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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Arthritis / June 2008How to recover from painful ligament or cartilage problems?
I am 62 years old. I am a right hand person. Around 9 months ago, my left middle finger’s middle and bottom joints around the knuckle areas, started to be painful, particularly in the morning. When I tried to bend my middle finger, I feel the joint movement not smooth, kind of snap and bounce like a toggle switch. I am unable to fold and curl my middle finger back to touch my palm, like trying to hold a fist. When I put my finger in hot water, the joint movement is smoother and less painful. I am taking Glucosamine Hydrochloride (1500mg) plug MSN (methylsulfonylmethane 1500mg) daily, but showing no help. My doctor has X-ray and blood test for Rheumatoid Arthritis. Everything tested normal. I have tried and see different physicians, physical therapist, orthopedic specialists; none offer much explanation or help. Except one athletic person suggested I have the “soft bone” problem. This soft bone is suppose to be part of the ligament and cartilage tightening problem. But he did not offer much solution for my problem, except that I should have physical therapy exercise. After 8 months of daily left middle finger pains, now my left thumb starts having the same kind of pain too. Can anyone out there offer any suggestions and recommendations? Thank you so much. >I am 62 years old. I am a right hand person. > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > Can anyone out there offer any suggestions and recommendations? Thank you > so much. Have you been tested for gout? Jo A M, I have joint pain in my fingers and thumb also and I don't have rheumatoid arthritis,. I have osteoarthritis, and you also might have it. You need to see a rheumatologist who speciallizes in the different kinds of arthritis and knows so much more about it than any other kind of doctor. Please get one of your doctors to refer you to a rheumatologist and let him/her check it out for you. Gwen >I am 62 years old. I am a right hand person. > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > Can anyone out there offer any suggestions and recommendations? Thank you > so much. Have you been tested for gout? Jo >A M, I have joint pain in my fingers and thumb also and I don't have > rheumatoid arthritis,. I have osteoarthritis, and you also might have it. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > him/her check it out for you. > Gwen Thanks Gwen. I am in Kaiser healthcare in Silicon Valley. Does anyone here know of any good specialist for this type? ><sweetpickleNO@SPAMknology.net> wrote... >>A M, I have joint pain in my fingers and thumb also and I don't have [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >I am in Kaiser healthcare in Silicon Valley. >Does anyone here know of any good specialist for this type?  SignatureRobin Fairbairns, Cambridge > "Jo Firey" <jofirey@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message > > Have you been tested for gout? > > Jo Jo, I have done a little research. Wiki: Gout is characterized by excruciating, sudden, unexpected, burning pain, as well as swelling, redness, warmness, and stiffness in the affected joint. Low-grade fever may also be present. The patient usually suffers from two sources of pain. The crystals inside the joint cause intense pain whenever the affected area is moved. The inflammation of the tissues around the joint also causes the skin to be swollen, tender and sore if it is even slightly touched. For example, a blanket or even the lightest sheet draping over the affected area could cause extreme pain Gout usually attacks the big toe (approximately 75 percent of first attacks); however, it also can affect other joints such as the ankle, heel, instep, knee, wrist, elbow, fingers, and spine. In some cases, the condition may appear in the joints of small toes that have become immobile due to impact injury earlier in life, causing poor blood circulation that leads to gout. Patients with longstanding hyperuricemia can have uric acid crystal deposits called tophi (singular: tophus) in other tissues such as the helix of the ear. Elevated levels of uric acid in the urine can lead to uric acid crystals precipitating in the kidneys or bladder, forming uric acid kidney stones. I do not think I have gout problem. But is there simple test I can do myself? Or, I have to ask my doctor to perform this at lab? Thank you. >> "Jo Firey" <jofirey@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message >> [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > I do not think I have gout problem. But is there simple test I can do > myself? Or, I have to ask my doctor to perform this at lab? Thank you. Sorry, but if you prefer Wiki and self diagnosis to reliable medical advice you are on your own so to speak. Doctors can do lab tests to diagnosis high blood levels of uric acid. And there are medications to reduce it. I had intermittent problems with 'hot' or sausage finger and toe joints. They haven't recurred since I've been on medication to treat the acid levels. Which by the way were high but not off the charts. RD didn't think they were the problem. Ortho guy said even high normal levels can cause digits to flare. Jo > Sorry, but if you prefer Wiki and self diagnosis to reliable medical > advice you are on your own so to speak. