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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Asthma / April 2006

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Methacholine Challenge

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wev162@yahoo.com - 12 Apr 2006 00:44 GMT
Anyone have any tips on how to ensure the highest probability of
passing a methacholine challenge test without displaying any asthmatic
symptoms, I've heard they have a 10% margin of error for displaying
false positives so I want to do everything possible to boost my chances
of not being labelled an asthmatic. Thanks!
Bob - 12 Apr 2006 00:52 GMT
>Anyone have any tips on how to ensure the highest probability of
>passing a methacholine challenge test without displaying any asthmatic
>symptoms, I've heard they have a 10% margin of error for displaying
>false positives so I want to do everything possible to boost my chances
>of not being labelled an asthmatic. Thanks!

Just pass the test.
aroberts - 12 Apr 2006 04:14 GMT
> Anyone have any tips on how to ensure the highest probability of
> passing a methacholine challenge test without displaying any asthmatic
> symptoms, I've heard they have a 10% margin of error for displaying
> false positives so I want to do everything possible to boost my chances
> of not being labelled an asthmatic. Thanks!

If you don't have the disease, you won't need to worry about the label;

if you do have the disease, the label will be the least of your worries...
Richard Friedel - 12 Apr 2006 07:41 GMT
> Anyone have any tips on how to ensure the highest probability of
> passing a methacholine challenge test without displaying any asthmatic
> symptoms, I've heard they have a 10% margin of error for displaying
> false positives so I want to do everything possible to boost my chances
> of not being labelled an asthmatic. Thanks!

According to recent research (Dr. Gwen Skloot of  Johns Hopkins Medical
Institution) a non-asthmatic reacts like an asthmatic in a challenge
test if prevented from taking a deep inspiration, i. e. whether the
test is passed or not depends on taking a deep breath.

Energetic alternate nostril breathing (nadi sodhani) might with some
patient training do the trick in an asthmatic (and stop asthma) because
then genuine deep breathing might become available.   In alternate
nostril breathing the resistance is doubled. If anything needs to be
labelled it's probably the asthma docs for not understanding the
mechanism behind taking a deep breath, i. e. a certain amount of
airflow resistance in the nose or throat. They don't see any sense in
airflow resistance as such in the respiratory system

So it would healthy and not irresponsible to "cheat" the test in this
way Peace be with ye, Richard Friedel
00doc - 12 Apr 2006 17:20 GMT
What would really be the best would be to be accurately diagnosed.
Being correctly classified as asthmatic would help get the treatment
you need. Being correctly diagnosed as not asthmatic would help the
docs figure out what really is going on. The worst would be being
misdiagnosed either way.

If your first priority is really to not be termed an asthmatic then the
best strategy would be to not take the test and stay away from doctors.
I'm not sure that would be best for your health but it would accomplish
the goal.

Signature

00doc

Richard Friedel - 13 Apr 2006 07:36 GMT
Nobody is suggesting that avoiding all doctors would be healthy.

It's just that they don't generally understand breathing in an
important respect.

Googling with the words "work of breathing" will show that there is
a medical craze for minimizing it.

This makes about as much sense as attempting to minimize the rpm of a
car engine to increase its horsepower.  Experimenting with trying to
breathe with the mouth and throat as wide open as possible and the
tongue protruded will show that breathing is promoted (not hindered) by
placing a finger across the gap between the tongue and the upper lip.
The head is tilted back or the person lies on his back. The possible
depth of breathing increases with a narrower gap.

Therefore some "work of breathing" is necessary for health and
cannot be regarded as a separate option.

Hence the medical view of respiratory  mechanics is  misleading and
simple experimenting gets us back to common sense about the value of
taking a deep breath with a feeling of airflow resistance in the nose.

Getting a square deal from a doctor on asthma would seem to mean
learning to take a deep breath as is implied (but not explicitly
stated) in the research of Gwen Skloot, as the highest priority.
Regards, Richard Friedel
00doc - 13 Apr 2006 17:42 GMT
Googling "Richard Friedel is a loon" shows over 19,000 hits.

I would have thought it might be more. Keep trying.

Signature

00doc

aroberts - 13 Apr 2006 21:46 GMT
>Googling "Richard Friedel is a loon" shows over 19,000 hits.

>I would have thought it might be more. Keep trying.

I believe that he was frightened by bellows at an early age.
Bob - 13 Apr 2006 22:28 GMT
>>Googling "Richard Friedel is a loon" shows over 19,000 hits.
>
>>I would have thought it might be more. Keep trying.
>
>I believe that he was frightened by bellows at an early age.

