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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Cancer / April 2004Mouth ulcers
I know I saw a post with a link in it recently, but can I find it? Perhaps someone could repost the link if it's relevant to the following: A friend of mine has confided that she has cervical cancer which seems to be spreading to the bowel and she has been noticing rectal bleeding lately just to add to the fun. For some reason (her age, I think; she's in her early 30s) her consultant is reluctant to give her a hysterectomy, despite the fact that she already has three children and her husband has had a vasectomy. Maybe it's because she would need some sort of HRT if 'they' operated? She has a specialist cancer nurse at her house twice a day to give her an injection of some sort - I know not what. Anyway, today my friend mentioned that she has a mouth and tongue full of ulcers, which are spreading down into her throat. These seem to be linked to her treatment. This morning she was wanting to rip her own tongue out just to get rid of the discomfort. Ugh. I can suggest all sorts of things for the mouth, but the throat? That's outside my experience entirely and since the stuff I use in my mouth - and very good it is too - has to be painted on, somehow I don't think the throat is the ideal location for it. Any ideas folks? > I know I saw a post with a link in it recently, but can I find it? > Perhaps someone could repost the link if it's relevant to the > following: http://www.cancer.org/docroot/MBC/content/MBC_2_3x_Mouth_Sores.asp > A friend of mine has confided that she has cervical cancer which > seems to be spreading to the bowel and she has been noticing rectal [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > don't think the throat is the ideal location for it. Any ideas > folks? From the Google archives Here's what Steph posted before: (2 different Posts) The ulcers can be a direct effect of the chemo on the mucous membrane, a sign of a low white count, or a local infection like candida. He really needs to show his oncologist Radiation: The soreness tends to be "lower down" than a sore throat, more like heartburn. Most patients do not find it too troublesome, and it last only a few days. I usually give my patients something simple like viscous xylocaine or one of the proprietary heartburn medicines. Amifostine is available in the UK, and has some role in radiotherapy, but it is a) very expensive and b) probably no better than simpler medicines for the temporary oesophagitis. http://tinyurl.com/3x73h Mike (posts) Mouth sores are a common (almost inevitable) side effect of chemo. Good oral hygiene is very important which means a mouthwash after every meal to get rid of food debris which could encourage infection. A dose of antacid like mylanta or mucaine swilled around the mouth will soothe and protect the tissues while he eats and for really sore mouth xylocaine gel, a local anaesthetic, will help. Obviously he should be taking only very soft foods until the mouth heals. If he gets an infection (thrush is common, look for white spots in the mouth and throat) nystatin drops taken four times daily will clear it up quite quickly. Steph is right about getting the oncologist to have a look at it. He may need special treatment or changes in his chemo regimen. One of the most effective ways to reduce mouth problems from chemo is to use ice during the treatment. Once you have the ulcers or sore mouth it is important to keep the mouth clean by rinsing four times a day and after eating, with warm water (adding some salt can be soothing). Be on the alert for signs of thrush infection (quite common). While these problems are a nuisance they are fairly short lived after the chemo is finished but what usually happens is you just get back to something like normal and the next lot of chemo is due, which can be a bit demoralising. If loss of appetite is a major problem your doctor might prescribe a steroid such as prednisolone or dexamethasone. This does have it's drawbacks but can work well in the short term. FWIW J NickName@example.com said... > If loss of appetite is a major problem your doctor might prescribe a > steroid such as prednisolone or dexamethasone. This does have it's > drawbacks but can work well in the short term. > > FWIW > J Thanks J, I'll pass that on. > A friend of mine has confided that she has cervical cancer which > seems to be spreading to the bowel and she has been noticing rectal [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > specialist cancer nurse at her house twice a day to give her an > injection of some sort - I know not what. Hi Emily, I'm sorry to hear about your friend. You are correct - they mention hysterectomy for cervical cancer. I can't see them denying her the surgery unless she's pregnant, not in good enough shape to survive the surgery or they want to try to shrink the cancer first OR (which seems to fit your description above). If she's Stage IV, they may have decided to try palliative chemotherapy. http://www.nci.nih.gov/cancerinfo/pdq/treatment/cervical/patient/ In stage IV, cancer has spread to the bladder, rectum, or other parts of the body. Stage IV is divided into stages IVA and IVB, based on where the cancer is found. Stage IVA: Cancer has spread to the bladder or rectal wall and may have spread to lymph nodes in the pelvis. Stage IVB: Cancer has spread beyond the pelvis and pelvic lymph nodes to other places in the body, such as the abdomen, liver, intestinal tract, or lungs. [] If she is taking chemo, she may decide to stop if the side effects are not controllable. If that is a McMillan nurse, that is a different story. You may want to try and find out more (by talking to the nurse as she arrives or leaves) so that you might know how to best help your friend or when professional help might be wise. You know the "get your affairs in order yada, yada, yada" spiel. Right? Hugs Emily, J NickName@example.com said... > She has a > > specialist cancer nurse at her house twice a day to give her an [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > good enough shape to survive the surgery or they want to try to shrink > the cancer first She's definitely not pregnant, and she's in reasonably good shape I'd have thought. She's been begging them to operate but for some reason 'they' won't. Or at least not yet. > OR (which seems to fit your description above). > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > not controllable. > If that is a McMillan nurse, that is a different story. It is a Macmillan nurse. Is the injection likely to be chemo? I forgot to ask her and I didn't want to seem too intrusive as my friend (N) was upset as she was telling me what was going on. > You may want to try and find out more (by talking to the nurse as she > arrives or leaves) so that you might know how to best help your friend > or when professional help might be wise. You know the "get your affairs > in order yada, yada, yada" spiel. Right? I gather she's been told that it's not likely to be fatal at the moment (helpful!), and she's not confined to the house or anything like that. She's in a certain amount of pain/discomfort, but still holds down a part time job and is often seen helping out at her younger children's school. Mind, part of that is that if she 'just lays down and lets it take over, it will'. It's almost as if she dare not rest for a moment, 'just in case'. Sometimes life just sucks, don't it. > She's definitely not pregnant, and she's in reasonably good shape > I'd have thought. She's been begging them to operate but for some [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Sometimes life just sucks, don't it. ( ( ( ( Emily ) ) ) ) I"m guessing that she's had some chemo and is getting http://www.cancernet.co.uk/neupogen.htm (or something similar) Maybe waiting for followup scans? This is all conjecture, since the first thing to know is type of cancer and where it has spread. It's good the Macmillan nursing system is involved. Hugs Emily, J > She's been begging them to operate but for some > reason 'they' won't. Or at least not yet. Hi Emily, I was thinking if it's rectal, some people don't like talking about. Maybe her husband would fill you in? I saw a guy on the prostate newsgroup who (seems to) have had both prostate removal and rectal surgery at the same time. (which is more doable because they're both in the same area of the body). Then temporary ileostomy. Rectal surgeries vary. Some are temporary and some close the rectum permanently (is my non-doctor understanding of reading). A hysterectomy and rectal would be difficult to do both at the same time (I would think). Perhaps she's not well enough yet (from the chemo)? Or there's scheduling problems? A lot depends on the details. Just thoughts J PooperScooper@invalid.nul said... > Hi Emily, > I was thinking if it's rectal, some people don't like talking about. > Maybe her husband would fill you in? I don't think it's that so much as she's battling more with the doctors than with the cancer. As for her husband - I doubt very much that he knows that I know. She seems determined to battle this through on her own or at least with a very small group of people, none of whom - or not many of whom - know who the others are. Her children are a boy in his teens and two young girls, one 7 the other 4. I have no idea how it's managed, what with the nurse coming to the house twice a day, but none of them know yet and N doesn't want them to. It's hard to help someone who seems determined not to be helped, and yet it's obvious to me that N's in a lot of discomfort most days and is scared stiff. She needs support but seems scared that if she accepts it it'll be the beginning of the end. Does this ring true with anyone else? > PooperScooper@invalid.nul said... > > Hi Emily, > > I was thinking if it's rectal, some people don't like talking about. > > Maybe her husband would fill you in? <snip> > She seems determined to battle this through on her own or at least >with a very small group of people, none of whom - or not many of >whom - know who the others are. >Does this ring true with anyone else? Yes, this rings very true to me! After my husband's diagnosis with Fibrolamellar, and doing a lot of research, and of course any book I could get my hand on, I read that when faced with a chronic illness, it is best not to tell too many people as this directs a lot of negative energy to yourself and your health. People are always asking how you are doing and one would wonder if this is real concern or they want to pity you. The next thing is they are offering all sorts of unwanted advice and you end up hearing all sorts of cancer stories whether it be them, their relatives, or friends of friends. Really if you think about it, is it really necessary to hear all of this?? Sometimes I don't think people think about what comes out of their mouths at times. I know they mean well, but sometimes it can be hurtful. My husband and I decided to try this out! Because I am in BC and he is getting treatment in AB, we decided or I mean (his mom decided) that she had to tell everyone from the church (by calling the paster and his wife). Within the hour, everyone knew. My husband had just found out himself only an hour earlier and he didn't even have time to "digest" it himself. The next thing you know, 3 weeks later, these same people saw that he was turning yellow, had lost weight and everyone kept telling him this...which he had not. I knew this because his bilirubin was in perfect ranges so I knew he wasn't turning yellow, and he hadn't lost any weight as we had to buy him larger pants for an event we were going to. Then I started questioning this myself, and it freaked me out! Was I not seeing this myself? I was sitting right next to him?! However, no one in BC knew! No one treated him any different. No one had said he was turning yellow or lost weight. Everyone treated him the same, not knowing otherwise he had a tumor 11cm x 12cm X 13cm. That was the test for us and we found out for ourselves how true it was. This is not for everyone! This is only what we decided to do. I only told people that I felt comfortable with telling. Not one person I told, knew the other. For us it worked out great. We come from a small town in BC - POP -3500. So you can imagine why we did it....and so far it has worked for us for us. It will be a year in May since the diagnosis, and no one in our small community or in BC knows. Are we in denial? Definately not. Would I do it again? In a heartbeat! Jenny jenny@nospam.com said... > We come from a small town in BC - POP -3500. So > you can imagine why we did it....and so far it has worked for us for us. It > will > be a year in May since the diagnosis, and no one in our small community or > in BC knows. It's the same here - a bit like living in a goldfish bowl! When I lived in and around London I barely knew the people in the same house, let alone next door or up the road (I was in a bedsit); here, just about everyone knows everyone else's business more or less before they do themselves! At times it's downright scary. > Are we in denial? Definitely not. Would I do it again? In a heartbeat! That's good to hear. Actually, much the same thing happened to my aunt, who was always known by her middle name (Mabel) ever since she was a child. The doctors and hospitals knew her by her first name (Florence) and so 'Florence' had cancer and had all the treatments. Mabel, however, kept her illness to herself and carried on as usual. It came as a great shock to a lot of her friends when she died, because so few people had realised what was going on. Even fellow Church members on the 'hospital visiting' rota who saw the surname failed to make the connection with an unknown first name - which was exactly what auntie Mabel had wanted. > Yes, this rings very true to me! After my husband's diagnosis with > Fibrolamellar, and doing a lot of research, and of course any book I [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > > Jenny Hi Jenny, I meant to ask you since you posted "is" (as opposed to was) getting treatments" Is Rudy still getting chemo-embolization ? How's he doing? Hugs J PS Likely his mother needed support too, after all it's her son. > > Yes, this rings very true to me! After my husband's diagnosis with > > Fibrolamellar, and doing a lot of research, and of course any book I [quoted text clipped - 52 lines] > J > PS Likely his mother needed support too, after all it's her son. Dear J, Rudy had only had 4 rounds of chemo-embolization. The surgeon decided at that point that there may be an opportunity of surgery which he was told would give him a "better quality of life". The surgery was scheduled on Jan 26, 04. The tumor measuring 11cm x 12cm x 13cm was not removed apparently due to the size of it. I have not yet witnessed the "quality of life" the surgeon was referring to. Before the surgery, Rudy had a great quality of life! He was in the hospital at the U of A in AB for 11 weeks! He was only discharged yesterday! First he got an infection that lasted 3 weeks, then a week and a half later, he got an abscess on his liver with a yeast infection......this is finally clearing up! His INR is totally off, and we just found out today that it could be caused by taking coumadin with his other medications which a "pharmacist" pointed out to him. I am surprised that these hospital staffers don't read the contraindications on certain medications. He is taking coumadin, flagyl, tylenol 3, pantaloc, cipro, voltarin. Apparently if you are on warfarin (coumadin) 2 of these other drugs shouldn't