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Jo Jo, I wish I have good healthcare providers willing to perform whatever you wish. Kaiser primary care physicans does not provide much care, and do least for insured. That is why I do research myself and have to sure what to ask. I do not have any swelling, bumps, nodules on palms or large joints. I had blood test several time and found no arthristis. It seems to me I heard somewhere that A M Jackson wrote in article <JJoRj.1012$1b7.1000@newssvr13.news.prodigy.net>: >> "Jo Firey" <jofirey@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message >> Have you been tested for gout? > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >impact injury earlier in life, causing poor blood circulation that leads to >gout. [. . .] >I do not think I have gout problem. But is there simple test I can do >myself? Or, I have to ask my doctor to perform this at lab? Thank you. I don't recall if you've mentioned this, but do you have bumps or nodules in the palm of your hand near the fingers that have the pain? My assumption is that you would have mentioned it if you did, but this is just to rule out the possibility of Dupuytren's contracture, the effects of which range from benign to quite painful. In my case I have fairly large nodules but very little pain (< 1 ) and no loss of hand function. If you do have nodules, you can find more about Dupuytrens at http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/dupuytrens-contracture/DS00732 SignatureDon Kirkman >> "Jo Firey" <jofirey@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message >> [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > I do not think I have gout problem. But is there simple test I can do > myself? Or, I have to ask my doctor to perform this at lab? Thank you. It's a blood test for uric acid - the compound that collects in the joints and crystallizes. The uric acid test is used to learn whether the body might be breaking down cells too quickly or not getting rid of uric acid quickly enough. The test also is used to monitor levels of uric acid when a patient has had chemotherapy or radiation treatments. You might also want to look up pseudogout, which is similar to gout, but is caused by calcium crystals. My RD has me on colchicine, but it is not a fast acting med. I may have it in my wrists. SignatureNavy Take out the FISH to email me. >> "Jo Firey" <jofirey@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message >> [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > I do not think I have gout problem. But is there simple test I can do > myself? Or, I have to ask my doctor to perform this at lab? Thank you. >A M, I have joint pain in my fingers and thumb also and I don't have > rheumatoid arthritis,. I have osteoarthritis, and you also might have it. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > him/her check it out for you. > Gwen Dear Gwen, I have read up more about osteoarthritis. Am I correct that there is no medication to treat and recover from this problem? Most of the medications and treatments are basically pain relief. Afraid you're right, A M. But getting pain relief is really great! You can also have joint replacements when it gets too bad to handle otherwise. I've had a hip replacement, and basal joint replacement on my left hand. I would not hesitate to get any joint replacement I needed. Many people have to have knee replacements. When the joint is bone on bone, a replacement is really the only way to go for relief. It is really important for you to see a rheumatologist (RD). Gwen <sweetpickleNO@SPAMknology.net> wrote in message news:e95a$4814daf2$45491df5$1432@KNOLOGY.NET... >A M, I have joint pain in my fingers and thumb also and I don't have > rheumatoid arthritis,. I have osteoarthritis, and you also might have it. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > him/her check it out for you. > Gwen Dear Gwen, I have read up more about osteoarthritis. Am I correct that there is no medication to treat and recover from this problem? Most of the medications and treatments are basically pain relief. amj one can test sero negative, have a reasonable ed rate, and still have any one of several forms of arthritis - including osteo, and even rheum type 'can' be sero neg. nothing showing on the xray is good - for now - but for anyone with arthritis, not indicative of anything other than damage hasn't progressed 'yet' to the point of being readable on the plate you do not mention if you have a history of 'hard use' of hands perhaps in heavy physical work history? any family indication of diabetes? any fairly rapid weight gain or loss? you describe morning stiffness, and tendon/ligament contracture - while this is most likely a form of arthritis, the above 'could' be a causative agent. i wouldn't settle for a 'wait and see' from my doc - if it is arthritis, or diabetes, the sooner addressed the better. my hands [total involvement] respond very much as yours are - i'm a sero neg still's disease auto immune and my blood tests don't reflect my condition either... all i can recc. is that you take a more active stance and insist on further work to diagnose > I am 62 years old. I am a right hand person. > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > Can anyone out there offer any suggestions and recommendations? Thank you so > much. On Apr 27, 12:49 pm, "A M Jackson" <no.s...@no.spam.com> > After 8 months of daily left middle finger pains, now my left thumb starts > having the same kind of pain too. > > Can anyone out there offer any suggestions and recommendations? Thank you so > much. Hi,,,, Usually if it is inflam.arth., it would be your middle finger on both hands or another finger on the other hand. This has been going on for too long. Ask your doctor for help and remind how long you have been dealing with this. Maybe a steroid shot in the finger. Harv Definitely get in to see your doctor and *insist* on something being done to treat this. My inflammatory arthritis has been affecting my thumbs in major ways since April of 2000 - I well remember it starting up the weekend of the Spring Arts Festival in Gainesville that year. As much as I hate pain in other finger joints, having it hit your thumb really affects everything in your life, though it does teach you to appreciate the evolutionary advance the opposable thumb was! Anyway, get in to see your doc - thumbs are just too important! Oh, and you can test negative for RA but still have it - 1/4 to 1/3 of folks with it never test positive. There are also many other types of inflammatory arthritis some of which affect the ligaments, muscles and organs of the body. My brand is psoriatic arthritis and it has affected ligaments from time to time as well as giving me some inflammation that makes no sense to anyone! A referral to a decent rheumatologist should get this investigated more thoroughly. SignatureNann remove the Gator cheer to email me Change everything. Love & forgive. > On Apr 27, 12:49 pm, "A M Jackson" <no.s...