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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Arthritis / March 2007

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ASA people who post in chronic pain-need some advice (Paul, Rosie, Johnie, anyone???)

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shenmei9wise@gmail.com - 26 Mar 2007 18:28 GMT
So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
weeks ago, which seems to have developed following a surgical
procedure on her foot.  She has been in very severe pain and her bones
in that foot are softening. She is feeling suicidal and depressed and
having a difficult time even taking care of Logan.

I so do not have a grip on RSD and how to treat it, either
allopathically or with complementary medicine.  So many things seem to
act as triggers and I have spent probably 20 hours trying to research
this disease and cannot get a clear picture of it or the neurological
pathways it might follow.

Megan is having a hard time as she wades through the kaiser system
trying to get diagnosis, treatment, etc.  We need to find a specialist
in the Bay Area; she needs to try to educate herself as to what can be
done

So, should I send Megan to chronic pain newsgroup?  Are there links
somewhere that would be good RSD resources (like drdoc's site for
arthritis)?  Any suggestions on any thing I can do?

Paul, if you read this:

Didn't Susie have RSD?  If I'm not tripping and that is actually the
case, how is she and what treatment did she have?

Rosie, johnie or anyone else that hangs out in chronic pain:  I will
have Megan post there-can you be looking for her post and help her
learn the newbie ropes?

Last, I would love it if we can have some ASA prayers for Megan

M
Kelly C. - 26 Mar 2007 18:52 GMT
M, you may have already found this site:
http://www.rsds.org/index2.html, but it looks to have some good information
and support links.

Megan has my prayers for peace and mostly for good, aggressive treatment,
and wisdom of the people who care for her. I wish she had other than Kaiser
insurance, though. It can be such a circus.

Hugs for your Mommy heart as you try and help her through this.

Kelly C.

> So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
> and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
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>
> M
Squirrely - 26 Mar 2007 19:04 GMT
M,

prayers coming for both Megan and you. I will join in with a ASA prayer.
Take care sweetie. You hang in there.

Signature

Love and Hugs to all
Jo the squirrely one

> So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
> and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
>
> M
Carole - 26 Mar 2007 19:10 GMT
I don't know anything about RSD, but I will keep you all in my prayers.

Hugs,
Carole

> So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
> and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
>
> M
Ann - 26 Mar 2007 19:52 GMT
Like Carole, I don't know anything about this disease but it sounds just
awful.  Will add Megan to my list of those who need some prayers.

Ann
Rosemarie Shiver - 26 Mar 2007 20:22 GMT
Heya, M,

   Here's a HUGE site that Painiacs use concerning RSD:

http://www.rsdhope.org/

     What it is is a condition of severe localized pain and all that that
brings with it. If caught early it can be prevented. If not, the sufferer is
stuck with it and needs to find the chronic pain treatment that will work
for them.

     Sleep disturbance for those with RSD/CRPS is also severe and needs to
be treated.

      I know of one sufferer who has an intrathecal pump implant and has
been getting Ketamine in it....Prialt seems not to have been of any use.

       Another sufferer who is using anti-convulsants and opiates is less
able to control the pain.

      A third is in the middle...doing ok now, but worried about the future
of her treatment. ( Fran's daughter, Squish)

       It is a YMMV thing, M, and Megan would benefit from a good pain
management doc.....the anesthesiologist kind, not the physiatrist type.

       Things are pretty calm these days at the chronic dash pain NG so it
would be a good idea for Megan to post there and get some support.

        As for YOU, m'dear...sending healing wishes and good vibes and
stepping them up to the max on April 2 for you. Be especially kind to M,
please? Thanks!

Luv and Hugs from Rosie

Signature

"If you wanna get it done, you gotta fight for yourself." -- Meat Loaf, Bat
Outta Hell II

> So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
> and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
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>
> M
shenmei9wise@gmail.com - 26 Mar 2007 21:02 GMT
> Heya, M,
>
[quoted text clipped - 71 lines]
>
> > M

 Thanks you with all my heart, Rosie.  I am at such a loss as I try
to figure this thing out.  If she had cancer or arthritis or avian flu
or whatever, I would know what to do medically and feel confident that
I can do it.  I have been talking to michael and caroline constantly
and niether one of them has much of a clue which scares me since they
are both such extraordinary doctors.

