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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Arthritis / July 2005

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Newsgroup Spambuster - 10 Jul 2005 03:56 GMT
Hi Everyone,

Sorry to have been absent for so long and then pop in to ask for your
help, but I am desperate!  

I have been thinking of you all and always keep you all in my prayers!!!

Anyways, I have this strange problem that popped up last night and
continues and I am at my wits end as to how to get things back under
control.

Last night / early this morning, I sneezed rather hard and actually
sneezed out a large blood clot (about the size of a quarter) from my
nose.   I know, I know, sorry to be so graphic and gross, but I can't
help it.   Anyways, right after that happened, I got this really severe
bloody nose that took me about 45 minutes to get it stopped.   I did
finally get it stopped, but then have had 5-6 re-occurrences during the
day and this evening.   Seems like when I bend over even just a little
ways or when I look down, my nose starts to bleed and bleed hard.
About a half hour ago, it started once again and I had blood everywhere
because it starts so quickly and gushes so hard at the beginning and
then I get a little light headed and sit down and apply pressure, etc
and wait for it to stop again.   I now have to wash all my bathroom rugs
and the clothes I had on as I got it (blood) everywhere.

Does anyone have any experience with this type of thing?   What may
cause it, why it bleeds so hard and so quickly and so easily?  Anyone
know how to get it to stop???

Please, if you have any suggestions I would greatly appreciate it!!!
Am really hoping I don't have to go to urgent care or the ER.  Not
really how I'd like to spend my weekend!   Grrrrrr......why do these
things always seem to happen either on the weekend or after normal
office hours?!!!!!

Anyways, sorry about the little rant and thanks for listening and for
any and all suggestions you might have to offer!!!

Donna G
d'huit - 10 Jul 2005 04:26 GMT
((((((((((((((((((((donnag)))))))))))))))))))))

think hard on this question, sweetie---have you been anywhere recently where
you may have inhaled irritants of some kind, or, have you used something
recently that could be an upper respiratory irritant for you?

butch and alex both have had these incessant nosebleeds happen and both had
to have their noses packed to get it to stop completely.  in butch's case,
the cause was hay dust; in alex's case, the irritant was an absorbant dust
used to soak up spilled oil in the army.  alex is also alergic to sawdust,
which also causes him nosebleeds.  in both cases, it was exactly how you
described your experience.

hon, i know you don't like the idea, but you might just have to go in and
get your nasal passage looked at, for cuts in the delicate nasal membranes
or accumulated irritants and/or packed.  not to worry about having your nose
packed to staunch the bleeding---unlike 5 or ten years ago, the new medical
nasal packing material is such that you can breathe through it.

boy, i'm sorry you are going through this, sweetie.  hope it stops quickly
for you.

kate

> Hi Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> Donna G
d'huit - 10 Jul 2005 04:37 GMT
oh, i forgot--- also, please remember that you can develop (over time and
through continued use) allergic reactions such as this, to products you
might use all the time, or things you are commonly exposed to, without
realizing an allergy is developing.

think about what you were doing before this all began and trace back 24
hours preceding the first symptoms.

kate

> ((((((((((((((((((((donnag)))))))))))))))))))))
>
[quoted text clipped - 59 lines]
>>
>> Donna G
Joan Carter - 10 Jul 2005 04:38 GMT
>Does anyone have any experience with this type of thing?   What may
>cause it, why it bleeds so hard and so quickly and so easily?  Anyone
>know how to get it to stop???

Get thee to Emergency. It may need to be packed. You can lose a lot of  blood
that way. If the usual things don't stop it, leaning forward, pinching your
nose, ice etc. (and it sounds as if they don't), then you need medical
treatment. I know, spending time in Emerg is not fun, but this is an
order......... Go! :-)

---
Joan
DianeW - 10 Jul 2005 05:19 GMT
Donna - My aunt gets nosebleeds like this but she's on coumadin. Are
you on any blood thinners?  Coumadin, plavix, asperin?  I agree with
Joan I'm afraid. I think you should go to the ER.  I now they told my
aunt she had to stay off her feet for 3 days and stop her coumadin.
There were some other things too but I don't remember.  DianeW
Newsgroup Spambuster - 10 Jul 2005 05:58 GMT
Hi Guys, thanks for your input thus far.  