@no.spam.com> > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > you have been dealing with this. Maybe a steroid shot in the finger. > Harv OK, now I got a name. Its called "trigger finger". I google and found many references. Most medications are for pain relief. I found only direct medicate is inject cortisone steriod shots to the area. Can you please tell me any side effect of this? By the way, I have taken cholesterol reducing drug (small dosage Simvastatin 40mg and Fenotidrate 40mg). Is these drug caused this side effect? Thank you. >OK, now I got a name. Its called "trigger finger". >I google and found many references. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >By the way, I have taken cholesterol reducing drug (small dosage Simvastatin >40mg and Fenotidrate 40mg). Is these drug caused this side effect? not that i've ever heard of, but then i've never had them. apart from the (eventual) injections, the only relief i ever found was heat. mostly, this came from filling up a wash basin with hot water, submerging the hands, and repeating as the water cooled. (a conference at a usanian hotel that had a hot tub was a godsend; i spent some time pre-breakfast in the tub, and i was set up for a good part of the day.) iirc, my consultant called it "claw hand", but a after a google search i _think_ that's a different condition. but then, i maybe simply don't understand what the pages it turns up actually mean -- the pictures are more-or-less the same. all the pictures i've found so far show only a single finger stuck: i usually had all four mia. (i was single at the time: dressing myself could be difficult...) SignatureRobin Fairbairns, Cambridge Have you done an elimination diet? > My brand is psoriatic arthritis and it has affected ligaments from time to > time as well as giving me some inflammation that makes no sense to anyone! >> My brand is psoriatic arthritis and it has affected ligaments from time to >> time as well as giving me some inflammation that makes no sense to anyone! > >Have you done an elimination diet? the op may not have done, but i have. psoriatic arthritis (now branded, in my case, sero-negative rheumatoid arthritis) tends to confuse rheumatologists, simply because it may _not_ present in many of the standard tests. i was lucky that my rheumies chose to treat the disease agressively, based on the symptoms rather than on the tests. in the end, my disease is pretty well controlled (i reached this state about 10 years after first rheum appointment ... they were investigating the possibility of anti-tnf treatment at the time, but rejected it on the basis that my inflammation had started to retreat. i still feel bad on days like today, though ... good old low pressure syndrome, eh?). SignatureRobin Fairbairns, Cambridge >>> My brand is psoriatic arthritis and it has affected ligaments from time to >>> time as well as giving me some inflammation that makes no sense to anyone! >> >> Have you done an elimination diet? > > the op may not have done, but i have. The OP posted just before leaving on vacation. :-) Yes, i did try the elimination diet, back during one of the most severe periods of my arthritis - no effect. I've tried eliminating just one or two types of foods a few times since, knowing that I DO have a true food allergy to milk and am therefore more susceptible to other food allergies, but no apparent effect there either. But there is STRONG evidence of an auto-immune genetic glitch coming from both sides of my family. psoriatic arthritis (now > branded, in my case, sero-negative rheumatoid arthritis) tends to > confuse rheumatologists, simply because it may _not_ present in many > of the standard tests. I actually went the other way - Daddy and his mother both had RA and my PA resembled that more originally, though we knew I had psoriasis as well. Down the road, it acquired more of the PA characteristics, though of course the overlaps and differences of the disease on a genetic level are not yet understood. My labwork almost never reflects the level of inflammaton inmy body and I've had some atypical inflammation, which has "helped" me establish relationships with several good doctors. LOL This just isn't the wayI ever intended on fascinating men..... (well, the heme is female, but I only saw her once). SignatureNann remove the Gator cheer to email me Change everything. Love & forgive. On Apr 27, 10:49 am, "A M Jackson" <no.s...@no.spam.com> wrote:my left middle fingers middle and bottom joints around the knuckle areas, << http://www.toomuchiron.ca/disorder/faqs.php "Aching joints, especially in the knuckle and first joint of the first and second fingers" Who loves ya. Tom Jesus Was A Vegetarian! http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh Man Is A Herbivore! http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3 DEAD PEOPLE WALKING http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk > I am 62 years old. I am a right hand person. > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > Can anyone out there offer any suggestions and recommendations? Thank you so > much. >On Apr 27, 10:49=A0am, "A M Jackson" <no.s...@no.spam.com> wrote:my left >middle fingers middle and bottom joints around the knuckle areas, << [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Who loves ya. plainly not the snake oil merchants. SignatureRobin Fairbairns, Cambridge On May 26, 2:27 am, r...