care for parents and grandparents who have ailments such as Alzheimer's
disease and cancer. At least 75% get some help, but half say they spend a
substantial amount of time caregiving. And even those who are not the primary
caregiver perform many tasks by themselves.

"Sometimes lower- to mid-income families really fall through the cracks," says
Nancy Law of the National Multiple Sclerosis Society, which assists young
caregivers.

According to the study, 58% of child caregivers help with at least one routine
daily activity, such as bathing, dressing, getting in and out of beds and
chairs, eating, and using the toilet or changing adult diapers. Nearly all help
with shopping, household tasks and meal preparation, the report says.

___________________________________________________________
Oprah showed some families where the "caregiver" child was caring for one or
more ill adults, plus 3 or 4 siblings, getting them off to school, getting
themselves off to school and having to leave the sick ones at home, until the
siblings got home to take over, until the "caregver child" got home to take
over.   I imagine it's happening in Canada as well. They stick to themselves for
fear the Child services or INS will split them up.
J
Figgertoes - 19 Mar 2007 14:07 GMT
>> Maybe I'm a dreamer, but the whole world needs help. I wonder about
>> places like Iraq, Iran, Korea. Does cancer tear these folks lives
[quoted text clipped - 31 lines]
> Canada as well. They stick to themselves for fear the Child services
> or INS will split them up. J

I did some of this as a teen & was even taught how to hook my mother up
to the dialysis machine at the hospital if no one there was available in
an emergency.  Never happened.  Hardest part was getting wheelchair
into/out of car trunk, putting up with her screaming demands, and not
getting to see my friends.  If I asked to go out for a coke, my mother
told me we had plenty of cokes in the fridge!  

I didn't realize it was temporary; my mother was dying. I had no idea of
that & knowing would have made it easier to cope.  My younger sister & I
thought this was to be our lives from then on.  My mother refused to let
people see her as she was on steroids & cheeks/stomach puffy.  So we had
far less household help than we had before she became ill.  There was a
routine around irrigating her surgical wounds.  My mother was
temperamental  & difficult.  Socks was opposite.  Big difference.

Giuditta.s Mimi is college age & volunteered.

I feel for kids put in this position.  Helping out at home to me is a
good thing, but it can be carried too far & too much responsibility can
rest on people too young to take it on. I wonder what happens if a crisis
occurs.

Fig
Figgertoes - 19 Mar 2007 13:44 GMT
>>> As I read about Scott, I envisioned him, and I hope this doesn't
>>> sound crude or too off-topic, but you're quite a gifted writer even
[quoted text clipped - 99 lines]
>
> Giuditta

Got to run this morning.  Glad you have Mimi & that she was willing to
take this on.  None of us really know what we're taking on when it comes
to caring for a person with advanced cancer.So you're going to work &
then will see what happens?  That makes sense.

Socks got chills & sweats too, even when not running a fever.  I just
kept tucking him in & then changing him, the bed linens, pillow,
everything.  Sometimes towel on pillow. Glass of water nearby to try to
prevent dehydration due to sweating. It's dry here, so I could put
pillows out in sun to dry/freshen.  There is a juniper that looks naked
without the pillows now.  I liked the fragrance the juniper imparted & it
allowed air circulation around the pillow.  LOL.

Fig
Giuditta - 20 Mar 2007 00:11 GMT
>>>> As I read about Scott, I envisioned him, and I hope this doesn't
>>>> sound crude or too off-topic, but you're quite a gifted writer even
[quoted text clipped - 114 lines]
>
> Fig

Glad I went on to work after all. Mimi took Don, and his blood count was up
a bit, and his pain is less. Wednesday he'll see the onc., and he'll decide
about another type scan to see what's going on in there.

He seems better, much better than yesterday. You always have good ideas on
how to help him.

It seems that I'm just now facing the fact that he's not going to live
forever like this, and it's made me shaky all day...how does a person get
through that annoying thing?

Giuditta
J - 20 Mar 2007 01:34 GMT
> It seems that I'm just now facing the fact that he's not going to live
> forever like this, and it's made me shaky all day...how does a person get
> through that annoying thing?

You get through it one day at a time, knowing that the decision is not yours,
you have no control over the situation and that you are a strong person who
will survive this.
Hugs
J
Figgertoes - 20 Mar 2007 06:04 GMT
>> It seems that I'm just now facing the fact that he's not going to
>> live forever like this, and it's made me shaky all day...how does a
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> Hugs
> J

Well put, J.  

Fig
Caz - 20 Mar 2007 11:15 GMT
>>>> Hi Giuditta.
>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 146 lines]
> Big warm hug,
> Giuditta

Hi G.

Yes Scott had a sense of humor. He had a lot of friend, he touch many
hearts. I have never in my life seen so many young men cry as I did when
Scott died. It broke my heart to see. He certainly made sure he won't be
forgotten.

Scott had childhood ailments nothing serious. He had a car accident when
he was 19 and had to have his liver sown back together. Scott is my only
child, the light of my life and the very best part of me.

Scott was a very loving child, love to cuddle, bright as a button, full
of fun. He was like any teenager
a bit mouthy on occasion, spent more time hiding the mess in his
bedroom, than it would of taken him to put things away properly, but
generally pretty good. He went off the deep end a bit when his dad and I
split up. He never graduated high school, but could off with his eyes
shut, he was smart as a whip. (in the grand scheme of things I guess
that doesn't really matter) He was a black belt in Tae Kwon Do. Did many
competitions, had several first place trophies and medals. I was so
proud of him, it would make me cry to watch him, win or not it didn't
matter, he was always a winner to me. He floundered a bit when it came
to working, didn't really know what he wanted to do, then one day he
went on a job with a friend brick laying and that was it he found what
he wanted to do. Got himself an apprenticeship, he loved it so much. He
was working nights where his dad works, then going to school during the
day, and he was passing his causes, the guys where his dad worked were
praising how hard he worked, his dad was finally proud of him! Then it
all went down hill. The pain in his back was getting so bad he could
hardly stand. He was going to the doctor, got pain meds and kept going.
Went to a chiropractor, and kept going. He was in so much pain, he was
so strong. Finally after his dad lost his temper with a doctor, Scott
got a scan, and thats when our lives all fell apart. Scott switched
doctors to the most wonderful man I've ever had the pleasure of meeting.
He rushed all Scott tests so he wasn't waiting for too long. Scott's
whole team were wonderful. There were two student nurses in the
hospital, about the same age as Scott, maybe a year or two younger, but
they both fell in love with him, they were always popping in and out of
his room every time they past. Sat by his bed at night, and cried when
he got sicker and sicker.... Oh dear, I do run on, sorry for being so
long winded.

Thank you so very much for saying I can write, never thought of myself
as a good writer, thought I was quite crap at it actually.... I'll leave
it there I think.

Best wishes.

Caz.
Scott's mom.
Giuditta - 20 Mar 2007 23:02 GMT
>>>>> Hi Giuditta.
>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 193 lines]
> a good writer, thought I was quite crap at it actually.... I'll leave it
> there I think.

No, keep going Caz.   Don't stop writing. I was getting all into visualizing
Scott, getting to know him, and then you stopped. I know it has to be hard
for you, remembering, so forgive me if I am making you feel sad. I don't
know what works for you. Writing my book about Michael was my therapy, but
Micheal wasn't my son.

