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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Arthritis / July 2006my mother had knee surgery
My mother had knee surgery and was in the hospital recovering for 2 weeks. She is 76. They got her doing agressive excercises much of the time which was very painfull. One of the therapists was very tough about it. She was told if she didn't do it that way she would lose mobility. Since I understand little about this, I told her I would research it. With all of the pain she was crying much of the time and I was concerned about her emotional and spiritual well being since I feel this is an essential part of health that may be overlooked. I think a person could well have a nervous breakdown just from being in a hospital under certain circumstances. She is a very sensitive person. I also questioned the agressiveness of the thearapy. I will do google searches elsewhere on "knee surgery" etc, any other comments would be greatly appreciated. Hi It is very important to do the physio. Maybe she could ask them to ice it and give her pain pills just before the session. I have had both knees and both hips done and lots of time I cried after a physio session but still did it. I have full movement in all them. It's a case of short term pain for long term gain. I sympathize with her but tell her to persevere. Sincerely Lorrie F > My mother had knee surgery and was in the hospital recovering for 2 > weeks. She is 76. They got her doing agressive excercises much of the [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > searches elsewhere on "knee surgery" etc, any other comments would be > greatly appreciated. They gave her percaset pin killers several times a day and she put ice on it allot as well. The pain goes on and on. It seems to me if the pain is that bad, they should back off on the therapy or go easy with it, it seems like they feel you have to go forward with it regardless of the pain. I asked if your knee is going to turn to stone if you back off on the therapy, but I don't really understand all of this. If there is pain, then something from the surgery is not fully healed, otherwise you would expect to be in pain endlessly. I am just concerned about the emotional strain on my mother with her age and all. She said her hospital stay was really horrible and she is still very upset from it all even though I brought her home yesterday. > Hi > It is very important to do the physio. Maybe she could ask them to ice it [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > searches elsewhere on "knee surgery" etc, any other comments would be > > greatly appreciated. > They gave her percaset pin killers several times a day and she put ice > on it allot as well. The pain goes on and on. It seems to me if the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > hospital stay was really horrible and she is still very upset from it > all even though I brought her home yesterday. Will it turn to stone? No Will it be as stiff and unbendable as stone? Yes The answer is not stopping the therapy. The answer is better pain management. Percocet is just plain not strong enough for most people in this situation. We had another group regular who inadequate pain control after a knee replacement and we all urged her to speak up. Maybe a different drug, a larger dose or different interval? Also, hospitals wait until you ask for pain meds. But pain management is often better achieved when you "stay ahead of the pain" by taking the medication on a time table, before the pain has a chance to build up again. These are all things for your mother to talk to her doctor about (or at least, the resident checking up on her). One last thing, and I say this not knowing your Mom - Some people have a tendency to become depressed after surgery. I forget whether its a reaction to the anesthesia or the physical trauma itself. But by being depressed, a person feels less able to cope. That doesn't mean they can't cope, only that they don't have faith in themselves. Maybe that's part of what is happening to your mom. If it is, the best thing you can do is empathize, but still encourage her to keep striving and not give up. By telling her to back off, you are trying to be empathetic, understanding, compassionate, and humane. But we can't protect our loved ones from pain in this situation. You may actually be undermining her faith in her own ability to persevere and recover. Be her cheerleader and protector. Talk to the nursing staff about how your mom's pain is interfering with her ability to do the physio, etc. Be her advocate. And then do everything possible to boost her confidence and perseverance. We can't take away the immediate pain, but we can act to help them recover as fully as possible so they don't spend the rest of their lives in pain the surgery was meant to prevent. Adelle Here I am, poking my head in again. My hospital experience was bad also. It wasn't the surgeon, but the nurses (excluding one) and a PT who wouldn't deal with my pain range and one even accused me of being addicted to pain meds. I had to insist they call my surgeon, and only then did I get the pain medication I needed. And, I've never been addicted to pain meds. There is a huge differance between "depending" on a drug to make your life more bearable, and an "addiction" problem. Keep