@cl.cam.ac.uk (Robin Fairbairns) wrote:plainly not the snake oil merchants.Robin Fairbairns, Cambridge << You have something you want to say about the Canadian Hemochromatosis Society .. do ya .. limey . Do ya .. ? Which may well explain the problem they have found in those with Juvenile Rheumatoid Arthritis .. INCREASED destruction by introduction of iron .. EXPERIMENTAL BIOLOGY UPDATE: Arthritic kids' iron supplements may hasten joint deterioration By Diana Swift WWASHINGTON, D.C. - The iron supplements that many arthritic children take to combat concomitant anemia may be hastening the deterioration of their joints, Houston researchers say. Led by biologist Roman Shypailo of the Children's Nutrition Research Centre at Baylor College of Medicine, a Texas team looked at eight children being treated for juvenile rheumatoid arthritis. The patients, aged five to 15 years, received an intravenous radioactive tracer dose of iron (0.03 microsievert). Iron activity in affected joints was monitored on a position/energy- sensitive gamma counter, while a second machine monitored whole-body iron retention. Iron deposition was measured two hours post-infusion and again at days seven, 14, 28 and 56. Anemic "We found that iron excessively accumulates in arthritic joints and probably contributes to the chronic damage," said Shypailo. "That puts you between a rock and a hard place because many of these arthritic kids are anemic and need iron supplements, which may worsen the disease." The study found a high level of agreement between the joint data and the whole-body data, with a greater than 90% retention rate of the infused iron both in joints and systemically. Furthermore, six of eight patients showed increased uptake at the affected joints: 165% over the first 30 days compared with initial uptake at two hours. The next step, he says, is to see if there is excessive deposition of dietary iron in arthritic joints. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ There are many bits of information required in order to make a case against a 'suspect' .. When one suspects .. something .. one gathers .. 'evidence' .. Evidence against iron in the pathogenesis of arthritis .. 1] Markers .. diagnostic of iron overload .. IN .. those with arthritis .. have been found to me of NO use in those with arthritis .. http://groups.google.com/group/alt.support.arthritis/msg/7a943fccf825... IE: 50% of patients manifest liver problems .. and the COMMON diagnostic marker used to detect liver iron load has been found to be of **no use** in those with arthritis. 2] Drugs used to treat arthritis commonly are iron binding / iron targeting .. drugs .. IE: aspirin,indomethacin,sulfasalazine, 3] Reduction of iron is recommended in the treatment of gout .. 4] Oxidative stress has been shown to be elevated in those with arthritis and iron reduction is shown to alleviate oxidative stress. 5] Iron restricted diet has been shown to alleviate symptoms of arthritis. 6] Introduction of iron rich blood into the joint induces / causes arthritis 7] Introduction of iron into the joint induces / causes arthritis 8] Those with diagnosed iron overload have a very high incidence of arthritis 9] Iron levels have recently been recommended to be tested in ALL those who manifest unexplained joint pain .. 10] The fact they have admitted to inadvertently **killing** millions of people by not being **able** to diagnose iron levels in the body. IE: malaria patients treated with iron and folic acid 11] The fact they have admitted to inadvertently killing Aids patients by giving them iron. 12] The fact they have only recently found all diabetics to have free floating unbound iron in their bodies when they had argued there was no iron at all. 13} Iron accumulates excessively in joints in those with arthritis. Tom Jesus Was A Vegetarian! http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh Man Is A Herbivore! http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3 DEAD PEOPLE WALKING http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk > snake oil <ironjust...@cashette.com> writes: > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > -- > Robin Fairbairns, Cambridge >2] Drugs used to treat arthritis commonly are iron binding / iron >targeting .. drugs .. [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] >13} Iron accumulates excessively in joints in those with arthritis. >Tom Well there we have it!, we're all in need of some Castrol as we're all going rusty;!..... SignatureTony Sayer Tony,,, you do not have to repeat all of what has been said. In other words, you do not have to repeeeet the crap. Harv >>2] Drugs used to treat arthritis commonly are iron binding / iron >>targeting .. drugs .. [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] > Well there we have it!, we're all in need of some Castrol as we're all > going rusty;!..... In article <toJ_j.853$iM3.120@flpi150.ffdc.sbc.com>, Harvey R. Stone <hrstone@swbell.net> scribeth thus >Tony,,, you do not have to repeat all of what has been said. In other >words, you do not have to repeeeet the crap. >Harv Well most of it was snipped.. However it might not be crap this is often the case in science;) And how many get worse symptoms when its damp;?.. I like this "rust" theory;!.. SignatureTony Sayer >In article <toJ_j.853$iM3.120@flpi150.ffdc.sbc.com>, Harvey R. Stone ><hrstone@swbell.net> scribeth thus [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >However it might not be crap this is often the case in science;) if he were to show us double-blind, peer-reviewed studies that suggests his iron postulate has legs, i'll be interested. most snake-oil people don't do that sort of thing, and rely on "studies" which report how many people say they feel "better" after something or other. since that sort of result can come from the placebo effect, such studies are useless as scientific evidence. it's good to know if a problem can be affected by a placebo, but to claim that a medication is worth spending money on when it's no more use than placebo, is plain misleading. >And how many get worse symptoms when its damp;?.. > >I like this "rust" theory;!.. i've noticed the damp effect. i've also seen reports that the effect is related to atmospheric pressure (low pressure, which tends to signal rain in this country, causes problems). i've never seen a detailed study of either claim. however, the suggestion that excess iron in the body would "rust" is plain silly. one of the real problems with treating anaemia is persuading the body to take up the iron in the drugs offered; this is because, to make it soluble at all, the iron has to be in a compound form, and for it to be taken up it has to