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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Breast Cancer / November 2003What happens to those who are left behind...
We are getting together with 3 other couples--close friends of ours for dinner later this afternoon. One of my friends is widowed. Her husband had a massive, fatal heart attack while mountain biking about 22 mos. ago. She is coming with a date, also a widower. This is the first of her dates that we will be meeting, although we've heard about many, if not most of them. She began meeting people about 9 mos. after her husband passed away. She was married for 27 years and hates coming home to an empty house. Her children are grown--in college or grad school and living out-of-the-house. She works full time as a teacher--a fabulous one--who just returned to school to get her doctorate in education. I used to semi-joke with my husband that if something happened to me he could get together with her. If the circumstances were 'right' that could easily happen, I'm sure. I have told my husband--from the start--that I hope he would remarry -- of course to someone I'd approve of <jk> (just kidding) We went through this with my dad--after my mom died, 6 years after she was dx'd with breast cancer. Although it was more than 25 years ago, it all seems like yesterday, now that I am dealing with b.c. I tease my husband about it--but do let him know that I want him to feel free to get involved in a relationship. I figured that with all that he's dealing with me--that not only does this have to be harder on him than me--that he is already dealing with some of the mourning process now--irregardless of outcome. So, today, when I meet my friend's date--the first guy that she has felt really comfortable with. He lost his wife to ovarian cancer 9 mos. ago. He had been happily married 29 years. I hope this is not a dress rehearsal for what my husband may deal with at some point in the future... I must say though it is easier for someone who has been happily married to meet someone of similar circumstances. At least that has been her experience. She felt like a counselor when dating divorced guys who had sour marriages--they wanted to dump on their exes and couldn't related to her when she said she couldn't do the same and hadn't felt any need to do so. I guess I am directing this at the widowed guys who are here and wondering if they had discussions with their wives before they passed away. I am also wondering if husbands here whose wives have breast cancer have done the same? Remember the guy who came here who wound up leaving his wife who was pregnant with breast cancer soon after she gave birth? I am guessing that the relationship hadn't been good before her b.c. diagnosis, though. I hope I am not opening alot of wounds, though, and do think this might be something that could be helpful to some. By the way, I have gone the gamut from telling my husband that I do expect him to marry to being angry--telling him that he will be 'rich' after I'm gone because of my retirement and insurance, etc. and get to enjoy the spoils with someone else. Of course, I hope that is NOT the case but can't help having some of these thoughts (both the positive and negative) every now and then... So, when we get together with our friends--I am wondering how the guys are going to see this. I am guessing it is going to be harder on the other husbands than it is on mine--just because I have opened the lines of communication re. such. I think it will affect them differently--and am thinking it might stir some feelings of cuiosity amongst mine, more so than the others. Interestingly one of the women--had a stroke--just a couple of weeks before her 50th birthday. Of all my friends she was one of the best in shape--perfect figure, watched what she ate, no family history. However, she had been on HRT. She lost the use of her non-dominant, upper left hand. She went through special rehabilitation so it isn't as noticeable--one doesn't realize it initially. She is able to drive a specially adapted car. Her speech and other skills are for the most part not affected. Interestingly--4 couples--friends for over 23+ years (together) although some of us knew each other a little longer, previously healthy and in relatively good shape--one of the spouses has a heart attack, another a stroke, and I have cancer. Although I also had M.S. it has been under good control (and fortunately treatment came out for it at a time when it started to worsen)...We met each other through our kids. Our friend who had the stroke--her oldest child, a boy was married last Spring; her younger child, a daughter 24, graduated college and is working. My friend who lost her husband--her oldest daughter (23) is in a physical therapy doctoral program; her younger daughter, 21, is getting her teaching credential. The other couple--oldest daughter (25) is in her 4th year of medical school; her son (23) is an engineer, working for a software company; Our oldest (24) is in her 3rd year of medical school; our middle one (21) is a sr. in college; our youngest (18) is a freshman in college. All of us are now 'empty-nesters'... Ah, the joys of aging... > I have told my husband--from the start--that I hope he would > remarry -- That puts him in a difficult situation. What if he chooses not to re-marry? It might seem that he wasn't doing what you wanted. Surely, it's up to the individual, when we're gone we're gone, we shouldn't influence anyone from the grave. Mary Mary wrote << That puts him in a difficult situation. What if he chooses not to re-marry? It might seem that he wasn't doing what you wanted. Surely, it's up to the individual, when we're gone we're gone, we shouldn't influence anyone from the grave.