I will have her pop into chronic pain and see what she can pick up
there

m
Gary Z - 27 Mar 2007 14:04 GMT
Hi Melinda,

Good to see you posting again. Sorry to hear about your legs! Wanna borrow
one of mine for awhile? You could only have it for a couple of weeks though
as golf is about to begin here again.

GaryZ
Kelly - 26 Mar 2007 20:45 GMT
Okay Melinda - time to stop.  Too much happening at once again!  Glad to
hear you have your feet up though!

If Megan wants ask her to write to me personally.  I handle chronic pain all
the time and have been through similiar things with the neuropathic pain
since the enbrel.  The treatment is similiar by the sounds of it.  I have
been on pregabilin (lyrica) and it did help but I did find my eyesight was a
bit wonky with it and my insurance did not cover it.  I found gabapentin
works just as well but I have to be careful when I take it and to go up
slowly with it so you don't get fatiqued.  The website says they use the
same for RSD.  I would also ask if it could be used in conjunction with
something like Keppra - a seizure med.  This is a combination for
neuropathic pain and in combination has brought my pain level to about an 8
out of 10.  Stopping 3 times a day to lie down and meditate or to do
relaxation exercises helps (elevating that leg when doing them as well).  I
know this is hard with a child but when they nap etc or while they are
watching 30 minutes of a tv program while in a playpen (I know again not
great but better than someone who is in great pain looking after a child).
Keeping range of motion is mandatory.  this is not the same as just walking
but you would know that.  I find ice or heat on the neuropathic leg is not
always great - it worked better if I had raised my blankets so they didn't
touch and had lukewarm showers or baths.  Not sure if this is the same for
RSD - she might have to experiment.  Antidepressants might be mandatory -
slowly titrating them - both for  the pain relief and for the depression.
As you know this can be really real.

As for complementary - well get her doctor to check her b12 levels.  This
can be low in diabetic neuroprathy, ms, and some other neuropathic things -
wonder if it is the same for RSD.  If true it might take shots - not just
pills.  The usual fish oil pills etc never hurt.  I did find although the
accupuncture helped while I was there and for a couple of hours in the long
run it irritated the nerves more.  There were just too many triggers.  when
I stopped I felt better overall - even though I felt great taking the
treatments during the hour.

I can talk to her about the chronic pain though so feel free to send her
quietly to me.  As you know I am positive and not dreary and will not bash
natural, complementary or allopathic medicine.  She is in a tough place with
Logan too!  I don't know the system down there but if she can get some help
with daycare that might help.  Maybe even a girl scout(not sure what the
older girls are called down there) who would come and play with Logan
several times in his home to help her - that would earn her badges if
nothing else.  I know the girls I helped with here would have loved a
service project like this and the price would have been free and Megan would
be right with them to advice them if needed.

Hang in there Melinda - sending you a piece of my rope.  Disneyland helped
to make it a little longer for me and I have a bit to share.

Kelly

> So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
> and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
>
> M
shenmei9wise@gmail.com - 26 Mar 2007 20:57 GMT
> Okay Melinda - time to stop.  Too much happening at once again!  Glad to
> hear you have your feet up though!
[quoted text clipped - 85 lines]
>
> > M

thanks for the info Kelly-I'm passing this along to her.  I had that
feeling that acupuncture might be a trigger-for sure moxa is.  I will
use ear points on her but no local points.  I just cannot imagine how
in the world we are all going to cope with all of this.

well, good info is always the first step and of course, great support

m
Kelly - 26 Mar 2007 23:31 GMT
Slow and easy on everything Melinda is the clue.  Do not work too hard on
any point - and yes the moxa was a trigger for me.  Even doing much physio
triggered pain.  We use low intensity for short periods.  I wish I could
communicate to you what did feel good in the accupuncture but hard to tell.
Occasionally it would not bother me.  Other times it really triggered pain
later in the week.

You can cope but yes it will be hard with Logan.  Try if possible to find
some way through the community that she can get a rest from him during the
day for short bits.  That will recharge her a little.  And the
antidepressant will help with the pain and the depression (I know so says
she who could just not tolerate them for very long even though they did
work.  Might need to try another before too long here.)