Who wasn't?

http://idojmikesws.michaeltprice.com/Websitetemplates/J-3.jpg
aroberts - 14 Apr 2006 05:02 GMT
>>>Googling "Richard Friedel is a loon" shows over 19,000 hits.
>>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> http://idojmikesws.michaeltprice.com/Websitetemplates/J-3.jpg

Apparently he wasn't as Jeannie-al as he seemed.
Richard Friedel - 14 Apr 2006 11:48 GMT
Best posting from Dr. Ish since time immorial.  Witty and succinct.
Just keep on with the yoga stuff.

See
http://www.yogayoga.nu/mediyoga/internationell-forskning/muskler-motorik/index.htm
Tapping (typing) improved as well. Regards, Richard Friedel
Richard Friedel - 14 Apr 2006 11:53 GMT
Should read immemorial
Bob - 13 Apr 2006 22:09 GMT
>What would really be the best would be to be accurately diagnosed.
>Being correctly classified as asthmatic would help get the treatment
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>I'm not sure that would be best for your health but it would accomplish
>the goal.

I want to bring you up-to-date on my health problems. I think I'm
finally getting somewhere. Dr. Uhren, my family doctor, has sent me to
several specialists and I wanted you to know everything they've been
telling me.

Dr. Looney, Psychologist, found no psychological problems, sort of.
That was a strange visit. He only asked me two questions and the exam
was over.  I don't know how he learned so much when all he wanted to
know was if I had a computer and how much time I spend reading Richard
Freidel online.  Dr. Blatter, Urologist, gave me a good report.  He
did make the suggestion that I drink less soda and more water. He said
he was having a lot of urinary tract infections among his patients who
are internet users; especially those used to filtering Freidel on a
regular basis.  Dr. Aikenhead, Allergist, said my headaches were being
caused by eye fatigue, not by inverted Kama Sutra postures I picked up
online.

Dr. Bonebrake, Chiropractor, gave me a treatment which should help my
neck. I'm suppose to get an adjustable chair to use at the computer
and set closer to my monitor. Dr. Drewel, Dentist, found that I had an
infected tooth. He has me scheduled for a root canal with Dr. Filler
on Monday. Dr. Whitehead, Dermatologist, says my pale skin color
wasn't a health issue, just a lack of sun.  Now if I can just get
enough sun, that just might kill my dust mites...
00doc - 14 Apr 2006 17:40 GMT
"Dr. Bonebrake, Chiropractor, gave me a treatment which should help my
neck."

Who would believe there might be a chiropractor with this name? Next
time try to be more creative.

A few years ago JAMA (I think) had an article listing ironic/humorous
pairings of doctors specialties and names. If you could find it maybe
you guys could form some kind of support group.

Signature

00doc

Bob - 14 Apr 2006 21:12 GMT
>"Dr. Bonebrake, Chiropractor, gave me a treatment which should help my
>neck."
>
>Who would believe there might be a chiropractor with this name? Next
>time try to be more creative.

There's my cousin, Dr. Vertebrake, my associates Dr.Torquebrake, Dr.
Discobone (boy, can he dance!) and Dr. Neckacre.  A real salty pack of
crackers...

>A few years ago JAMA (I think) had an article listing ironic/humorous
>pairings of doctors specialties and names. If you could find it maybe
>you guys could form some kind of support group.

Here's a list from u.arizona, harvested from MEDLIB-L:

http://www.u.arizona.edu/~stoddard/doctor.htm

I'm not sure I want to commiserate with Dr. Wack,  Dr Handler, The
Drs. Mash or Dr. Bender.
00doc - 15 Apr 2006 01:31 GMT
> Here's a list from u.arizona, harvested from MEDLIB-L:
>
> http://www.u.arizona.edu/~stoddard/doctor.htm
>
> I'm not sure I want to commiserate with Dr. Wack,  Dr Handler, The
> Drs. Mash or Dr. Bender.

Thanks - that list is derived in part from the JAMA article I was thinking
of.

I know a Dr. Love who is a pediatric cardiologist. Of course, it is
impossible to tell if it is the same person.

Signature

00doc

Richard Friedel - 15 Apr 2006 07:16 GMT
Thanks  Don't  forget Dr. Jekyll  and Mr. Hyde and possibly Prof.
Subluxator

And last but not least:
Stephen M. Perle, D.C., M.S.
American Chiropractic Association, Faculty Council Chairperson
Professor of Clinical Sciences
Adjunct Professor of Mechanical Engineering
University of Bridgeport
Bridgeport, CT 06604  USA
www.bridgeport.edu/~perle
Ethics Articles  www.chiroweb.com/columnist/perle
 
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