>> Of course not. My wishes are that he does what he feels is 'right' for him without having any guilt, but I am hoping to be around for awhile. However, if I am not I wouldn't want him not to pursue what he desired out of guilt or because others said there was a certain time frame to be followed. He is a wonderful husband in ALL ways, and if I were not able to be around for us to continue on together I would like for him to feel free to pursue other relationships should he desire wihen he is emotionally read. Of course, I hope we can continue on together but did feel I needed to address the other possibility. > I guess I am directing this at the widowed guys who are here and wondering if > they had discussions with their wives before they passed away. I am also > wondering if husbands here whose wives have breast cancer have done the same? Yes, we did. My wife even initially designated an "heir apparent" (another Russian), although later retracted the idea, figuring the girl for a gold digger. (I hope to hell she isn't reading this!) There was a good chemistry and in the vulnerable time shortly after my wife's death I might have gone for it but for the fact that there was absolutely no way I could afford to import another immigrant wife at that time, and (perhaps fortunately) she had no interest in waiting. She completed a marriage to another Brit within six months, although a year later she was regretting her haste. My wife always had had a very poor grasp of economics. Our discussions ran along the lines of her saying that I was a good husband and we had good children and I would have no difficulty in finding another wife. I argued that I had been single until I was 40, so statistically I would be unlikely to remarry while I was still of an age to care about it. It remains an open question as to whether the advent of the Internet makes a significant difference to the statistics by extending the geographical range of search. I don't yet have a statistically significant sample. I must admit to having some difficulty with these discussions because they were not markedly different from the regular unfounded accusations of infidelity that had characterised our marriage. I was always very cautious for fear that I was being led into a verbal trap, such as being tricked into saying something that could be construed as meaning that I fancied someone else more than her. Tim > I must admit to having some difficulty with these discussions because they > were not markedly different from the regular unfounded accusations of > infidelity that had characterised our marriage. I was always very cautious > for fear that I was being led into a verbal trap, such as being tricked into > saying something that could be construed as meaning that I fancied someone > else more than her. Oh, Tim, you had such a difficult time ... You're an amazing man to have come through it as you have. Mary > Tim Tim wrote << I must admit to having some difficulty with these discussions because they were not markedly different from the regular unfounded accusations of infidelity that had characterised our marriage. I was always very cautious for fear that I was being led into a verbal trap, such as being tricked into saying something that could be construed as meaning that I fancied someone else more than her. Oh Tim, so very sorry that you had to deal with the other aspect, too. The idea of one's mate actually being with someone else, to me, is a bit surreal at this point in time. I guess I am looking at it existentially--or in the '3rd' or other person--at least for the moment... > Tim wrote << I must admit to having some difficulty with these discussions > because they [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Oh Tim, so very sorry that you had to deal with the other aspect, too. Let me just make it clear that I am not moaning, my last post sounded a bit that way on re-reading. The marriage that does not have -some- compromises is a rare thing. My wife was beautiful, sexy, loving, an excellent and dedicated mother to her children, and in Russian tradition thrived in adversity. I was always proud of her, and she of me. The few weaknesses in her personality were a small price to pay, and were probably a benefit to the relationship as they played to my strengths. There was never any real question that we both loved each other. My point was that despite the subject being an absolute minefield in our particular case, we still did manage to discuss it. Tim Tim wrote << My point was that despite the subject being an absolute minefield in our particular case, we still did manage to discuss it.>> I understand. That is what is so important -- the fact that it could be discussed. There is so much of one's early past that can contribute to that difficulty and it often has very little to do with the reality of what is actually going on in the current situation. > Let me just make it clear that I am not moaning, my last post sounded a bit > that way on re-reading. It didn't to me. When I first joined this group your wife was still alive and you posted some very deep questions. I've admired your openness from that time but have never, ever, felt that you were complaining. Mary |
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