I want magic words for you, flowing mystical words that will take the edge
off your pain, and I detest that I am at a loss for those words. I hurt with
you, for you ...

Cliches are just cliches that don't mean anything at times like these. You
must be a strong lady because you're up, you're typing, you're existing.

I have this ministry that I started through email a few years ago where my
friends, family, and even people I don't know (those who read my column)
email me and tell me that they need prayer or they know a friend who needs
prayer, and sometimes the person wants to remain anonymous, but I still list
the prayer request because I figure God knows who it is...

Anyway, it's kind of crazy, and I call it Six Flags Over Jesus. People write
about miracles in their lives, marriages and births, etc. It's a prayer
chain actually, and many people are praying for each other. I'm just the
instrument that gets the requests out there.

Of course, there's no money involved, nothing like that, just something I
felt led to do one day when so many folks I knew had problems. Some refer to
it as SFOJ. Would you mind if I put you on the prayer chain?

After I send the requests to all my email buddies, they forward them to
their buddies, and last summer we found out that it has gone around the
world ... I'll explain.

We had two teenagers in Oklahoma that were struck by lightening. One had a
cell phone in his pocket, and they were almost in the house when lightening
hit a tree, bounced to the cell phone and into the boys. They were in ICU
for months, and we referred to them as our lightening boys.

One day this guy comes to the hospital and asks if he can see the lightening
boys. The young man was from France and said he read about them on SFOJ and
had been praying for them...cool huh?

I believe in the power of prayer, and since I'm a backsliding Catholic, ths
is my way to help people in my own way. So, I would be glad to add you to
our list of folks who need prayer for strength and peace.

If you'd like, I can email you the last one I sent out so you can see what
it is. My email address is jmarrs@myspeedworks.com so if you'd like to be
added or just read one, send me your email address...it's okay if you're not
interested...

So, let me know and anyone else who would like prayer can do the same...

Please don't take this as some scam or something where I'm getting anything
but a sense of peace from the ministry ... that's not who I am. I just felt
led to mention it.

I feel that we're all in the same bowl of alphabet soup in this world, and I
can't accept that we're just brought to this earth to live, hurt and then
die. There has to be more than that or what the hell, we could all just
drink Jim Jone's Kool Aid and off ourselves.

And it's not a ministry where I try to convert people, nothing like that ...
it's serious and humorous, too. I mean, God, look at the name of it, and I
don't mean to be disrepectful just real.

Oh, I have to tell you one more thing...(excuse my longwindedness). I had a
student last year who was in some trouble, and we were afraid he'd be sent
from our facility to training school. His charge was fighting a kid who had
been bullying him.

He was with us all year (I teach at an alternative school for teenage felons
and behavioral problem students.) Every day Chris (my student) asked if I
would read a positive message from this calendar that my sister created
that's based on Bible verses.

Chris's attitude started to change, the chip flew off his shoulder, and he
asked me to put him on SFOJ for prayer. He was a sad teenager whose brother
was killed in an automobile accident at the age of 24. Chris told me that he
wanted to change his life for his brother and that he wanted to get back in
reguilar school and play football for his brother, too..

We began to pray for his wish, and through a miracle, he was allowed back in
school last August in time for football practice. This was his senior year,
and he had never played football for a school.

I was reading the paper in the fall and saw where he recovered a fumble and
ran 78 yards for a td to win over their rival team. We teachers all sent him
a card, telling him how proud we were of him. A few weeks ago, I read that
he received a scholarship to Auburn and was voted MVP of his high school
team.

So, if you ever hear about Chris Zinn  playing for the NFL some day, you'll
know that his faith got him there. I love stories like that, and we have a
lot of them on SFOJ.

Sorry for going on and on ... hope some of it made you smile.

love and hugs!
Giuditta
Caz - 22 Mar 2007 10:58 GMT
>>>>>> Hi Giuditta.
>>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 291 lines]
> love and hugs!
> Giuditta

Hi G.

Please don't take offense, but I'm not religious. There were so many
people praying from all over the world for my son to get better, and I
had to watch him get worse day by day, just to watch him die at the end
of all his suffering. I'm happy that your belief works for you and for
anyone else that it works for.

He suffered so much without complaint. Our lives revolved around doctors
and hospital visits. He banned most of his friends from seeing him,
there were a certain few he allowed in, but not many. They all called
all the time wanted to see how he was. They were all so heartbroken. He
kept telling them he was going to get better.

One time when he was in hospital he stood in front of me and said "I
don't want to die mom" I felt like my heart exploded in my chest. I
didn't know what to say to him, I just hugged him. I stayed in the
hospital with him every time he had to be there. Even when he had to
have his chest cavity drained. 5 and a half litres of fluid they drained
from him. He liked his doctor, he was operated on by James Bond :-)
The only time I left him, was when I had to go home shower and change,
then I came right back. Even when he was home we slept in the same room,
he had a hospital bed. Not that he did much sleeping, he couldn't lay
down at all. Whenever I woke up Scott was usually in the computer room
playing poker or sitting at the kitchen table.

Some of the meds he was on caused him to hallucinate. Just out of the
blue he looked at me and said "Where did Lyndsey go" I'd say "She hasn't
been here yet" He'd just give his head a shake and off he'd go. I'd walk
into the t.v room and find him having a conversation with someone
unseen. He thought his friends where there. There were quite a few
instances like that. Some of them quite funny. One time he was just
laying in bed, all of a sudden he opened his eyes and looked at his dad
and I and with a quizzical look on his face he said "Did you see that"
we said "What" He said "That giant caterpillar" I said "No darling, that
was just you, seeing one of your little friends" Fortunately he was fine
 because he knew it was the meds causing it.

The bad dreams he had weren't fine though. Sometimes he woke up
terrified and in tears. The bad dreams he had were always about his dad,
something bad happening to him. I always had to go call him to make sure
he was ok. His dad had a very bad motorcycle accident just before Scott
was diagnosed, so that probably played on his mind all the time.

It all seems like a blur and a bad dream. I don't want to forget one
second, but I have. I feel like I have to do this in installments I feel
like I'm writing a book :-)

Best wishes to you and yours ((hugs))

Caz.
Scott's mom
Giuditta - 24 Mar 2007 02:42 GMT
>>>>>>> Hi Giuditta.
>>>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 349 lines]
> Caz.
> Scott's mom

Hi again,

Hey, I'm not offended that you aren't religious. I'm not either...I'm just a
believer, spiritual person. I was so mad at God when my mom died because she
was a real holy roller and went to this church where they danced in the
aisles. They prayed for people, and they were healed, and then it teed me
off that my own mom couldn't be healed.

The church intercessors would come and circle her bed and pray and speak in
tongues, and at that point I was thinking that whatever it took, if it would
heal her, go for it, but it didn't heal her.

My priest came, and I told him I was mad at God, and he told me at least I
still believed in him/her ...

I haven't been back to any church since but just do the email thing because
I felt people's pain and didn't know what else to do with it but give it to
God...

So, don't worry about not being religious with me...I understand how you
feel...You must be such a strong person. Your writing touches me so ...

You said you felt like you were writing a book, and maybe you are. I hope
you're saving all this to Word or something...you have a knack for conveying
your innermost emotions and love for your son.

