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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Alzheimer's / March 2004

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Can Aricept CAUSE dementia /?

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Greg - 21 Feb 2004 09:13 GMT
I'm not demented but my mother is. It seems that when she does NOT take the
aricept, life's good. One pill though and she sees GW marching through her
walls chasing after that fictional character Bin what's-his-name.

I repeat .. no dementia on my part (though it may seem so)

just a post to see if someone else has noticed an aricept reaction.
Evelyn Ruut - 21 Feb 2004 12:17 GMT
> I'm not demented but my mother is. It seems that when she does NOT take the
> aricept, life's good. One pill though and she sees GW marching through her
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> just a post to see if someone else has noticed an aricept reaction.

Everyone's body chemistry is different, and I am not going to say that your
mom isn't having this sort of reaction, but our experience has been VERY
good with Aricept.  My mother in law is more focused and functional when she
is on it.   When our doctor tried to change her to another drug, for the
entire time she got noticeably worse.   Switching her back to the Aricept
even for the very first day was noticeable and she was so much better!
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Greg - 21 Feb 2004 14:42 GMT
Thx for the reply. My mother's been doing well on it for about a month then
all of a sudden, major dementia taking
a pill.  I saw somewhere that that might happen if the problem was NOT
alzheimers as we have been led to believe.
There have been no neurological tests done yet, just general MD visits.

> > I'm not demented but my mother is. It seems that when she does NOT take
> the
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> (To reply to me personally, remove sox)
Evelyn Ruut - 21 Feb 2004 14:53 GMT
Greg,

Dementia has been known to take sudden turns for the worse, Aricept or no
Aricept.  If you have not had the diagnostics done, it could be mini strokes
or something else.  Dementia has many causes, and Alzheimers is only one of
them.

My advice to you would be to get good diagnostics done and in place, so you
know what you are dealing with.   Not knowing is not a good place to be
working from.
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Evelyn

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> Thx for the reply. My mother's been doing well on it for about a month then
> all of a sudden, major dementia taking
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
> >
> > (To reply to me personally, remove sox)
Darryl - 21 Feb 2004 14:45 GMT
>I'm not demented but my mother is. It seems that when she does NOT take the
>aricept, life's good. One pill though and she sees GW marching through her
>walls chasing after that fictional character Bin what's-his-name.

Did GW ultimately catch him? ;-)

On a serious note, Aricept can surprisingly cause hallucinations in at
least 1/100 people.  The symptom usually resolves with a reduction in
the dose or discontinuation in treatment; however, you should not stop
the medication yourself since starting and stopping can also have
negative consequences especially in the elderly.  The hallucinations
should be reported to your doctor

Darryl.
Greg - 21 Feb 2004 16:36 GMT
did GW ultimately catch him?

"in your dreams".

In reality, Bin's after Dubya (pronounced  "w").

Thx again for more info. These things doctors don't tell you and not much
info on the net. I myself will be awake all night googling, trying to figure
out where you discovered that tidbit of Aricept knowledge.

> >I'm not demented but my mother is. It seems that when she does NOT take the
> >aricept, life's good. One pill though and she sees GW marching through her
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> Darryl.
Dennis P. Harris - 21 Feb 2004 20:12 GMT
> I'm not demented but my mother is. It seems that when she does NOT take the
> aricept, life's good. One pill though and she sees GW marching through her
> walls chasing after that fictional character Bin what's-his-name.

you've mislabeled what's going on.  "dementia" is a loss of
memory, NOT hallucinations.

yes, aricept can trigger hallucinations in a very few patients.
given that she hasn't seen a neurologist, you need to get her in
for a full neuro-psych exam, since her uninformed primary care
doc apparently doesn't have a clue as to *what* is wrong, just
that something is wrong.

she needs to have that exam because there are many causes of
memory problems other than AD, including thyroid problems,
incorrect medication levels, bad reaction to some statin heart
meds, tumors, etc.

once the cause of her dementia has been determined, her meds can
be adjusted.  it's highly likely that she can take other meds in
addition to the aricept that will help control the
hallucinations.  evelyn's MIL is on zoloft and (risperdol?) to
control them, for example, in addition to aricept.
Greg - 22 Feb 2004 07:40 GMT
I know I keep going THX to everybody but you folks are really helpful ..
made me think back. You're right, she WAS doing fine
memory-wise, everything, then .. hallucinations set in .. 2 different
things. And WHEN did that first occur?

