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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Arthritis / September 2007

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Sucking Out Pain

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ironjustice@aol.com - 15 Sep 2007 18:13 GMT
According to him, cupping can cure fatigue, laziness, ankle pains,
back pains and other problems.

http://tinyurl.com/22ljpp

Sucking Out Blood Is Big Business
Ali Al-Zahrani & Raid Qusti, Arab News

African men, purportedly experts in Hijama, wait for customers in
front of barbershops that line a street in Riyadh's Al-Shumaisi
district. (AN photo by Iqbal Hossain)

RIYADH, 15 May 2007 - Over 20 barbershops, all licensed and next door
to one another in the capital's Al-Shumaisi district, would be a
familiar scene in many of the Kingdom's streets - that is, if
customers were going in and out for a haircut or a shave. An
investigation by Arab News, however, has revealed that these shops are
fronts for what is known in Arabic as "Hijama."

Hijama is the Arabic word for cupping or "sucking blood." It is
carried out by using a small vacuum over a small incision in the skin
and was widely practiced in the past by Arabs and Muslims. It is
mentioned in several Hadiths, which praise it as a good remedy.

Hijama is normally performed on the head, but can be performed
anywhere on the body, often at the site of an ache or pain. The
purpose is to ease or alleviate pain. The location is first shaved, if
necessary, to ensure a tight seal with the cup.

The mouth of the cup (metal, glass and plastic cups are generally
used) is placed on the skin at the site chosen for cupping. Then a
tight seal is created, generally by burning a small piece of paper or
cotton inside the vessel so that the mouth of the cup clings to the
skin.

The cup is left to cling to the skin for a few minutes, then it is
lifted off and a couple of small incisions are made in the skin. The
cup is then put back as it was before and remains until it is filled
with blood.

Customers who look for cupping in the capital - which is banned by the
Health Ministry - come to these shops and negotiate with the African
men sitting outside for a good price. The men even have special
business cards where they print the nature of their business - ("Abdul
Raoof: Barber, Hijama and Circumcision Specialist" Mobile No:
05.........).

Without proper hygienic equipment and inappropriate training the men
are possibly spreading contagious blood diseases. They sit in front of
the barbershops and wait until someone comes along and asks about
cupping.

"We've been here for decades," one of the men said. "Come inside and
see our catalogue. Don't worry; all our equipment is new and clean. We
suck out the bad blood anywhere in your body and you feel better
afterward," he explained.

He admitted, however, that cupping is not done in the shops for fear
of the police. "We cut their hair a little here and the Hijama is done
in our houses in the back," he said.

He said that in the houses in the alleys behind the shops, there were
women who could do the cupping for a female customer if she were
interested.

Another African man sitting near the shop said he knew that the
authorities had banned the practice but the demand remained. "We
charge SR25 for each cup," he replied when asked about prices. "You do
not need to take a day's rest. After the bad blood is drawn out, you
can carry on normally as before," he went on.

The man said that he was experienced and learned the technique from
his father. He said he could easily determine the symptoms of bad
blood in a person's body, giving examples of laziness and fatigue.

The man even recommended that a cupping therapy be done every couple
of months to ensure better health. According to him, cupping can cure
fatigue, laziness, ankle pains, back pains and other problems.

Last year, Riyadh Municipality shut down 15 barbershops in the capital
for practicing Hijama using unhygienic equipment. "The municipality
does not provide licenses to Hijama shops unless they meet all
hygienic conditions, including using new cups and razors for each
patient," a municipality official was reported as saying in a
newspaper.

On Feb. 1, the Health Ministry vowed to crack down on Hijama shops in
the Kingdom and threatened to close all institutions that practice it.
Minister of Health Hamad Al-Manie announced to the press that any
medical institution listing Hijama as one of its practices would be
shut down completely and banned from future operations.

He denied that his ministry had allowed the practice in the Kingdom
and even issued licenses to medical institutions. He also noted that
his ministry had banned doctors from working in the Kingdom when he
learned that they were practicing the therapy. "I have refused to
accept the research paper from the Council of Medical Services on
Hijama which referred to it as a religious therapy," he said. "I told
them that if they had information based on scientific evidence, then
they are welcome. But if you are merely relying on religious aspects,
no. During the time of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) there
was no equipment to draw out blood."

The minister stressed to the professionals attending an international
symposium on blood transfusion to do more research on Hijama and prove
its benefits scientifically so that people would not continue to
practice it based solely on religious reasons.

Last month, a spokesperson for the Health Ministry made a public
announcement that the Health Services Council had decided not to allow
the practice of Hijama in Saudi Arabia because evidence given to prove
its effectiveness was non-scientific. It added that the council would
rely only on modern scientific evidence.

