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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Arthritis / December 2004

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Psoriasis question

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Squirrely - 15 Dec 2004 08:23 GMT
I have only had it on my head. So I have not really been following the stuff
on this.

Now I have it on  my forehead also and it is headed for the eye. It is down
on the eye lid and beside the eye. Is this dangerous?

Is this something I need to see the dr about right away?

I guess my real question is can it go in the eye and do damage to the eye?

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Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

Harvey R. Stone - 15 Dec 2004 13:24 GMT
>I have only had it on my head. So I have not really been following the
>stuff
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Squirrely Jo

Hi Jo,   I guess your RD knows about the Psoriasis.   You might have PA in
the inflam.arth. family.
We have several people in this newsgroup that have this and I hope some of
them see your post.  I can not help you.
Harv
Squirrely - 18 Dec 2004 03:26 GMT
Harv, Rosie, and Nann,

Thanks Harv, don't have a RD anymore. She kicked me out. Couldn't treat my
OA because of allergies so she didn't want to check for anything else.

Rosie, I don't think it will happen with all this other stuff going on right
now and not having an RD yet.

Nann, Thanks for your response and that was a good article.
I do have problems with the eyes but that has been happening for months now
because of allergies so not sure how to tell if it is different now
compaired to usual allergy stuff. They are always dry, scratchy and sand
papery. Even when I had my eye exam last Jan, I told them about it. Saw two
eye drs on the issue.

I am now beginning to wonder if some of the rash couldn't be the psorasis
moving around. I am sure I will soon find out. ;-)

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Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> Hi Jo,   I guess your RD knows about the Psoriasis.   You might have PA in
> the inflam.arth. family.
> We have several people in this newsgroup that have this and I hope some of
> them see your post.  I can not help you.
> Harv
Nann Bell - 18 Dec 2004 14:04 GMT
> Nann, Thanks for your response and that was a good article.
> I do have problems with the eyes but that has been happening for months now
> because of allergies so not sure how to tell if it is different now
> compaired to usual allergy stuff. They are always dry, scratchy and sand
> papery. Even when I had my eye exam last Jan, I told them about it. Saw two
> eye drs on the issue.

I hate to say it as you have too many doctors already, and you've had too
many BAD docs lately, but you may need to see a derm about the rash and/or
psoriasis.  I'm thinking that because there are lots of new meds out for Ps.  
Anything that can be done to help you feel better in at least one way, would
be a step in the right direction.

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Simply the thing I am shall make me live --- William Shakespeare

Squirrely - 20 Dec 2004 03:48 GMT
Thanks Nann, I was thinking I might have to see a derm. I haven't had to see
one in awhile. I used to have to go quite a bit years ago because of the
ecezema (sp) but outside of the hands that seems to be better controlled
lately.

Yeah like I need another dr. ;-)

Hey the more heads, the better to get answers right. ;-)

Nann, you too with the carbon monoxide poisoning. We had it bad too oh about
5-6 yrs ago. They said the reading for it was really bad. They didn't know
how we made it out of there as ok as we did. That is probably what prompted
my lungs to get so bad to begin with.

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Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> > Nann, Thanks for your response and that was a good article.
> > I do have problems with the eyes but that has been happening for months now
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> Anything that can be done to help you feel better in at least one way, would
> be a step in the right direction.
Nann Bell - 22 Dec 2004 15:15 GMT
> Nann, you too with the carbon monoxide poisoning. We had it bad too oh about
> 5-6 yrs ago. They said the reading for it was really bad. They didn't know
> how we made it out of there as ok as we did. That is probably what prompted
> my lungs to get so bad to begin with.

Our CO poisoning was more bizarre.  It happened my senior year of high school
when the band went to Mexico for a special band festival.  Something happened
to the decent busses we were supposed to have for a trip out of Mexico City.  
We ended up on Mexican school busses and they were really dilapidated.    We
were climbing out of the city and the busses couldn't go over about 20 mph.
we were all breathing in the fumes of the busses in front of us, after 4 days
in a highly polluted city and at an altitude we Floridians had difficulty
with anyway!  8 of us in the last of the 4 busses ended up with carbon
monoxide poisoning.  Didn't know what the deal was at first - it was just far
more difficult to play when we got to Toluca.  Then we started feeling sick
to our stomach and having some trouble breathing at all.  One person fainted.