be taken??? He went to his mother's place yesterday with a wound vac and a drain. He's is not impressed with either. He didn't go in with one so he shouldn't go home with one...that's his attitude. At least the wound vac is doing a great job at healing the wound. The surgeon did some debriding last week, and apparently pulled out a bunch of toxic foul smelling black"dead tumor". Any of you medical experts out there hear of this??? I thought he meant "dead tissue"...so I asked the surgeon again and he confirmed he said "dead tumor". Is this safe for an "encapsulated tumor"??? or is the tumor now not encapsulated? What do you think? The surgeon said this is what he wanted - dead tumor. This was apparently a good thing, although we have been questioning it ever since. Since he got out of the hospital yesterday and this happened a few times in the hospital, he has been getting the chills. He can't seem to warm up. This morning we had the heat cranked to 25C and he was freezing while his mother and I were dripping in sweat. We also had extra blankets, a hot water bottle, and thick socks on him to get him warm. My mom had mentioned that after her major surgery, when she came to stay with us during her recovery, she would get chilly too, this ended up in the result of low potassium. After taking the potassium the doc had prescribed for her, she was fine! Does this make sense? His mom was not that depressed or negative this time around. I didn't have to try to cheer her up and hold myself up at the same time. When I wasn't with Rudy, I was with her, and we actually had "fun"... <Alayne, did you hear that?> :) we went to the gym every morning at 6am to work out. She has a life time membership at a local health spa! I figured out that what his mom really needs is a "buddy". Someone to keep her occupied during all of this. She has tons of friends that she talks on the phone to daily, but it's all general chit chat. She needs someone to actually do things with, go places with....to keep her occupied. I just flew back home here to BC today after having time off to see him. He is still in AB which he will be until the end of June I would imagine. Drs visits etc etc, close to the U of A hospital as well in case there are any complications. Thanks for asking! Hugs! Jenny > Dear J, > Rudy had only had 4 rounds of chemo-embolization. The surgeon decided at that [quoted text clipped - 77 lines] > Hugs! > Jenny Hi Jenny, You're "writing the book" here about chemo-embolization. I do not recall anyone else having it OR posting here about it. I would think that, at least, part of that "toxic foul smelling black" is the yeast infection for which I think the flagyl is for, the rest is dead tissue (tumour or other). Only the surgeon can tell you whether he got all the tumour out . Debridement and abscesses are mentioned here http://theoncologist.alphamedpress.org/cgi/content/full/6/1/24 The chills may be because of infection(s)/fever for which he's taking two antibiotics, one for the yeast and one for bacterial. Chills can also be a sign of poor blood circulation/thinning. But he needs the coumadin (is my understanding) to prevent clots from forming elsewhere in his body. If his blood is too thin, it might be seen by low blood pressure. If his blood pressure is low, then make him a "blanket tent" on his bed to help him keep his body heat in. If his blood pressure is low and he has an infection(s), I don't know what to do unless stopping the Tylenol improves that because usually one would want "cooling" for fevers. ie warming him up could be making things worse, so someone should be taking his temperature daily, I would think and go by that? Tylenol 3 is a) not good for the liver longterm? and b) contains acetaminophen and has a warning about aspirin containing medications. Aspirin thins the blood, coumadin thins the blood. So presumably acetaminophen thins the blood http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/druginfo/uspdi/202392.html So I'd be asking why he's taking that one vs a different type of pain medication. There's pain patches. I know Mike might mention morphine but you might have difficulty getting that. Diclofenac/Voltaren is potassium and can cause gastrointestinal problems for which he's taking the pantaloc (I assume). http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/diclofen_ad.htm It does mention "gastro bleeds without ulcers" My Pantoloc drugstore printout says nothing about bleeds or blood-thinning. As to which other medication that might be affecting his INR, you/he would have look each up, or ask the drugstore or his doctor. AND/OR I don't see,at the moment, how he can stop any of the others until maybe his potassium levels are okay at which time he could stop the potassium and the pantoloc? I'm glad you had time to have fun with her mother. Likely she needs to be with someone who understands her concerns and can help take her mind off them. thanks for the update, keep in touch, Hope things start to go better soon. None of the above is advice because I'm not an expert. J > > Dear J, > > Rudy had only had 4 rounds of chemo-embolization. The surgeon decided at that [quoted text clipped - 77 lines] > > Hugs! > > Jenny Jenny, Sorry, only just picked this up (had a bit of a clear out of older e-mails). It doesn't sound like you and Rudy have had much of a time of it of late, but hopefully the worst is over now, sometimes things have to get a little worse before they get better. Excuse me "had fun with mother-in-law", pick me up of the floor if you please! Perhaps I should try going to the gym with mine, second thoughts, better not, I might want to drop weights on her..... (and I'm not talking dumb-bells either!) Hope all gets better for you soon honey. Alayne >Jenny, > Sorry, only just picked this up (had a bit of a clear out of older e-mails). > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Alayne Alayne - You are too funny!!!!...I laughed so hard...thanks for that little bit of inside humor to cheer a gal up! Jenny > Alayne - > You are too funny!!!!...I laughed so hard...thanks for that little bit of > inside humor > to cheer a gal up! > Jenny You're welcome hon - what's life without a little sprinkled laughter (I don't have wrinkles thems is laughter lines!) A. > > Dear J, > > Rudy had only had 4 rounds of chemo-embolization. The surgeon decided at that [quoted text clipped - 125 lines] > None of the above is advice because I'm not an expert. > J J, Thanks for all of that! I have passed on the information to Rudy. In the hospital, Rudy was on a pain killer called Percaset when they weaned him off of the morphine. Apparently his sugeon couldnt'/wouldn't prescribe this painkiller for him while out of the hospital. Yesterday was Rudy's 1st wound vac - wound change at home. He said the Tylenol 3 didn't even touch the pain. He is not looking forward to Friday when he gets the next wound change. Thanks again for all the great information/advice, I will keep everyone posted when I have something new to report. Jenny > Thanks for all of that! I have passed on the information to Rudy. > In the hospital, Rudy was on a pain killer called Percaset when they [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > when I have something new to report. > Jenny Hi Jenny, well some pain can be expected, but I don't think that's right. He'll end up traumatized and tensing up and/or not wanting them to come at all. On the other hand, I don't like the idea of adding another oral medication to his mix. (for a number of reasons, including that he's not in hospital to be monitored, if there's side effects etc). Who's doing the dressing change? A nurse? Some of these mention topical pain medications, and/or premedication 60 minutes before the procedure. They may or may not be specific about short-acting injectibles