be chelated into an organic compound in the body. in neither case is the iron available to "rust". in any case, if iron is such a devil, why doesn't popeye, who subsists on an iron-rich vegetable, a martyr to arthritis? note 1: that last sentence wasn't intended to be on the same level as the rest. note 2: i haven't studied chemistry since the 1960s: i gave it up to become a mathematician. so it's probably easy to pick holes in my chemistry, but the basic principles are as likely as not "sound". SignatureRobin Fairbairns, Cambridge >>In article <toJ_j.853$iM3.120@flpi150.ffdc.sbc.com>, Harvey R. Stone >><hrstone@swbell.net> scribeth thus [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > signal rain in this country, causes problems). i've never seen a > detailed study of either claim. The changing high and low pressure causes some of us to feel pain in some of our joints. I went to a RD many years ago that had an office in a building in the medical center of Houston. That building has a lightning fast elevator if no one else was calling on the floors between and the doctors office. When it stopped,,, my ears would pop and both knees would go """ throbbb"""". People in the elevator would always look at me because I could not help groaning before I stepped out of it. :-) my kind of prooofff that pressure change does cause pain. Harv > however, the suggestion that excess iron in the body would "rust" is > plain silly. one of the real problems with treating anaemia is [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > become a mathematician. so it's probably easy to pick holes in my > chemistry, but the basic principles are as likely as not "sound". >The changing high and low pressure causes some of us to feel pain in some of >our joints. I went to a RD many years ago that had an office in a [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >prooofff that pressure change does cause pain. >Harv I'm with you on that one, Harv. I have actually kept records of wet and dry days and my level of pain. No connection, but when the barometer takes a sudden rise or fall I react. Who knows? Joan >>The changing high and low pressure causes some of us to feel pain in some of >>our joints. I went to a RD many years ago that had an office in a [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >wet and dry days and my level of pain. No connection, but when >the barometer takes a sudden rise or fall I react. Who knows? aha. i'll take that as rather strong evidence: no idea how i would make it into a "proper" experiment (how do you generate placebo weather effects? ;-) (fortunately, i'm not paid to design experiments, i just spend my time being an experimental animal for the medics.) come to think of it, perhaps this evening's state of my hands is related to the ambient pressure. or perhaps it's because i'm tired... it doesn't fit with the naive assertion that excess iron was "rusting", though. i _am_ surprised... SignatureRobin Fairbairns, Cambridge > I'm with you on that one, Harv. I have actually kept records of > wet and dry days and my level of pain. No connection, but when > the barometer takes a sudden rise or fall I react. Who knows? I'm that way too. I actually had more weather related flares in north Florida tha I do here because cold fronts would come through, stall out just south of us, then return as warm fronts all winter long, keeping the barometer in constant flux. and summer brought severe changes from passing hurricanes and tropical storms. Here, fronts pass through and move on - and some of them don't evn hange the barometer that much. SignatureNann remove the Gator cheer to email me Change everything. Love & forgive. > i've noticed the damp effect. i've also seen reports that the effect > is related to atmospheric pressure (low pressure, which tends to > signal rain in this country, causes problems). i've never seen a > detailed study of either claim. starting from the premise that with over 100 forms of arthritis, each will have it's own distinct response to such influences - there have been numerous studies over the past 10 years that are properly run, and show the connection [disclosure, i was in one of 'em]: "Further support for an effect on atmospheric pressure in arthritis was published in the Proceedings of the Western Pharmacology Society in 2004. In this prospective, double blind study, 92 patients with osteoarthritis and rheumatoid arthritis were compared to a control group of 42 subjects. The authors concluded that the osteoarthritis patients experienced increased joint pain with a low atmospheric pressure while low temperature increased the risk of joint pain in the rheumatoid group. Another study published in the Journal of Rheumatology in 2004 demonstrated that high humidity was unfavorable for arthritis patients. Based on these particular studies, it would seem that a location that tends to have a higher barometric pressure and lower humidity would represent a favorable environment for arthritis patients." also: # The Effect of Simultaneous Variations of Humidity and Barometric Pressure on Arthritis # Joseph P. Hollander and Sarantos Y. Yeostros # AIBS Bulletin, Vol. 13, No. 3 (Jun., 1963), pp. 24-28 (article consists of 5 pages) # Published by: American Institute of Biological Sciences http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb4365/is_200505/ai_n15251829 Study finds knee arthritis pain does predict changes in barometric pressure, temperature.