Who loves ya.
Tom

Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com

Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3

DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
greyhackles - 15 Sep 2007 18:49 GMT
>According to him, cupping can cure fatigue, laziness, ankle pains,
>back pains and other problems.

Now we know what was at the very bottom of that well you've been digging...
never@million - 15 Sep 2007 19:02 GMT
>>According to him, cupping can cure fatigue, laziness, ankle pains,
>>back pains and other problems.
>
>Now we know what was at the very bottom of that well you've been digging...

But can it cure tax problems, marriage problems, problem children?

Donn
Shelley - 15 Sep 2007 19:29 GMT
Athletes foot?  Constipation?  Halitosis?

>>>According to him, cupping can cure fatigue, laziness, ankle pains,
>>>back pains and other problems.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> Donn
ironjustice - 15 Sep 2007 19:53 GMT
>> On Sep 15, 11:29 am, "Shelley" <no...@nohow.com> wrote:
Athletes foot?  Constipation?  Halitosis? <<

Athlete's foot is the .. host .. and their iron .. levels .. pathogens
REQUIRE iron and unless the iron levels in the body are low one is
**prone** to infection.

As evidenced by "scrum disease" found in footballers and wrestlers ..

>> On Sep 15, 11:29 am, "Shelley" <no...@nohow.com> wrote:
Constipation?<<

Iron causes constipation ..

Everyone knows that ..

>> On Sep 15, 11:29 am, "Shelley" <no...@nohow.com> wrote:
Halitosis<<

Halitosis is linked to acidity of the body and heavy metal toxicity
causes acidosis.

Boil some potato .. drink the potato juice for your bad breath ..

It alkalizes the body ..

Who loves ya.
Tom

Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com

Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3

DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
timmythesaint - 15 Sep 2007 19:58 GMT
you...are...an...idiot.
Your..."research"...is...nothing...but...stolen...snippets...from...very...????????????
dubious
(that means suspect)...sources. Please help everyone out and go shoot
yourself.

Tim
spodosaurus - 16 Sep 2007 06:10 GMT
Tommah, when are you coming to visit? You said you would!
Thip - 16 Sep 2007 01:09 GMT
>>According to him, cupping can cure fatigue, laziness, ankle pains,
>>back pains and other problems.
>
> Now we know what was at the very bottom of that well you've been
> digging...

And it doesn't cure dirty windows or clean toilets.  No use to me
whatsoever.
Donna G. - 16 Sep 2007 01:23 GMT
Bud - 24 Sep 2007 16:59 GMT
As he promised/threatened, is he gone yet? ;-)
Bud - 25 Sep 2007 16:55 GMT
> As he promised/threatened, is he gone yet? ;-)

No, I guess not.
california_chief - 15 Sep 2007 23:38 GMT
> According to him, cupping can cure fatigue, laziness, ankle pains,
> back pains and other problems.

Why don't blood donations do the same?

> The mouth of the cup (metal, glass and plastic cups are generally
> used)

Duh, what other kind are there?

... DO NOT ADJUST YOUR MIND - The problem is with numbnut's non-reality.
Salmon Egg - 16 Sep 2007 00:16 GMT
On 9/15/07 10:13 AM, in article
1189876400.753865.20600@19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com, "ironjustice@aol.com"

> Sucking Out Blood Is Big Business

That is why the businessmen doing so are often called bloodsuckers.

Bill
--
Fermez le Bush--less than 18 months to go.
bobbyD - 16 Sep 2007 22:00 GMT
> According to him, cupping can cure fatigue, laziness, ankle pains,
> back pains and other problems.

i prefer''SPOONING''to any other kind of sexual tableware.lol

bobbyD
Cupper - 24 Sep 2007 10:08 GMT
I am an expert at cupping and have hadseveral years of experience.
Performed and witnessed hundreds of proceedures. The claims for the
medical benefits of cupping are granted all anecdotal. A few years ago
there was a joint effort between doctors in England and doctors in
Syria to validate the benefits, I should like to search for that. As I
recall their experiments yielded positive results for many ailments.

Nonetheless, the general medical community is not the least bit
interested in what is effectively free treatment that is almost
impossible to control and profit from. The actual mechanics of cupping
are quite simple but as with all real natural healing, a healer who is
authorized by another real healer should be the only people engaging
in such practices. Real healers do not charge for cupping, only
accepting charity that in facts promotes the healing and offers a
protection all it's own. Tithing is a form of protection and cleaning
- a concept lost in the western and christian world.