I'll be honest. I don't think I could be as strong as you are. You are
amazing, and I hate that word because it's so over-used, but I can't think
of another one to describe you.

The way I see it is that Scott is not hurting, and you'll see him again, and
he won't be racked with pain. I have to hang onto that. And I know you're
not religious and me neither, but I don't believe Scott was given to you and
then snatched away forever...I can't believe that.

Keep writing if it's not too painful for you. You've sure brought Scott to
life for me. Somewhere in this universe, if there is a God, a part of you is
looking at God right now...part of you is there in Scott.

Love and hugs to you, Dear,

Giuditta
Caz - 24 Mar 2007 10:42 GMT
>>>>>>>> Hi Giuditta.
>>>>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 392 lines]
>
> Giuditta

Hi G.

I don't know where Scott is, but I have to believe he is somewhere safe
and pain free. To believe anything else would be too unbearable.

I try so hard to find my son in my dreams, but I can't. I just want him
to come to me and tell me he's ok, I want to hug him and kiss him and
tell him I love him. I want to look into his beautiful blue eyes and see
his bright smile and hear him laugh. 15 months today. When does the pain
go away!

I wasn't actually saving what I wrote, but since you asked if I was I
went back over my posts and copied and saved them into word. Not really
sure what to do with it, everything will be all mixed up. A bit like me
today!

Best wishes and ((hugs)) I hope you all have a wonderful day today. And
thank you for your kind word.

Caz.
Scott's mom
Giuditta - 27 Mar 2007 13:47 GMT
>>>>>>>>> Hi Giuditta.
>>>>>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 420 lines]
> Caz.
> Scott's mom

Good! You saved it. It's your book.

Girl, I don't know when the pain goes away. I wish I had an answer for you.
The only answer I got from a friend two years after my mom died was that I
could only feel as bad as I wanted to feel...that snapped me out of pain and
into peace and good memories that I could smile about instead of crying
myself to sleep every night, but with a child, I don't know...maybe his
wisdom applies to everyone. It was harsh and kind of a cold remark at the
time, but I think something had to snap me out of my grief, and that did it.

Hugs,
Giuditta
starfleet - 17 Mar 2007 21:19 GMT
Giuditta schreef:

> Yesterday, the nurse at the CC said they were going to do another type scan,
> and if everything looked significantly improved, they would let him sit a
> few weeks before starting any other chemo that wouldn't be carboplatin
> because she said that it was bad about attacking the bone marrow.
>
>  
I would chance oncologists. What kind of a life is that??

Anne
Giuditta - 18 Mar 2007 14:46 GMT
> Giuditta schreef:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
> Anne

Did you mean "change" his oncologist? I didn't know if you meant to take a
chance with the oncologist or change to another one.

Don would never change. He feels safe at the cancer clinic and with his
oncologist. All I can do at this point is go by his wishes, whatever makes
him comfortable.

He wants to live. He could be taking his last breath and still ask to have
chemo. The nurse said when the cancer is no longer improved by chemo that
this oncologist starts cancer studies with other drugs.

Don says that everything he is enduring will be worth it if he can beat
cancer, and he truly believes that he will win.

Although I see him at his lowest, how could I not go along with his wishes.
This conflict will be man against all odds, not man against me. I'm sitting
out this round.

I see your point.

Giuditta
Figgertoes - 18 Mar 2007 17:12 GMT
> Although I see him at his lowest, how could I not go along with his
> wishes. This conflict will be man against all odds, not man against
> me. I'm sitting out this round.
>
> Giuditta

Very well put Giuditta.  Socks made all his own treatment decisions with no
input from me.  It made him feel in control of something at a time when he
had lost control of so much else.  I think he also realized, though I did
not at the time, that he would also own the outcomes, consequences.  It's a
gift, later, that I don't look back & feel that anything I did caused
suffering, shortened his life - fill in blank.  I just supported his
decisions & him & helped him when he needed help.  And he helped me too.

I do have to say it was difficult in the beginning when he said he wanted
to go to his appointments alone.  Especially when he didn't ask questions.  
He even played a game with figuring out what stage his disease was in when
he could have just asked.  But it all worked out.

Fig
Giuditta - 19 Mar 2007 12:17 GMT
>> Although I see him at his lowest, how could I not go along with his
>> wishes. This conflict will be man against all odds, not man against
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
>
> Fig

I know where you're coming from and feel that Don has to feel somewhat in
control of his life because he feels bad enough that he can't control much
else right now.

Don can't drive himself anywhere. He's too weak. He feels bad about that,
too. I think he is beginning to feel worse about not being able to help me
with things that he used to do like taking Cheyenne where he needs to be,
etc.

Cheyenne must sense that things aren't going so well because he came in my
room last night and told me his gf was going to help get him to the driver's
license place after they study today when he gets home from work...he just
said, "Mom, you don't worry about it." And that blessed my heart because I
knew then that he realized that I have too big a load right now and don't
need one more thing.

He's right. I'm at my worry limit. I've had times when I have been scared,
but yesterday it hit me that I might really lose my husband. It hit me hard
enough to take my breath away. This is real, and I have to teach classes
today. Before, teaching was an outlet, a distraction from what was going on
at home, but now that Don seems to be getting worse, I don't know if I can
keep my mind on work.

Please pray. I need more strength so I can help him, my family and my
students.

Giuditta
starfleet - 19 Mar 2007 09:28 GMT
Giuditta schreef:
>  
>> Giuditta schreef:
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> chance with the oncologist or change to another one.
>  

I meant "change" ;-)
> Don would never change. He feels safe at the cancer clinic and with his
> oncologist. All I can do at this point is go by his wishes, whatever makes
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
>  

I see your point. If it's Dons choice I certainly respect that, and I
wouldn't interfere if he was my spouse and respect his wishes. It's the
oncologist I don't quite understand.
Hope Don is feeling a bit better every day and he will be around for a
long time to come ;-)

Anne

Anne
J - 19 Mar 2007 10:36 GMT
> Giuditta schreef:
> > "starfleet" <starfleet1960@hotmail.com> wrote in message
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
> wouldn't interfere if he was my spouse and respect his wishes. It's the
> oncologist I don't quite understand.

Yes, I guess the oncologist is being dishonest by not clarifying that Don's not
curable.
J
Giuditta - 19 Mar 2007 12:34 GMT
>> Giuditta schreef:
>> > "starfleet" <starfleet1960@hotmail.com> wrote in message
[quoted text clipped - 34 lines]
> curable.
> J

You know, it's weird. The onc gave us the prognosis the first day we saw
him, but he and the nurse both say a cure or remission is their goal. I
asked the nurse a few weeks ago if they were just giving him a few more
months by the agressive chemo, and she said that curing him was the
objective.

It doesn't make any sense to me. How do you tell someone he has a few weeks
without chemo and eight to twelve months with it and then say the goal is
curing him?

It's a mystery to me. Maybe Don has told them not to scare me with the
truth, who knows. But I see what I see, and he looks worse, and he feels
worse.