Fortunately for us, there was a medical school in town that lots of Americans
attended, and they staffed the emergency facility in town.  They kept an eye
on us going back to Mexico City and got us on oxygen when we got there.  Then
the 8 of us ended staying an extra day and being put on oxygen again at the
airport as the trip through town apparently triggered things again.  They
just told our parents we were ill without giving details so my mom expected a
bad case of diarrhea.  She later told me that she has never seen me as white
as I was when I finally got home.

Four of us went to the same family practice group, though to 3 different
docs.  Poor guy on call dealt with a lot of CO poisoning calls the night we
got back!  We ended being excused from school for several days by the school
board.  It was a year or two before my lungs seemed truly recovered.  I
sometimes wonder what else we were breathing in!

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Nann
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Simply the thing I am shall make me live --- William Shakespeare

Gwen Love - 22 Dec 2004 17:49 GMT
Nann, your speaking of lung problems makes me wonder if that is why I now
have pulmonary fibrosis.  I had carbon monoxide poisoning when I was about 5
or 6.  I was going with my uncle's family from the farm to Savannah, GA. and
we left very early in the morning.  I went to sleep in the back seat with my
nose in the division between the seat and the back.  When I started kicking,
they stopped and I was passed out.  We went on to Savannah and I was in bed
all day at my aunt's house,
had a bad, bad headache all day and was given several enemas.  I was so
embarrassed that my uncle went in and out during all this time; nobody
thought a young one like me needed privacy!!  I now have a carbon monoxide
detector in my house.
Gwen

> > Nann, you too with the carbon monoxide poisoning. We had it bad too oh about
> > 5-6 yrs ago. They said the reading for it was really bad. They didn't know
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> board.  It was a year or two before my lungs seemed truly recovered.  I
> sometimes wonder what else we were breathing in!
JOYHTON - 22 Dec 2004 19:00 GMT
>> Nann, you too with the carbon monoxide poisoning.

I don't know if anyone else has posted about NYC's new law requiring mandatory
installation of CO detectors as well as smoke detectors in apartments.  (I
don't know about single family dwellings.)  My building just recently installed
new detectors in all our apartments that combine both CO and smoke.

They are so efficient that all I have to do is turn on the oven in the kitchen
and the thing goes off.  So now if I am going to roast or bake anything, I turn
it off before I warm up the oven.

It's a really loud, piercing shriek.  First time I heard it, I almost hit the
ceiling.

Joyce
Gwen Love - 22 Dec 2004 20:45 GMT
The only time mine has gone off was when I was having carpets cleaned in
Florida.  Neither the carpet cleaner or I could figure what it was; thought
it was a smoke alarm but went to each one and couldn't find it.  Finally he
noticed the CO detector and turned it off.  Then he immediately got his
machine out of the house.
Gwen

> >> Nann, you too with the carbon monoxide poisoning.
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>
> Joyce
Squirrely - 30 Dec 2004 01:37 GMT
It does make you wonder doesn't it. You could have been breathing in so many
different things that could have harmed you.

I know once the damage is done with the CO poisoning they say it can't be
fixed. Many people have alot of damage done to them that is long term
because of it.

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Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> Our CO poisoning was more bizarre.  It happened my senior year of high school
> when the band went to Mexico for a special band festival.  Something happened
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
> board.  It was a year or two before my lungs seemed truly recovered.  I
> sometimes wonder what else we were breathing in!
Nann Bell - 15 Dec 2004 14:17 GMT
> Is this something I need to see the dr about right away?
>
> I guess my real question is can it go in the eye and do damage to the eye?

Psoriasis CAN go into the eye, but it doesn't generally TRAVEL from the skin
around the eye into the eye.  It's generally a separate onset of psoriasis.  
If your eyes are feeling particularly scratchy and/or dry and/or
"sand-papery", get thee to a doctor.  That could be psoriasis affecting the
eye.  The difficulty is separating that from allergies affecting the eye.  My
rule of thumb has been if eye problems coincide with other allergy flare-ups
and the eyes are markedly improved with allergy eye drops, I don't worry.  So
far, I've had only allergy problems with my eyes though I have had an
occasional outbreak of Ps around the eyes.

