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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Asthma / March 2004

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Difficulty Breathing During and After Eating

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Robbie Allen - 29 Dec 2003 17:10 GMT
I've never been diagnosed with Asthma and I've never had any problems
breathing up until about a year ago (I'm 30 now).  I started to notice
that after a large meal, I would have trouble catching my breath.  The
feeling was like I needed to yawn, but couldn't.  It would take 15-30
minutes before this would go away.  I then started to feel this
sensation while I was eating (very annoying).  But it is very
sporadic.  Sometimes it happens and sometimes it doesn't.  This
morning I took one bite of cereal and it started (so I don't think it
is necessarily related to the amount of food eaten).  It went away but
sure enough after I started to each lunch it came back.

There are no other symptons (no heart burn or anything like that).
Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?
My doctor wasn't very helpful.

Thanks,
Rob
Peter Kolb - 29 Dec 2003 21:09 GMT
>There are no other symptons (no heart burn or anything like that).
>Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?
>My doctor wasn't very helpful.

Probably chronic hyperventilation, Rob.  Eating anything increases
respiration, and for someone who is already over breathing,  CHVS
symptoms can pop up after anything that triggers a further increase in
breathing.

Check out our non-commercial web site.

Peter Kolb
Biomedical Engineer

pkolb@wt.com.au
___________________________________________________

Free information provided by grateful ex-asthmatics

   http://www.wt.com.au/~pkolb/buteyko.htm

__________________________________________________
Colin Campbell - 29 Dec 2003 21:05 GMT
>>There are no other symptons (no heart burn or anything like that).
>>Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>symptoms can pop up after anything that triggers a further increase in
>breathing.

Please note that to this guy - everything is caused by
'overbreathing.'

Your best bet is to see a doctor and get real medical advice.

"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea --
massive, diffucult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a
source of mind boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it."
Gene Spafford 1992
Immuno - 30 Dec 2003 00:10 GMT
> >There are no other symptons (no heart burn or anything like that).
> >Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> symptoms can pop up after anything that triggers a further increase in
> breathing.

<rest of bollocks snipped>

...."PROBABLY......"!!!!!!!!!!

for f***s sake Kolb! Tell the guy to see a f***in' Medic!

[rant over, and excuse me Ladies]

On a "lighter" note, I had very similar symptoms a couple of years ago. They
mysteriously departed.... together with about 50lbs of gut and 6 inches of
girth....Odd!

Pete
ARoberts - 30 Dec 2003 00:45 GMT
> >There are no other symptons (no heart burn or anything like that).
> >Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> symptoms can pop up after anything that triggers a further increase in
> breathing.

This time you're dangerous.  This person needs to get real medical advice,
not provide fodder for your pet delusion.
Peter Kolb - 30 Dec 2003 06:05 GMT
>> >There are no other symptons (no heart burn or anything like that).
>> >Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>This time you're dangerous.  This person needs to get real medical advice,
>not provide fodder for your pet delusion.

Gosh, you and Immuno are a prize couple of twits.

Judging from Robbie's writing style, meticulous attention to
punctuation and intelligent question,  he seems like the sort of guy
who could have worked out for himeslf that he should see a doctor.

In fact, if you two clowns had bothered to read his message, you would
have seen that he actually saught professional medical advice from his
doctor.  But as he points out, his doctor was not very helpful.

Perhaps I should tell Robbie that he should keep seeing his doctor?
Just keep on going back again and again untill he has no more money
left?  Then he can sell his computer and use that money to keep going
back to his doctor.  Then he will no longer be able to bother us on
asa.

Buteyko therapy is, in fact, the best way for Robbie to go.  Why?
Because as the many articles in the medical literature that deal with
CHVS point out,  this is a very common disorder and has never been
addressed by mainstream medicine.  The condition is hardly ever
diagnosed and, apart from Buteyko therapy,  there has been no useful
medical intervention developed.  Doctors are inevitably stuck when
dealing with this condition, as Robbie's doctor  was.

You dick heads should have a little more respect for the people who
write in for advice.  Telling someone he should see a doctor is a
patronizing  insult to his intelligence, especially when he already
has!

Peter Kolb

pkolb@wt.com.au
___________________________________________________

Free information provided by grateful ex-asthmatics

   http://www.wt.com.au/~pkolb/buteyko.htm

__________________________________________________
Colin Campbell - 30 Dec 2003 07:22 GMT
>Buteyko therapy is, in fact, the best way for Robbie to go.  Why?
>Because as the many articles in the medical literature that deal with
>CHVS point out,  this is a very common disorder and has never been
>addressed by mainstream medicine.

Translation - has not been demonstrated to actually exist.

>The condition is hardly ever
>diagnosed and, apart from Buteyko therapy,  there has been no useful
>medical intervention developed.  Doctors are inevitably stuck when
>dealing with this condition, as Robbie's doctor  was.

Of course - it is hard to treat conditions that do not actually exist.

>You dick heads should have a little more respect for the people who
>write in for advice.  Telling someone he should see a doctor is a
>patronizing  insult to his intelligence, especially when he already
>has!

