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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Arthritis / August 2007helicobacter pylori
Is it possible that a person may not show any signs of helicobacter pylori infection but carries the infection? According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicobacter_pylori it says "...infection may be symptomatic or asymptomatic (without perceptible ill effects)." According to http://www.helico.com/faq_infection.html#Q11 and many other sources, they say one possible way of transmission is via the mouth. I have been with my spouse since 2002 (5 years). My spouse has been diagnosed with HP (helicobacter pylori). She undergone 3 months of anti-biotics and still has HP. I have never shown any signs/symptoms of HP. When I read how easy HP can be transmitted it made me think. I remember when me & my spouse tried the inhale/exhale kissing method. I must've been the HP carrier. I tried to pursuade my doctor for me to have a HP breath test. But I was rejected with "laughter from the hospital" & "wasting NHS time and money". If I do have asymptomatic HP then wouldn't I reinfect my spouse over and over again? What are your thoughts? And should I persist in getting a HP breath test? Lastly, I found it very hard finding a HP diet plan. My spouse is lactose intolerant (can't eat/drink dairy/milk content) so it's very hard. If anyone who knows a lactose intolerant HP diet then please let me know. Not a big deal. Develop a fondness for hot peppers. Or take the capsaicin capsules. http://www.annmicro.unimi.it/full/55/zeyrek_55_125-127.pdf http://www.herbsforhealth.com/index.php?page=article&do=view&id=praise_of_peppers > Is it possible that a person may not show any signs of helicobacter > pylori [quoted text clipped - 52 lines] > > who knows a lactose intolerant HP diet then please let me know. Info to consider, pointing out the in vitro/in vivo relationship http://www.yourhealthbase.com/database/a93f.htm Brought to you by Procter & Gamble Pharmaceuticals. > Not a big deal. > Develop a fondness for hot peppers. Or take the capsaicin capsules.http://www.annmicro.unimi.it/full/55/zeyrek_55_125-127.pdf [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] > > > who knows a lactose intolerant HP diet then please let me know. Would you all kindly take alt.support.arthritis out of your crossposting nonsense and keep your stuff to yourself!!! . . . Donna . . . . 1. ANGELS EXIST, but some times, since they don't all have wings, we call them FRIENDS...... 2. J.K.M.A. First time around years ago when I had the first test I had to of all things blow up a balloon. Seems you exhale the stuff. Second time around because a doctor didn't believe I had it for years was a blood test that showed it. These days I've learned it's all about aggressive treatment of several things at once and if you have a doctor who is not willing to catch onto this then it's time to flush him or her. > Info to consider, pointing out the in vitro/in vivo relationship > http://www.yourhealthbase.com/database/a93f.htm [quoted text clipped - 63 lines] >> >>> who knows a lactose intolerant HP diet then please let me know. > If I do have asymptomatic HP then wouldn't I reinfect my spouse over and > over again? The literature suggests reinfections rates are quite low, and quite a lot of spouses are likely infected, so it seems more likely the infection is just not being eradicated in the first place. There are no doubt things spouses can do to increase/decrease the risks. > If anyone who knows a lactose intolerant HP diet then please let me know. One paper suggests Broccoli sprouts are a potential food to try. I'm always suspicious of such things, and couldn't find follow-up studies, but sounds like it wouldn't hurt to try it. They ate broccoli sprouts, twice a day, for seven days. > > If I do have asymptomatic HP then wouldn't I reinfect my spouse over and > > over again? [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > but sounds like it wouldn't hurt to try it. They ate broccoli sprouts, > twice a day, for seven days. Actually, more than one paper has been written on the study of H. pylori and broccoli sprouts. The first study was published in 2002, then a small, preliminary human clinical study was published in 2004, and a larger study in Japan published a year later. Of course, nothing is confirmed by FDA standards, but the studies are interesting. Here is a link to 3 of them: http://www.brassica.com/sci/papers.asp#stomach, namely: Daily Intake of Sulforaphane-Rich Broccoli Sprouts Improves Gastritis in H.pylori-Infected Human Subjects. (#) Cancer Epidemiology, Biomarkers & Prevention, November 2005, Vol. 14(11 Part 2): 2754s. Yanaka, A, Zhang, S, Yamamoto, M, Fahey, J. (Abstract PDF) Oral Broccoli Sprouts for the Treatment of Helicobacter pylori Infection: A Preliminary Report