No, I am not on any blood thinners of any kind nor have I really been
anywhere lately.   In fact, I had been homebound for several days with
an intestinal bug (diarrhea) and it is only the last 3-4 days that I
started getting out and about again.  This literally started in the
middle of the night after the hard sneeze and I can't think of any
unusual exposures I might have had.  I don't have high blood pressure,
in fact, just the opposite.....I take 2 meds to keep my bp up because it
generally runs so low and it used to run so low I would pass out all the
time.   Now, with these severe bloody noses I get a bit light headed and
have to sit down in order not to pass out.  Very strange and not like
anything I have had before.   Am trying now to get my laundry done from
the mess I made earlier, but it is a challenge to keep the nose from
having blood run down my face and also from getting light headed.
Hopefully as soon as the couple of loads that are in the dryer are done,
I can sit down and get this all under control soon  (Guess mopping the
floor will have to wait a bit, at least I got the worst of it up
already.)  If not, I may end up doing what you all suggest and heading
for the ER.   Man is this strange!

Donna G
Joan Carter - 10 Jul 2005 15:47 GMT
>Now, with these severe bloody noses I get a bit light headed and
>have to sit down in order not to pass out.  Very strange and not like
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>already.)  If not, I may end up doing what you all suggest and heading
>for the ER.   Man is this strange!

Donna, screw the laundry, go to emerg. Light-headed is not good. This is sound
nursing advice I am giving here, and I am not even charging. :-)

Go, please.
---
Joan
Duckie - 11 Jul 2005 04:07 GMT
when I was hit in the nose by a baseball as a child,
our neighbor who was a nurse tucked a very hard piece
of paper [like folded piece of a file folder] under my
front lip in front of the teeth. She pushed up on this
piece of paper until it quit bleeding. A finger might
do the same thing. Not sure how but it stopped the
bleeding but it did. anyone else heard of that?
Duckie

> Hi Guys, thanks for your input thus far.  

......  (Guess mopping the
> floor will have to wait a bit, at least I got the worst of it up
> already.)  If not, I may end up doing what you all suggest and heading
> for the ER.   Man is this strange!
>
> Donna G

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Carole - 10 Jul 2005 07:30 GMT
I'm not a doctor but I'd get to the emergency room!  Nose bleeds are
sometimes caused by high blood pressure. But since it's happening over
and over again, better to be safe than sorry. Get moving!!!

Carole

> Hi Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> Donna G
DeeTee and Bob Taggart - 10 Jul 2005 12:07 GMT
Honey - you need to be seen by a doctor! Go to the ER even if it is a pain
in the butt.  That's what the ER is for...emergencies.  You can lose an
awful amount of blood through nosebleeds....get to the hospital! Then come
back here and tell us what they said.

DeeTee
________________________________
DeeTee and Bob Taggart
http://www.marykay.com/dtaggart3
http://mysite.verizon.net/vze8fwov/
________________________________

> Hi Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> Donna G
Harvey R. Stone - 10 Jul 2005 14:00 GMT
> Anyways, sorry about the little rant and thanks for listening and for
> any and all suggestions you might have to offer!!!
>
> Donna G

Hi Donna G,,,,   Only you can estimate how much blood you have lost.   Down
at the hospital they can tell and what is the cause.    Believe me when I
say that things like this are not your fault and it NOT about you getting
this under control.   You may not be able to control what is taking place.
You can cool out. You can control bending over and stay out of the heat.
Please,  please have someone look at what is taking place.   If you take
blood pressure medicine, someone needs to tell what you can take with this
or not.   I have and will continue to pray that this will go away and that
the right help will come for you.
Harv
Lyn - 10 Jul 2005 14:04 GMT
You need to see someone, now.

Lyn
Cooly - 10 Jul 2005 18:49 GMT
> You need to see someone, now.
>
> Lyn

If not sooner.
Cooly
Cindy - 10 Jul 2005 14:41 GMT
You need to go to ER...They can definitely help you...If you are almost
passing out because of this...WEll GO GO GO>...
Okay..
Hugs Cindy

> Hi Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> Donna G
spodosaurus - 10 Jul 2005 14:58 GMT
> Hi Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> Donna G

If it were me, I'd probably risk the ER (and for me, that's a GIGANTIC
risk). Then again, if it were me I'd be risking severe blood loss due to
lack of platelets. If you're on any of the immunosuppressive
anti-arthritis drugs that have the potential to suppress bone marrow
function, go to the ER. Your platelets may have suddenly dipped if
you're still bleeding heavilly after this long.

