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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Breast Cancer / September 2004

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is anyone watching these posts?

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C. Falise - 11 Sep 2004 23:00 GMT
i have been an active member of this board for some time.  i keep coming
back here because i find great information, great support, and occasionally
i have something to offer the group.
i haven't looked here for a week or two, as i was out of town.  when i came
back this afternoon to catch up, i saw some very disturbing posts and i have
to ask, is anyone watching here?
why should we have to read posts about pornography and rape scenes when we
come here for support and info?
i have to admit, i'm a little angry about it.  is there any way to keep this
stuff off this board?  there's so much of it everywhere, i don't want this
board to be corrupted by it, if possible.
just asking.
-christina

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see www.tortoisephotography.com

Greta - 11 Sep 2004 23:37 GMT
> i have been an active member of this board for some time.  i keep coming
> back here because i find great information, great support, and occasionally
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> just asking.
> -christina

you can block the sender with your software. The only other way as far
as I know would be to develop a monitored newsgroup - however such a
group presents a whole set of new problems because the decision to allow
a post would be vested in a few people.
Greta
Eva - 12 Sep 2004 00:56 GMT
> > ....why should we have to read posts about pornography and rape scenes
when we
> > come here for support and info?
> > i have to admit, i'm a little angry about it.  is there any way to keep this
> > stuff off this board?  ....

> you can block the sender with your software. The only other way as far
> as I know would be to develop a monitored newsgroup - however such a
> group presents a whole set of new problems because the decision to allow
> a post would be vested in a few people.
------------
I never saw any posts about pornography and rape scenes here, so I would
guess my ISP already filtered them out.  What I have seen are a bunch of
crazy off-topic religious posts.

Eva
Mary Fisher - 12 Sep 2004 09:10 GMT
> > > ....why should we have to read posts about pornography and rape scenes
> when we
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> guess my ISP already filtered them out.  What I have seen are a bunch of
> crazy off-topic religious posts.

I haven't seen any porn or religious posts but I don't open anything with a
subject which isn't relevant. It's dumped.

Mary

> Eva
Sandy L - 12 Sep 2004 02:44 GMT
>i have been an active member of this board for some time.  i keep coming
> back here because i find great information, great support, and
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> just asking.
> -christina

As with Eva, I have not seen any pornographic etc material for at least a
couple of weeks.  I could usually tell it was nothing I would be interested
in without opening the posts and just deleted them.  It was a nuisance,but
didn't stop me from reading.
Sandy L
Kaye301 - 12 Sep 2004 21:46 GMT
There were 2 posts with that in the subject heading that came through on 9/5
but I didn't open any of them so don't know if they were actually dealing with
that or someone protesting or commenting re. such.  However, there were at
leaat 9 posts included, with subjects written in capital letters, dealing with
spirituality, supreme being, and forms of an after-life, which are also
inappropriate.
And as far as the subject heading "Re: is anyone watching these posts?"  I have
been having a mail problem with only this email name.  Apparently posts are
being sent with this name--but not by me.  One newsgroup which I subscribe to
received a post related to b.c. and exercise--not sent by me but which had to
be downloaded.  I don't send posts that need downloading -- at least not
purposefully -- to anyone other  than a single person at a time, if at all.
However, this post went to an email list.  I am not sure whether someone has
gotten access to my account or it was a virus (to which I foolishly thought I
was immune using a MAC, aol, and dial-up).  Anyway, it was posted to the list
with a warning that it might be spam.  I don't do 'spam.'  
If anyone has any idea on what may be happening--would appreciate the feedback.
Thanks in advance.
Mary Fisher - 12 Sep 2004 22:02 GMT
> If anyone has any idea on what may be happening--would appreciate the feedback.

I think we simply have to be very vigilant.

Mary

>  Thanks in advance.
Tim Jackson - 13 Sep 2004 00:17 GMT
> There were 2 posts with that in the subject heading that came through on 9/5
> but I didn't open any of them so don't know if they were actually dealing with
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> If anyone has any idea on what may be happening--would appreciate the feedback.
>  Thanks in advance.

I would think that your email address has been 'harvested' and is being used
as a fake 'from' address by spammers.  This is one of the techniques they
use to try to defeat spam filters, they have to ensure their fake return
address is actually a valid address.  You can tell when this is happening
because you get nonsense emails saying "Undeliverable mail" as the viruses
etc. get trapped and "returned to sender" i.e. bounced back to you, the
apparent sender.  This can happen to anyone who posts their real address on
Usenet or puts it on the world-wide-web.

It isn't your fault, it doesn't mean there is a virus on your machine, it
doesn't mean anyone has accessed your account and there isn't anything you
can do about it.  This is one sort of identity theft, which is common.  That
said, while I have had my address used lots of times for spam email, I've
never seen it sent to Usenet, that is rather harder.  Are you sure it was
a -newsgroup- and not a list server or website bulletin board.