whether in/near the wound ??? vs systemic injectibles. http://tinyurl.com/28c4f BC Cancer Agency - mentions "dry" IIRC, also mentions allergy to tape, which some people have more problems with than others. http://www.usask.ca/cme/articles/managementofpain.shtml - I think it was this one that has the "Who" criteria for treating pain.. This one is very interesting and has quite a bit of detail about which approach (wet or dry, for instance) is better in individual situations. Also mentions premedication http://www.nursingcenter.com/library/JournalArticle.asp?Article_ID=280700 Of course, if there's premedication, then one has to pay someone to come by and inject and wait, or come back. You know his situation better than I, so I wonder if you can make some notes from the above as to questions he can ask of the nurse OR agency. The other question would be of technique. If you're paying, seems to me he has the right to call the Agency and say " I'd like someone who's perhaps more experienced in changing dressing because I'm having way too much pain" OR can we talk about how the dressing's being changed, in case it can or should be done a different way, so there's less pain. I took the above from a larger Google search http://tinyurl.com/2h8gu I'm not sure that Rudy is well enough to wade through and pick out the better ones, maybe you'd have time? So as usual, this is all FWIW and I suppose any change in dressing type needs clearance from his surgeon/doctors. I hope this can be sorted out so there's an improvement in his quality of life. Tell him I care and hope he'll be feeling better soon so he can go back home to you. :-)) PS Would experts on the West Coast (BC) in wound care rather not be involved ? Hugs J - usual disclaimer > Dash wrote: > > > Thanks for all of that! I have passed on the information to Rudy. > > In the hospital, Rudy was on a pain killer called Percaset when they > > weaned him off of the morphine. Apparently his sugeon couldnt'/wouldn't > > prescribe this painkiller for him while out of the hospital. > > Yesterday was Rudy's 1st wound vac - wound change at home. He said > > the Tylenol 3 didn't even touch the pain. He is not looking forward to > > Friday when he gets the next wound change. > > Thanks again for all the great information/advice, I will keep everyone posted > > > > when I have something new to report. > > Jenny > > Hi Jenny, well some pain can be expected, but I don't think that's right. > He'll end up traumatized and tensing up and/or not wanting them to come at all. > On the other hand, I don't like the idea of adding another oral medication to > his mix. (for a number of reasons, including that he's not in hospital to be > monitored, if there's side effects etc). > Who's doing the dressing change? A nurse? > > Some of these mention topical pain medications, and/or premedication 60 minutes > before the procedure. > They may or may not be specific about short-acting injectibles whether in/near > the wound ??? vs systemic injectibles. > > http://tinyurl.com/28c4f BC Cancer Agency - mentions "dry" IIRC, also mentions > allergy to tape, which some people have more problems with than others. > > http://www.usask.ca/cme/articles/managementofpain.shtml - I think it was this > one that has the "Who" criteria for treating pain.. > > This one is very interesting and has quite a bit of detail about which approach > (wet or dry, for instance) is better in individual situations. > Also mentions premedication > http://www.nursingcenter.com/library/JournalArticle.asp?Article_ID=280700 > > Of course, if there's premedication, then one has to pay someone to come by and > inject and wait, or come back. > > You know his situation better than I, so I wonder if you can make some notes > from the above as to questions he can ask of the nurse OR agency. The other > question would be of technique. If you're paying, seems to me he has the right > to call the Agency and say " I'd like someone who's perhaps more experienced in > changing dressing because I'm having way too much pain" OR can we talk about how > the dressing's being changed, in case it can or should be done a different way, > so there's less pain. > > I took the above from a larger Google search http://tinyurl.com/2h8gu > I'm not sure that Rudy is well enough to wade through and pick out the better > ones, maybe you'd have time? > > So as usual, this is all FWIW and I suppose any change in dressing type needs > clearance from his surgeon/doctors. > I hope this can be sorted out so there's an improvement in his quality of life. > > Tell him I care and hope he'll be feeling better soon so he can go back home to > you. :-)) > > PS Would experts on the West Coast (BC) in wound care rather not be involved ? > Hugs > J - usual disclaimer > Ohhhhh J, I haven't gotten back right away as I have been busy with work and research on the internet and I am so tired! I have no idea why Rudy is going through all of this. His biggest problem now is the fever, sweats and chills. I have been looking everything up on this on how to make it more comfortable for him. I told him to record his temperatures daily so he can at least figure out a pattern. This is unfortunately too much for him to record right now. I have been reading the that the fevers could be caused by infection, liver abscess, tumor or allergic reactions to drugs. His coumadin advice is way out of whack! He's been on it long enough to know by now how to regulate it himself, but the doctors keep telling him otherwise. We both think this is why the wound is not healing properly in a timely fashion - the blood is too thin! He has noticed one thing, however, when he takes lower amounts of coumadin, the canister for the wound vac, pumps in a yellow fluid. When he takes more coumadin as requested by his doctor, more red fluid/blood is pumped into the canister. He is on an "old-fashioned" wound vac, that doesn't work near as good as the other from the hospital. Every time he would like to disconnect himself from it for awhile, he needs to reset this one and bending down, because of the wound, is not very comfortable for him. It is great to have home support, but the nurse that comes is apparently such a tyrant - from the old school of hard knocks - tough love - whatever! She doesn't know much about the vac and would like to see him administer some freezing to the wound himself by injection? Does this sound right? It is so difficult being so far away from him. I am planning on another trip there by the end of April for 3 weeks so I can be hands on! I have been talking to him and researching the internet at the same time! Thank goodness for the internet! Thanks for all your help and advice and i-n-f-o-r-m-a-t-i-o-n - it is all very much appreciated! Jenny > Ohhhhh J, > I haven't gotten back right away as I have been busy with work and [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > he can > at least figure out a pattern. Jenny, our body temperatures vary at different times of the day. If I previously suggested that he monitor his temperature and watch for patterns, I meant "from day to day, at the same time each day" (not multiple times during the same day) meaning if the trend starts increasing to get him back to the doctor or hospital. If he's not able to take and record his temperature once a day, sounds to me like he needs help there. > This is unfortunately too much for him to record right now. > I have been reading the that the fevers could be caused by infection,liver > abscess, > tumor or allergic reactions to drugs. I don't know Jenny. The doctors are supposed to tell Rudy and you why this is happening. > His coumadin advice is way out of whack! He's been on it long enough to know > by [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > very much appreciated! > Jenny Jeeny, I'm worried