Ari
Adelle - 10 Jul 2005 17:15 GMT
Deary,

It has now been more than 24 hours and your nose is still bleeding. And
everyone here has told you to get to the ER!

If you are not already on your way there, climb out of the river and get
someone to drive you to the ER. The nosebleed has the potential of being a
very serious issue. Losing blood means losing lots of red cells. It also
means losing lots of white cells. For someone on an immunosuppressant, that
can be serious stuff.

Even if this isn't a matter of a foreign body causing a scratch which bled,
it could be a ruptured vessel from the force of the sneeze. If it has bled
this long, It's probably too big to clot on its own; it may need cautery to
seal it and stop the bleeding (my friend's 6 year old daughter needed that).
Not something that will fix itself.

We love you. Get going!!!!!

...

...

...

Why are you still reading this and not on the phone to get a ride to the ER?

Love, Adelle

> Hi Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> Donna G
Newsgroup Spambuster - 10 Jul 2005 18:49 GMT
Once again I thank you all for your suggestions, your support, and your
concern!   What a wonderful bunch you are!!!

OK, here is how the last 12 hours or so have played out.   I ended up
finally managing to get the laundry done and the bloody mess cleaned up
for the most part last night.   Since I continued with the bloody noses,
I paged the ENT on call and talked to him.   He suggested trying a
cotton ball soaked with Afrin nasal spray as I guess this helps
constrict the blood vessels and often will help bloody noses stop.
This seemed to help considerably slow things down and during the night I
still had oozing but not the huge gushing I was having.   The ENT called
back this morning (what a sweetheart,  I sure wasn't expecting that!)
and after learning that I was still having some bloody nose although not
as bad, he recommended I still go to the ER and get this checked out.
So, off to the ER I went and spent several hours there.   They said it
looked like I had a pretty nasty sinus infection but also felt that the
bloody nose thing was from a combination of the infection and the
dryness caused from my continuous oxygen use.    They packed the side
with a packing soaked in an antibiotic solution and I will have to have
that in for 3 days and then removed by the ENT so they can further
evaluate to see if further action like cautery or surgery to ?ligate the
vessel is needed.   They started me on an oral antibiotic to take for
the next 21 days.   They gave me several bags of fluids as my bloodwork
showed my ?hemaglobin had dropped from a normal of 13 down to I think he
said 7 or 8.  Anyways, low enough for them to want to get some more
fluids on board.   Thankfully I got there before the blood work numbers
got too low, cause the ER doc said if they had been much lower they
would have had to admit me and even think about giving me some blood!
Wow, never thought a stupid bloody nose could cause so much problems!!!
I am to rest and do nothing strenuous at all for the next 3 days.  Don't
know how that is going to happen when you live alone and no one is
around to help with things.  Oh well, will get it all figured out.
So, that is my saga and I will follow up with the ENT this week to
figure out what might be next.   The doctors in the ER also suggested
keeping on hand the afrin nose spray and cotton balls in case I run into
future problems like this again.   Sheesh, never a dull moment!!!
Keep them prayers going if you don't mind, so hopefully this will end up
being done with and no further monkeying around will be necessary!

Thanks again everyone for your prayers and your loving concern---I
appreciate it more than words can say!!!

Lots of hugs and wishes for painfree days for all of you!!!

Donna G
spodosaurus - 10 Jul 2005 19:02 GMT
> Once again I thank you all for your suggestions, your support, and your
> concern!   What a wonderful bunch you are!!!
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
>
> Donna G

A drop that fast to a haemoglobin of 7 or 8 is VERY serious! Heck, I
prefer to be transfused at 9 and don't like letting it drop below 8.
Then again, the normal range of haemoglobin for adult males is higher
than that for adult females, so keep that in mind (ie - my hb of 9 may
be similar to your hb of 7 to 8). Still, I have a fatal bone marrow
failure disorder, you had a blood nose! It just goes to show that even
things that we consider minor because of the connotations associated
with the phrase, such as 'bloody nose', can inhibit our seeking the
medical care we need. I'm VERY relieved to hear that you've started to
get this mess sorted (sinus infections can lead to serious bleeding, as
I'm just finding out myself).