Giuditta
Figgertoes - 19 Mar 2007 14:18 GMT
>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>> > "starfleet" <starfleet1960@hotmail.com> wrote in message
[quoted text clipped - 50 lines]
>
> Giuditta

I wonder if you could have a one-on-one with the oncologist. It's cruel
to keep you in the dark although with HIPPA, they can't tell you anything
about Don's condition without his permission, so Don would have to grant
that.  I don't know what's going on, but it sounds very strange to me.  
And could be cruel.  People need some time to prepare for death.  Maybe
Don can't cope with that?  Or maybe the oncologist sees more profit in
continuing the extreme treatments?  Can you tell if this particular
oncologist treats other patients similarly (maybe scuttlebut in chemo
room)?  It might help to know if this treatment imperative is coming from
Don or from the oncologist.

Fig
Figgertoes - 19 Mar 2007 19:29 GMT
> >>> Giuditta schreef:
> >>> > "starfleet" <starfleet1...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
[quoted text clipped - 65 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

Now that I've thought on this, I'm wondering if maybe you should talk
to both oncologist & Don together.  At work, I call it getting all the
liars in the same room :P.  That eliminates the he said/she said as
they are all right there.

Ask what has changed since initial prognosis since current thought
seems to be counter to that.  Ask how many in Don's condition have
been cured or had lives prolonged by the treatment he is on.

If you get non-answers, keep asking.  What I'm asking is..., what I
really want to know is...can you please explain....

This may sound brutal, but it may be a kindness in the long run.   And
we all know you'd go to the moon & back without complaint if it would
cure Don or help him.

Fig
Giuditta - 20 Mar 2007 00:33 GMT
>> >>> Giuditta schreef:
>> >>> > "starfleet" <starfleet1...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
[quoted text clipped - 83 lines]
>
> Fig

I have done this (not with Don present), but have heard three answers from
the onc. First prognosis, with chemo eight to twelve months or close, The he
had the scan, which showed everything "significantly improved," so my older
daughter and I asked if the prognosis was the same. The oncologist's answer
was that two percent of the patients in Don's condition have lived up to
five years.

Then Mimi asked a day or two later, and it was changed to two percent live
up to a year or two ... that's the day she went crazy, and I had to leave
work and get Don from chemo s he wouldn't see her so upset.

In other words, the oncologist hasn't told us much that we
understand...surely he's had enough patients to know what we should expect,
but I do have to give him some credit ... I know of people that he's treated
who had short prognosis's that have lived two to three years longer and are
still doing well.

It seems that he's surprised and pleased that Don is still living and not
bedridden ... he's chairridden though...

Another thing is he's weak from low blood counts, but he's also taking a lot
of pain meds, so that would make a person weak I would think, but he needs
them. He also has a lot of cancer, so I'd expect him to be weak ...

My think is that I want to know what's making him so weak. I see patients on
chemo that are driving themselves there and back, but there's no way that
Don could drive a car right now. Thank God for Mimi and for Donnie when he's
in town...what do people do when they have no help? There's no way I could
quit my job...I consider us blessed in this just by having sweet children
... it could be worse ... couldn't it?

I'm really gonna crash this time...

Ciao and thanks for being so helpful and kind,
Hugs and God Bless,
Giuditta

excuse typos
J - 20 Mar 2007 01:33 GMT
> > On Mar 19, 7:18 am,
>
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
>
> My think is that I want to know what's making him so weak.

Just so you know that chemo does not only "target" cancer; it affects the whole
body.
What's written below fits with what the oncologist is saying.
He's giving Don the "kill or cure" him dose of chemo and he's heading for bone
marrow failure due to the extent of his cancer and the involvement of his
spleen. (is my non-expert opinion) if he continues on more chemo.
J
<http://www.bccancer.bc.ca/HPI/CancerManagementGuidelines/Lung/6ManagementPolicie
s/642SmallCellLungCancer/622ExtensiveStageSCLC.htm
>

The prognosis for most cases of extensive stage SCLC is guarded and treatment is
palliative. Without chemotherapy, the average survival is only 8-10 weeks.
Radiotherapy alone may palliate local symptoms but has little impact on
survival. The majority of patients (70-90%) respond to chemotherapy and complete
responses occur in 15-20%. Median survival with standard regimens is 8-11
months. Almost all patients relapse and less than 5% are alive at 2 years. The
small proportion (1-2%) of long-term survivors usually had low bulk metastatic
disease and an exceptional response to chemotherapy.

Standard Chemotherapy of Extensive Stage SCLC

Guideline: Combination chemotherapy is superior to monotherapy in SCLC.

Grade of Recommendation: A

Monotherapy with oral etoposide has been proved inferior to combination
chemotherapy in SCLC (Souhami, 1997). Combination chemotherapy should be
recommended to all extensive SCLC patients fit enough to receive it. However,
randomised trials of various combination chemotherapy protocols have not
demonstrated a superior regimen.

Standard regimens are the same as for limited SCLC (see above 6.4.2.1) including
four cycles of sequential EP, six cycles of alternating CAV/EP or 4 cycles of
PAVE.

Intensive Chemotherapy
A variety of methods of delivering greater than standard dosing of
chemotherapeutic agents for extensive SCLC have been tried including in
controlled trials including higher doses with cytokine support, weekly
chemotherapy and high dose chemotherapy with bone marrow or stem cell
transplantation. None of these innovations have improved survival and all are
more toxic than standard therapy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spleen
   * Creation of red blood cells. While the bone marrow is the primary site of
hematopoeisis in the adult, up until the fifth month of gestation, the spleen
has important hematopoietic functions. After birth, no significant hematopoietic
function is left in the spleen except in some hematologic disorders: e.g.
myelodysplastic syndrome, hemoglobinopathies.

   * Storage of red blood cells and other formed elements. This is only valid
for certain mammals, such as dogs. The red blood cells can be released when
needed. In humans, however, the spleen does not function as a deposit of red
blood cells, but instead it stores platelets in case of an emergency
Figgertoes - 20 Mar 2007 07:21 GMT
>> > On Mar 19, 7:18 am,
>>
[quoted text clipped - 92 lines]
> deposit of red blood cells, but instead it stores platelets in case of
> an emergency

Is there no ethics pannel?  Maybe docs don't have to answer to anyone &
maybe the insurance companies grant anything a dying patient authorizes,
regardless of benefit?  I would have thought there would be insurance
company medical review at some juncture.  This is so very different from
anything I have ever heard of.  What happened to 'first, do no harm'?

It's one thing for someone to say they want anything that might cure them
but quite another for them to say they want non-stop chemo because they
think that's the answer - and to get it, if that's what's happening here.

A most disturbing & puzzling situation.

Fig
Giuditta - 20 Mar 2007 23:34 GMT
>>> > On Mar 19, 7:18 am,
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 106 lines]
>
> Fig

Fig, that seems to be what's happening here although the onc won't do more
chemo until Don's blood is built back up. He did say that, but I don't know
how up he's talking about. His blood count was improved Monday, and I was
surprised since he was so weak Sunday and cold...

It's up and down like a pogo stick, and I want it to stay up. Tomorrow
another type scan will be discussed, so that will tell us a lot more about
what's going on in there.

I dread heaing that the cancer is not reacting to the chemo anymore and also
worry that if it is better again that they'll zap him out with more.

I'm puzzled too.

Giuditta
Figgertoes - 21 Mar 2007 08:06 GMT
>>>> > On Mar 19, 7:18 am,
>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 126 lines]
>
> Giuditta

You've hit it on the head.  It's a conundrum.  