Now for the limited science lesson. Blood extrapulated from cupping is
scientifically proven to be comprised of only dead blood cells. Unlike
blood extrapultaed from the vein, mostly living cells. Thus cupping
rids the body of dead blood cells. What benefit do dead blood cells
have on the body. NOTHING. They do nothing but harm the cardiovascular
system. The clog up the works. They prevent the body from recieving
proper oxegenation - a critical component in healing. Cupping does not
cure disease - it cleans the body so the body is more effective in
healing itself.

Think of a car radiator. If it is not flushed periodically it will
cause the car to overheat.

Who needs cupping are mostly sexual active men 35 and older - AS A
PREVENTATIVE THEAPY, not a cure for aliments. A women's cycle acts
very similar to cupping therapy and thus women need not do cupping
until after menapause.

I have had cupping performed on me by experts, perhaps a dozen times.
The benefits have been clear for me, which is what caught my intrest
and made me continue to study this field. I have been authorized by a
real healer. I have never charged for cupping and no one has ever
charged me for cupping. The barber shops in the Middle East do charge
and mostly have no idea what they are doing. I have seen barbers
perform cupping in Syria and it is a bit scary. Nonetheless, I do not
think anyone has been harmed.Blood born illness is rare in Syria. I do
imagine there have been some cases where persons have contracted
illness. There is no data.

What I object to is letting the medical mafia regulate this so they
can profit from it. Cuppers are healers, not business people, not
doctors.

I am currently getting beat up for having offered a URL to a free site
where people can more information. The hiccup is that we do not accept
payment for services or solicite doations - what we did do is offer an
e-book that if requested can be had for free. We present it as a sale
with an option to request for free because we find this more
honorable. We never charge for the actual service but we felt that
those already profiting from doing cuppin WRONG would be willing to
give something to find out how to do it RIGHT. Most accupuncturists
and many chiropractors are doing cupping in the States. They are doing
it wrong and e wanted to provide a method to correct this. Anyone
wanting to come to a cupping session can see what we do for free. And
again, anyone can request the material for free. I am amazed at the
hostility coming from some people in this forum towards what was a
genuine offer to inform and help. I digess . . . .

Cupping in fact is sanctioned and recommended by Prophets. The Jews
claim it's orgins, so do the Buddists - we are believing ourselves
that Buddah was a Prophet as was Moses. Leach and larva therapy is now
an accepted form of treatment in micro surgery - once though
barbaric.

The major risk assocaited with cupping is resting afterwards and
promoting blood clotting. Done properly, I have never heard of or
experenced any problems.

Arthritis is caused by not living right and from the gazzilion
artificial chemicals and poisons in our daily lives. Yes, cupping ill
help. Cooking sheeps feet in a soup until reduced to a jell also
works. Eat a tablespoon full each morning. I would point you to the
free information on our site, but I do not wish to get into another
prolonged battle with the self appointed forum police. You may take
the pills - this works much better.

My advice is to also stop masterbating - at least cut down - but I do
not think anyone wants to talk about that relationship to arthritis.
If we lived as we were intended to live for the purpose that we were
created for - we would not see the amount of illness and disease we
experience. A simple healthy life dedicated to HIM is the answer.

If you have any questions about cupping, feel free to ask.

Cupping does not cure arthritis - but it does help let the body cure
itself.
Joan Carter - 24 Sep 2007 16:03 GMT
>Who needs cupping are mostly sexual active men 35 and older - AS A
>PREVENTATIVE THEAPY, not a cure for aliments. A women's cycle acts
>very similar to cupping therapy and thus women need not do cupping
>until after menapause.

Sooooo, explain why so many women develop arthritis and MS and
other such diseases before menopause, young girls, even..... You
related to Rust for Brains?
ironjustice@aol.com - 25 Sep 2007 18:30 GMT
>> On Sep 24, 8:03 am, Joan Carter <spamf...@sentex.ca> wrote: Sooooo, explain why so many women develop arthritis and MS and
other such diseases before menopause, young girls, even<<

"estrogen can trigger an attack"

THE PORPHYRIA CONNECTION

Then in 1994, testing showed that over 90% of MCS sufferers have
developed a condition known as Disorders of Porphyrinopathy (an
acquired form of the porphyrias). The porphyrias are a group of rare
metabolic, enzyme deficiency disorders involving the production of
heme
(a component of blood) and liver and/or bone marrow damage and has
many
symptoms in common with MCS. The most significant symptom MCS shares
with the porphyrias is chemical intolerance/sensitivity, and any
estrogen mimicking chemical or drug can trigger an attack.