Tim
Kaye301 - 14 Sep 2004 04:41 GMT
That makes sense but don't think I explained very well.  In my case, I was
referring to the list of posts when I went to the newsgroups through UseNet.
None of them showed up in my private email.

Tim wrote << I would think that your email address has been 'harvested' and is
being used
as a fake 'from' address by spammers.  This is one of the techniques they
use to try to defeat spam filters, they have to ensure their fake return
address is actually a valid address.  You can tell when this is happening
because you get nonsense emails saying "Undeliverable mail" as the viruses
etc. get trapped and "returned to sender" i.e. bounced back to you, the
apparent sender.  This can happen to anyone who posts their real address on
Usenet or puts it on the world-wide-web.

It isn't your fault, it doesn't mean there is a virus on your machine, it
doesn't mean anyone has accessed your account and there isn't anything you
can do about it.  This is one sort of identity theft, which is common.  That
said, while I have had my address used lots of times for spam email, I've
never seen it sent to Usenet, that is rather harder.  Are you sure it was
a -newsgroup- and not a list server or website bulletin board. >><BR><BR>

Kaye wrote:
<< > There were 2 posts with that in the subject heading that came through on
9/5
> but I didn't open any of them so don't know if they were actually dealing
with
> that or someone protesting or commenting re. such.  However, there were at
> leaat 9 posts included, with subjects written in capital letters, dealing
with
> spirituality, supreme being, and forms of an after-life, which are also
> inappropriate.
> And as far as the subject heading "Re: is anyone watching these posts?"  I
have
> been having a mail problem with only this email name.  Apparently posts
are
> being sent with this name--but not by me.  One newsgroup which I subscribe
to
> received a post related to b.c. and exercise--not sent by me but which had
to
> be downloaded.  I don't send posts that need downloading -- at least not
> purposefully -- to anyone other  than a single person at a time, if at
all.
> However, this post went to an email list.  I am not sure whether someone
has
> gotten access to my account or it was a virus (to which I foolishly
thought I
> was immune using a MAC, aol, and dial-up).  Anyway, it was posted to the
list
> with a warning that it might be spam.  I don't do 'spam.'
> If anyone has any idea on what may be happening--would appreciate the
feedback.
>  Thanks in advance. >><BR><BR>
bell-lady - 13 Sep 2004 13:05 GMT
Another way you name can show up in a spam From field"
Someone who has your email address in their address book has contracted a
virus/worm etc. whose job it is is to use the address book both as from and
to addresses, send to anywhere it can send to!
No fault of yours!

NOTE: Anyone who thinks they may have a trojan/worm/virus...free help:
Download from download.com:
 AdAware and SpyBot
Install them; use their update button to update its definitions after
installing. Then run the programs and let them repair anything they finds.
Also ABSOLUTELY be sure your are not only running an anti-virus program, but
that its virus definitions are up to date (double click on its icon; most
have the 'database date' or 'definitions date' on their  main screen.).
Ann in PA

To Tim:
How does one enroll in a newsgroup without their real email address, and
many sites online require a REAL email address (one that works) before you
can do stuff there. I can't remember if newsgroups do allow fakes tho..,
seems like I used the word AT or UNDERSCORE instead of the symbols...

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<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
www.ajbservices.com
www.parkavenueumc.org

Tim Jackson - 13 Sep 2004 21:22 GMT
> To Tim:
> How does one enroll in a newsgroup without their real email address, and
> many sites online require a REAL email address (one that works) before you
> can do stuff there. I can't remember if newsgroups do allow fakes tho..,
> seems like I used the word AT or UNDERSCORE instead of the symbols...

Um, you -are- using a fake address.

"Subscribing" to a Usenet newsgroup is something your computer does
internally, there is no registration with any server.  All it does is tell
you computer to keep a list of messages for that group.  When you download
it just requests message lists for the groups you are 'subscribed' to.  What
you do enrol in is a news account with your ISP, but any information given
there does not appear in your posts.

When you post a message, your computer inserts certain header records,
normally including a 'from' address.  In unmoderated groups (like this one)
the address is not usually checked for validity, and you can put what you
like (in the news account properties under the tools/accounts menu item in
Outlook Express).  Further header records are added by your ISP when the
message is posted, eg identifying the originating server and message-id.
This can be used to trace the posting user in cases of abuse if the 'from'
addresses is invalid.

If you post to a moderated newsgroup (unlike this one) then your post first
goes to a (human or robotic) moderator who decides whether it should be
posted.  One criterion is usually whether you (i.e. the identity named in
the reply address) have posted before.

