> hello everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
> Michele
This article in particular raises some valid and well known questions
about western diet, but in an unscientific manner, and certainly does
not provide any answers. The use of statistics is seriously flawed, for
example as breast cancer is mostly a disease of old age, incidence
statistics are useless unless one controls for longevity. In a country
where life expectancy is say 45, one would expect a pretty low incidence
of bc, and alternatively if you cure everything else, then cancer will
get everyone in the end.
It would be easy to do a clinical trial a) looking at the outcomes of
cancer patients who voluntarily gave up or already avoided dairy
products, and b) recruiting random patients and persuading them to avoid
dairy foods. No such evidence is presented here, so the conclusion is
that it probably wouldn't get the desired result. Existing research
does not support the theory, see for example
http://rex.nci.nih.gov/NCI_Pub_Interface/raterisk/risks73.html
The site in general periodically gets promoted by posts to this and
other newsgroups and tends to be characterised by some plausible
arguments followed through specious logic to very unlikely conclusions,
which result in an attempt to part the reader from some cash.
Looking on the internet for things that will lower cancer risk is like
looking for a needle in a haystack, when you don't even know how to tell
the difference between needles and hay.
If a product is offered for sale which cannot produce evidence of
clinical trials and peer-reviewed statistical proof of its
effectiveness, then in all likelihood it doesn't work. Of course the
promoter will explain that there is a conspiracy to prevent the cure
from being brought to the public, usually by drug companies to prevent
unpatentable cures from undermining their business, or by health
insurance companies to promote business for hospitals. The first
argument only works in rare cases where an existing approved drug can be
reused as a cure, the second is a US-centric view that doesn't work
internationally.
Tim Jackson
Michele - 19 Jan 2007 09:32 GMT
Thank-you Tim,
It really is difficult sometimes to poke holes in things that seem just not
quite right but not knowing why? I didn't find a place on the site that
asked me for money so I looked further and when you get statistics, doctors
and phd's thrown at you at the same time so it's hard to decide the
differnce between truth and fiction.
I trust and esteem your opinion. I've been reading this forum since 2005 and
you are a guide light of common sense and breast cancer knowledge to me and
probably many others.
warm regards and again thank-you,
Michele
>> hello everyone,
>>
[quoted text clipped - 61 lines]
>
> Tim Jackson
Peter Moran - 19 Jan 2007 23:26 GMT
>> hello everyone,
>>
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
>>
>> Michele
> If a product is offered for sale which cannot produce evidence of clinical
> trials and peer-reviewed statistical proof of its effectiveness, then in
> all likelihood it doesn't work.
True, but I am wary of creating a false dichotomy that the cancer quacks use
as an excuse for not being able to produce "the kind of evidence the
doctors' want". They do not usually have the wherewithall for
sophisticated studies
Their real problem, in my opinion, is that if the treatments worked as well
the the usual claims imply they should be able to produce a substantial body
of unequivocally cured cancer patients, i,e, patients who had proven,
established cancer and it was shown to go away with the treatment being
promoted and nothing else. If they did so the studies would follow, just
as they have with other unpatentable methods such as Laetrile. Vitamin C and
shark cartilagem often on even less substantial evidence. .
PM
www.cancerwatcher.com
.
>Of course the promoter will explain that there is a conspiracy to prevent
>the cure from being brought to the public, usually by drug companies to
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Tim Jackson
David Larson - 27 Jan 2007 23:28 GMT
With the laws the way they are even if you can prove you have a miracle cure
you are not allowed to say you have found one because the Pharm Industry is
holding a monopoly of the natural market. The problem is not the different
"Juices" and supplements. The problem is that if you speek the truth you
can be arrested and jailed.
Dave
Having cancer is a terrible thing.... people are scared and try to
grab onto any lifeline they can see. And unfortunately there are too
many opportunists out there trying to take advantage of these poor
individuals. All kinds of lotions and potions....
And why are these 'great' discoveries not known by the general
population? Because of the conspiracy by the established
pharmaceuticals and doctors? That's what they say. To me it's
insulting and ridiculous.
Have you ever heard of Microsoft? When they were first born, they were
nobody and who would ever need a computer at home, anyways? Same for
Apple... a couple of guys in their garage came up with an idea.
Pennicillin? Discovered by accident by. Yet all these products are
household names used all over the world. Why did they displace the
existing giants of their time? because they work
Now these 'cures' If they really worked... does anyone think the
inventor would not be all over the world distributing this? Making
unspeakable amounts of money or just having the satisfaction of
changing the world?
Would the establishment really be able to suppress this?
Knowledge is contagious... nothing can stop it
Michele,
I just want to add my two cents to this discussion. Please make note of the
non-medical references. I've been reading this newsgroup for many years
now. Most of the long timers remember our story. My wife recurred over
five yrs ago with mets to her brain and lung. Treated with WBR, SRS and
Herceptin/Femara for four years. Currently on Zeloda. Scans of two days
ago show stable disease in her lung, no disease in her brain or liver.
She's playing tennis this morning...
That being said, the biggest dietary change we've made is to remove
processed food and hormonally grown from our diets the best we can. I'm not
talking about every last thing, but there are no frozen pre-made meals in
the house and all the milk is organic.
We took our daughter to France eight months after Sharon recurred and went
to the Loire Valley. One of the interesting things I noticed was that all
the kings who lived in these castles 500 yrs ago had lived as long as 80 yrs
(with no real medicines btw). I got to thinking about what their diet might
have been and came to the conclusion that they ate everything fresh.
We try to do the same thing.
Mark
> hello everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
>
> Michele
If an alternative cancer cure was really effective, it would be
headline news on the front page of all the major newspapers.
So, unless you believe in a gigantic conspiracy being committed
by all the major newspapers... (draw your own conclusion).

Signature
John Richards
> hello everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
> Michele
Tim Jackson - 21 Jan 2007 11:28 GMT
> If an alternative cancer cure was really effective, it would be
> headline news on the front page of all the major newspapers.
> So, unless you believe in a gigantic conspiracy being committed
> by all the major newspapers... (draw your own conclusion).
It's worse than that John, it would need an international conspiracy
involving not just the major US media (that seems quite easy really) but
also major Canadian, British, Australian, German, French, Italian, and
Russian media, Al Jazeera, the pan-African rumour mill (although they
probably believe in it anyway) and the blogosphere. Oh, and us. Which
does start to look like herding cats.
Tim