This estrogen connection may be one reason that females (human and
animal) are more susceptible than males to metabolic disorders,
time-dependent sensitization, and MCS.

Another may be butyrylcholinesterases. Plasma butyrylcholinesterases
are scavenger enzymes responsible for removing toxins from the body.
A
Danish study found that women in their 30s and 40s are at an all-time
low for the production of this enzyme, and a recent study on Gulf War
veterans discovered that plasma butyrylcholinesterase deficiencies
were
playing a significant role in how people get poisoned.

Disorders of Porphyrinopathy are also showing up in people with
chronic
fatigue, fibromylagia, amalgam problems, and silicone implants. I
believe that these metabolic problems will provide the tie that binds
all of the chemically injured communities together.

http://www.earthisland.org/eijournal/spring98/sp98e_fe.htm

Who loves ya.
Tom

Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com

Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3

DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
california_chief - 25 Sep 2007 21:00 GMT
numbnuts wrote:

> Then in 1994, testing showed that over 90% of MCS sufferers have
> developed a condition known as Disorders of Porphyrinopathy (an
> acquired form of the porphyrias).

Kinda old stuff there.  What's happened in the past 13 years?

> This estrogen connection may be one reason

...may be

   ,,,may be

       ...may be

           ...may be

Never anything definite.  Always afraid to come right out and say with
confidence "Yes, this is it!"

Never any follow up to 10-, 15-, or 20-year old writings.

Maybe they all learned they were wrong and the studies stopped.

... How to make numbnuts/ironjustice tommy quack:
... 1.  Type a sentence that contains a truth;
... 2.  Click  "Send".
d'huit - 24 Sep 2007 18:46 GMT
<snip>

Now for the limited science lesson. Blood extrapulated from cupping is
scientifically proven to be comprised of only dead blood cells. Unlike
blood extrapultaed from the vein, mostly living cells. Thus cupping
rids the body of dead blood cells. What benefit do dead blood cells
have on the body. NOTHING. They do nothing but harm the cardiovascular
system. The clog up the works. They prevent the body from recieving
proper oxegenation - a critical component in healing. Cupping does not
cure disease - it cleans the body so the body is more effective in
healing itself.

this is not science at all.  you are very misinformed.  your statement is
simply part of a badly misunderstood process that is brought into the
mythology of cupping to justify it.

all that the function of cupping does is create an external vacuum that
brings a small amount of blood closer to the skin's surface (giving somebody
a hickey does the same exact thing).  then a small incision releases that
blood, exposing it to air.  there is no definitive discrimination process in
the cupping process that distinguishes bringing healthy/live from bringing
unhealthy/dead blood cells to the skin's surface. the cupping vacuum created
brings all local blood cells to the surface.  any healthy/living blood cells
that are exposed to air automatically becomes dead blood cells.

the only difference between exsanguinations and cupping is the amount of
blood released by the body, because of the depth of the cuts.

kate
Shelley - 24 Sep 2007 18:57 GMT
Thanks Kate, that made no sense to me either, distinguishing between dead
and live blood cells.  No matter how the skin is damaged to release the
blood, it releases whatever is locally available.  Given my druthers,
hickies sound like the most fun! :)  Shelley

> <snip>
>
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
>
> kate
d'huit - 24 Sep 2007 19:17 GMT
Thanks Kate, that made no sense to me either, distinguishing between dead
and live blood cells.  No matter how the skin is damaged to release the
blood, it releases whatever is locally available.  Given my druthers,
hickies sound like the most fun! :)  Shelley

<g> your druthers make so much more sense!

kate

> <snip>
>
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
>
> kate
never@million - 24 Sep 2007 23:41 GMT
>Thanks Kate, that made no sense to me either, distinguishing between dead
>and live blood cells.  No matter how the skin is damaged to release the
>blood, it releases whatever is locally available.  Given my druthers,
>hickies sound like the most fun! :)  Shelley

"Exsanguinations"? Damn, what about just bleeding?

Donn
Joan Carter - 25 Sep 2007 00:18 GMT
>this is not science at all.  you are very misinformed.  your statement is
>simply part of a badly misunderstood process that is brought into the
>mythology of cupping to justify it.

Yup, Kate, he is definitely related to Rustbucket.
california_chief - 24 Sep 2007 19:18 GMT
> I am an expert at cupping and have had several years of experience.

Had?   As in past tense?   You haven't done any recently?

> Performed and witnessed hundreds of proceedures.

Practicing medicine without a license?   It will be interesting to see if
your state is amused by that.

> Cupping does not cure arthritis - but it does help let the body cure
itself.

