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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Asthma / May 2004

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Prevent Asthma with Vitamin A

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Danny Kubrick - 24 May 2004 14:35 GMT
This website may interest readers:

http://www.aforasthma.com.au

It has the story of an Australian woman who came across a very good
treatment for asthma. She has written a book which became an
Australian bestseller.  No gimmicks with this one: just a simple
treatment with vitamins A, C & E.
The primary treatment is the use of cod liver oil capsules (a source
of high level vitamin A).  The book was first published in 1996 and
this treatment is starting to line up with some current research where
fish oils are turning out to be beneficial to the treatment of asthma.

The book has some real-life case studies where the use of these
vitamins has worked.
David S-H - 24 May 2004 18:39 GMT
But you have to buy the book to get the secret, which makes me a little
suspicious.  And why does it take a whole book to say 'take x number of cod
liver oil capsules per day to help your asthma'? Or am I just being a cynic?
The other issue I have is that vitamins aren't benign substances. Vitamins A
and E are fat soluble, and in large enough doses can build up and eventually
kill you.

Rgds

> This website may interest readers:
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> The book has some real-life case studies where the use of these
> vitamins has worked.
Mike Edwards - 24 May 2004 20:25 GMT
> > This website may interest readers:
> >
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> > The book has some real-life case studies where the use of these
> > vitamins has worked.

> But you have to buy the book to get the secret, which makes me a little
> suspicious.  And why does it take a whole book to say 'take x number of cod
> liver oil capsules per day to help your asthma'? Or am I just being a cynic?
> The other issue I have is that vitamins aren't benign substances. Vitamins A
> and E are fat soluble, and in large enough doses can build up and eventually
> kill you.

Perhaps more importantly what does it recommend we do for those people
who are allergic to fish?

It's hard enough trying to get decent information on where the source of
the vitamins added to products these days. I lived in Boston for a while
back in '96 and started feeling unwell the within a few days of arriving.

After several months I eventually found out that the wonderful vitamins
that were added to the milk I was drinking got there through pouring
quantities of fish oil straight in to the bottle. Needless to say the
ingredients merely listed milk, vitamin a, etc.
David S-H - 24 May 2004 22:07 GMT
I didn't realise that fish allergy extended to cod liver or fish oil. I
thought fish allergy was due to some kind of protein in the fish flesh, not
in the liver.  I also thought that fish allergy could come from the
parasites that attached themselves to the fish rather than the fish
themselves.  Is that not the case?

Rgds

David

> > > This website may interest readers:
> > >
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
> quantities of fish oil straight in to the bottle. Needless to say the
> ingredients merely listed milk, vitamin a, etc.
CBI - 25 May 2004 13:31 GMT
> I didn't realise that fish allergy extended to cod liver or fish oil. I
> thought fish allergy was due to some kind of protein in the fish flesh, not
> in the liver.  I also thought that fish allergy could come from the
> parasites that attached themselves to the fish rather than the fish
> themselves.  Is that not the case?

No, it is to the fish.

My daughter can react to the vapors if she gets to close to a pan
frying fish. If you touch fish with your hands then her it will leave
read hand prints.

Signature

00doc

David S-H - 25 May 2004 13:58 GMT
I've developed an odd reaction lately to fish (salmon, cod etc).  My mouth
and lips tingle after eating them and my mouth becomes quite dry.  I'm
wondering if I'm developing some kind of allergy to them.  Tuna (not tinned,
but fresh cooked) doesn't seem to affect me.

How is fish allergy detected?  By skin scratch tests?

Rgds

> > I didn't realise that fish allergy extended to cod liver or fish oil. I
> > thought fish allergy was due to some kind of protein in the fish flesh, not
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> frying fish. If you touch fish with your hands then her it will leave
> read hand prints.
Bob - 25 May 2004 14:43 GMT
>I've developed an odd reaction lately to fish (salmon, cod etc).  My mouth
>and lips tingle after eating them and my mouth becomes quite dry.  I'm
>wondering if I'm developing some kind of allergy to them.  Tuna (not tinned,
>but fresh cooked) doesn't seem to affect me.
>
>How is fish allergy detected?  By skin scratch tests?

Yes, among others.  Sensitivity and cross-reactivity (allergy to
other fish species) can be determined by using additional testing
methods.  

A list of allergy testing methods:
http://www.nationaljewish.org/medfacts/testing.html

And a study discussing cross-reactivity among adults:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=8
705636&dopt=Abstract

David S-H - 25 May 2004 20:54 GMT
Thanks for that information.  I do wonder whether it is allergy or merely MS
related oral disturbances (disturbance of tongue, mouth and lip sensory
signals).  I want to get to the bottom of it, whatever, so I can avoid
what's causing it if I need to.

Rgds

> >I've developed an odd reaction lately to fish (salmon, cod etc).  My mouth
> >and lips tingle after eating them and my mouth becomes quite dry.  I'm
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
> And a study discussing cross-reactivity among adults:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=8
705636&dopt=Abstract

Bob - 25 May 2004 23:14 GMT
>Thanks for that information.  I do wonder whether it is allergy or merely MS
>related oral disturbances (disturbance of tongue, mouth and lip sensory
>signals).  I want to get to the bottom of it, whatever, so I can avoid
>what's causing it if I need to.

My pleasure.  Since allergies are common in the general population,
allergies can coexist in a person with MS.  If your problem is the
fish, avoidance should help determine whether or not your oral
symptoms are related.
CBI - 25 May 2004 18:36 GMT
> I've developed an odd reaction lately to fish (salmon, cod etc).  My mouth
> and lips tingle after eating them and my mouth becomes quite dry.  I'm
> wondering if I'm developing some kind of allergy to them.  Tuna (not tinned,
> but fresh cooked) doesn't seem to affect me.