us posted on this; I really feel for your Mom right now. Nanny > They gave her percaset pin killers several times a day and she put ice > on it allot as well. The pain goes on and on. It seems to me if the [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] >> > searches elsewhere on "knee surgery" etc, any other comments would be >> > greatly appreciated. > My mother had knee surgery and No reson she should have to bear that pain. Talk to the docs about increasing her pain meds to be sure she can tolerate the increaase. I had hip replacement and was in rehab for a month but at times was taking 20mg oxycodone for relief. Of course I'm prolly bigger than your Mom. ;-) P.S. I'm 75. First, let me say you can tell you care about your mother. Adelle gave you some very good suggestions. Talk with the doctor and see if her pain management can be better. She might need stronger meds or more regular. Don't let the pain get ahead of her. I think from what I've read that knee surgery is a rough surgery. The exercises do have to be done or the knee will not get back it's mobility. However, you have the right to ask for a therapist that is more sensitive. At her age it is even harder and it is easy to get depressed after surgery or a hospital stay. It takes longer for an older person to bounce back from being put to sleep. I hope things will get better for her in the future. debbie m. > My mother had knee surgery and was in the hospital recovering for 2 > weeks. She is 76. They got her doing agressive excercises much of the [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > searches elsewhere on "knee surgery" etc, any other comments would be > greatly appreciated. Some good advice, Debbie. Nanny > First, let me say you can tell you care about your mother. Adelle gave > you some very good suggestions. [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] >> searches elsewhere on "knee surgery" etc, any other comments would be >> greatly appreciated. surfunbear said: > My mother had knee surgery and was in the hospital recovering for 2 > weeks. She is 76. They got her doing agressive excercises much of the [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > searches elsewhere on "knee surgery" etc, any other comments would be > greatly appreciated. While I've never had surgery on my knees or hips, I have had 3 surgeries on my elbow, the last one being a total elbow replacement. PT is not easy by any means but it has to be done. After my second surgery, in the middle of my PT, my normal person ( who was wonderful) was out sick and they sent in a temporary replacement who was extremely rough. If I had been able, I think I would have socked her lights out! She gave me all of this stuff about having to get that joint moving again and it was for my own good and I was in tears the entire time. I nicknamed her "The Nazi" and it was such a relief when the regular lady came back. She was very upset when I told her what happened and said they didn't believe in doing it that way. I think it took about 5 months before I was through. The PT for this last surgery wasn't easy either but absolutely nothing like The Nazi. I wonder if your mom might be able to get another therapist assigned to her? And pain meds are a must. It's absolutely a hard thing to go through but it does get better over time. ~Lindy~ You can start your research, if you want, from my own experience of having total knee replacement. I had a renowned orthopedic surgeon, and the only physical therapy he had his patients do was 5-6 specific types of exercises IN MY OWN HOME. I'll admit it was painful at first, but I know it wasn't as vigorous as you are describing your Mom as having. This is a personal gripe with me: physical therapists who think the same blueprint applies to all! I have perfect range of motion in my knee/leg, and the surgery was in 2000 - never had to go to a PT but was responsible for doing my exercises in my own home. I have little tolerance for the "gung-ho" PT's, who often don't take into consideration the age and other physical conditions of the patient; i.e., in my case, FM and RA. Personally, I really think your mother is undergoing too rigid and vigorous PT by the way you describe it. If your Mother or you want to write me in my personal mailbox, I will answer any questions you may have and try to assure your Mother in the midst of her grief with this whole thing. I remember one particular experience I had after Arthopedic surgery with one of *those* PT's.....bad memory, and a nightmare to me while going through with it. Nanny > My mother had knee surgery and was in the hospital recovering for 2 > weeks. She is 76. They got her doing agressive excercises much of the [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > searches elsewhere on "knee surgery" etc, any other comments would be > greatly appreciated. > You can start your research, if you want, from my own experience of having > total knee replacement. I had a renowned orthopedic surgeon, and the only > physical therapy he had his patients do was 5-6 specific types of exercises > IN MY OWN HOME. I'll admit it was painful at first, but I know it wasn't as > vigorous as you are describing your Mom as having. This is a personal gripe > with me: physical therapists who think the same blueprint applies to all! this reminds me - when