Digestive Diseases and Sciences, 49(7/8):1088-1090, 2004. Mark V. Galan, Md, Arfana A. Kishan, Md, And Ann L. Silverman, Md doi:10.1023/B:DDAS.0000037792.04787.8a PubMed ID: 15387326 Sulforaphane inhibits extracellular, intracellular, and antibiotic- resistant strains of Helicobacter pylori and prevents benzo[a]pyrene- induced stomach tumors (#) Proc. Natl. Acad. Sci. USA, Vol. 99, Issue 11, pp. 7610-7615, May 28, 2002 Jed W. Fahey, Xavier Haristoy, Patrick M. Dolan, Thomas W. Kensler, Isabelle Scholtus, Katherine K. Stephenson, Paul Talalay, and Alain Lozniewski doi:10.1073/pnas.112203099 PubMed ID: 12032331 > Is it possible that a person may not show any signs of helicobacter > pylori [quoted text clipped - 52 lines] > > who knows a lactose intolerant HP diet then please let me know. HP does not cause ulcers. These spirochetes were found in the human stomach in 1898 and dismissed, yes dismissed, as the cause of ulcers. You have ill health and are being conned by the medical monopoly for their benefit and profit. Welcome to the real world of medicine. Investigate natural hygiene. Begin to live a lifestyle that does not promote indigestion. In a few weeks you will no longer have indigestion and ta da, your stomach problems will abate and heal in time. Sorry that no Nobel Prize is associated with the health truth. DrCee Perhaps you would be gracious enough to correct the Wikipedia folks for the benefit of the rest of us? That would be nice of you. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_peptic_ulcer_disease_and_Helicobacter_pylori On Jul 14, 10:26 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > HP does not cause ulcers. These spirochetes were found in the human > stomach in 1898 and dismissed, yes dismissed, as the cause of [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > DrCee > Perhaps you would be gracious enough to correct the Wikipedia > folks for the benefit of the rest of us? That would be nice of you. > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_peptic_ulcer_disease_and_Helicobacter_pylori WIKIPEDIA DOES NOT GIVE MEDICAL ADVICE Wikipedia contains articles on many medical topics; however, no warranty whatsoever is made that any of the articles are accurate. There is absolutely no assurance that any statement contained or cited in an article touching on medical matters is true, correct, precise, or up-to-date. The overwhelming majority of such articles are written, in part or in whole, by nonprofessionals. Even if a statement made about medicine is accurate, it may not apply to you or your symptoms. The medical information provided on Wikipedia is, at best, of a general nature and cannot substitute for the advice of a medical professional (for instance, a qualified doctor/physician, nurse, pharmacist/chemist, and so on). Wikipedia is not a doctor. None of the individual contributors, system operators, developers, sponsors of Wikipedia nor anyone else connected to Wikipedia can take any responsibility for the results or consequences of any attempt to use or adopt any of the information presented on this web site. Nothing on Wikipedia.org or included as part of any project of Wikimedia Foundation Inc., should be construed as an attempt to offer or render a medical opinion or otherwise engage in the practice of medicine. Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Medical_disclaimer" USE WIKIPEDIA AT YOUR OWN RISK PLEASE BE AWARE THAT ANY INFORMATION YOU MAY FIND IN WIKIPEDIA MAY BE INACCURATE, MISLEADING, DANGEROUS OR ILLEGAL. This risk disclaimer has been linked to the page you have been reading because someone feels that some of the information on that page may create an unreasonable risk for those readers who choose to apply or use the information in their own activities or to promote the information for use by third parties. None of the authors, contributors, sponsors, administrators, vandals, or anyone else connected with Wikipedia, in any way whatsoever, can be responsible for your use of the information contained in or linked from these web pages. Please take all steps necessary to ascertain that any information you receive from Wikipedia is correct and has been verified. Check the references at the end of the article. Read the article's talk page and revision history to see if there are any outstanding disputes over the contents of the article. Double-check information with independent sources. If an article contains suggestions regarding dangerous, illegal or unethical activities, remember that anyone can post this information on Wikipedia. The authors may not be qualified to provide you with complete information or to inform you about adequate safety precautions or steps you can take to prevent injury, bodily damage, or other damages to your person, property or reputation. If you need specific advice (for example, medical, legal, risk