However that is Usenet, which is where we are.  There are other things
around that look like newsgroups but aren't Usenet.  These are websites,
usually called forums, they are accessed by web browsers (like Internet
Explorer), not newsgroup/email browsers like OE.  These can make their own
rules about who can post and usually involve some degree of moderation.
Just to confuse you, Google provides access to Usenet through the Web, but
it's still Usenet, what Google provides is a gateway between the protocols.

Tim
Sandy L - 13 Sep 2004 11:02 GMT
>>i have been an active member of this board for some time.  i keep coming
>> back here because i find great information, great support, and
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> nuisance,but didn't stop me from reading.
> Sandy L
Well, the charm ended.  There were four with obscene titles this morning.  I
have been told that they quite often contain viruses, soopening them even
out of curiosity is unwise.  Just delete them.
Tim Jackson - 12 Sep 2004 08:42 GMT
> i saw some very disturbing posts and i have
> to ask, is anyone watching here?
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> stuff off this board?  there's so much of it everywhere, i don't want this
> board to be corrupted by it, if possible.

Christina, this is an unmoderated "alt" Usenet newsgroup, which means in
principle that anyone is free to post whatever they like, and no-one
controls anything.  Any restrictions are effectively imposed by individual
ISPs, or down to the powers of persuasion of group members.  This is anarchy
in action.

First perhaps a little explanation of how Usenet works would be in order.
Usenet is a broadcast news medium which predates the internet.  In its
present incarnation, it utilises 'idle' time on the internet to propagate
posts around the world.  When you post a message on a newsgroup, you send it
to your ISP's news server.  Your ISP then broadcasts it on the internet.
All ISP news servers (millions of them) listen for broadcasts, and store
them on their hard disks.  As some are inevitably missed there is a
mechanism for 'peer' servers to check against each other to fill in any
gaps.  The news servers decide whether to store a message depending on such
things as whether they intend to carry that newsgroup, and whether they have
enough disk space for that class of message (eg text or "binary" (usually
graphics) may be different classes).  Then when you read the posts in a
newsgroup you are accessing the copies stored on your own ISP's news server.
Each article is only transmitted over the internet once, but many copies are
stored.

This is quite different from the world-wide-web, where a single copy of the
data is stored on one server and is transmitted separately to each reader
around the world on demand, and so each article is transmitted many many
times.  There are also Usenet-to-Web servers around, like Google.

Most ISP's would consider it a breach of their conditions of use to post
offensive or blatantly off-topic material on Usenet.  It is harder to
conceal the origin of Usenet posts than say email, so it is always worth
reporting Usenet spam to the originating ISP, which you can find in the
headers, as a "complaints-to" field, also as the last part of the
"message-id" field.

Of course there are uncontrolled spammers around, and most ISPs also
implement some level of spam filtering to remove these, eg by looking for
cross-posts to certain 'fake' newsgroups the no-one really posts to.  Like
others, I haven't seen any recent porn spam, so my ISP has obviously
filtered out what you are seeing.

So in this case your first port-of-call would be a complaint to your own
ISP's news service.

Tim Jackson
C. Falise - 12 Sep 2004 23:09 GMT
thanks everyone for clarifying this subject.  especially thanks to tim for
the thorough explanation of what the heck we're all doing here logistically.
obviously, i have not quite mastered the electronic age.  i just sort of
stumble around till i find something good, like this group.
hope everyone is well this weekend, and thanks again.  i'll find a way
around the stuff i don't want.
:)
-christina

> i have been an active member of this board for some time.  i keep coming
> back here because i find great information, great support, and occasionally
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> just asking.
> -christina
DebITRC - 13 Sep 2004 16:23 GMT
Besides checking with your own ISP as Tim suggests, I recommend just getting
over it.

Spam tends to come in waves--the same message in every one of my varied (?)
newsgroups. Does anyone else here read misc.fitness.weights?  I thought not.
It's pretty easy to spot and it takes more time to worry about it than to
delete.  

One of the drawbacks of this medium that lets us communicate in so many more
ways than we could before.

Deb
•*•Annie•*• - 13 Sep 2004 07:59 GMT
I'm seeing them here too. Infact there were 4 news ones when I logged on
just now. I won't dignify them by giving "thread titles"  {ugh!}
I don't have the luxury of getting rid of them so I can't see them, as
I'm on a Webtv.
I truly wish there was more we could do also so that we didn't have to
deal with them. {those of us that don't have the option of not seeing
them}
We can always hope that someday there will be a way to deal with this
garbage, for lack of a better word and I do have them but "garbage" is
polite in mixed company... ;-))
Take care there dear/God bless
annie  

Ultimately.....we know deeply that the other side of every fear is a
freedom.

"Courage"...is *fear* that has said it's prayers.
 
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