J said it best about it not being your decision & you can't control the
situation.  Sometimes that's a hard place to be.  Maybe that's what we
are supposed to learn from this.  It's just so hard if Don is making
decisions based on false premises.

Fig
Giuditta - 21 Mar 2007 21:16 GMT
>>>>> > On Mar 19, 7:18 am,
>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 135 lines]
>
> Fig

Hi again,

Well, Mimi took Don for his oncologist appointment today, and here's the
latest word. Monday he will have a CT scan without the dye because he's
allergic to it but will drink something...barium (sp?)

His blood count is better than it was Monday. Whether or not they continue
the chemo now depends on how the cancer looks ... Don said that the dr. said
they would either let him sit for a month or go right back into more chemo.
I don't know what determines this, whether it has to be more cancer or less
cancer...

Don told me they won't see everything as well without the dye, so I asked
why not do an MRI, and then he said that the dr. said they weren't doing an
MRI because the cancer is in the lungs and that the lungs move while
breathing, and it might be harder to see on an MRI...

I'm thinking, what about the cancer everywhere else ... shouldn't that be
considered ... but what do I know. I'm not a doctor.

He said that the MRI was used more for stomach cancer, etc. But he also said
that with the CT scan they will check out his stomach and see why it is
hurting so much...the dr. thinks it's the constipation making his stomach
hurt so gave him a huge bottle of some kind of medicine for that...

So, Don seems to be feeling better. He said the doctor seemed pleased, so I
pray everything is just fine...when I look at him now, it does seem that
he's better. It just bothers me that the pain in the stomach is bad enough
for him to be taking morphine, an occasional lortab 10 and the psychedelic
lollipops. Don's not one to take these type drugs (only pot), so for him to
be doing it reveals to me the intensity of his pain.

I don't think he could tolerate the pain without the meds. Would
constipation cause one to hurt this much?

Giuditta
starfleet - 22 Mar 2007 02:20 GMT
Giuditta schreef:

> I don't think he could tolerate the pain without the meds. Would
> constipation cause one to hurt this much?
>
> Giuditta
>
>  
It could  be a side effect of the morphine Don is taking. Is he on a
high dosis of morphine?  His constipation certainly is but he gets
medicne for that isn't it? Glad to hear that Don, though still in pain
seems to be a bit better and his blood counts up.

Anne
Giuditta - 22 Mar 2007 22:09 GMT
> Giuditta schreef:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> Anne

Thank you. I don't know the mg of his morphine, but it says he can take one
to two, but he hardly ever takes two at once...he might at bedtime or take
one and have a pop a couple of hours later. He has medicine for the stomach
problem, too.

He says he feels better today but has the nagging cough again, which he
seems to get right before time for his next chemo round...

So, wonder what that's all about ... it scares me, everything scares me...

Thanks again for kind words,

G
Figgertoes - 23 Mar 2007 17:07 GMT
>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
>
> G

He doesn't keep a med log?  Socks kept one the whole time & it helped
them regulate.  You don't wait until you experience pain to take the
painkiller. There are some that work in the background to keep pain at a
lower level & others for breakthrough pain.  Sometimes he had 3 different
kinds going.  Sometimes the breakthrough med is the same thing, just a
different dose, or could be something different altogether.  These
changed continually depending on what Socks had logged - how many
breakthroughs doses & at what times. Pain control/lucidity - objective is
to keep in balance.

If you already know this, please forgive.  If not, maybe he needs to see
a medication specialist.
J - 23 Mar 2007 17:19 GMT
> > "starfleet" <starfleet1960@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >> Giuditta schreef:
[quoted text clipped - 38 lines]
> If you already know this, please forgive.  If not, maybe he needs to see
> a medication specialist.

Yes, a med log would be nice, but since he's got the lollipop and may not
have someone always supervising (to take notes), might be difficult to keep
it straight.

Tim, on the BC newsgroup, always said to start laxative changes 2 days before
pain meds changes.
Anticipatory.
But we don't know if that's what causing Don's pain at this point until he's
had the scan.

I suppose it could also be neuropathic pain. I've got neuropathy and some
medications: antibiotics and some pain medications cause a sudden acute pain,
not as bad if I take with food; so I don't take a pain med for that, because
it's gone almost as fast as it appears, if I'm careful about which meds I
take.  Reams of gastro tests revealed nothing.

Hopefully the scan for Don will clarify what is or isn't happening.
J
Giuditta - 24 Mar 2007 01:38 GMT
>> > "starfleet" <starfleet1960@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >> Giuditta schreef:
[quoted text clipped - 62 lines]
> Hopefully the scan for Don will clarify what is or isn't happening.
> J

We're believing that the scan will show progress like it did last time, and
the fact that his stomach is much better gives us a lot of hope.

I think he got on a certain pain schedule, and that's why he quit writing it
down...or maybe we all just got tired and forgot...but the pad is right by
his medication ... I should probably start writing it again, huh?

He does the lollipops more than anything else now...and between those and
the poop pills, things are so much better for him. I'm so relieved for him.

TGIF Hugs to you!!!
G
starfleet - 24 Mar 2007 08:58 GMT
Giuditta schreef:

> I think he got on a certain pain schedule, and that's why he quit writing it
> down...or maybe we all just got tired and forgot...but the pad is right by
> his medication ... I should probably start writing it again, huh?
>
>  
I think Don should since pain is very, very  personal and he is able to
do it. He could write down the meds he is taking and write down in how
much pain he is with a grade for the the pain form 0 (no pain) to ten (
totally unbearable, the worst pain you can imagine) + location of the
pain. If he does that every time he takes something  for example that
lollipop (we don't have that overhere) you can see if the pain gets
worse or less.

I think that its better to be a bit careful with those lollipops in Dons
case since he's not terminal and might (we all hope fot hat) be around
for a long time. I guess there is morphine in them? Its better to take
morphine in slow release and only use the lollipops for breakthrough
pain. If he needs more and more  lollipops, the slow release should be
higher. There is less danger for addiction with the slow release.
Addiction is not a problem when one has  only little time left, but in
Don's case it could be a problem because he used to smoke, misses his
cigarette and now has his lollipops. Don is a grown man and should
decide for himself, but maybe he's not aware of how this works.

Anne
Giuditta - 24 Mar 2007 13:55 GMT
> Giuditta schreef:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
> Anne

Anne,

I see what you're saying. From what the oncologist said at our first visit,
Don is a terminal case, but my question is does that change. I can't get a
real straight answer from his dr. just percentages. Don says that he doesn't
think the onc expected him to be doing as well as he is because he said he
always looks pleasantly surprised at his check-ups, like "you're still
here?"

Don's been through the hippiedom rock & roll band era when Jim Morrison was
a frequent friend at his place in LA, but Don never got into the drug scene
not even pot ... I didn't know him back then, but I know people that did.

I was attracked to him when we met because he was the guy that played his
gigs, liked a wholesome life, drank milk and played basketball or tennis,
etc...he didn't even drink! Not even a beer ... always drank Pepsi. I was
amazed because most people I knew had their drinks, weed or whatever. He was
like a breath of fresh air.