B.S.    That's like saying water is liquid and wet only if we touch it.
Joan Carter - 25 Sep 2007 00:23 GMT
>> I am an expert at cupping and have had several years of experience.

Then, On Mon, 24 Sep 2007 11:18:24 -0700, "california_chief"
<Fire_Chief@Jamacha_Junction_FD.ca.us> wrote:

>Had?   As in past tense?   You haven't done any recently?

No, Chief, he cupped himself to exsanguination and no longer
exists. :-)

Joan
d'huit - 25 Sep 2007 00:40 GMT
>> I am an expert at cupping and have had several years of experience.

Then, On Mon, 24 Sep 2007 11:18:24 -0700, "california_chief"
<Fire_Chief@Jamacha_Junction_FD.ca.us> wrote:

>Had?   As in past tense?   You haven't done any recently?

No, Chief, he cupped himself to exsanguination and no longer
exists. :-)

Joan

LOL!  i was hoping somebody would pick up on that word and use it exactly as
you did!<chuckling>

kate
(who soooo loves passing to a receiver for a touchdown!)
california_chief - 24 Sep 2007 19:38 GMT
> Who needs cupping are mostly sexual active men 35 and older - AS A
> PREVENTATIVE THEAPY, not a cure for aliments. A women's cycle acts
> very similar to cupping therapy and thus women need not do cupping
> until after menapause.

That doesn't explain JRA, or why babies develop arthritis.

It doesn't explain why a 28-year-old woman need THREE joint replacements
because of arthritis.
california_chief - 24 Sep 2007 19:47 GMT
"Cupper" <info@brokenearth.org> wrote in message:

> My advice is to also stop masterbating -

There he goes again, display his ignorance once again.

It's spelled    M A S T U R B A T E.

Perhaps if you stopped long enough yourself, you could obtain a little
education.

... Cupper give up his search for reality and now seeks a good fantasy.
Paul T. Holland - 25 Sep 2007 01:31 GMT
might as well parse this one:

> I am an expert at cupping and have hadseveral years of experience.

no verification for self-proclaimed status

> Performed and witnessed hundreds of proceedures.

ditto

>The claims for the
> medical benefits of cupping are granted all anecdotal.

true

>A few years ago
> there was a joint effort between doctors in England and doctors in
> Syria to validate the benefits, I should like to search for that.

since you state it is/was several years ago, why haven't you already
done so

>As I
> recall their experiments yielded positive results for many ailments.

no documentation

> Nonetheless, the general medical community is not the least bit
> interested in what is effectively free treatment that is almost
> impossible to control and profit from.

the actual numbers of trials, studies, and reports of alternative
procedures that are well known prove this to be untrue as to the level
of interest, and your statement re the monetary issue is simply your
attempt to broadbrush indict without any factual information as to this
specific isuse.

>The actual mechanics of cupping
> are quite simple but as with all real natural healing, a healer who is
> authorized

authorized'?

>by another real healer

and just who, or what, verifies and authorizes the
healer...'another'...an example of self-proclamation

it's more than a bit difficlt to ascertain legitimacy when things are
operated on the basis of:

"If you are asking for titles, degrees, resumes, certificates,
references, you have come to the wrong place."

make a claim, but don't have to prove anything...uh-huh

>should be the only people engaging
> in such practices.

and we all just take their word for it

>Real healers do not charge for cupping,

only in some arenas. your all incompassing statement is factual for only
a small percentage of alternative practioners.

>only
> accepting charity that in facts promotes the healing

in what way is this supposedly accomplished? you are espousing a
mystical aspect

>and offers a
> protection all it's own.

'protection? ...

>Tithing is

to the believer, is a compulsary practice - hardly voluntary

>a form of protection and cleaning

'cleaning'? no substance accompanying this statement

> - a concept lost in the western and christian world.

which perhaps is as a result of watching what those receiving such
tithes 'do' with the monies guilted from the flock?

here is one of your writings:

"Inconspicuously, money, if that was what was given, was concealed in an
envelope or small gift box and presented to the healer after the act of
treatment"

so, it's hidden but everyone knows what it is...that is nothing more
than avoidance of 'naming'.

don't talk about it, but everyone knows what is expected, and what is
there...

kind of like those 'tours' you promote to the middle east - everryone
pays their way, and you are along as 'guide'  you say:

"They earn nothing from these tours other than the satisfaction of
sharing their experiences with you."
but isn't it true that the tour pays your way? so you do receive
something don't you? two trips a year isn't it?, not bad...

also speaking of money and product - you praise panera bread for their
work and blast wonder thrift bakery [stillwater]...that wouldn't be
because the one gives you stuff and the other doesn't, now would it?

