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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Breast Cancer / August 2005

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Severe Headaches Possible Mets?

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Marni Lee - 14 Jul 2005 00:28 GMT
I have a question for the group. A year ago I did have an MRI and everything
was clear. All that showed up was some "arthritis" in my neck.

For at least six weeks now I am getting the most severe headaches and some
blurred vision. Nothing will relieve the headache. I feel stupid going to
the doctor over nothing but these headaches won't stop.

I guess my question is, is it possible for bone mets to be mistaken for
arthritis on an MRI?

Marni
Tim Jackson - 14 Jul 2005 08:29 GMT
> I have a question for the group. A year ago I did have an MRI and everything
> was clear. All that showed up was some "arthritis" in my neck.
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
> Marni

Yes I think it is *possible* in an early stage, or for both to be
present.  I don't think that particular site is likely to be the cause
of the headaches though, but mets can't be ruled out.  However the usual
way of diagnosing mets is to first rule out everything else.

I would say that for anyone, not just a cancer survivor, a persistent
headache with blurred vision is a perfectly good reason to "bother" the
doctor (your GP rather than oncologist) and nothing to feel stupid about.

Tim Jackson
Marni Lee - 15 Jul 2005 01:52 GMT
OK, thanks Tim. I'll make an appointment with the GP and see what's going
on.

Marni

>> I have a question for the group. A year ago I did have an MRI and
>> everything was clear. All that showed up was some "arthritis" in my neck.
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> Tim Jackson
Marni Lee - 15 Jul 2005 02:34 GMT
Tim,

When you say the usual way of diagnosing mets is to first rule out
everything else, I'm not sure what you mean. Do you mean they can't really
diagnose mets and just assume that's what it is if nothing else shows? Do
bone mets actually show in an xray, or MRI?

Marni

>> I have a question for the group. A year ago I did have an MRI and
>> everything was clear. All that showed up was some "arthritis" in my neck.
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> Tim Jackson
Tim Jackson - 15 Jul 2005 09:39 GMT
> Tim,
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Marni

Not always conclusively.  They can see "there is something going on",
but not definitely cancer.  The primary test for bone mets is an isotope
bone scan, although even that also lights up for arthritis and needs
skilled interpretation.  Unfortunately this is an expensive test and
incurs a significant radiation burden, so is not undertaken lightly.

The early symptoms of mets can mimic common conditions.  They can't go
doing bone scans on ever cancer survivor who has a backache or headache.
 One of the distinguishing characteristics of mets is that it increases
slowly but relentlessly over time, whereas most other conditions either
stabilise, clear up spontaneously in a few months or come and go.  So
steady deterioration and failure to respond to treatment for common
conditions is what the are looking for (or rather, hoping not to see).

In my wife's case it was backache.  She went to see the oncologist, who
referred her to a physiotherapist and eventually to an orthopaedic
surgeon. He x-rayed her, declared she had probable mets and referred her
back to the oncologist, who then ordered a bone scan and confirmed it.

New tests are appearing which can detect mets less invasively but as yet
they are either unreliable, especially in the early stages, or not
widely available.

Tim
A. P. Thorsen - 15 Jul 2005 15:41 GMT
> The primary test for bone mets is an isotope
> bone scan, although even that also lights up for arthritis and needs
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> The early symptoms of mets can mimic common conditions.  They can't go
> doing bone scans on ever cancer survivor who has a backache or headache.

This may not be true everywhere or for everyone.

I presented with locally advanced BC (stage III, probably, though
multifocal BC is more ambiguous to stage).  Especially early on, my docs
were pretty quick to go to the bone scan if I reported backache or
similar symptoms.  I think I've had 3 or 4 bone scans, all negative so
far.

Very little else was done first diagnostically, other than physical
exam.  Maybe this is irresponsble test-happy American medicine, maybe
it's all about the "doctor vacation fund" (my term for the tendency to
run more tests on cancer survivors), maybe it's a medically defensible
different approach used in particular types of cases.  Dunno.

I comment only because I want Marni to know that if they are quick to
send her for a bone scan, that action by itself should not be taken to
be a dire warning.

Let us know how things work out, Marni -- we'll be hoping for a non-dire
and easily-treated outcome!

Ann T.
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Marni Lee - 16 Jul 2005 03:32 GMT
> Let us know how things work out, Marni -- we'll be hoping for a non-dire
> and easily-treated outcome!

Thank-you, Ann.  I will. I am trying to think positively, and hoping it just
a migrane that has decided to run wild :)  Tomorrow I'll file the
prescription for the painkillers and see if that helps.

Marni
Marni Lee - 16 Jul 2005 03:29 GMT
> Not always conclusively.  They can see "there is something going on",
> but not definitely cancer.  The primary test for bone mets is an isotope
[quoted text clipped - 20 lines]
>
> Tim

OK, thanks. Well I saw the doctor today and he has given me some strong
painkillers in case it's a migrane that is "locked in". But he also ordered
a Cat scan.

Marni
Marni Lee - 31 Jul 2005 19:49 GMT
Woo-hoo! I had my CAT scan, and it is clear!!! Thank-God. So now I can at
least stop worrying about brain mets.

Marni
Eva - 31 Jul 2005 22:51 GMT
> Woo-hoo! I had my CAT scan, and it is clear!!! Thank-God. So now I can at
> least stop worrying about brain mets.
-----------
Woohoo is right!...but how are your headaches?

Eva
Marni Lee - 01 Aug 2005 00:57 GMT
Well, the headaches are still here.

Marni
Sandy L - 01 Aug 2005 01:29 GMT
> Well, the headaches are still here.
>
> Marni

Check out http://www.i-h-s.org, the site for the International Headache
Society.  Go to Guidelines, then criteria.  Look first at migraine, then at
tension type headaches, then see if there is something about cervicogenic
(caused by neck problems) headaches.
 
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