However, you need to be extremely careful with using psoriasis preparations
around the eyes.  I've only had very small outbreaks in the area, right in
the outside corner of my eye, and have managed to get away with very careful
application of OTC stuff but I wouldn't advise that with the amount of
coverage you mention.  You should talk to the doctor about what to use on it.
You might be able to cover that point over the phone rather than having to
go in.  Or wait until you go in, just using moisturizer on it for now, as you
have to go to the doctor so often anyway.

Below I'm pasting an article that was posted on the psoriasis newsgroup about
a MAJOR breakthrough in psoriasis research.  It is really exciting news and
is already leading to new treatments.  If this pans out, then they can begin
focussing on PsA!

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Simply the thing I am shall make me live --- William Shakespeare

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6705773/

Study links key protein to psoriasis
Research on mice could lead to effective treatment

Updated: 12:39 p.m. ET Dec. 13, 2004WASHINGTON - Researchers said
Sunday they may have discovered what causes psoriasis, a common and
irritating skin ailment, and said their findings may open the way to an
effective treatment.

They found that it takes a combination of a protein called STAT3 and an
active immune system to cause psoriasis, which experts estimate affects
as much as 2 percent of the population.

Their finding suggests that psoriasis may start with an
over-enthusiastic attempt by the body to heal wounds.

And the researchers at The University of Texas M. D. Anderson Cancer
Center made a skin cream that blocked the process that leads to
psoriasis in mice.

"We may have found an entirely new treatment option for psoriasis,"
said M.D. Anderson's John DiGiovanni, who led the study.

"We have developed a mouse model that exhibits all the major features
of human psoriatic lesions and shown we can reverse those steps."

Research opens door to new treatment
Psoriasis is a chronic condition in which patches of skin become
inflamed and become itchy, red and flaky. There is no good treatment,
although symptoms can be alleviated.

The disease involves skin cells called keratinocytes that grow too fast
and too abundantly.

"There has been an ongoing controversy about whether the primary
defect in psoriasis is in the immune system or in the keratinocytes,"
DiGiovanni said in a statement.

"We may have found the link -- the change in keratinocytes that
cooperates with the immune system cells necessary for development of
human psoriasis."

Writing in the journal Nature Medicine, the researchers said they
looked at STAT3, a protein involved in wound healing and the
development of skin cancer.

Activated STAT3 is essential for wound healing. When the healing
process is complete, normal STAT3 returns to its inactive form. But
when it fails to turn off, the wound healing process continues and skin
cells proliferate.

DiGiovanni's team first looked for activated STAT3 in the skin of
psoriasis patients and found high levels of activated STAT3 in
psoriasis lesions in 19 of 21 of them.

They bred a mouse in which STAT3 is always turned on in the
keratinocyte skin cells, and these mice always developed psoriasis.

The researchers then developed a solution containing a small piece of
DNA called an oligonucleotide, which was designed to prevent STAT3 from
activating genes.

It helped clear up the lesions in the mice.

"This study opens the door to a whole new kind of therapy for
psoriasis," said DiGiovanni.

Copyright 2004 Reuters Limited. All rights reserved. Republication or
redistribution of Reuters content is expressly prohibited without the
prior written consent of Reuters.

Rosemarie Shiver - 15 Dec 2004 20:46 GMT
   Which one is it that I've seen: the commercial with folks dancing around
'cuz their psoriasis is in remission? Is it Enbrel or Remicade?

    Either way, I'd like to see Squish on the appropriate one to see if it
gets rid of the majority of her symptoms. :-)

Treatment Hugs from Rosie

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"If you wanna get it done, you gotta fight for yourself" -- Meat Loaf, Bat
Outta Hell II

> > Is this something I need to see the dr about right away?
> >
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
> is already leading to new treatments.  If this pans out, then they can begin
> focussing on PsA!
Bruce - 15 Dec 2004 22:55 GMT
My Derm never fools around when psoriasis is anywhere on the face for if it
get to the eyes it can cause damage.  Dovonex is cream of choice for
forehead.  Also my derm will begin either prednisone or MTX if face does not
show rapid (4-7) days improvement.
I have asked my Derm about the biologicals for psoriasis.  His cousin who is
in practice with him was part of the clinical trials here.  While there is
evidence that they may work he does not believe the rate of success vs cost
is worth prescribing it widely.
With me the Prednisone usually settles it down, but we need to weigh it's
effects (I'm now experiencing adrenal suppression).
Bruce
>    Which one is it that I've seen: the commercial with folks dancing
> around
[quoted text clipped - 48 lines]
> begin
>> focussing on PsA!
Squirrely - 16 Dec 2004 20:37 GMT
Thank you Bruce and the others too.