that he still may have infection especially after just reading this http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000666.htm "The infection is often confirmed by a positive blood culture, though blood cultures may be negative in individuals who have been receiving antibiotics. " and the signs and symptoms there are exactly what happened to me, but "thank G" I got to a different doctor and was put on a different antibiotic. (see below) AND I have to wonder if this VAC-ing is actually closing the wound up into his body, as opposed to it being supposed to be drained out while the antibiotics continue to help him fight infection (if applicable). I don't know what the yellow is, it could be bile. On the other hand, when I had a serious infection, the last stuff draining out was yellow and I thought that was a sign of healing (or something I'd been eating), and less than a month later the infection "ramped up" severely. I was very ill and could barely see, so I can see how Rudy cannot cope with taking his temperature and if the nurse isn't taking care of that and he doesn't have the "right VAC", then why is he out of hospital having to cope with all this by himself? It scares me that you rely on me, because I'm not a doctor. I'm not there to see what's going on. Neither are you. If it was one of my loved ones, I'd want same person examined by and a second opinion from other doctors (specialist in wound care, specialist in infections, specialist in internal medicine). You and Rudy "hired" whoever did this procedure. I don't know if they're being honest with you (or not) or if they even know what's going on. Here's part of my concern. If they know he'll not get better (or won't admit it), then Rudy and you should be together and he should be getting palliative care. I honestly do not know so, no, this is not advice. Just my .02 cents and that's all it's worth. Keep us posted. I care. Hugs to Rudy and Jenny J > <snip> > > AND I have to wonder if this VAC-ing is actually closing the wound I meant "closing the wound over the infection" > up into his body, as opposed to it "it" the infection > being supposed to be drained out while the antibiotics > continue to help him fight infection (if applicable). J > Dash wrote: > > > Ohhhhh J, > > I haven't gotten back right away as I have been busy with work and > > research on the internet and I am so tired! > > I have no idea why Rudy is going through all of this. His biggest problem > > now is the > > fever, sweats and chills. I have been looking everything up on this on how > > to make > > it more comfortable for him. I told him to record his temperatures daily so > > he can > > at least figure out a pattern. > > Jenny, our body temperatures vary at different times of the day. > If I previously suggested that he monitor his temperature and watch for > patterns, I meant "from day to day, at the same time each day" (not multiple > times during the same day) meaning if the trend starts increasing to get him > back to the doctor or hospital. > If he's not able to take and record his temperature once a day, sounds to me > like he needs help there. > > > This is unfortunately too much for him to record right now. > > I have been reading the that the fevers could be caused by infection,liver > > abscess, > > tumor or allergic reactions to drugs. > > I don't know Jenny. The doctors are supposed to tell Rudy and you why this is > happening. > > > His coumadin advice is way out of whack! He's been on it long enough to know > > by > > now how to regulate it himself, but the doctors keep telling him otherwise. > > We both > > think this is why the wound is not healing properly in a timely fashion -the > > blood is too > > thin! He has noticed one thing, however, when he takes lower amounts of > > coumadin, > > the canister for the wound vac, pumps in a yellow fluid. When he takes more > > coumadin > > as requested by his doctor, more red fluid/blood is pumped into the > > canister. > > > > He is on an "old-fashioned" wound vac, that doesn't work near as good as the > > other from > > the hospital. Every time he would like to disconnect himself from it for > > awhile, he needs to > > reset this one and bending down, because of the wound, is not very > > comfortable for him. It > > is great to have home support, but the nurse that comes is apparently such a > > tyrant - from > > the old school of hard knocks - tough love - whatever! She doesn't know much > > about the > > vac and would like to see him administer some freezing to the wound himself > > by injection? > > Does this sound right? > > > > It is so difficult being so far away from him. I am planning on another trip > > there by the end of > > April for 3 weeks so I can be hands on! I have been talking to him and > > researching the internet > > at the same time! Thank goodness for the internet! > > > > Thanks for all your help and advice and i-n-f-o-r-m-a-t-i-o-n - it is all > > very much appreciated! > > Jenny > > Jeeny, I'm worried that he still may have infection especially after just > reading this > http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000666.htm > "The infection is often confirmed by a positive blood culture, though blood > cultures may be negative in individuals who have been receiving antibiotics. " > and the signs and symptoms there are exactly what happened to me, but "thank G" > I got to a different doctor and was put on a different antibiotic. (see below) > > AND I have to wonder if this VAC-ing is actually closing the wound up into his > body, as opposed to it being supposed to be drained out while the antibiotics > continue to help him fight infection (if applicable). > > I don't know what the yellow is, it could be bile. On the other hand, when I had > a serious infection, the last stuff draining out was yellow and I thought that > was a sign of healing (or something I'd been eating), and less than a month > later the infection "ramped up" severely. I was very ill and could barely see, > so I can see how Rudy cannot cope with taking his temperature and if the nurse > isn't taking care of that and he doesn't have the "right VAC", then why is he > out of hospital having to cope with all this by himself? > > It scares me that you rely on me, because I'm not a doctor. I'm not there to see > what's going on. Neither are you. > If it was one of my loved ones, I'd want same person examined by and a second > opinion from other doctors (specialist in wound care, specialist in infections, > specialist in internal medicine). > > You and Rudy "hired" whoever did this procedure. I don't know if they're being > honest with you (or not) or if they even know what's going on. > > Here's part of my concern. If they know he'll not get better (or won't admit > it), then Rudy and you should be together and he should be getting palliative > care. > > I honestly do not know so, no, this is not advice. Just my .02 cents and that's > all it's worth. > Keep us posted. I care. > Hugs to Rudy and Jenny > J > > Didn't mean to think that I was relying on you J, Just venting a little in regards to the inadequate medical service Rudy has been receiving lately. Everyone (medical people) seem to think that everything is going great!!! I mean everyone...there hasn't been one who seems to think differently. Rudy called the surgeon's office last week (Friday) and they still haven't called him back - he suspected they wouldn't. As mentioned in an earlier posting, we have noticed a pattern around his mother irritating/frustrating him. When they have their "battles" which has been almost daily since he has been out of the hospital causing him uncalled for stress, his temperature goes up. When his sister comes over, his temperature goes down. Although his mom thinks she is doing the best she can - she really isn't. She is