Hang in there Melinda and remember I will work with her long distance on
some of the relaxation and distraction things if you want.  They do work for
chronic pain the best I believe. I could not do without them.

We are behind you all the way M.  Grab hold.

Kelly

>> Okay Melinda - time to stop.  Too much happening at once again!  Glad to
>> hear you have your feet up though!
[quoted text clipped - 111 lines]
>
> m
Donna G. - 27 Mar 2007 04:17 GMT
Oh, M!   I don't even know what to say.  You and Megan and Logan have
been through soooooo much as of late!   Enough already!!!   It's odd
sometimes how certain people seem to just get pummeled by so much and
continue to go on.  I know we're not promised that life will be fair,
but sometimes you just gotta shake your head and wonder outloud,
why?!!!!

Don't know anything about RSD, but certainly can light some candles and
send tons of healing prayers to Megan and all of you!!!

Gentle hugs,

Donna G.
.
.
.
ANGELS EXIST, but some times, since they don't all have wings, we call
them FRIENDS......
Kimmy - 26 Mar 2007 22:01 GMT
Prayers being said.

Love ya,
Kimmy

> So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
> and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
>
> M
Alex B., - 27 Mar 2007 04:02 GMT
Sending Good Thoughts,
{{{{Megan}}}}

GrampaHugs,
Alex,

> So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
> and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
>
> M

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Cindy - 27 Mar 2007 13:18 GMT
Melinda...I am so sorry about Megan...I don't know alot about RSD, but that
it is very painful..Also trying to care for a child..
I think that you should gently push her towards A counselor who deals with
Chronic Pain...I know that my pain was only a part of my depression when I
sought therapy...And it is a life saver for me...and while 3 years ago when
I started...I was going every two weeks, I now see him about every  6
weeks...
And for someone who has not ever been to a Pain Management Doctor..but saw
such care for my BIL...that might be a way to go.He had to deal with the VA
until he got his SSDI and the strongest thing they ever gave him was
Ultram...I thought all pain management doctors did was to throw meds at
you...His doctor treats his pain as real and is trying to do all he can to
get  him  out of pain WHILE...he trys to figure out what is causing it...The
first time He saw Tom, he watched him in the waiting room and could tell
that he was in so much pain...He gave him Morphine...Along with his
Neurontin.If at some point my Rheumy thinks I would more benefit from a PM
doctor...I will consider it...

I surely hope she gets some relief...But do push her to see the
counselor...As the depression that comes with Chronic Pain is so real and it
becomes a part of the vicious circle...the pain causes depression which
causes the pain to be worse...
And hugs and prayers for you too Melinda...Please get well soon...and try to
keep your Gymnastics and Circus Acts to a mininimum...
Hugs Cindy

> So here i am still not mobile after fracturing a knee if two places
> and dislocating another knee.  Megan was disagnosed with RSD a few
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
>
> M
shenmei9wise@gmail.com - 27 Mar 2007 17:05 GMT
good idea, cindy.  I should be able to find a therapist in the SF area
who deals with chronic pain.  Thanks

m
Nann Bell - 28 Mar 2007 13:18 GMT
I had a little exposure to RSD when i worked at the teaching hospital, but
just the most intractable cases.  I know our anesthesia clinic would do
permanent epidurals to get the medication directly to the affected nerves.  
This was in the early years of specific pain treatment, before Pain Clinics
became so common and sometimes not wholly trusttworthy.

Anyway, I know they also treated RSD at their clinic, with a variety of
therapies short of the epidurals.  If she and her docs can ever jump through
enough kaiser hoops to get her to a GOOD pain clinic, than she made get some
real help from allopathic medicine.

Don't really know any complementary treatments, though I did have one chiro
who knew a LOT about nerves and was good at such stuff.  He's down in Florida
though so I can't axk him more.  If you can find any complementary med
practitioner of any discipline who really seems to know a lot about RSD
specifically, that would be a place to start.  It's little wonder she's so
depressed.  I've been through severe, but time limited bouts of nerve pain
and I really hate it more than other types of pain I've had.  She's in my
prayers along with you.

Big, big hugs for you with your present immobilities.  New rule in this group
- you are only allowed major injuries to one half of each joint pair at the
same time.  No more messing up your second knee before the first one heals!

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