I figured it out when I saw how much he was into his music. If not at a gig,
he was in the studio. I asked him about the stereotype I had always heard
about with musicians, and he said that the ones that were messed up on
drugs, etc. can't play like they should, screw up in the studio and miss
gigs. He has had to fire a bass player because he smoked so much pot that he
kept dragging during concerts, which really affects the drummer's timing as
well and then the whole band.

He was road manager too at the time and the guy was a great friend, but the
music came first. I remember my ex used to ridicule Don for being the type
person he still is ... he wasn't the party animal, and my ex was a clone of
every party animal you could imagine and in every way.

Don and I became friends for three years, and I saw that he was real. He was
also a true friend. So, how did I get off on all that? Oh, the possibility
of him becoming addicted. I can already see in the past couple of days,
since Don's pain is less, that he hasn't been sucking pops as often and that
he seems a lot more alert so I assume he hasn't been taking his pain pills
as often either.

Let me clarify on the drug scene. Don never smoked pot even back in the day,
but he was in his bunk on the bus one night and had a problem lifting his
arm the next morning. He thought it was just sleeping on it, but it got
worse. We went to seven different doctors for this pain that started in his
arm...even an acupuncturist, chiropractor, osteopath, and finally a
neurosurgeon discovered a ruptured disc. This was when we also discovered
that he had degenerative arthritis of the spine.

Anyway, through this awful pain, the pain meds didn't help him so the guitar
player gave him some pot, and that was the only thing that helped him. He
even told his doctor that, so he has been smoking pot since his back
problems started, but he isn't a 24/7 stoner guy.

It bothered me because I held him up on this pedestal. I didn't understand
that pot helped pain like that and even thought ...yeah right ... just an
excuse to get high, which really bugged me, and that's another reason I quit
going to concerts. The band smoked pot (ironic since he fired a guy for it,
huh), and I felt like an outsider because I didn't partake of the weed and
had just become a teacher and the horror of getting busted scared the hell
out of me.

The week after Don quit playing for Gilley, Mickey's band's bus was busted
and all of them were arrested enroute to another show. Don was supposed to
be on Ricky Nelson's plane but backed out for another gig, and you know what
happened to that and all the drugs involved.

So, weed has been the only problem we've had in the past years of our
married life. I was like a brick wall that had been built...my white knight
had been tarnished, and I sure didn't want the kids knowing about the pot
because they were becoming that age where they might try to experiment
themselves, and they thought anything Don would do would be okay.

So, now, me, the old prude, could care less how much pot he has as long as
he doesn't hurt. But then smoking pot is still smoking, right. I have taught
drug ed. and learned that one joint is ten times worse than one cigarette.

With saying all that, this is why I don't think he'll become addicted to the
other drugs. He's had plenty of opportunities but wasn't into it. He'd
rather just have the pot when he needs it. But I could be wrong. The reason
that my daughter and I had been the ones to write down his pain med doses is
because we were afraid that since he was groggy from them that he might not
remember when he took one. We had him tell us every time he took a pill, and
then we'd write it down.

Before his cancer dx he went to a pain clinic for the arthritis problem, and
they put him on methadone. They had him taking about nine pills a day. He
did this for a few weeks, and it did help, but he got tired of taking it and
quit cold turkey. He said that he felt like his arms were stretching out of
his body for the first night and since then hasn't touched any pain meds
until the cancer dx. He told all of this to his oncologist because he was
afraid of the same thing happening again.

I got the feeling that the oncologist wanted him to take pain meds because
he told him that he could prescribe him whatever he wanted, and Don just
told him whatever he thought would help but not methadone. So, then he
started the morphine.

I pray that his pain continues to lessen so he can feel healthier, and now
weed is just a small thing compared to him having SCLC, extensively. If he
gets out to the concert this weekend and keeps feeling better, stronger, I
don't think it will be much longer before he's back playing again full-time.
That's his real drug of choice, his music.

Sorry I wrote such a long post ... I get started sometimes and just rattle
on...I'll try to quit being so long-winded or long-fingered? Whatever the
word is for writing ... writers are bad about not knowing when to stop, and
since I quit the paper, I've been into withdrawal myself.

Have a great day!

Giuditta
starfleet - 24 Mar 2007 15:07 GMT
Giuditta schreef:

> Anne,
>
> I see what you're saying. From what the oncologist said at our first visit,
> Don is a terminal case, but my question is does that change.
Guiditta,

I have had  a terminal disease  for two years now but I'm not terminal
yet ( I hope) ;-) Even though Don may not be cured, that doesn't mean he
is terminal in the way that he is dying very soon. Some people don't get
better anymore but are able to lead a pretty normal life for who knows
how long. That is what I meant by the lollipops + addiction + terminal.
There is a difference in incurable or or being in the end stage of
disease. In the endstage it's no use to bother about becoming addicted
to anything, but if you have months and months  even years to live, you
might be worried about that. With slow release chances for addiction are
less, but more important it keeps the level constant so there need not
be any pain and lollipops can be used occasionally for  breakthrough
pain. Much more comfortable because that way you are ahead of the pain.
If Don gets nausious and gets sick a lot, there are also patches he can
use that work two or three days. Like I said he is a grown man, but many
people aren't aware that it is much more comfortable and less addictive
to use a slow release form of morphine and use the lollipops etc.
occasionally for breakthrough pain. More and more breakthrough pain
should mean a higher dose of slow release.
But if Don likes the lollipops I really wouldn't want to  take them away
from him ;-))))) I just wrote the post because Don maybe isn't aware, as
many people are. They think "I'll only take morphine when I'm in really
bad pain, otherwise I become addicted" and it doesn't work that way with
pain from cancer.

Anne
Giuditta - 25 Mar 2007 13:14 GMT
> Giuditta schreef:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
>
> Anne

Don does use the lollipops more than the morphine pills but is closely
monitored on them because the prescription says no more than four a day, and
if he runs out, his insurance won't pay ... without insurance they're $2500
for 100 pops!

What's good about the pops is they are better for him if he is nauseated,
which is when he first discovered them at the cancer clinic one day when he
was very sick at his stomach. The nurse gave him one during chemo, and he
said it worked better than the morphine.

I understand what you're saying about the pain threshold and the morphine.
His dr. suggests ge take the morphine pretty much as prescribed, but he
isn't taking that much unless his pain does get worse...

I appreciate your knowledge on all this because we are new it ... well,
since November.

So, how are you doing? Do you have much pain? And you know, aren't we all
terminal? Who knows what any of our lives will be played out like or our
demise. The thing about you and the others on this ng is that you all seem
to appreciate life and what it offers more than others. Nothing is taken for
granted here.

Thanks again for the advice.

Have a beautiful day!

Giuditta
Giuditta - 24 Mar 2007 01:27 GMT
>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 37 lines]
> If you already know this, please forgive.  If not, maybe he needs to see
> a medication specialist.

We kept a med log for him up until maybe the last month...Usually Mimi or I
wrote down what he took, and then he was doing it, and now the last entry is
just a note from me saying I love you, and no more med entries.

He seems to be doing better pain wise now that the stomach thing is getting
better and is even talking about going with a friend to a gig tomorrow
night...he was on the phone, talking to his buddies that are playing, and
he's meeting them at the bus and going for a concert.

He just told me that his pain is ten times less than it was...yipppeee!!!