It sound like you are developing a "small bony fish" allergy. I had
never heard of it until sometime last year when the allergist said it
of my daughter. Most of the fish you eat at home are in the family but
Tuna is not supposed to be. Personally, due to cross reactions (not
trusting that they won;t happen) and not wanting to send confusing
messages to a three year old, we just have her avoid all fish. I
assume Swordfish should also not be a small bony fish but would check
on that before trying it.

> How is fish allergy detected?  By skin scratch tests?

Bob gave some good links. Our allergist did blood tests. The
commercial lab had a panel that he ordered.

Signature

CBI, MD

David S-H - 25 May 2004 20:52 GMT
I've not heard of 'small bony fish' allergy before.  I'll look into it,
thanks.  I was surprised that Tuna didn't have any affect, but the others
did.  I had assumed it was something to do with the parasites that I believe
can live on fish, and its they not the fish that can cause the allergy.  The
allergy is therefore apparently intermittent dependant on how the fish is
cooked and at what temperature.

Rgds

> > I've developed an odd reaction lately to fish (salmon, cod etc).  My mouth
> > and lips tingle after eating them and my mouth becomes quite dry.  I'm
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> Bob gave some good links. Our allergist did blood tests. The
> commercial lab had a panel that he ordered.
CBI - 29 May 2004 20:28 GMT
> I've not heard of 'small bony fish' allergy before.  I'll look into it,
> thanks.  I was surprised that Tuna didn't have any affect, but the others
> did.  I had assumed it was something to do with the parasites that I believe
> can live on fish, and its they not the fish that can cause the allergy.  The
> allergy is therefore apparently intermittent dependant on how the fish is
> cooked and at what temperature.

My son's allergist says that he should be able to eat tuna
but we are just keeping him fish free to be safe.

It souns like you are with fish as I am with milk. I can't
drink the stuff. It gives me a lump in the throat and then
hours later makes me wheeze. However, I can eat a lot of
dairy products where the milk has undergone some processing.

Signature

CBI, MD

merlin - 30 May 2004 00:54 GMT
> I've not heard of 'small bony fish' allergy before.  I'll look into it,
> thanks.  I was surprised that Tuna didn't have any affect, but the others
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> > Bob gave some good links. Our allergist did blood tests. The
> > commercial lab had a panel that he ordered.

I would suggest having a look at ciguatera or cigateura poisoning, I
am not real sure of the spelling, but have come across it on several
occasions in the south west pacific tropical areas. It appears to be
related to some kind of worm being eaten by small fish which in turn
get eatem by progressively larger ones, any one eating the end product
have the most incredible symptoms, and every case is different. It
appears to be some kind of "nerve" agent toxin. In some cases it
appears almost immediately whilst others take as much as a fortnight
to be affected.
I did note that natives often catch fish and leave them sitting on the
sand on the beach whilst observing to see if the flies land and remain
on their catch.
Any fish that flies do not land and remain on, get thrown back.
As a general rule the poisoning has long remaining effect and any
second exposure is often fatal. So I don't know that your description
is actually the same as this, but it has a similar ring to it. It is
not apparently detectable by normal means.
You might examine the subject further, but I would be extremely
careful.
Cheers, Merlin
merlin - 30 May 2004 09:05 GMT
> I've not heard of 'small bony fish' allergy before.  I'll look into it,
> thanks.  I was surprised that Tuna didn't have any affect, but the others
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> > Bob gave some good links. Our allergist did blood tests. The
> > commercial lab had a panel that he ordered.

For what it is worth this sounds very similar to a poison that is
quite common in the south-west pacific. Small worm kinds of creatures
appear on the coral reefs, small fish eat them which are in turn eaten
by larger fish. The poison is quite dangerous, as far as I know it is
called cigateura or ciguatera poisoning.
It also involves a kind of neuro toxin which is difficult to detect
normally.
It has strange symptoms which vary case to case, sometimes taking up
to a couple of weeks to appear. It is fatal in some cases.
Anyone affected by the problem should not allow any further exposure
for many years, it can otherwise be extremely dangerous.
Cooking the fish has no effect on the poison. There is supposed to be
a method for testing where a silver coin is placed in a boiler with
the fish whilst it is boiled, if the coin turns black the fish is
poisoned, but I don't know the validity of this method.
The natives have a main method where they leave the fish on the beach
for a period and observe to see if flies land and stay on the fish, if
they land and leave, the fish are thrown away. I don't know if there
is any truth in this method but they seem pretty clever with regard to
these kinds of things.
I have heard of symptoms very similar to those you mentioned.
Cheers, Merlin
Colin Campbell - 25 May 2004 05:18 GMT
> This website may interest readers:
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Australian bestseller.  No gimmicks with this one: just a simple
> treatment with vitamins A, C & E.

Are you aware that this has been studied scientifically and it has
been determined that vitamin supplementation will not prevent asthma?

It is wise to be suspicous of 'health advice' from somebodty trying to
sell you something.
Chefchk - 25 May 2004 05:23 GMT
>Are you aware that this has been studied scientifically and it has
>been determined that vitamin supplementation will not prevent asthma?
>
>It is wise to be suspicous of 'health advice' from somebodty trying to
>sell you something.

Hey Colin - How the heck are ya??

Great to see you posting.  Know  that we are thinking of you and sending you
our best.  If we can send you anything else, you only need to ask.

Take care of yourself - the group isn't the same without you!!

Life is uncertain - eat dessert first.
Nancy
8=: )
 
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