(Rheumatology) Findings from a study conducted by Dr. McAlindon and his colleagues at Tufts-New England Medical Center, Boston, suggest that persons with knee osteoarthritis do indeed have greater pain when there are changes in barometric pressure. The study was conducted from March 2000 to May 2003 and included about 200 people with knee osteoarthritis in 41 U.S. states. Purpose Individuals with osteoarthritis often assert that change in the weather influences their pain, but the evidence is inconclusive. Our objective was to determine if short-term weather parameters influence knee osteoarthritis pain. Methods "We performed a longitudinal analysis of pain reports from a 3-month clinical trial among individuals with knee osteoarthritis dispersed across the United States. Daily values for temperature, barometric pressure, dew point, precipitation, and relative humidity were obtained from the weather station closest to each participant. We used a longitudinal mixed-model random effects analysis with a first-order autoregressive error structure to test for associations while accounting for within-patient correlation. Results The study included 200 participants with knee osteoarthritis. Their mean age was 60 years (standard deviation [SD] 9.4), 64% were female, and 10.5% were African American or Hispanic. They had a mean body mass index of 32.5 kg/m2 (SD 8.4) and a baseline WOMAC pain score of 9.0 (SD 3.4). There were consistent associations of pressure change and ambient temperature with pain severity (change in barometric pressure, coefficient = 1.14, P = .02, ambient temperature = -0.01, P = .004; adjusted mutually and for age, gender, body mass index, nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drug use, opiate use, and prior pain score). Interaction terms between change in barometric pressure and ambient temperature had no influence in the models. Conclusions Changes in barometric pressure and ambient temperature are independently associated with osteoarthritis knee pain severity." and a fairly new one: http://news.healingwell.com/index.php?p=news1&id=521836 now, there are always those, like Dr. Amos Tversky, a Stanford University psychologist who try to find a 'mind' based reason - and just can't allow themselves to actually look at the studies. > however, the suggestion that excess iron in the body would "rust" is > plain silly. one of the real problems with treating anaemia is [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > -- > Robin Fairbairns, Cambridge >> i've noticed the damp effect. i've also seen reports that the effect >> is related to atmospheric pressure (low pressure, which tends to [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >been numerous studies over the past 10 years that are properly run, and >show the connection [disclosure, i was in one of 'em]: coo, thanks for all that! SignatureRobin Fairbairns, Cambridge On May 26, 10:37 am, tony sayer <t...@bancom.co.uk> wrote:Well there we have it!, we're all in need of some Castrol as we're all going rusty;!..... << It IS just as simple as that .. but spelled different .. Castor .. oil .. The iron **selectively** destroys the 'lubricant' around the joints and castor oil is one of many plant oils which contain this lubricant and soooo eating it seems to be the way one might replace it. Lack Of Critical Lubricant Causes Wear In Joints, First-Ever Study Finds Main Category: Arthritis News Article Date: 07 Nov 2007 - 1:00 PST Mice that don't produce lubricin, a thin film of protein found in the cartilage of joints, showed early wear and higher friction in their joints, a new study led by Brown University researchers shows. This link between increased friction and early wear in joints is a first; no other team of scientists has proven this association before. The finding, published in Arthritis & Rheumatism, sheds important light on how joints work. The discovery also suggests that lubricin, or a close cousin, could be injected directly into hips, knees or other joints inflamed from arthritis or injury -- a preventive treatment that could reduce the need for painful and costly joint replacement surgery. In an editorial that accompanies the journal article, orthopedics researchers from Rush University Medical Center in Chicago call the research an "important contribution to the field" and note that the use of biomolecules like lubricin to prevent joint wear "could have a substantial clinical impact, if successful." Gregory Jay, M.D, a Rhode Island Hospital emergency physician and an associate professor of emergency medicine and engineering at Brown, led the research. For 20 years, Jay has studied lubricin's role as a "boundary lubricant" by reducing friction between opposing layers of cartilage inside joints. In this new work, Jay and his colleagues set out to answer the next question: Does reducing friction actually prevent wear, or surface damage, in joints? To find out, Jay and his team studied cartilage from the knees of mice that don't produce lubricin. Directly after birth, the cartilage was smooth. But in as little as two weeks, researchers found, the cartilage began to show signs of wear. Under an electron microscope, scientists could see that the collagen fibers that cartilage is composed of were breaking up, giving the surface a rough, frayed appearance. This damage is called wear, an early sign of joint disease or injury. Jay and his team then took the work a step further. To better understand how lubricin works, they tried to see the structure of the film. So they put a tiny bit of the protein under an atomic force microscope. At the nanoscale, the molecule appeared as a mesh -- row upon row of interlocking fibers -- that could repel a microscope probe. This repulsion, created with water and electrical charges, shows how lubricin acts as a buffer, keeping opposing layers of cartilage apart. "We demonstrated that lubricin reduces both friction and wear and also showed how, on a molecular level, it does this work in the body," Jay said. "What's exciting are the clinical implications. Arthritis and sports injuries damage the joints of thousands of people in the United States and millions of people worldwide each year. Our aim is to make a treatment that can actually prevent wear in the joints." Through Rhode Island Hospital, Jay has filed two patents on the protein and its sequences and, in 2004, helped form Tribologics, a biotech company formed out of Rhode Island Hospital. The Massaschusetts-based business is developing an injection treatment for inflamed joints that contains lubricin. Members of the research team included Jahn Torres, a former Brown graduate student in engineering; David Rhee, a former graduate student at Case Western Reserve University; Heikki Helminen, M.D., and Mika Hytinnen, M.D., from the University