Ari
Adelle - 10 Jul 2005 19:14 GMT
Donna,

So glad and relieved that you got medical attention! Now, follow your
discharge orders!!!!

Let the housework sit. Eat leftovers, canned stuff or eggs. Do sedentary
stuff, etc....

Is there a way to humidify the oxygen like they do at the hospital?

Adelle
Carole - 11 Jul 2005 02:39 GMT
Prayers being said, Donna, and I'm glad you took everyone's advice and
went to the ER. I've been thinking about you all day and hoping you were
OK :)

Hugs,
Carole :)

> Once again I thank you all for your suggestions, your support, and your
> concern!   What a wonderful bunch you are!!!
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
>
> Donna G
DeeTee and Bob Taggart - 11 Jul 2005 09:05 GMT
Good thing you called.  I HATE having oxygen...it gives me a terrible
headache and, yep, nose bleeds.

DeeTee
________________________________
DeeTee and Bob Taggart
http://www.marykay.com/dtaggart3
http://mysite.verizon.net/vze8fwov/
________________________________
> Prayers being said, Donna, and I'm glad you took everyone's advice and
> went to the ER. I've been thinking about you all day and hoping you were
[quoted text clipped - 48 lines]
>>
>> Donna G
d'huit - 11 Jul 2005 03:02 GMT
> Once again I thank you all for your suggestions, your support, and your
> concern!   What a wonderful bunch you are!!!
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
>
> Donna G

(((((((((((donnag))))))))))  i'm very relieved you went to er, sweetie.
sinus infections can become serious if not attended to.  i'm not sure, but i
think ligate mean to tie it off.  maybe one of the nurses on asa can define
that better for you.  still keeping you in my prayers and healing thoughts.

kate
Duckie - 11 Jul 2005 04:13 GMT
Ah - glad glad glad you went. Good to know about the
Afrin trick. I know damp tea bags will stop a mouth cut
from bleeding but couldn't figure out how you would
stuff that up your nose. I don't envy your 21 days on
antibiotic. Hope you have some yogurt in the house. So
what do you do when oxygen dries out your nose and you
need oxygen. that seems like a no win situation.
Duckie

> Once again I thank you all for your suggestions, your support, and your
> concern!   What a wonderful bunch you are!!!
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
>
> Donna G

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Squirrely - 12 Jul 2005 19:35 GMT
Donna,

Glad you went to the ER was worried about you. I hope you heal quickly and
that you need no further treatment for the bloody nose things.

Signature

Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> Once again I thank you all for your suggestions, your support, and your
> concern!   What a wonderful bunch you are!!!
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
>
> Donna G
Navy1 - 12 Jul 2005 21:51 GMT
<clip>
>I am to rest and do nothing strenuous at all for the next 3 days.  Don't
>know how that is going to happen when you live alone and no one is
>around to help with things.  Oh well, will get it all figured out.
<clip>
>Donna G

The one positive thought in that is that there is no one to mess it up
either!  :-)
Sure glad you got it fixed anyhow.  I had lots of sinus problems and
continued congestion until I gave up dairy products and started taking
calcium supplements (with vitamin D).  Now, I do much better just
taking Nasonex spray and an antihistamine Allegra.  Good luck on all
and get a couple of good books out and forget the housework.
That's why they invented delivery food and paper plates!

Loujean

FEARS
Known fears are uncomfortable,
Unknown fears a danger-
They haunt the back, pinch the neck-
I feel like an overused Ranger:
You know, the one who's 'lone.
But I'm not really, you see,
For I have God, family, and friends
To give support to me.

Loujean Baker
1994

Loujean
Retired and love it.
Throw that FISH out and
put in an S to email me.
Duckie - 11 Jul 2005 04:00 GMT
Hopefully you have it stopped by now but was thinking
that maybe the oxygen has the membranes irritated and
they are bleeding easily because of it.
I'll keep reading on further.
Duckie

> Hi Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> Donna G

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Diane - 11 Jul 2005 04:13 GMT
oh, donna, what a miserable time you've had! i'm so glad that you went
to the e.r. and hope you're not too, too uncomfortable over the next
few days. hugs coming your way,

diane
debbie m. - 11 Jul 2005 17:29 GMT
Donna,

I'm so glad to hear your feeling better!

debbie m.

> Hi Everyone,
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> Donna G
 
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