I am still reading the others and will respond as I can.

I cringed when I read your post though Bruce. I kind of figured that if it
was bad it would have to be treated with pred. I don't think I can do pred
right now because of my cortisol levels being up so high. I really hate this
body at times. ;-)

I will have to call in and find out who they want me to see about this. I
did put some lotion on my forehead and hope it will help keep it at bay till
I can get in to see someone.

I am sorry Bruce, adrenal suppression, is that where the adrenal gland quits
producing cortisol. So then you have to use pred to keep it at a balance. My
brain is not working yesterday or today for some reason.

So you have just the psoriasis or do you have the PA. If you have the PA who
do you see about it. Does the Derm take care of that or do you have to go to
a RD for it. Just wondering because I already saw a RD and she thinks my
arthritis is just OA.

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Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> My Derm never fools around when psoriasis is anywhere on the face for if it
> get to the eyes it can cause damage.  Dovonex is cream of choice for
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> effects (I'm now experiencing adrenal suppression).
> Bruce
Bruce - 16 Dec 2004 23:20 GMT
Yes, my adrenal glands produce minute amounts of cortisol, my recent test
was 7 normal range at our hosp is over 175.  My ACHT was positive so my
adrenals are not shutting down just highly suppressed secondary to the use
of Inhaled Steroids and Prednisone.
I have PA as well as OA and osteoporosis as the result of the steroids.
My PA is managed by my RD.  She is a friend of my derm.  Thy will consult
each other when drugs are used that have a crossover use, ie.MTX both derm
and RD have used it but they consult each other first as it is good for both
and my derm may wish to lower other meds while i'm on MTX.
Bruce
> Thank you Bruce and the others too.
>
[quoted text clipped - 40 lines]
>> effects (I'm now experiencing adrenal suppression).
>> Bruce
Squirrely - 17 Dec 2004 04:44 GMT
Bruce,

that is not good with your adrenals not working right. I wish you the best
with it.

I am sure I am not far behind you though because of using pred for my lungs.

That is good that your RD and Derm work together like that. I am hoping that
my endo and PCP will eventually do that also.

Signature

Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> Yes, my adrenal glands produce minute amounts of cortisol, my recent test
> was 7 normal range at our hosp is over 175.  My ACHT was positive so my
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> and my derm may wish to lower other meds while i'm on MTX.
> Bruce
Bruce - 17 Dec 2004 10:51 GMT
Jo

I have not had to use Pred for my lungs in some time.  My Respirologist put
me on advair500 1 puff twice daily and Qvar100mcg 2 puffs twice daily.  That
is a hefty dose of inhaled steroid but has the efficacy equal to that of
Prednisone.  It is easier on the body also.  The only draw back is cost, you
really need a good drug plan for those puffers.
Bruce
> Bruce,
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>> and my derm may wish to lower other meds while i'm on MTX.
>> Bruce
Nann Bell - 17 Dec 2004 14:51 GMT
> I have not had to use Pred for my lungs in some time.  My Respirologist put
> me on advair500 1 puff twice daily and Qvar100mcg 2 puffs twice daily.  That
> is a hefty dose of inhaled steroid but has the efficacy equal to that of
> Prednisone.  It is easier on the body also.  The only draw back is cost, you
> really need a good drug plan for those puffers.
> Bruce

that's great that your doc found something less difficult for the body that
works.  I always feel for you asthma folks.  I had carbon monoxide poisoning
once and I well remember that feeling of not being able to breathe.  It's
awful.  Can't imagine doing it over and over.  Luckily my allergies still let
me breathe through my mouth even when my head is completely clogged.