of Kuopio in Finland; Chung-Ja Cha, a research assistant at Rhode Island Hospital; Khaled Elsaid, a postdoctoral research fellow at Rhode Island Hospital; Kyung-Suk Kim, a professor of engineering at Brown; and Yajun Cui, M.D., and Matthew Warman, M.D., of Boston Children's Hospital and Harvard Medical School. The National Institute of Arthritis and Musculoskelatal and Skin Diseases funded the work, along with the Academy of Finland, the McCutchen Foundation, the Howard Hughes Medical Institute and the Burroughs Wellcome Fund. Source: Wendy Lawton Brown University -------------------------------------------------- J Orthop Surg. 2007 Aug 23;2(1):14 [Epub ahead of print] Links Unsaturated phosphatidylcholines lining on the surface of cartilage and its possible physiological roles. Chen Y, Crawford RW, Oloyede A. ABSTRACT: BACKGROUND: Evidence has strongly indicated that surface-active phospholipid (SAPL), or surfactant, lines the surface of cartilage and serves as a lubricating agent. Previous clinical study showed that a saturated phosphatidylcholine (SPC), dipalmitoyl-phosphatidylcholine (DPPC), was effective in the treatment of osteoarthritis, however recent studies suggested that the dominant SAPL species at some sites outside the lung are not SPC, rather, are unsaturated phosphatidylcholine (USPC). Some of these USPC have been proven to be good boundary lubricants by our previous study, implicating their possible important physiological roles in joint if their existence can be confirmed. So far, no study has been conducted to identify the whole molecule species of different phosphatidylcholine (PC) classes on the surface of cartilage. In this study we identified the dominant PC molecule species on the surface of cartilage. We also confirmed that some of these PC species possess a property of semipermeability. METHODS: HPLC was used to analyse the PC profile of bovine cartilage samples and comparisons of DPPC and USPC were carried out through semipermeability tests. RESULTS: It was confirmed that USPC are the dominant SAPL species on the surface of cartilage. In particular, they are Dilinoleoyl- phosphatidylcholine (DLPC), Palmitoyl-linoleoyl-phosphatidylcholine, (PLPC), Palmitoyl-oleoyl-phosphatidylcholine (POPC) and Stearoyl- linoleoyl-phosphatidylcholine (SLPC). The relative content of DPPC (a SPC) was only 8%. Two USPC, PLPC and POPC, were capable of generating osmotic pressure that is equivalent to that by DPPC. CONCLUSIONS: The results from the current study confirm vigorously that USPC is the endogenous species inside the joint as against DPPC thereby confirming once again that USPC, and not SPC, characterizes the PC species distribution at non-lung sites of the body. USPC not only has better anti-friction and lubrication properties than DPPC, they also possess a level of semipermeability that is equivalent to DPPC. We therefore hypothesize that USPC can constitute a possible addition or alternative to the current commercially available viscosupplementation products for the prevention and treatment of osteoarthritis in the future. PMID: 17718898 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Who loves ya. Tom Jesus Was A Vegetarian! http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh Man Is A Herbivore! http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3 DEAD PEOPLE WALKING http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk > >2] Drugs used to treat arthritis commonly are iron binding / iron > >targeting .. drugs .. [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > - Show quoted text - On May 28, 9:36 am, ironjustice <teamtan...@hotmail.com> wrote:confirm vigorously that unsaturated phosphatidylcholine (USPC) is the endogenous species inside the joint << "Unsaturated phosphatidylcholine in the treatment and/or prophylaxis of particular medical conditions such as osteoarthritis and for lubricating interactive surfaces in artificial joints." (WO/2005/027933) UNSATURATED PHOSPHATIDYLCHOLINES AND USES THEREOF Biblio. Data Description Claims National PhaseNoticesDocuments Latest bibliographic data on file with the International Bureau -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Pub. No.: WO/2005/027933 International Application No.: PCT/ AU2004/001290 Publication Date: 31.03.2005 International Filing Date: 21.09.2004 Chapter 2 Demand Filed: 22.07.2005 IPC: A61K 31/6615 (2006.01), A61K 31/685 (2006.01) Applicants: THE CORPORATION OF THE TRUSTEES OF THE ORDER OF THE SISTERS OF MERCY IN QUEENSLAND [AU/AU]; Raymond Terrace, South Brisbane, Queensland 4101 (AU) (All Except US). CHEN, Yi [AU/AU]; 15 Love Street, Fairfield, Queensland 4103 (AU) (US Only). HILLS, Brian, Andrew [AU/AU]; 29 Peach Treet Close, Alexandra Hills, Queensland 4161 (AU) (US Only). Inventors: CHEN, Yi [AU/AU]; 15 Love Street, Fairfield, Queensland 4103 (AU). HILLS, Brian, Andrew [AU/AU]; 29 Peach Treet Close, Alexandra Hills, Queensland 4161 (AU). Agent: HUGHES, E, John, L; Davies Collison Cave, 1 Nicholson Street, Melbourne, Victoria 3000 (AU). Priority Data: 2003905186 23.09.2003 AU 2004901087 02.03.2004 AU Title: UNSATURATED PHOSPHATIDYLCHOLINES AND USES THEREOF Abstract: The present invention relates generally to a method for providing formation, ultrafiltration and/or lubrication between two or more opposing or in contact surfaces. More particularly, the present invention effects one or more of surface tension reduction anti-stick, barrier formation, ultrafiltration, lubrication and/or effector of cellular therapeutic, and regeneration between two or more surfaces by the application or absorption of an unsaturated phosphatidylcholine alone or in combination with a saturated phosphatidylcholine. The present invention further provides compositions comprising unsaturated phosphatidylcholine species alone or in combination with a saturated phosphatidylcholine and their use in the treatment and/or prophylaxis of particular medical conditions such as osteoarthritis, surgical adhesion, burns injuries, ocular disorders, ultra-filtration failure in peritoneal dialysis, barrier disorders of the skin and mucosa, middle ear disorders, as a