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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Arthritis / October 2005SSDI & LTD - Help!
Just when I thought my life was going well and that I'd be able to survive, I got hit with a whammy. My HR manager at my former employer told me that I could get LTD and SSDI - no problem. Now I get a letter in the mail from the LTD company that says if I get SSDI that my LTD benefits will be reduced by the amount of the SSDI. Since my SSDI benefits are more than my LTD, that means I get nothing from LTD. Not only that, the letter also states that if I get SSDI I have to pay them back for the LTD they've paid out to me already. In my case, that's $1600. Now, no way do I have that money as I paid bills with it and got everything caught up. I figured the LTD would cover my COBRA. And now I am really screwed as there is no way I can afford COBRA on what SSDI is giving me. If anyone has any advice, I'm listening because I have no idea what I'm going to do. Why can't life leave me alone for a while? Carole (((((carole))))) While I have no answer for you, I do care! Vickie B. I know that when you are accepted for disability, in most states, the check is retroactive to the date that you applied. (I also do know that some states limit how far back the retroactive check can go...one online chatter told me she fought for four years for disability, then when she was finally approved, her state limited the retroactive check to two years. Therefore, she received 2 years retro instead of 4). In light of that, would it be possible for you to use your own long term disability to pay your cobra and to live on, until you receive the retro disability check, then use that to pay back LTD? I am very interested in your answer, because the same situation may be looming in my future. Would it be possible to just live on the LTD until you are eligible for regular SS? (and skip the SS disability altogether?) Since the insurance that you paid for is paying more than SS disability, would you be allowed just to continue collecting from that? I do remember when I signed up for the LTD here in MA, I was told that it kicks in after 6 months out of work, then will pay out UNTIL I START COLLECTING FROM SOCIAL SECURITY. (Which is why I also signed up for the STD, so I would be collecting something for the first 6 months.) What a terrible situation to be in Carole, I am so sorry. (((Carole))) Charlene Hi Charlene, No, I can't live on the LTD alone. My SSDI is more than the LTD since it's based on the salary I was making in New York. The thing that ticks me off the most is that I specifically asked HR about this and the woman told me that I could collect both and that the LTD wouldn't affect the SSDI. I got my SSDI with no problem since my heart condition is what it is, so I started getting it as soon as the six month thing kicked in. Carole > I know that when you are accepted for disability, in most states, the > check is retroactive to the date that you applied. (I also do know that [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > (((Carole))) > Charlene > Hi Charlene, > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Carole Something in this whole situation does not make any sense. They only pay LTD if you are disabled enough to qualify for SSDI. Then they reduce the LTD by the amount of SSDI. Virtually guaranteeing they won't have to pay anyone much of anything. What would they have done if you had been slower to apply for SSDI? Paid you the money and then tried to get it back? If I were in your shoes I'd want a copy of that LTD policy in my hands and I'd not only make myself read the dang thing, I'd be looking for an expert to read it. Oh, and I don't have a lot of faith in anyone who works in HR. Not when it comes to anything that is not run of the mill. Apologies in advance to any HR people out there. Jo > Something in this whole situation does not make any sense. They only pay > LTD if you are disabled enough to qualify for SSDI. Then they reduce the > LTD by the amount of SSDI. Virtually guaranteeing they won't have to pay > anyone much of anything. What would they have done if you had been slower > to apply for SSDI? Paid you the money and then tried to get it back? Absolutely! There is a form with this letter that I am supposed to fill out that says that if I get SSDI I promise to pay them back the money they have sent me. And it says that if you apply and then get a retroactive check, you have to pay them ALL the money back if your SSDI is more than your LTD. Thank God I didn't fill out their EFT form as they would have granted them access to my checking account and they could have taken every penny that I have. Right now that's only about $53 once the rent check is cashed, but to think that they could have drained my whole account? > If I were in your shoes I'd want a copy of that LTD policy in my hands and > I'd not only make myself read the dang thing, I'd be looking for an expert > to read it. Where do I find one of those? > Oh, and I don't have a lot of faith in anyone who works in HR. Not when it > comes to anything that is not run of the mill. Apologies in advance to any > HR people out there. The kicker is that she didn't answer me right away. She said she had to check with her benefits experts. Then she called me and said it would be no problem - that one would not impact the other. Carole Carole, Sorry this is