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Simply the thing I am shall make me live --- William Shakespeare

Squirrely - 20 Dec 2004 03:55 GMT
Bruce,

I am sure you have a good dr that is watching you. But I heard that there is
something with advair. I think that it caused either more respiratory
problems or heart stuff. I can't remember what exactly at the moment. darn
brain fog. I know I was telling Debbie H, (who should someday soon be
joining us here) about it because she has lung and heart problems.

I am glad you have something that helps though.

I have not had to be on pred for awhile now but I have a feeling i will be
soon. Got Jims flu and it seems to be in lungs now.

I usually get away with using my nebulizer twice a day. I stopped my
inhalators a few weeks ago. Now I will probably have to go back on them
again too.

Signature

Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> Jo
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> really need a good drug plan for those puffers.
> Bruce
Bruce - 20 Dec 2004 16:20 GMT
Yes, it is with the Serevent component of the medication.  It's a heads up
from the SMART study done in Boston.   My Resp. informs me that these
results were specific to African American men.  She said no other
populations have showed anything yet.  I guess that the risk we all take
with any meds, especially newer ones.
Bruce
> Bruce,
>
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
>> really need a good drug plan for those puffers.
>> Bruce
Squirrely - 21 Dec 2004 20:30 GMT
I am glad you will be ok with it. I was worried there.

Signature

Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> Yes, it is with the Serevent component of the medication.  It's a heads up
> from the SMART study done in Boston.   My Resp. informs me that these
> results were specific to African American men.  She said no other
> populations have showed anything yet.  I guess that the risk we all take
> with any meds, especially newer ones.
> Bruce
Nann Bell - 16 Dec 2004 01:52 GMT
>     Which one is it that I've seen: the commercial with folks dancing around
> 'cuz their psoriasis is in remission? Is it Enbrel or Remicade?

Enbrel - it recently was officially approved for psoriasis though it has been
used for it for several years by folks whose docs could get it past the
insurers.

>      Either way, I'd like to see Squish on the appropriate one to see if it
> gets rid of the majority of her symptoms. :-)

Amen.

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Simply the thing I am shall make me live --- William Shakespeare

Rosemarie Shiver - 16 Dec 2004 02:07 GMT
Thanx, Nann!

Enbrel for Psoriasis Hugs from Rosie

Signature

"If you wanna get it done, you gotta fight for yourself" -- Meat Loaf, Bat
Outta Hell II

>
> >     Which one is it that I've seen: the commercial with folks dancing around
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Amen.
Scottie - 18 Dec 2004 18:30 GMT
Squirrely,

 I have PA and for quite a while on and off as the P flared and spread, I
too had it move toward and in fact get onto the eyelids.
At that time my dermatologist did prescribe some cream or ointment for areas
on my face. I had gotten dovonex for other areas but not for the face.
The strength of the ointments for the face are generally not as strong. For
the eyelid you do have to be extremely careful!

I havent had eyelid involvement since before I went on enbrel for PA.
Although I wasnt ever in any trials, I was likely one of the first PA
patients given enbrel off-label as its been 5 years now.
It was obvious that enbrel was EXCELLENT treatment for my P as it cleared it
all up (and creeps back when I go off enbrel short term).
Dont know if my doc did or did not but he often commented that he'd have to
tell Immunex how effective it was for P and that I would have been a good
"poster child" example of how enbrel worked for both PA and P.

> I have only had it on my head. So I have not really been following the stuff
> on this.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> I guess my real question is can it go in the eye and do damage to the eye?
Squirrely - 20 Dec 2004 03:52 GMT
Scottie,

Sorry to hear how you have had to deal with the PA.

I am putting some jergens face cream on forehead and cheek area and around
eyes but not real close to eye and it seems to be helping. I hope that gives
me time to get over this flu before I have to go see the dr about it.

I think I have it on the eyelids or rims whatever you want to call it.
I have dandruff (sp) flaking on the eyelashes too. So I think I waited too
long.

Signature

Love and hugs to all
Good thoughts coming your way too.

Squirrely Jo

> Squirrely,
>
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> tell Immunex how effective it was for P and that I would have been a good
> "poster child" example of how enbrel worked for both PA and P.
 
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