facilitation of cellular therapeutics and regenerative medicine and for lubricating interactive surfaces in artificial joints. Designated States: AE, AG, AL, AM, AT, AU, AZ, BA, BB, BG, BR, BW, BY, BZ, CA, CH, CN, CO, CR, CU, CZ, DE, DK, DM, DZ, EC, EE, EG, ES, FI, GB, GD, GE, GH, GM, HR, HU, ID, IL, IN, IS, JP, KE, KG, KP, KR, KZ, LC, LK, LR, LS, LT, LU, LV, MA, MD, MG, MK, MN, MW, MX, MZ, NA, NI, NO, NZ, OM, PG, PH, PL, PT, RO, RU, SC, SD, SE, SG, SK, SL, SY, TJ, TM, TN, TR, TT, TZ, UA, UG, US, UZ, VC, VN, YU, ZA, ZM, ZW. African Regional Intellectual Property Org. (ARIPO) (BW, GH, GM, KE, LS, MW, MZ, NA, SD, SL, SZ, TZ, UG, ZM, ZW) Eurasian Patent Organization (EAPO) (AM, AZ, BY, KG, KZ, MD, RU, TJ, TM) European Patent Office (EPO) (AT, BE, BG, CH, CY, CZ, DE, DK, EE, ES, FI, FR, GB, GR, HU, IE, IT, LU, MC, NL, PL, PT, RO, SE, SI, SK, TR) African Intellectual Property Organization (OAPI) (BF, BJ, CF, CG, CI, CM, GA, GN, GQ, GW, ML, MR, NE, SN, TD, TG). Who loves ya. Tom Jesus Was A Vegetarian! http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh Man Is A Herbivore! http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3 DEAD PEOPLE WALKING http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk > On May 26, 10:37 am, tony sayer <t...@bancom.co.uk> wrote:Well there > we have it!, we're all in need of some Castrol as we're all going [quoted text clipped - 214 lines] > > - Show quoted text - On Apr 27, 10:49 am, "A M Jackson" <no.s...@no.spam.com> wrote:my left middle fingers middle and bottom joints around the knuckle areas, << http://www.toomuchiron.ca/disorder/faqs.php "Aching joints, especially in the knuckle and first joint of the first and second fingers" Who loves ya. Tom OK. Tom. My aching joints is the thumb and index fingers. Second and bottom joints. No problem with first joint. But I will ask my Kaiser doctor to include this in my next blood test. Thank you. On Apr 27, 10:49 am, "A M Jackson" <no.s...@no.spam.com> wrote:any suggestions << "The uptake and storage of iron and its potential relation to imflammation of the joints has been unknown until now" "A high iron content has been noted in synovial membraines in RA" Annals of the Rheumatic Diseases 2002;61:741-744 Iron deposits may damage joint tissue in RA Our understanding of the role of iron in rheumatoid arthritis (RA) has improved with a recent study showing where iron accumulates in the synovial membranes of affected joints. The researchers speculate how iron might build up to toxic amounts. Ferritin, both light and heavy subunits , was found in the lining layer and subintimal zone of the synovium and in synovial macrophages and fibroblasts. Transferrin receptor appeared only in the lining layer . Non-specific resistance associated macrophage proteins (Nramp) were also found These are proteins that span membranes and transport divalent cations. Nramp 2 occurred in the macrophages and fibroblasts. Nramp 1 was present in macrophages and neutrophils, in the synovial lining layer and the subintimal zone, and in infiltrating inflammatory cells, but not in fibroblasts. The study used synovial membranes from arthroplasties of 20 patients with RA. Thin sections were stained cytochemically for ferritin, transferrin receptor , and Nramp 1 with monoclonal or polyclonal antibodies. Macrophages and fibroblasts were isolated from collaginase digests of synovial membranes. Neutrophils were isolated from synovial fluid aspirated routinely from the joints . These cell types were stained for ferritin and transferrin receptor immunocytochemically. Nramp 1 and Nramp 2 were identified by reverse transcriptase polymerase chain reaction. A high iron content has been noted in synovial membraines in RA , but the uptake and storage of iron and its potential relation to imflammation of the joints has been unknown until now. --------------------------------------------------- Who loves ya. Tom Jesus Was A Vegetarian! http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh Man Is A Herbivore! http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3 DEAD PEOPLE WALKING http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk > I am 62 years old. I am a right hand person. > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > Can anyone out there offer any suggestions and recommendations? Thank you so > much. On Apr 27, 10:49 am, "A M Jackson" <no.s...@no.spam.com> wrote:any suggestions << "Unexplained joint complaints" "We therefore advocate routine sampling of ferritin levels in patients with unexplained joint complaints" Neth J Med. 2006 Sep;64(8):307-9. Links Sporadic porphyria cutanea tarda due to haemochromatosis. de Geus HR, Dees A. Department of Intensive Care, Erasmus Medical Centre, Rotterdam, the Netherlands. Haemochromatosis is a hereditary iron-overload syndrome caused by increased intestinal iron absorption and characterised by accumulation of potentially toxic iron in the tissues. Sometimes this disease presents as a cutanea porphyria. We describe a patient with joint complaints and blistering skin lesions on sun-exposed skin. After identifying the porphyria cutanea tarda by urine analysis we found that the serum activity of uroporphyrinogen decarboxylase (UROD) was normal, meaning a partial inactivation of UROD in liver tissue due to external factors. Further investigation showed the homozygous Cys282Tyr missense mutation and high levels of serum ferritin. It is important to recognise the symptoms of iron overloading at an early stage because hereditary haemochromatosis needs to be treated immediately. We therefore advocate routine sampling of ferritin levels in patients with unexplained joint complaints. PMID: 16990695 Who loves ya. Tom Jesus Was A Vegetarian! http://tinyurl.com/2r2nkh Man Is A Herbivore! http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3 DEAD PEOPLE WALKING http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk > I am 62 years old. I am a right hand person. > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > Can anyone out there offer any suggestions and recommendations? Thank you so > much.
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