I had my thumb worked on last winter, my surgeon chose NOT to send me to hand therapy. He said I'd actually be better off long term if my range of motion was slightly restricted and he was worried that PT would work the thumb TOO much. He told me just to move it around at home and to avoid working it to the extremes of its range. Of course, I'd had therapy for it previously, so I knew the moves already, but my point is that sometimes PT can go overboard. Unfortunately, some folks won't do the necessary work without a therapist standing over them - one of my aunts is that sort, and she freely admits it! LOL  SignatureNann remove the Gator cheer to email me Simply the thing I am shall make me live --- William Shakespeare A friend of mine had surgery on his shoulder by the same surgeon who did mine. He lived near a different rehab center so we went to different places. My therapists were wonderful and last time I went for four months; they took their time with me. Where Zack went they nearly killed him. He complained to the doctor and the doctor told them to go slower, but they didn't-so he just stopped going. So glad I had a good one. Gwen >> You can start your research, if you want, from my own experience of >> having [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > necessary work without a therapist standing over them - one of my aunts is > that sort, and she freely admits it! LOL I looked through the responses here, thanks. What I would really like to know is why the knee would lose mobility if you did not vigoursly pursue the excercises or did them at a slower rate until the knee heals a bit. In other words I would like to know the scientific term for this type of mobility loss or it's causes so I can understand it better as it seems somewhat non intuitive to me, though I don't neccesarily prescribe to the no pain no gain culture as readily as some. Is it caused by calcification, growth of cartiledge, or related specificaly to artificial joints ? I want to understand the why to a greater extent, perhaps because I am skeptical of some aspects of medicine because of what I have heard of alternative medicine and other issues surrounding the health profession. Thus I want to be better informed so that if I or someone I know has these issues I can have my own degree of confidence etc. It's not uncommon to have pain that you can do little about for some time, however this is my first encounter with therapy induced pain and I was a bit puzzled by it. I had both knees replaced in 2003. My understanding of the necessity of PT to repetitively move the knees is to prevent the development of scar tissue. If you allow the knees to remain in the most comfortable position (bent about 20 degrees or so) scar tissue can form in the joint preventing you from bending or straightening the knees. > I looked through the responses here, thanks. What I would really like >to know is why the knee would lose mobility if you did not vigoursly [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >little about for some time, however this is my first encounter with >therapy induced pain and I was a bit puzzled by it. -- BettyB -- www.flamingo-code.com "I have noticed even people who claim everything is predestined, and that we can do nothing to change it, look before they cross the road." - Stephen Hawking Scar tissue then would be made of calcium, or perhaps is a form of calcification ? > I had both knees replaced in 2003. My understanding of the necessity > of PT to repetitively move the knees is to prevent the development of [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > predestined, and that we can do nothing to change it, > look before they cross the road." - Stephen Hawking No It would be scar tissue in the muscles and tendons. When they do a knee replacement they take the joint out of the socket to work on it and they have to move around the tendons and muscles which is the reason why it is sore afterwards and if you don't work the joint it will not get good movement back in it. Incidently, do not be concerned if the outside of the knee feels numb in an area, it is because they have to cut a nerve there, at least that is how my Doctor explained it and it doesn't interfer with the joint in any way. In the hospital that I was in, you had to have at least a 90 degree bend before you could go home and you were out of there in 5-7 days. Sincerely Lorrie F > Scar tissue then would be made of calcium, or perhaps is a form of > calcification ? [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > predestined, and that we can do nothing to change it, > > look before they cross the road." - Stephen Hawking According to my online dictionary: scar tissue is "Dense fibrous connective tissue that forms over a healed wound or cut." I don't believe that is calcium or calcification. >Scar tissue then would be made of calcium, or perhaps is a form of >calcification ? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> position (bent about 20 degrees or so) scar tissue can form in the >> joint preventing you from bending or straightening the knees. -- BettyB -- www.flamingo-code.com "I have noticed even people who claim everything is predestined, and that we can do nothing to change it, look before they cross the road." - Stephen Hawking |
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