all happening to you. Please find someone who does administrative law and disability law to check on the LTD/SSDI issue and to check the following, which was true when I was practicing law, but that was 15 years ago: If you are collecting SSDI, you are what is called 'judgment proof.' That means though someone can get a judgment against you, they cannot attach any $ from SSDI or SS to collect on that judgment. It means no cash gifts from family; any inheritance could be attached, etc. But they could not go after your SSDI. Now, why is this important? So you can break your lease. Yes, they can sue you for back rent, etc. But if they can't ever collect it, they may just skip the effort. Especially if you are up front with them about why you are moving. When you signed the lease, you were gainfully employed and did not know you had a cardiac condition. Now, that condition prevents you from working and you are disabled. Being on SSDI means you can't afford the apt. So they are better off letting you out of your lease and re-renting it to someone who can pay. I know you've applied for section 8. What about elder/disabled housing. Get on those lists, too, if you haven't already. Adelle > Hi Charlene, > [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] >> (((Carole))) >> Charlene > Carole, > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > family; any inheritance could be attached, etc. But they could not go after > your SSDI. So I wouldn't have to pay the LTD money back? Also, I've never had to get a lawyer for anything. We had a family lawyer growing up but he's in NY and retired now. Is there some place I can call to get a referral for someone who does administrative and disability law? I'm in the state of Washington. > Now, why is this important? So you can break your lease. Yes, they can sue > you for back rent, etc. But if they can't ever collect it, they may just [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > So they are better off letting you out of your lease and re-renting it to > someone who can pay. Actually when I signed this lease, I was on short term disability, but still thought that I'd be able to return to work. The final decision about working was made after the lease was signed. > I know you've applied for section 8. What about elder/disabled housing. Get > on those lists, too, if you haven't already. I haven't applied for section 8 as the waiting lists in Washington are closed. I wish I could get on section 8 as the apartment complex across the street from me is section 8. I am looking into elder/disable housing. I have a friend who works for Habitat for Humanity who is getting me information on those. Thanks, Adelle :) Hugs, Carole >> Carole, >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > So I wouldn't have to pay the LTD money back? Not sure. I was thinking more about getting out of the lease. I don't know the laws for Washington and whether anything has changed since I last practiced (when I was pregnant with my daughter who is now 14). >Also, I've never had to get a lawyer for anything. We had a family lawyer >growing up but he's in NY and retired now. Is there some place I can call >to get a referral for someone who does administrative and disability law? >I'm in the state of Washington. Many volumes of white pages for municipal areas (as opposed to small towns) have an agency listing section in the front that list main numbers for AA, AARP, and other rights and Social Service organizations. I'd start there. Maybe the reference librarian, too. You want to look for disability rights organizations. They'd have acces to referral phone numbers. It may take calling several agencies before you find the right one. Or one might help in the insurance stuff and another in the housing stuff. What you are looking for is: 1 - someone to help tell you whether the local municipality has an elder/disbled housing program, and how you get into it; and 2 - whether you are entitled to the LTD $ in addition to the SSDI; and 3 - if you are legally obligated to pay back the LTD $, is your SSDI $ protected from collections? Adelle > What you are looking for is: 1 - someone to help tell you whether the local > municipality has an elder/disbled housing program, and how you get into it; > and 2 - whether you are entitled to the LTD $ in addition to the SSDI; and > 3 - if you are legally obligated to pay back the LTD $, is your SSDI $ > protected from collections? OK, thanks so much, Adelle. I'll get working on this Monday morning! Hugs, Carole :) >> What you are looking for is: 1 - someone to help tell you whether the >> local municipality has an elder/disbled housing program, and how you get [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > OK, thanks so much, Adelle. I'll get working on this Monday morning! Umm, you might have to wait until Tuesday if municipal offices are closed for Columbus Day in your area. Adelle > Umm, you might have to wait until Tuesday if municipal offices are closed > for Columbus Day in your area. D'oh!!! You are right :) Now that I'm not working anymore I don't think about holidays that are coming since I'm off every day. Hugs, Carole :) > (((((carole))))) > > While I have no answer for you, I do care! > > Vickie B. Thanks, Vickie. Oh Carole, so sorry to hear this, I hope things turn around and you find the help you need. Know that you are in my thoughts, heart and prayers.  