unfortunately causing more harm then good at the moment. I am leaving soon to relieve her for about 3 weeks. Jenny > > Dash wrote: > > > Didn't mean to think that I was relying on you J, Just venting a little in > regards to the [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > Jenny Hang in there Jenny and I am sorry to read that things are still tough for you guys. I am in the middle of making you a "voodoo" doll (and you so know where I am coming from!!) but it's not quite ready yet, so Rudy will have to count to ten for a while longer. Here's hoping that when you arrive on your white charger all the evil spirits will run away and peace will reign again. Hugs to you both Alayne p.s. Apparently mine is feeling very unloved because I sent no mothers day card - how to say so much by merely saying nothing.... > Didn't mean to think that I was relying on you J, Just venting a little in > regards to the inadequate medical service Rudy has been receiving lately. [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Jenny I see, welll, vent away Jenny. Stress really can elevate the temperature. We were talking about that on another newsgroup. Does she tell him to "go to his room" ? ;-) In any event, once you're there, I'm sure things will go smoother for all. Hugs J > Dash wrote: > > > Didn't mean to think that I was relying on you J, Just venting a little in > > regards to the inadequate medical service Rudy has been receiving lately. > > > > Everyone (medical people) seem to think that everything is going great!!! > > I mean everyone...there hasn't been one who seems to think differently. Rudy > > called the surgeon's office last week (Friday) and they still haven't called > > him > > back - he suspected they wouldn't. > > > > As mentioned in an earlier posting, we have noticed a pattern around his > > mother irritating/frustrating him. When they have their "battles" which has > > been > > almost daily since he has been out of the hospital causing him uncalled for > > stress, his > > temperature goes up. When his sister comes over, his temperature goes down. > > Although > > his mom thinks she is doing the best she can - she really isn't. She is > > unfortunately causing more > > harm then good at the moment. I am leaving soon to relieve her for about 3 > > weeks. > > > > Jenny > > I see, welll, vent away Jenny. > Stress really can elevate the temperature. We were talking about that on another > newsgroup. > Does she tell him to "go to his room" ? ;-) > In any event, once you're there, I'm sure things will go smoother for all. > Hugs > J > Well so far it's been 3 days and no battles - and no fevers! J, I'm sure she would love to tell him to go to his room, isn't that what controlling and manipulative mothers try to do when their adult son is 46 and they are 74??? You probably won't understand this, but I think it's great that they are/were battling as I think it has literally gotten a lot of things off his chest! Probably things he has wanted to say before, but didn't have the guts to hurt his mom. Now, when he isn't up to trying to please her, he lets her know how he feels quite verbally! Probably unloads a lot of toxic bullsh*t that created the tumor in the first place! It's a good cleanse of the body and soul! Jenny > Well so far it's been 3 days and no battles - and no fevers! J, I'm sure > she would [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Jenny Update? and how are you doing? Just an FYI embolization might be also called "vessel occulsion" (in case you're still searching) http://www.muschealth.com/ddc/test/ir.htm Hugs J > Dash wrote: > > > Well so far it's been 3 days and no battles - and no fevers! J, I'm sure > > she would > > love to tell him to go to his room, isn't that what controlling and > > manipulative mothers > > try to do when their adult son is 46 and they are 74??? > > > > You probably won't understand this, but I think it's great that they > > are/were battling > > as I think it has literally gotten a lot of things off his chest! Probably > > things he has > > wanted to say before, but didn't have the guts to hurt his mom. Now, when he > > isn't > > up to trying to please her, he lets her know how he feels quite verbally! > > Probably unloads a lot of toxic bullsh*t that created the tumor in the first > > place! > > It's a good cleanse of the body and soul! > > > > Jenny > > Update? and how are you doing? > Just an FYI embolization might be also called "vessel occulsion" (in case you're > still searching) > http://www.muschealth.com/ddc/test/ir.htm > Hugs > J > Thanks for asking! Rudy is doing much better now. There have still been no battles or fevers, so the "heated" conversations were exactly that.."heated"...which were causing the fevers. Also, the night sweats have gotten better, only wakes up once now instead of 3 times in the middle of the night with no chills, then goes back to sleep! His appetite seems to be getting better as well! The drain that he went out of the hospital with is draining very little if anything now. He is still on the wound vac as the top vertical wound between the ribcage area doesn't seem to want to heal properly but everything on the horizontal wound is good. For those of you who don't know, the wound is shaped like the Mercedes symbol. He is using a relic wound vac compared to the one from the hospital and he knows it doesn't do half the job. I am doing pretty good! Now that I know the fevers weren't caused by in infection or abscess or the tumor...thank goodness for that. It is so difficult not being right there and him going through this. I will be leaving on Thursday or Friday for Edmonton for 3 weeks. I will have no access to a computer unless I go to an internet cafe, which I am sure won't be able to access the newsgroup - but I am unsure. I spotted an internet cafe the last day I was there a couple of weeks ago. Wow, thanks for all your research and input, it's all really appreciated! (I hope you know that). I have always noticed the hours of work you put into getting information to others right way. I have been reading up on "Nicholas", and saw how much you went out of your way to help those parents and that little baby. You really bent over backwards with the information you got to them right away - I was really impressed...down to the doctors they could get a second opinion from...despite the slight language barrier. J, you have really gone beyond the call of duty - as always! A Big Thank you! Hugs! Jenny :) > > Dash wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > an internet > cafe the last day I was there a couple of weeks ago. Pleased to hear that Rudy is doing better (and I haven't even finished the voodoo doll - must have been the vibes I was sending!!) Have a good visit Jenny and send my regards to Rudy. Hugs Alayne > I am doing pretty good! Now that I know the fevers weren't caused by in > infection or abscess or the tumor...thank goodness for that. It is so [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I spotted > an internet cafe the last day I was there a couple of weeks ago. Google http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search is the only way I know to access newsgroups from someone else's computer especially a "public computer". I rather doubt (but could be wrong) that Internet cafes are set up for newsgroups. A friend on another newsgroup was, but she owned the internet cafe in a small restaurant so I don't know if it was one dedicated computer that only she used. type alt.support.cancer in the appropriate box and on the top right it says "Post a new message to alt.support.cancer" Once you click on that, it wants you to key in your email and password (as previously set up in Google) but first one has to register with a yahoo or hotmail account (if one does not want to show their "home or