Happy hugs!
G
Figgertoes - 24 Mar 2007 05:37 GMT
>>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 53 lines]
> Happy hugs!
> G

That's wonderful & I so hope Don feels like going, even if only for a
little while.  That's great news.

Maybe the lollipops act faster than the different things Socks took for
breakthrough.  I don't know why he did't do the lollipops.  I had heard
of them but the idea never came up.  Maybe not included on our
'formulary.'

Funny day today.  Last night I adopted a 10 month old kitten to be a
playmate for my 15 year old cat, Isaac, who has been very lonely.  Kitten
got loose in the house last night & I couldn't find him..So we stayed
home today b/c Isaac had no clue the kitten was even here.  There was no
good way to isolate, not knowing where the kitten was.  A loud hissing
around noon lead to the discovery (Isaac found)!  This kitten has found
some clever hiding places.  Now in utility room - not in the nice bed I
made him but behind washer/dryer. Hope he gets brave soon.  His cage name
was Mr. Tips.  I started out with Sylvester but am now thinking
Barthalamew (sing it).  He's b/w.  

Fig
Giuditta - 24 Mar 2007 14:14 GMT
>>>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 74 lines]
>
> Fig

A cat or puppy gives a certain warmth to a home doesn't it? I have had cats,
but none of them ever came to me if I called them by any name other than
"Kitty," like in "Here, kitty kitty." Why is that?

How's Issac getting along with Barthalamew? We had a b/w cat named Jack, but
our neighbors stole him. We were in the process of moving, and when we went
back to get Jack, he was in the neighbor's yard.

I took Jack, and we left. A few minutes later, this redneck dude was
speeding up behind us in his big red truck and motioned us off the road. He
comes to the car window and asks me what I am doing, stealing his
granddaughter's cat and that she was in tears and that he wanted that cat
back.

We loved Jack, and I said, "No, this is our cat." Then he started
threatening to call the cops, Bud Light breath fogged my window as I was
rolling it up, and he became a bit crazy, and Cheyenne is frantically
saying,"Give him the cat, Mom, give him the cat." I looked at Cheyenne,
wondering how he could just give his cat away ...

I saw how scared he was and rolled the window back down and handed the fool
our cat and told him they better take care of him because I'd be back to
check and to tell his granddaughter to stop crying ...

Then I cried all the way home while Cheyenne sat in his own thoughts...he
loved Jack, too, but his fear of his mom going to jail overpowered that.

Now, four years later, Cheyenne says it wasn't Jack, but it was. Please, if
you ever move, take your kittens on the first trip with the furniture.

I love their purring. Have fun with new kitty.

Giuditta
Figgertoes - 24 Mar 2007 05:37 GMT
>>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 53 lines]
> Happy hugs!
> G

That's wonderful & I so hope Don feels like going, even if only for a
little while.  That's great news.

Maybe the lollipops act faster than the different things Socks took for
breakthrough.  I don't know why he did't do the lollipops.  I had heard
of them but the idea never came up.  Maybe not included on our
'formulary.'

Funny day today.  Last night I adopted a 10 month old kitten to be a
playmate for my 15 year old cat, Isaac, who has been very lonely.  Kitten
got loose in the house last night & I couldn't find him..So we stayed
home today b/c Isaac had no clue the kitten was even here.  There was no
good way to isolate, not knowing where the kitten was.  A loud hissing
around noon lead to the discovery (Isaac found)!  This kitten has found
some clever hiding places.  Now in utility room - not in the nice bed I
made him but behind washer/dryer. Hope he gets brave soon.  His cage name
was Mr. Tips.  I started out with Sylvester but am now thinking
Barthalamew (sing it).  He's b/w.  

Fig
Giuditta - 25 Mar 2007 14:16 GMT
>>>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 74 lines]
>
> Fig

Hi Fig!

How is the kitten today? Is he still hiding? Good news ... Don went out to
the gig last nght! Other than going to our son's to watch a basketball game
a couple of times, this was his first outing since November except for trips
to the dr.

He seemed fine when he got in and said he had a good time. I asked him if he
sat in with the band, and he said he wasn't up to that yet. I told him he
would be.

He has been coughing again, which happens after a few weeks off chemo. The
dr. always listens to his chest and says it sounds good yet he has this
cough (it seemed less a couple of days ago). It makes me scared that the
tumor has started growing again...I know I'm analyzing again, but I just
can't help it.

He has another scan tomorrow. It won't be as accurate without the dye, but
won't it show if the last three rounds of chemo continued improving his
condition like the first three did?

Giuditta
Figgertoes - 25 Mar 2007 15:09 GMT
>>>>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 100 lines]
>
> Giuditta

Hee hee - kitty Bartholomew is doing his first exploratory round in one
small part of the house. Isaac sometimes watches, sometimes ignores.  
Barth is feeling comfortable with me. We'll see if that holds b/c I just
started laundry in his safe haven.  He doesn't like the noise, but I have
to wash clothes.

I am SO glad Don got out & enjoyed himself.  I hope this happens more &
more.  And I hope the scan gives good results.  Sometimes they come out
better than others it seems.

Have a great rest of w/e.

Fig
Giuditta - 27 Mar 2007 14:09 GMT
>>>>>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 114 lines]
>
> Fig

I'm glad he got out, too. The guitar player called me the next day and said,
"Thanks for letting Don caome out to play." He's a nut. I told him to keep
taking him because he needs it and loved being there. Buddy (guitar player)
was joking around with me, but I did wonder if he meant play as in an
instrument or play as in being a child whose mom finally let him out.

Buddy said they had a blast backstage, foiund some wigs and all put them on,
Don had a blonde one with a bun...he's supposed to send me pictures if he
ever figures out how to make his digital work with his computer...funny how
they can be so talented in some areas and so not-having-a-clue in others.

What happened with Barth after the clothes started spinning? Our Jack hid
behind the tv for three days when we got him. Then after he trusted us, he
would sleep on my keyboard, and if I was writing in bed on regular paper, he
would jump up and sit right on the tablet...that was hilarious. And he loved
getting inside paper sacks. Gosh, I miss Jack.

You have a great week, too.

G/J
J - 26 Mar 2007 09:19 GMT
> He seemed fine when he got in and said he had a good time. I asked him if he
> sat in with the band, and he said he wasn't up to that yet. I told him he
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> won't it show if the last three rounds of chemo continued improving his
> condition like the first three

It's hard to know what the onc will say this time, G.
Be there, if you have questions. Write the answers down.
Good luck.
J - thinking of you all
Giuditta - 27 Mar 2007 14:16 GMT
>> He seemed fine when he got in and said he had a good time. I asked him if
>> he
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
> Good luck.
> J - thinking of you all

Well, I figure he'll either say that the cancer has responded well to chemo,
and that it (again) is "significantly improved" so let's try more chemo and
see if it cures you or kills you or either he'll say, "You know that
two-year offer at the gym with the discount, forgetaboutit."

Today will be the second watershed event of our lives, and I'm only ready
for good news.

We need a miracle here,
G
starfleet - 24 Mar 2007 08:25 GMT
Giuditta schreef:

> He just told me that his pain is ten times less than it was...yipppeee!!!
>
> Happy hugs!
> G
>
>  
That is very good news Guiditta. When he's not in so much pain anymore
he will probably enjoy life a whole lot more an able to do fun things.
When you're in pain the world is very, very small.