> Now for the limited science lesson.

limited is accurate so far...

>Blood extrapulated from cupping is
> scientifically proven

other than you 'word' for it, where are your citations and proofs?

>to be comprised of only dead blood cells.

since it comes out red, and only a live cell can carry the oxy that
makes it red, they cannot be dead.

you are proving a lack of science on your part. just what citation can
you give for this satement of yours?

>Unlike
> blood extrapultaed

what?????? 'extrapulated' is the closest i can infer, but that makes no
sense.

>from the vein, mostly living cells. Thus cupping
> rids the body of dead blood cells.

so you say, where is the science behind your assertion? as a result the
next portion is meaningless

>What benefit do dead blood cells
> have on the body. NOTHING.

duh...the body voids waste product and sloughs off and replaces cells
constantly - it does so however, by an orderly process of elimination -
not - thru proximity to caplliaries at the dermal layer.

>They do nothing but harm the cardiovascular
> system.

again, duh....

>The clog up the works.

what? citation for this...the healthy body does no such thing.

>They prevent the body from recieving
> proper oxegenation

the supposed logic appears to be that the dead cells take up the space
of healthy cells? show proof

>- a critical component in healing. Cupping does not
> cure disease -

yet you have occasionally been given to throw the 'cure' word out there
now haven't lyou?

>it cleans the body so the body is more effective in
> healing itself.

yet you haven't been able to give a single citation...

> Think of a car radiator. If it is not flushed periodically it will
> cause the car to overheat.

so, these 'dead' cells will make you blow a gasket? is that why you've
gotten so testy in your replies?
you're too full of dead cells...

> Who needs cupping are mostly sexual active men 35 and older - AS A
> PREVENTATIVE THEAPY, not a cure for aliments.

another of those unexplained assertions

>A women's cycle acts
> very similar to cupping therapy and thus women need not do cupping
> until after menapause.

uh-huh

> I have had cupping performed on me by experts, perhaps a dozen times.

but you claim it needs to be so much more often than that. and by the
way, who are these supposed experts anyway?

> The benefits have been clear for me,

sure sounds like placebo effect at this point.

>which is what caught my intrest
> and made me continue to study this field.

where, when, for how long,

>I have been authorized by a
> real healer.

conveniently left unnamed

>I have never charged for cupping and no one has ever
> charged me for cupping.

but you paid none the less...

>The barber shops in the Middle East do charge
> and mostly have no idea what they are doing.

ah yes those nasty barbers carrying on tradtion - but you know better...

>I have seen barbers
> perform cupping in Syria and it is a bit scary.

but of course yours isn't...

>Nonetheless, I do not
> think anyone has been harmed.

'think'? for someone so devoted to the issue why haven't you researched
it?

>Blood born illness is rare in Syria.

citation? how about cutaneous leishmaniasis  it's endemic there. and
you'll find brucellosis, malaria, west nile virus, measles, polio, and a
hos tof other conditions...

>I do
> imagine there have been some cases where persons have contracted
> illness. There is no data.

really now? perhaps you mean contractiong it from the cuppoing
procedure?  but since nothing is regulated how would anyone know or find
out?

> What I object to is letting the medical mafia regulate this so they
> can profit from it.

i'm sure you do, but just waht do you espose for safety and
certification? ah that's right, one healer to the next...with no
safeguards other than your word...

>Cuppers are healers, not business people, not
> doctors.

horse hockey - healers have always been 'supported' by the tribe, clan,
or whatever social grouping existed.
that is the simplest form of business there is.

> I am currently getting beat up for having offered a URL to a free site
> where people can more information.

untrue, you got soundly rebutted for your attitude

>The hiccup is that we do not accept
> payment for services or solicite doations -

thils is so baltently false that i have to call it the lie

thruout your site you have repepated reference to 'how' to make donation
- you are entirely too savvy not hto have written the way you did for
the emotioanl tulg it would give - it's called amrketing and your are
quite proficient at at. 'oh we don't 'ask' for a donation  - over -and -
over - and over again...'is' asking bubba - and you know it.

>what we did do is offer an
> e-book that if requested can be had for free. We present it as a sale
> with an option to request for free because we find this more
> honorable.

and a durned good marketing play too -

>We never charge for the actual service but we felt that
> those already profiting from doing cuppin WRONG would be willing to
> give something to find out how to do it RIGHT.

lyupper, so you so hope...

>Most accupuncturists
> and many chiropractors are doing cupping in the States. They are doing
> it wrong and e wanted to provide a method to correct this.

yet you are stuck away in the boondocks aand haven't even bothered to
find the stul;dies that may be out there...oh ! you're trying sooooo
hard...