work" email address). They ask for a name, I assume that's "screenname". Then they e-mail said yahoo or hotmail to confirm that it's been "registered" and now okay to post or reply. So then one goes to the above, types in alt.support.cancer, starts a new post or finds "your thread" and continues on it. I would think you might want a holiday from us :-) Good to hear that things are looking up. Hugs J > <snip> > and him going through this. I will be leaving on Thursday or Friday for [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > an internet > cafe the last day I was there a couple of weeks ago. Hi Jenny, See how you've got "line spillover" above? I think your "characters per line" in Newsguy is set too long. "Personal Preferences"? http://www.newsguy.com/drnhelpw.htm 72 characters might do it. Hugs J PS that's a kewl "help" web page. Lots of clickables to demonstrate. :-) > Dash wrote: > > > <snip> > > and him going through this. I will be leaving on Thursday or Friday for > > Edmonton for > > 3 weeks. I will have no access to a computer unless I go to an internet > > cafe, which I > > am sure won't be able to access the newsgroup - but I am unsure. I spotted > > an internet > > cafe the last day I was there a couple of weeks ago. > > Hi Jenny, > See how you've got "line spillover" above? > I think your "characters per line" in Newsguy is set too long. > "Personal Preferences"? http://www.newsguy.com/drnhelpw.htm > 72 characters might do it. > Hugs > J > PS that's a kewl "help" web page. Lots of clickables to demonstrate. :-) > I have notice this before...now I am in the website and am unsure about what to do. Where do I plug in 72 in the characters line? Um...never knew about the "Newsguy" before this.... Jenny > "J" <RecycleBin@example.net> wrote in message > > Dash wrote: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > the "Newsguy" before this.... > Jenny Your posting headers indicate that's what you are using (Newguy). In theory you click on Personal Preferences and look for line length settings.. (might be under "wrap" or "window width" or something else) but if someone else set up Newguy for you, you need the user name and password to get in there and change your settings. Since you are showing "Dash" that must be the user name. You're on your own about the password (and please don't post it here). If Rudy set you up, maybe you have to ask him? (try it first if you have a known password and see if it turns you down). J > J, you have really gone beyond the call of duty - as always! Gee, where are you? Now I'm worried that my suggestion to change your settings in your newsreader has disconnected you from us (if not done properly). Did you hear on the news? (they said it takes a week to grow, but didn't say what size). J http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,3604,1203945,00.html 'Biological bandages' grown in lab James Meikle Tuesday April 27, 2004 The Guardian Thousands of patients with severe burns and ulcerous wounds should soon benefit from "biological bandages" which use their own cells to regenerate skin. Doctors said the bandages, 10 years in development by CellTran, a spin-off from Sheffield University, are used alongside conventional skin grafts to ease pain and speed recovery. Samples of skin are taken and the cells are then expanded hundreds-fold in the laboratory before being put on dressings. These are applied to damaged regions, releasing the cells so that they can jump-start growth. Myskin has already been tried on burns patients at the Northern General hospital, Sheffield, and have produced some "excellent results", said David Ralston, a burns and plastic surgeon.  Signature"Behind Every Good Woman Is Herself" > > > J, you have really gone beyond the call of duty - as always! [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > hospital, Sheffield, and have produced some "excellent results", said David > Ralston, a burns and plastic surgeon. J Ha ha ha...don't worry...I'm still here! I have been working lots with nothing new to report on Rudy except that he is doing good. I will pass on this info to him regarding the new wound bandages. Take care, and have a good 3 weeks (from advice to me anyways)! I am leaving tomorrow first thing for Edmonton for 3 weeks. So you won't see me around here for awhile. Hugs, Jenny > PooperScooper@invalid.nul said... > > Hi Emily, [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > that if she accepts it it'll be the beginning of the end. Does this > ring true with anyone else? I can understand that she is scared of accepting support and that she feels that if she does it is the beginning of the end. Tony and myself were exactly the same in the beginning even at the very mention of the word Macmillan nurse or Marie Curie nurse (hey shucks, that's death-row nursing, we don't need that was our very initial reaction). However, once cold stark reality begins to creep in, opinions begin to change. Looking back on my experience though, whilst it was horrendous, I managed without any outside help (other than a week in the hospice and then the last hospice admittance) because we were of too an independent nature to do it any other way. Everyone's different and sometimes, just sometimes, not acknowledging grim reality makes for a better quality of life if you get my drift. Trying to carry on virtually as normal does have its benefits. Each to their own, but and again from my own experience, I would question not telling the children. Children aren't daft, no matter what their ages, and soon pick up when something is wrong. What is actually worse for them is being kept in the dark and drawing their own conclusions and their own scary thoughts anyway. I got short sharp shrift from my two when they began to pick up on what I was mentioning to others and they were unaware of. But again, each to their own. It's very hard to stand on the sidelines of someone else's pain and feel incredibly helpless but that's life sometimes. Hugs Now Alayne totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > Each to their own, but and again from my own experience, I would question > not telling the children. Children aren't daft, no matter what their ages, > and soon pick up when something is wrong. As a mother myself that bothers me a bit as well. I understand why she's not saying anything to them, but I also understand that when they find out they're likely to be more hurt by the feeling of not having been trusted. The teenager especially has a right to know IMO, but it's not for me to interfere in the way N wants things done. > What is actually worse for them > is being kept in the dark and drawing their own conclusions and their own > scary thoughts anyway. I got short sharp shrift from my two when they began > to pick up on what I was mentioning to others and they were unaware of. But > again, each to their own. I can't imagine how the twice daily visits of a nurse are being explained away. I can appreciate that telling the girls might be the quickest way to tell the whole town, because of their ages. On the other hand... Oh, it's hard when children are involved. I don't even know what I'd do myself in N's situation, to be honest. I'd want to tell them, and I'd probably say something to my older children, but the younger ones... some things are too heavy for little ones to carry. > It's very hard to stand on the sidelines of someone else's pain and feel > incredibly helpless but that's life sometimes. Ain't that the truth. > totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > > It's very hard to stand on the sidelines of someone else's pain and feel > > incredibly helpless but that's life sometimes. > > Ain't that the truth. Reading between the lines, you don't sound too chirpy Emily.. are you okay? Can I squash the last solitary (and usually coffee) chocolate left in my box into my keyboard for you? Sorry, it's not my last rolo! Times are tough aren't they? (I'm "brewing" slightly myself with it being the damned 28th again tommorrow) but hey, stiff upper lip and all that (as the English - and Welsh before you beat me with a stick!) say! Take care hon. the clocks go forward tonight which means Spring has finally Sprung here and another year truly begins, the dafs are out, the birds are chirping and the sun pokes through the rain clouds (well, occasionally). Much needed Hugs sent to Emily... Alayne totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Reading between the lines, you don't sound too chirpy Emily.. are you okay? I'm OK - just a bit frustrated 'cos I can't actually *do* anything. Plus I'm starting a bout of sinusitis so one side of my face is getting sore, and I'm guessing that since it's nearly midnight the plumber I've waited in for today because I'm incapable of drilling 32mm and 40mm holes through stone walls isn't going to show. > Can I squash the last solitary (and usually coffee) chocolate left in my box > into my keyboard for you? Sorry, it's not my last rolo! 