Anne
Giuditta - 24 Mar 2007 14:16 GMT
> Giuditta schreef:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Anne

So so true, and the world looks a lot different when the mind isn't a fog of
morphine I'm sure. I'm excited!!!

G
Caz - 24 Mar 2007 09:55 GMT
>>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>> I don't think he could tolerate the pain without the meds. Would
[quoted text clipped - 49 lines]
> Happy hugs!
> G

Hi G.

I am so happy for all of you. I truly hope things keep moving in this
same direction. I hope Don has a wonderful time at the concert and also
you if you go too :-) Hang in there!

Best wishes and ((hugs))

Caz.
Scott's mom
Giuditta - 24 Mar 2007 14:22 GMT
>>>>> Giuditta schreef:
>>>>>> I don't think he could tolerate the pain without the meds. Would
[quoted text clipped - 62 lines]
> Caz.
> Scott's mom

Caz, I pray he feels like going. I'm not because I think he needs a night
out with his friends. He's not one of those have-a-night-out-with-the-boys
type guys becuase I guess the gigs take the place of that, but he hasn't
been out amongst his music friends since November ... It's time.

I will stay home and celebrate him feeling so much better by making my
lesson plans for next week ... LOL. Teachers' work is never done. It's just
such a relief. I feel like the cloud is lifting.

Today, I am not going to worry ... I'll do that tomorrow.

Hugs to you,

Giuditta
Figgertoes - 22 Mar 2007 05:08 GMT
> I don't think he could tolerate the pain without the meds. Would
> constipation cause one to hurt this much?
>
> Giuditta

Trying to cut down on pain meds to alleviate constipation would be a very
bad idea.

You read Penny's blog.  The constipation caused middle of the night trips
to the hospital & the problem dominates many of her posts.  Socks had
severe problems too.  For some reason, that stopped up the commodes,
although that was the least of it.

Fig
starfleet - 22 Mar 2007 10:56 GMT
Figgertoes schreef:
>>    
> Trying to cut down on pain meds to alleviate constipation would be a very
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
>  
For Guiditta,

Things that may help are: exercise, walking even if it's for short
periods during the day, eating enough fibers (fruit and vegetables),
drink a lot of fluid (water) take the laxatives and if that doesn't help
enough ask the doctor for an enema once in a while. Like Fig said it is
a very common problem and alas doctors forget to fill in a recipe for
laxatives together with the morphine and don't give some rules to live
by  that help with constipation..

Anne
islavision2004@yahoo.com - 22 Mar 2007 11:37 GMT
> Figgertoes schreef:
>
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>
> Anne

A home remedy which helps a lot with constipation is -

1 tablespoon of extra virgin olive oil,
the juice of one lemon,
a clove of crushed garlic.
Shake them together in a jar and drink.  Drinking this everyday and
drinking at least 2 litres of water and/or juice a day keeps thing
moving in an easy way.  If you really hate garlic leave it out.  Until
one gets used to it, it tastes strange as a drink, using a juice
chaser helps it to go down.

Constipation can cause terrible stomach and abdominal pains.

isi
Figgertoes - 22 Mar 2007 13:43 GMT
>> Figgertoes schreef:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 34 lines]
>
> isi

Ground flax seed also works miracles & could be added to this cocktail.  
I put a tablespoon or 2 in a spice/coffee grinder.  Socks preferred it in
warm cranberry juice or apple cider.  You need to grind it just before
using for best nutritional benefit.  Flax seed is in the bulk cannisters
at our natural food stores. You really need to grind it.

Somewhere I have a book with lots of recipes for bars containing the
ground flax seed.  Some are like rice krispy treats & others are fruit
bars using dried fruit.  Flax also eases menopausal symptoms, but the
laxative effect is strong & made it difficult for me to eat.

Fig
Giuditta - 22 Mar 2007 23:09 GMT
>>> Figgertoes schreef:
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 47 lines]
>
> Fig

Flax seed? I don't even know what that is but will look for some. Now to go
make my brew for him...

We'll see what he does...

Ooops...more news.

I actually just got in from school when I beamed myself online, and Don was,
where else, in the bathroom. He just came out, and I told him about the brew
I was going to make him, and he told me that he was much better from what
the dr. gave him yesterday. He said his stomach isn't even hurting as bad.
Yay!

Here's what he's taking...a stool softener once a day, a powder that he
dissolves in 8 oz. of water that is called polyeth Glyc or something like
that ... the name is half covered by a label that says "Dissolve in water
before taking," duh. What else would he do with it?

And a capsule he takes once a day, omeprazole, 20 mg. Don said this was
supposed to take a few days to affect him but that it's working like a charm
already.

I've been telling him about you all, and he told me to be sure and let you
know what he's taking in case anyone else is having the same problem.

His band called a couple of weeks ago and asked if he could be ready to play
a concert in two weeks...Don told them he didn't know yet...then they called
again today and asked him if he could play Sat. night's gig, and he said he
could mentally but not physically yet.

They understand and are using Jerry Lee's drummer until Don feels like
playing, but I could see he looked so disappointed that he wasn't ready yet.
He's put so much into this band, and they just got a bus and are ready to
rock and roll, on their own instead of behind some big star, and it just
irks me that he worked toward this all his life, and now he can't do it.

I never in our married life thought I would see the day that he didn't feel
like playing. I've seen him play with a broken ankle and once in a concert
when he had a bad stomach virus and they put a bucket by his drums...you can
imagine the rest...it was upchucking city...but he never missed a beat.

No one could notice him throwing up because it was up on a high stage with
the drum throne behind everyone else...

I'm just sad for him....I know I am sounding depressing but why even have
goals...what does it all matter in the scheme of things...Don's such a good
man, a good dad and husband with a gentle spirit...I want to see him happy
in his niche again...what if it never happens? I was listening to the radio
on the way home from school one day and I always notice the drums and can
envision his smiling face, so happy and into it. I thought ... if I lose
him, I don't think I would ever be able to listen to music again...it would
hurt too bad.

But if he does make a snappy come-back and gets back out there, if you like
country music, you'll have back stage passes for sure...you deserve that for
listening to my constant whining, blubbering, moaning and groaning...

I told him what you all have said about starting to take walks, and he said
now that the weather is warmig up that he thinks he can do that and just
play drums a little at a time...not jump back into it full force...he will
have to build himself up for that as he feels stronger. He believes that he
will do that ... I pray he will, too.

It's like baby steps ... the stomach is better so who knows. I have to
believe.

Please believe with me.

Giuditta
Giuditta - 22 Mar 2007 22:25 GMT
>> Figgertoes schreef:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
>
> isi

For real? I will mix him up some and see if he'll drink it. I think he would
drink Draino if it would help his stomach right now. He keeps saying that
he's going to walk a bit but just isn't up for it yet.

He goes from bathroom to living room and sometimes to the kitchen and to the
doctor...that's it.

So ...

Now what?

G
Giuditta - 22 Mar 2007 22:21 GMT
> Figgertoes schreef:
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>
> Anne

I don't know if you read my posts where I said the dr. told Don not to eat
salads, fresh fruit, etc...but he was doing better with the bathroom prolem
after I finally g