>Anyone
> wanting to come to a cupping session can see what we do for free. And
> again, anyone can request the material for free. I am amazed at the
> hostility coming from some people in this forum towards what was a
> genuine offer to inform and help. I digess . . . .

no you don't  - you're just trying to get in one more plug...

> Cupping in fact is sanctioned and recommended by Prophets.

and what certification did they have?

>The Jews
> claim it's orgins, so do the Buddists - we are believing ourselves
> that Buddah was a Prophet as was Moses.

relevance?

?Leach and larva therapy is now
> an accepted form of treatment in micro surgery - once though
> barbaric.

as a result of those terrible western docs that you rail against doing
the work to find the proofs that it does work - funny about that...

> The major risk assocaited with cupping is resting afterwards and
> promoting blood clotting. Done properly, I have never heard of or
> experenced any problems.

but you haven't really done any work to find the citations. gosh...

> Arthritis is caused by not living right and from the gazzilion
> artificial chemicals and poisons in our daily lives.

ahem...not true bubba - you fail to have even a basic understanding of
biology, genetics, auto-immune, and the list goes -

>Yes, cupping ill
> help.

not for my type it won't

>Cooking sheeps feet in a soup until reduced to a jell also
> works.

no, it doesn't

>Eat a tablespoon full each morning. I would point you to the
> free information on our site, but I do not wish to get into another
> prolonged battle with the self appointed forum police.

dul;rn good thing you don't bubba - 'cause you know what will result

>You may take
> the pills - this works much better.

your unsuppoorted owrd - cause that's all you have....

> My advice is to also stop masterbating -

well, can we ask for you to stop the emotional masturbation that you
have been exhibiting here for several days nowa? it really is unseemly
of you...

>at least cut down - but I do
> not think anyone wants to talk about that relationship to arthritis.

lolololololololololol

> If we lived as we were intended to live for the purpose that we were
> created for - we would not see the amount of illness and disease we
> experience.

that, is actually a valid staement - even if you have it buried amongst
a whole lot of blather.

>A simple healthy life dedicated to HIM is the answer.

very paternalistic of you - not at all inclusive...

> If you have any questions about cupping, feel free to ask.

yawn

> Cupping does not cure arthritis - but it does help let the body cure
> itself.

unfounded and unsupported  by anything included in your information or
site.
bobbyD - 25 Sep 2007 02:13 GMT
> might as well parse this one:

mega holes you have poked in this cuppers baloney,, perhaps this should cure
it of this blood suckin practice,,,

- and i now think the cuppin method could cure,, but might need mega
suction pressure, like  ohh opening an airlock on the space shuttle with no
space suit on,, the ultimate cupping experience this would be,, suck the
eyeballs right outta ya,, and all yer diseases too, sucked right out into
space,,,

cuppin as a form of what????  making a hickey on your back???

anyone who would pay for this garbage,, needs to buy bees and start
injecting, and get some sheep ovaries and start eatin. put magnets in yer
shoes, and a pyramid on yer head,

these folks would be on TV too, sunday mornings,, lettin benny hinn smack em
on the forhead to cure their paralysis

i just dont understand what drives folks to lose all rational thought and
pay for these retarded services.  from palm readings, to Re-birthings, to
healing by touch,, to past lives, to religous healing tv shows, to herbal
Cures, to pychic services, to ghost cleansings,, to smeels as a cure, to
bathing in ground up placentas from 7 sisters who gave birth all on same day
and 7 sets of twins, at 7am, ont he 7 day of the 7th month,,  by seven
doctors samed sevin,,,, all babies had seven fingers on one hand,,,

this garbage doesnt work,  if you pay for it, might as well tosss coins in
Trevi fountain make a wish,, just as much a chance of that working as ,
lettin benny hinn wack you on the head to cure paralysis,  it is beyond me,
why people fork over millions to those fraudsters.

cupping, is a new fad for rich folks who have to much time and money,,,
whats next birthing pools filled with jello,, not pudding, gelatin ,,,
why???  cause it costs alot of money so they will pay for it,,, if you
charge alot for something stupid rich folks will buy it!!!!

cheers
bobbyD

ps i would not waste one cent on garbage cure bullshit!!!!!! whoever does is
enabling this crap to continue.

>> I am an expert at cupping and have hadseveral years of experience.
>
[quoted text clipped - 382 lines]
> unfounded and unsupported  by anything included in your information or
> site.
Cupper - 25 Sep 2007 06:53 GMT
Deaf, dumb and blind . . .