'S OK, I don't mind it not being a Rolo :-) > Times are tough aren't they? (I'm "brewing" slightly myself with it being > the damned 28th again tommorrow) but hey, stiff upper lip and all that (as > the English - and Welsh before you beat me with a stick!) say! No need to worry about the stick - I was born in SE London and brought up in a posh bit of one of the London boroughs. I prefer it here in Wales though - people in Wales are generally more friendly than people in posh bits of the SE > Take care hon. the clocks go forward tonight which means Spring has finally > Sprung here and another year truly begins, the daffs are out, the birds are > chirping and the sun pokes through the rain clouds (well, occasionally). And tomorrow's Sunday so it's not the end of the world that we get an hour's less sleep. Tomorrow I have the wonderful task of helping two small children (6 and nearly 4) to create Easter bonnets for the end of term parade. I have thick white card, thin coloured card, cotton wool, lots of glue, paint, foliage from the garden... Anyone seen a spare conveyor belt, cuddly toy and a pair of sliding doors? (That little lot may need a bit of explaining to anyone who has never suffered the torture of the 'Generation Game' on TV) > Much needed Hugs sent to Emily... Thanks love, and have some yourself. You do know, don't you, that your dislike of 28th is irrational? But I know as well as you do that that won't get in the way of disliking it, so have a large mug of drinking chocolate with a sprinkling of cinnamon on top to help you feel better. > totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > (That little lot may need a bit of explaining to anyone who has > never suffered the torture of the 'Generation Game' on TV) .... now would that be in the era of Bruce Forsyth or Larry Grayson........!! Or I could really show my true colours on telly viewing and mention that if you drop anything you will have to hold a cabbage (but only if it is a Friday) and you won't win the prize of a pencil.......!! > > Much needed Hugs sent to Emily... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > of drinking chocolate with a sprinkling of cinnamon on top to help > you feel better. Yes, I know that it is irrational (but then I am a blonde) but I can't help my focus being pulled whenever the 28th approaches because it marks yet another month since Tony died (and its now 7 months), it's a bit like marking time when you are pregnant or when you have just started going out with someone. I just find it bizarre that the months have flashed past and yet it seems only like yesterday. Drinking chocolate with a sprinkling of cinnamon sounds yummy, although I am trying the flavoured coffees at the moment - the hazelnut one is nice! Take care hon. Alayne totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > And tomorrow's Sunday so it's not the end of the world that we get > > an hour's less sleep. Tomorrow I have the wonderful task of helping [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > and mention that if you drop anything you will have to hold a cabbage (but > only if it is a Friday) and you won't win the prize of a pencil.......!! Ooh!! It's Friday, it's five to five, it's.... CRACKERJACK! *CRACKERJACK*!!! D'oh. It just wasn't the same without the dynamic duo of Peter Glaze and Leslie Crowther. > > You do know, don't you, that your dislike of 28th is irrational? > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > with someone. I just find it bizarre that the months have flashed past and > yet it seems only like yesterday. Soon though, you'll find it's a whole year, and although you'll maybe wonder where the time went and how you coped, you'll also realise that you *have* coped, and your girls have coped, and that life does indeed carry on whether you like it or not. And of course Tony hasn't really left you, has he. He's there with you every step of the way, laughing at your attempts to fix things and to put together a flatpack or to 'put the gearbox back in reverse order'... and he'll be grinning as you wonder where that strange nut was supposed to go (yes, I've used Haynes manuals as well <g>)... and he'll cry with you as he watches proudly from wherever you believe he is as one after the other your girls get their exam certificates, get married, have children of their own... and even if you remarry, he'll never, ever finally leave you. And dates won't matter any more, because they'll cease to be important. And I'm rambling... > Drinking chocolate with a sprinkling of cinnamon sounds yummy, although I am > trying the flavoured coffees at the moment - the hazelnut one is nice! I shall have to try them. Thus far the price has put me off, but sod it, what's an overdraft for if not to increase it occasionally? <g> > totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > > And tomorrow's Sunday so it's not the end of the world that we get > Soon though, you'll find it's a whole year, and although you'll [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > he'll never, ever finally leave you. And dates won't matter any > more, because they'll cease to be important. And I'm rambling... Thanks Emily!! (even if I did have to "blink a lot" whilst reading!!) Alayne totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > Thanks Emily!! (even if I did have to "blink a lot" whilst reading!!) Sometimes I can't believe I'm capable of writing such drivel. I must be getting old or something. Gah. > totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > Thanks Emily!! (even if I did have to "blink a lot" whilst reading!!) > > Sometimes I can't believe I'm capable of writing such drivel. I > must be getting old or something. Gah. Perhaps I am getting old too - I understood your drivel!! Words are always open to interpretation and I took yours to be (and kindly so) a good size nine up the backside!! Hugs Alayne totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > totallyfake@emailaddress.com said... > > > Thanks Emily!! (even if I did have to "blink a lot" whilst reading!!) [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Words are always open to interpretation and I took yours to be (and kindly > so) a good size nine up the backside!! You know what? You're going to be just fine, I just know it. You're going to come through this and out the other side, and you'll be stronger than ever. And so will the girls. {{{{{Alayne}}}}} > Take care hon. the clocks go forward tonight which means Spring has finally I shouldn't believe everything I read on the internet. I changed all my clocks last night..phooey ! :-) J |
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