And trying to pull a scam on him with your patent remedy is a worse
insult.

"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea --
massive, diffucult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a
source of mind boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it."
Gene Spafford 1992
ARoberts - 30 Dec 2003 14:33 GMT
> >> >There are no other symptons (no heart burn or anything like that).
> >> >Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> >This time you're dangerous.  This person needs to get real medical advice,
> >not provide fodder for your pet delusion.

> In fact, if you two clowns had bothered to read his message, you would
> have seen that he actually saught professional medical advice from his
> doctor.  But as he points out, his doctor was not very helpful.

The key word, scammer, is 'real'.  That would be to find a doctor who is not
so casual about what could be a potentially dangerous problem.  That would
_not_ be an opportunistic, net-vermin as you who pounces on every chance to
squeeze in a pitch for your pet non-existent 'syndrome'.

> Perhaps I should tell Robbie that he should keep seeing his doctor?

You shouldn't tell him anything; you don't give credible advice.
CBI - 30 Dec 2003 23:14 GMT
> Perhaps I should tell Robbie that he should keep seeing his doctor?
> Just keep on going back again and again untill he has no more money
> left?  Then he can sell his computer and use that money to keep going
> back to his doctor.  Then he will no longer be able to bother us on
> asa.

How would that be different than if he spent all his money on useless
breathing scams?

--
CBI, MD
Richard Friedel - 31 Dec 2003 09:31 GMT
.....

Peter Kolb has been touting a crazy breath therapy here for years on
end.

1) It is often said that most westerners do not breathe correctly and
one could at a stretch of imagination say that having a deficit of
carbon dioxide in the body is due to breathing.
2)  However breathing more than normal (in liters of air per minute)
is not logically treatable with breathing exercises. It might be due
to diabetes, which could not possibly be reversed by (in this case
harmful) breathing exercises.
3) The Buteyko therapy is based on pseudo-science because of its
assuming that excessive carbon dioxide loss could be influenced by
reducing the breathing rate like the course of a chemical reaction
could be influenced by changing the input rate of a reactant into a
reactor.
4) The workings of the lungs and of the breathing muscles are however
heavily dependent on reflexes. Opening the mouth wide as in yawning
does not simply let more air in but expands the lungs by reflex.
5) Therefore "Buteyko therapy" cannot be successful because Buteyko's
theory of breathing is incorrect, probably because of its having been
developed in Soviet Russia by Buteyko (1923-2003) while Russian
science was isolated and out of touch with the rest of the scientific
community.  Buteyko only refers to Russian scientific papers in a
vicious circle.
6) In particular the Buteyko tactic for exercise induced asthma (EIA)
by sticking to nose breathing whatever is misleading because this
reduces exertion capacity.  Training nose breathing to reach a normal
exertion capacity takes 6 months, see John Douillard in "Body Mind and
Sport" page 157.  If an asthmatic faced with the EIA problem cannot
tackle the problem with diaphragmatic breathing, then he should mouth
breathe and not follow Buteyko's tactic.

Generally it seems that while the Buteyko method of curbing an attack
by breath holding may be effective for some, orthodox methods such as
pursed lips breathing and the specific techniques of Prof. Deane
Hillsman of UCLA (http://www.ohiou.edu/isarp/conf_00/papr_19.htm) are
far superior because they take account of airtrapping and are not
misused as an deological launch pad. If Buteyko were pruned down to
specific details and know-how of curbing attacks and freed of the
ideological propaganda and were in the hands of qualified  medical
doctors things might be different. However Buteyko is generally
understood as a method for curing asthma by normalizing carbon dioxide
levels, something which fails to do, see clinical trials on it.  The
levels are unaffected.  Regards and a prosperous New Year, Richard
Friedel

Mistakes are a fact of life. It is the response to error that counts.
Nikki Giovanni
Joan Marie Verba - 30 Dec 2003 00:24 GMT
> I've never been diagnosed with Asthma and I've never had any problems
> breathing up until about a year ago (I'm 30 now).  I started to notice
> that after a large meal, I would have trouble catching my breath.
>
> There are no other symptons (no heart burn or anything like that).
> Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?

Ever consider getting tested for food allergies?

Joan
******************************************
Joan Marie Verba
verba001@tc.umn.edu
http://www.sff.net/people/Joan.Marie.Verba
Robbie Allen - 30 Dec 2003 13:28 GMT
No I haven't been tested for food allergies.  That's a good thought,
but would food allergies be so sporadic?  The only thing I can think
of is it might be is an issue with my weight.  I've gained perhaps 15
pounds since college (10 years ago), but I'm definitely not obese.
Perhaps that coupled with lack of exercise could be contributors. I
think what I really need to do is get back on a workout regimen, loose
10 pounds and see if continues to happen.  I was just hoping someone
had this same problem and could tell me what it is called.