management) please seek a professional licensed or knowledgeable in that area. Wikipedia is not uniformly peer reviewed; while readers may correct errors or remove erroneous suggestions, they have no legal duty to do so, and thus all information read here is without any implied warranty of fitness for any purpose or use whatsoever. No consequential damages can be sought against Wikipedia, as it is a voluntary association of individuals developed freely to create various open source online educational, cultural and informational resources. This information is being given to you gratuitously and thus there is no agreement or understanding between you and Wikipedia regarding your use or modification of this information beyond the GNU Free Documentation License. DO NOT RELY UPON ANY INFORMATION FOUND IN WIKIPEDIA WITHOUT INDEPENDENT VERIFICATION. Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Risk_disclaimer" > On Jul 14, 10:26 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >> >> DrCee >> Perhaps you would be gracious enough to correct the Wikipedia >> folks for the benefit of the rest of us? That would be nice of you. >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_peptic_ulcer_disease_and_Helicobacter_pylori > >WIKIPEDIA DOES NOT GIVE MEDICAL ADVICE Whatever. Are you arguing for or against H pylori as a cause of ulcers, Jan?  SignaturePeter Bowditch aa #2243 The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com Ya know, I'd like to think that this crowd is sophisticated enough that your advice is unnecessary. However, since the original poster made reference to a piece of Wikipedia info, and since "Dr Cee" came up with the included proposal, I directed him(?) to there. Rather than directing to the Nobel Prize Committee to tell them how wrong they had been. But while we are on the same subject of Wikipedia disclaimers, the same holds true on ANY MEDICAL ADVICE gotten from most anywhere, including medical professionals who are not necessarily fully aware of all sources and content of information on the subject. In other words, the patient/client still needs to try to be the most informed on products they apply to or within their body. Michael Baugh Training fibromyalgia couples in safe and effective massage > > Perhaps you would be gracious enough to correct the Wikipedia > > folks for the benefit of the rest of us? That would be nice of you. [quoted text clipped - 89 lines] > > >> DrCee >Perhaps you would be gracious enough to correct the Wikipedia >folks for the benefit of the rest of us? That would be nice of you. >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_peptic_ulcer_disease_and_Helicobacter_pylori Not-doctor Cee doesn't believe that bacteria or viruses cause anything - it's all in the soil. >On Jul 14, 10:26 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >> DrCee > SignaturePeter Bowditch aa #2243 The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com >>Perhaps you would be gracious enough to correct the Wikipedia >>folks for the benefit of the rest of us? That would be nice of you. >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_peptic_ulcer_disease_and_Helicobacter_pylori > >Not-doctor Cee doesn't believe that bacteria or viruses cause anything >- it's all in the soil. Yes, but I wish he'd quit soiling himself here on m.h.a, out in public view. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "Only George Bush could start a war for oil and not get any." -- Bill Maher >> Is it possible that a person may not show any signs of helicobacter >> pylori [quoted text clipped - 59 lines] > You have ill health and are being conned by the medical monopoly > for their benefit and profit. Welcome to the real world of medicine. You're an absolute fuckwit who is too lazy to actually understand microbiology and pathology. Try graduating from high school. > Investigate natural hygiene. When you can successfully wipe your own a.s, let us all know. Cheers, Ari Signaturespammage trappage: remove the underscores to reply Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow transplant. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor and literally save someone's life: http://www.abmdr.org.au/ http://www.marrow.org/ >>> Is it possible that a person may not show any signs of helicobacter >>> pylori [quoted text clipped - 62 lines] >You're an absolute fuckwit who is too lazy to actually understand >microbiology and pathology. Try graduating from high school. Anyone who denies that bacteria and viruses play any part in causing disease has no need for knowledge of microbiology. You got the fuckwit part right. >> Investigate natural hygiene. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Ari SignaturePeter Bowditch aa #2243 The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com On 15 Jul, 03:26, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > > Is it possible that a person may not show any signs of helicobacter > > pylori [quoted text clipped - 70 lines] > > - Show quoted text - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3 October 2005 The Nobel Assembly at Karolinska Institutet has today decided to award The Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine for 2005 jointly to Barry J. Marshall and J. Robin Warren for their discovery of "the bacterium Helicobacter pylori and its role in gastritis and peptic ulcer disease" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr Barry Marshall's original work was in 1984. There was a strong correlation between dyspepsia and peptic ulcer and the presence of HP in the stomach. And the use of antibioitics against HP cures ulcers that were once longterm, intractable, and frequently required major surgery. Toom > On 15 Jul, 03:26, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 93 lines] > > - Show quoted text - The power of Big Pharma to con humanity is limited only by their bank account. The spirochetes HP were discovered in 1898. Marshall and Warren did not discover them first. Marshall and Warren are not justified in receiving the Nobel Prize. Receiving the Nobel Prize does not validate the work nor make HP the true cause of ulcers. The treatment is three fold and not always successful. HP is not found in all cases of ulcers. Clearing HP does not "cure" all cases of ulcers. The data clearly indicates that HP is an innocent bystander as far as ulcers are concerned. Enjoy your delusions. Enjoy your profits. The truth lies elsewhere. DrCee On 15 Jul, 17:29, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > The power of Big Pharma to con humanity is limited only by their bank > account. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Enjoy your delusions. Enjoy your profits. The truth lies elsewhere. errr. Big Pharma wouldn't have been too pleased with them, since they found a simple, fast and cheap treatment and cure, where Big Pharma had been making lots of money on long-term drug treatment of symptoms. HP in the stomach may well have been discovered in 1898; the important bit is recognising it as a causative agent in peptic disease. Where HP is present in ulceration, removing the HP by antibiotic treatment usually effects a cure. Toom > errr. Big Pharma wouldn't have been too pleased with them, since they > found a simple, fast and cheap treatment and cure, where Big Pharma [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > is present in ulceration, removing the HP by antibiotic treatment > usually effects a cure. and sometimes, like in the case of my father, there is just too much damage to totally 'cure' all symptoms, but at least it doesnt get any worse :) > > errr. Big Pharma wouldn't have been too pleased with them, since they > > found a simple, fast and cheap treatment and cure, where Big Pharma [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > damage to totally 'cure' all symptoms, but at least it doesnt get any > worse :) There is a cause for ulcers, both peptic and duodenal. By accepting the allopathic con, you take drugs to eliminate a spirochete which may be associated with the stomach flora, but does not cause ulcers. Thus, you may never remove the true cause for ulcers and they can and may reoccur. This is only one of the problems that occurs from believing the medical lies and deceit. Correct your diet and lifestyle. Eliminate indigestion. You will then have removed the cause for ulcers and the body will heal in time. DrCee. >> > errr. Big Pharma wouldn't have been too pleased with them, since they >> > found a simple, fast and cheap treatment and cure, where Big Pharma [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >Correct your diet and lifestyle. Eliminate indigestion. You will >then have removed the cause for ulcers and the body will heal in time. And you can trust "Dr" Cee, because he's long since established himself as...as...well, actually, he's never established himself to be anything other than a foolish blowhard, but far be it from me to tell anyone they can't follow his advice, such as it is. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "Only George Bush could start a war for oil and not get any." -- Bill Maher On Jul 16, 7:28 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > There is a cause for ulcers, both peptic and duodenal. By accepting > the allopathic con, you take drugs to eliminate a spirochete which may [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > DrCee. Yes, there is a cause for ulcers. In type A gastritis, it's your own immune system. In type B it's helicobacter pylori. In type C there are chemicals like NSAID or gall fluid reflux. Plus there is acute gastritis from various cases like transient hypoxemia. So, you're right, there is a cause for ulcers. If you do not believe that H. pylori