Does not elude to the physical senses. The heart has it's own set of
spiritual senses that see, hear, etc. . .

This should be the goal of every human. Animals are fighting for
another bone and are happy to be trapped in their mind.

Real knowledge only comes from a purified heart. The brain will never
contain the knowledge of the heart.

We are approaching knowledge and understanding from opposite ends. I
do not anticipate you ever understanding. You are locked in your own
ego, really thinking yourself to be your own God. It keeps you traped
in the mind, never experiencing real knowledge and real understanding.

We are not here selling anyhting. If you like take from the knowledge
presented. If not, don't take.

I earned a long time ago that people who respond line by line to a
post rather than collect their thoughts and right a thoughtful
response are people you are just wasting your time with. We are
speaking to people with the capacity of achieving real knowledge and
understanding. Real experts on real knowledge have no need to defend
what they do. I have only responded to you in the past so others may
see and learn.

I do hope for you a better understanding someday.

Peace
d'huit - 25 Sep 2007 07:20 GMT
Deaf, dumb and blind . . .

Does not elude to the physical senses. The heart has it's own set of
spiritual senses that see, hear, etc. . .

This should be the goal of every human. Animals are fighting for
another bone and are happy to be trapped in their mind.

Real knowledge only comes from a purified heart. The brain will never
contain the knowledge of the heart.

We are approaching knowledge and understanding from opposite ends. I
do not anticipate you ever understanding. You are locked in your own
ego, really thinking yourself to be your own God. It keeps you traped
in the mind, never experiencing real knowledge and real understanding.

We are not here selling anyhting. If you like take from the knowledge
presented. If not, don't take.

I earned a long time ago that people who respond line by line to a
post rather than collect their thoughts and right a thoughtful
response are people you are just wasting your time with. We are
speaking to people with the capacity of achieving real knowledge and
understanding. Real experts on real knowledge have no need to defend
what they do. I have only responded to you in the past so others may
see and learn.

I do hope for you a better understanding someday.

Peace

i disagree.

knowledge is that which we quest for and acquire to explain and cope/deal
with those things with which we are uncertain and uncomfortable.  knowledge
is ever changeable.  hence, there is no such thing as, and can never be,
real experts on real knowledge.

understanding is that which ultimately brings us to being comfortable with
uncertainty.

kate
(yes, well . . . i do tend to be a bit inexplicably philosophical, at times.
but, i'm comfortable with that.<smile>)
Joan Carter - 25 Sep 2007 15:35 GMT
>We are approaching knowledge and understanding from opposite ends. I
>do not anticipate you ever understanding. You are locked in your own
>ego, really thinking yourself to be your own God. It keeps you traped
>in the mind, never experiencing real knowledge and real understanding.

It's time for you to go. Plonk! Bye, bye.
Paul T. Holland - 25 Sep 2007 21:26 GMT
while almost all of this is just regurgitation of his posturing, this
line stands out:

>Real experts on real knowledge have no need to defend
>what they do.

so, bubba, that means that all of the defending that you have been doing
these past days signals that 'you' aren't an expert at all...

> Deaf, dumb and blind . . .
>
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
>
> Peace
california_chief - 26 Sep 2007 06:35 GMT
> Real experts on real knowledge have no need to defend
> what they do.

Well, with the amount of defending you've been up to, you must be on the
lowest rung of any experts' ladder - if you've somehow managed to conquer
even that.  Have to get out of the crib, be potty trained, and learn how to
walk erect before you can climb ladders.

Be careful you don't fall off.

> I have only responded to you in the past so others may
> see and learn.

What a freakin' LIAR.  Your sole intent in to draw in suckers who may fall
for your B.S.

... Cupper's ramblings are almost hypnotic, like a lava lamp.
ironjustice@aol.com - 25 Sep 2007 18:58 GMT
Hijamah
The pearl divers in the Arabian Gulf used to undergo hijamah before
the diving season in the belief that the procedure will prevent
diseases during the 3 months at sea.

http://www.hmc.org.qa/heartviews/VOL5NO2/special_section.htm

---------------------------------------------------

I wonder if divers get .. increased red blood cell production .. ?

"The strongest interventions (simulated diving, maximal apnea, and
maximal simulated diving) elicited modest but significant increases in
hemoglobin concentration (0.1-0.3 mmol/l) and hematocrit (0.3-1%)."

http://tinyurl.com/285ssn

Who loves ya.
Tom

Jesus Was A Vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com

Man Is A Herbivore!
http://tinyurl.com/a3cc3

DEAD PEOPLE WALKING
http://tinyurl.com/zk9fk
 
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