SignatureLove and hugs to all Good thoughts coming your way too. Squirrely Jo > Just when I thought my life was going well and that I'd be able to > survive, I got hit with a whammy. My HR manager at my former employer told [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Carole > Oh Carole, so sorry to hear this, I hope things turn around and you find the > help you need. Know that you are in my thoughts, heart and prayers. Thanks Squirrely. At this point, I am just so tired. When I was getting both checks I finally felt that my life was calming down and I could concentrate on deciding what to do with the rest of it since I can no longer work. Now I don't know what to do. The counties in Washington are not even taking section 8 applications anymore. The waiting lists are a mile long. I definitely have to find a cheaper apartment, but I'm locked into a lease until the end of June, 2006. Carole Your welcome Carol I was reading Jo's post to you. I was wondering if you can go to legal aid or something like that that help the poor and see what they say about all this. It doesn't sound right to me that you would have to pay LTD back. I thought that is what we all pay into it for, for when we need it. I sure hope things change quickly for you. I know this stress is not doing you any good. SignatureLove and hugs to all Good thoughts coming your way too. Squirrely Jo >> Oh Carole, so sorry to hear this, I hope things turn around and you find >> the help you need. Know that you are in my thoughts, heart and prayers. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Carole > Your welcome Carol > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > I sure hope things change quickly for you. I know this stress is not doing > you any good. Yes, I am thinking of doing that. This is all their fault and not mine since I specifically asked HR about this. Carole I'd recommend calling your HR manager TODAY to ask for clarification and perhaps for help in dealing with the LTD insurance company. This really sucks. I can't believe they are putting you through even more crap. SignatureNann remove the Gator cheer to email me Simply the thing I am shall make me live --- William Shakespeare > Just when I thought my life was going well and that I'd be able to > survive, I got hit with a whammy. My HR manager at my former employer [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Carole (((((((((((((((((carole)))))))))))))) sigh . . . i'm sorry you're going through this, sweetie. i know how hard it is. we went through the very same thing with butch and boeing's ltd ins. had to send them his entire ssdi retro check. told us ltd was just a stop gap insurance measue until ssdi kicked in. ssdi ins. paying back ltd ins. his ltd was based on 60% of his wages, so after we gave them his entire retro check, they supplimented his ssdi with $53 a month. but they couldn't touch his retirement pension check, which we filed for immediately after that, though the $53 suppliment stopped. we were in a qaundry for awhile, wondering if they wound take his disability retirement check if he filed that way. decided to go with regular boeing retirement pension instaed. what i don't get is how ltd can get away with charging premiums when they lose nothing---no insurance risk for them at all. it's almost like they are a money lender taking their profits out front in the premiums, then lending money out in monthly payments until ssdi gives them their money back. and they still keep the years of premiums. on second thot, i guess the only risk they have is when people die before they can qualify to file for ssdi to reimbuse them. have you applied for medicaid and any stat benefits yet, sweetie? kate Just when I thought my life was going well and that I'd be able to survive, I got hit with a whammy. My HR manager at my former employer told me that I could get LTD and SSDI - no problem. Now I get a letter in the mail from the LTD company that says if I get SSDI that my LTD benefits will be reduced by the amount of the SSDI. Since my SSDI benefits are more than my LTD, that means I get nothing from LTD. Not only that, the letter also states that if I get SSDI I have to pay them back for the LTD they've paid out to me already. In my case, that's $1600. Now, no way do I have that money as I paid bills with it and got everything caught up. I figured the LTD would cover my COBRA. And now I am really screwed as there is no way I can afford COBRA on what SSDI is giving me. If anyone has any advice, I'm listening because I have no idea what I'm going to do. Why can't life leave me alone for a while? Carole > (((((((((((((((((carole)))))))))))))) sigh . . . i'm sorry you're going > through this, sweetie. i know how hard it is. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > risk they have is when people die before they can qualify to file for ssdi > to reimbuse them. Yea, the whole thing is absurd! And there is no way I can pay the money back as what I get from SSDI is all I have to live on. Thankfully I never filled out LTD's ETF form! The thing that ticks me off is that I specifically asked the HR Manager about this and she assured me that I could get both and one would not affect the other. > have you applied for medicaid and any stat benefits yet, sweetie? I don't qualify as my SSDI is over their limit for monthly income. That's why I have to pay COBRA. Carole |
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