is associated with gastric ulcers, even now that the nobel price committee has awarded a nobel prize for this discovery, then you should really, really, renew your world-view. And you should definitively NOT give medical advice, ever. > On Jul 16, 7:28 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Let us view how the con has grown. Type A gastritis is caused by your own immune system. How very stupid. My body and yours works to provide me or you with health and not disease. I cannot accept this excuse for knowledge and understanding. In type B, it is due to a bacteria which cannot cause ulcers under any circumstances. This is the typical allopathic con and lie. Bacteria do not infect and cause disease. If the bacteria are present, they are innocent bystanders. This has been known and accepted by scientists since 1870. Yet, the present medical monopoly needs this lie and continues to promote the germ theory of disease. In type C, you are admitting that ulcers can be an iatrogentic disease, a disease caused by your allopathic doctor. Here I can agree. If the docs don't kill you, they can cause you to be sicker than before you went to them. Investigate medical history, not just the history the pharma shills would like you to believe. DrCee I am familiar with Bechamp, including his malignment, but frankly see no value to a set of threads in alt.med.fibromyalgia such as already displayed in other newsgroups. So if anyone wants to (yet again) take up the discussion, please remove alt.med.fibromyalgia newsgroup from the crosspostings. Thanks to all. On Jul 22, 7:56 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > > On Jul 16, 7:28 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > > DrCee But Mike it IS funny seeing what they do not know LOL CB > I am familiar with Bechamp, including his malignment, but frankly > see no value to a set of threads in alt.med.fibromyalgia such as [quoted text clipped - 61 lines] >> >> DrCee >> On Jul 16, 7:28 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] >not disease. I cannot accept this excuse for knowledge and >understanding. Right back atcha, pal. You're claiming that the body's design is utterly perfect and can never go wrong. That's obviously untrue and simply a blind religious belief. >In type B, it is due to a bacteria which cannot cause ulcers under any >circumstances. This is the typical allopathic con and lie. Bacteria >do not infect and cause disease. If the bacteria are present, they >are innocent bystanders. This has been known and accepted by >scientists since 1870. Maybe back in 1870. Today, scientists do not accept it. You are not a scientist, by the way. Scientists go where the data leads them, no matter whether it collides with their preferences or not. >Yet, the present medical monopoly needs this >lie and continues to promote the germ theory of disease. Well, only because it's true. >Investigate medical history, not just the history the pharma shills >would like you to believe. By all means, do. You'll find out that there were other theories of disease, like the "four humours" that also fell by the wayside. Or the idea that "bad air" causes disease (consider the literal translation of "malaria"). Orthopathy is just another such. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "[Republicans] talk about Ronald Reagan the way gays talk about Barbra Streisand." -- Bill Maher >>> On Jul 16, 7:28 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: >>> [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > utterly perfect and can never go wrong. That's obviously untrue and > simply a blind religious belief. You got that idea where? What religion believes the body's design is utterly perfect AND can never go wrong? >>In type B, it is due to a bacteria which cannot cause ulcers under any >>circumstances. This is the typical allopathic con and lie. Bacteria [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > "[Republicans] talk about Ronald Reagan the way gays talk about > Barbra Streisand." -- Bill Maher For those of you responding to this post, please trim your headers to exclude alt.supportthyroid. We really don't need or want the noise, as it is off topic for our group. Thanks >>>> On Jul 16, 7:28 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: >>>> [quoted text clipped - 69 lines] >> "[Republicans] talk about Ronald Reagan the way gays talk about >> Barbra Streisand." -- Bill Maher Somewhat correct, as I understand it. HP accounts for ALMOST all peptic ulcers, accounting for 80 percent of stomach ulcers and more than 90 percent of duodenal ulcers. Steady use of NSAIDS and other meds can cause ulcers as well. On Jul 15, 12:29 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > Enjoy your delusions. Enjoy your profits. The truth lies elsewhere. > > DrCee |
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