I appreciate the posts so far.  I wasn't expecting an asthma newsgroup
to have such a lively bunch :-)

Rob

> > I've never been diagnosed with Asthma and I've never had any problems
> > breathing up until about a year ago (I'm 30 now).  I started to notice
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> verba001@tc.umn.edu
> http://www.sff.net/people/Joan.Marie.Verba
Joan Marie Verba - 30 Dec 2003 13:58 GMT
>The only thing I can think
> of is it might be is an issue with my weight.

While you're being evaluated for food allergies, you might consider
being evaluated for GERD (acid reflux) as well. That may be a
possibility.

Joan
******************************************
Joan Marie Verba
verba001@tc.umn.edu
http://www.sff.net/people/Joan.Marie.Verba
Bob - 30 Dec 2003 15:54 GMT
>I've never been diagnosed with Asthma and I've never had any problems
>breathing up until about a year ago (I'm 30 now).  I started to notice
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>is necessarily related to the amount of food eaten).  It went away but
>sure enough after I started to each lunch it came back.

At the pleasurable risk of continuing the spirit of lovingkindness in
this thread (BTW Peter, it's one word; dickhead), may I offer another
theory?  You are describing "sighing syndrome," which has been
explained to me by the department head of a nationally respected
dyspnea clinic (not to be confused with a mild-mannered reporter for a
great metropolitan newspaper), to be a variant of hyperventilation
syndrome.

In the following link, scroll down to the functions of the
parasympathetic nervous system, and notice the corresponding
functional changes in breathing and digestion when these nerves are
being stimulated.  Do you have any neck pain or neck stiffness, or did
you suffer a head injury prior to developing this symptom?  I ask
because the parasympathetic nerves exit/enter the spine in the upper
neck, and mechanical irritation of these nerves_may_be a possibility.

http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/auto.html

>My doctor wasn't very helpful.

Ask him/her for a referral.

>Thanks,
>Rob
CBI - 30 Dec 2003 23:13 GMT
> I've never been diagnosed with Asthma and I've never had any problems
> breathing up until about a year ago (I'm 30 now).  I started to notice
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> Just occasional difficulty breathing during/after eating.  Any ideas?
> My doctor wasn't very helpful.

There is a good chance it does have soemthing to do with your wieght gain.
Eating large meals can do this (I know you said it sometimes happens before
being full) and the reflux suggestion is a good one (which is made worse by
increasing weight. I would try to eat smaller meals and lose some weight.

Also - Ignore Peter Kolb. He would have said the exact same thing no matter
what symptoms you described.

--
CBI, MD

--
CBI, MD
Immuno - 31 Dec 2003 02:17 GMT
> There is a good chance it does have soemthing to do with your wieght gain.
> Eating large meals can do this (I know you said it sometimes happens before
> being full) and the reflux suggestion is a good one (which is made worse by
> increasing weight. I would try to eat smaller meals and lose some weight.

No.....: it was me with the weight gain - or rather departure of the similar
symptoms together with the excess kilos. :o)

....Oh, and for the record (not that I need the urge to set anything
"straight") my irritation at Kolb's original reply was at his [almost]
unequivocal distance-diagnosis with such little additional "trivial" detail
to go on. I mean hey! - let's find out how tall and how wide the guy is, and
if his idea of a light snack involve more than the contents of one trolley
of groceries! :o)

Pete
Donald Link - 16 Mar 2004 10:48 GMT
Dump the a.shole doctor.  Trouble is finding another that one that is
not trying to run a profit mill.  I am lucky being a veteran because I
finally went there after spending 15 years with a couple of doctors
that either could care less or just did not know what was the problem.
About 4 years ago I decided to sign up with my local veterans hospital
and was lucky to run across a doctor that was doing research and co
authoring  articles (Dr Sontag) on the relationship with asthma and
GERDs which is a food intake issue.  Since being treated for GERDs my
condition has improved tremendously and can get along with just the
normal asthma drugs and exercise and have not had to visit a hospital
or take steriod tablets since.

>I've never been diagnosed with Asthma and I've never had any problems
>breathing up until about a year ago (I'm 30 now).  I started to notice
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>Thanks,
>Rob
cmd77 - 17 Mar 2004 05:44 GMT
if you find out what the problem is let me know, i have the exact same symptoms.  i've had it since i was young, probably around 12, but didn't consider it a big really big deal.  doctors looked at me like i was making it up when i told them that when i'd yawn it would fix it.  now, it happens from time to time, and i've never known anyone else to have it.  thx
cmd77 - 17 Mar 2004 05:45 GMT
if you find out what the problem is let me know, i have the exact same symptoms.  i've had it since i was young, probably around 12, but didn't consider it a big really big deal.  doctors looked at me like i was making it up when i told them that when i'd yawn it would fix it.  now, it happens from time to time, and i've never known anyone else to have it.  thx
cmd77 - 17 Mar 2004 05:46 GMT
if you find out what the problem is let me know, i have the exact same symptoms.  i've had it since i was young, probably around 12, but didn't consider it a big really big deal.  doctors looked at me like i was making it up when i told them that when i'd yawn it would fix it.  now, it happens from time to time, and i've never known anyone else to have it.  thx
 
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