The night the doctor doubled her aricept dosage from 5 mg to 10.

What have I been thinking by not seeing a
neurologist, letting a general md (no gp offense intended) see her. Does
anyone know if the neurologist tests can be
done in one day?   She is staying with me in Austin Tx, want's to go back
home to Houston Tx.  If the neurologist
tests take time maybe she should just go back home, take them there, have a
local neurologist.  If, however, all we
have to do is show up at a neurologist's,  get a
kat
scan
(no offense to my feline brothers and sisters)
done
then maybe we could just do it all here in Austin before she leaves.  I
guess all I want to know if is it really AD?
The GP simply took some blood samples and ruled OUT a few things.

(whew)

> > I'm not demented but my mother is. It seems that when she does NOT take the
> > aricept, life's good. One pill though and she sees GW marching through her
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> hallucinations.  evelyn's MIL is on zoloft and (risperdol?) to
> control them, for example, in addition to aricept.
Dennis P. Harris - 22 Feb 2004 08:52 GMT
> The GP simply took some blood samples and ruled OUT a few things.

he *should* have referred her for a complete neuro-psych workup!
sounds like time for a new doctor that's more in tune with
geriatric problems, especially dementias!

all the tests together should take about a day.  you talk about
her going back to houston... to live alone?  you need to accept
the fact that she's going to have to change her living situation
before too long, and *now* is the time to plan for it --- once
you really have a diagnosis.  see
http://www.mayoclinic.org/alzheimers-rst/diagnosis.html
(note to our FAQ maintainer, this is a new link; your old one is
broken).

also, some causes of dementias, such as lewy bodies, have more
hallucinations than others.  see the group FAQ at
http://www.muggsmulcher.com/kstuff/a.s.a/faq.htm

one other thing, often not considered by many docs who should
know better:  have someone in houston (a friend or neighbor of
hers that she trusts) go to her house and inventory *every*
medication, whether prescription, home remedy, "supplement", or
over the counter med, noting the dosage, filling, and expiration
dates of prescriptions.  it's amazing how older folks, once
they've mis-medicated and get foggy, take meds too often, or thw
wrong ones, or the meds interact, all of which can cause dementia
symptoms.  

suddenly stopping or starting some meds, like steroids used for
allergies or hormones to treat osteoporosis, can result in
depression with accompanying memory loss.

you can call the alzheimers association in austin see
http://www.alz-austin.org/ to find out which clinics or hospitals
in your area can do the tests, and then call her primary care doc
and ask him to refer her, so that medicare will pay for the
tests.
Greg - 22 Feb 2004 13:38 GMT
> he *should* have referred her for a complete neuro-psych workup!
> sounds like time for a new doctor that's more in tune with
> geriatric problems, especially dementias!

thx again,  quite helpful resources you listed. I've half a mind to not even
go see a neurologist since you people
seem to be able to provide all the advice I need for free. Wish I could
contribute but being in the early
stages of the thing you all already know it all.
The Cranky Genee - 22 Feb 2004 13:53 GMT
We can't provide results of a CT Scan or an MRI.  They really need to
be done.  Please have them done so you can reach an accurate
diagnosis.

In addition I will tell you that my mother had auditory hallucinations
from taking Aricept.  When she was on it she heard voices in the
distance, thought the television was on all the time and music
especially at night.  During her sleep she was awakened by knocking
sounds.  All of this disappeared when we took her off the Aricept.
Unfortunately it's just not for everyone.

The Cranky Genee

>> he *should* have referred her for a complete neuro-psych workup!
>> sounds like time for a new doctor that's more in tune with
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>contribute but being in the early
>stages of the thing you all already know it all.
Darryl - 22 Feb 2004 14:03 GMT
>> he *should* have referred her for a complete neuro-psych workup!
>> sounds like time for a new doctor that's more in tune with
>> geriatric problems, especially dementias!
>
>thx again,  quite helpful resources you listed. I've half a mind to not even
>go see a neurologist since you people

Although a gp or family physician may not have the expertise in
dealing with dementias, neurologists do.  If your gp resists making a
referral, ask why and then seek out a second opinion.  As for *us* (if
I can speak collectively), we can ask you whether they've performed a
MMSE or a clock-drawing test or looked for a stroke, TIA, etc., but
this does not qualify as medical advice.  Dennis has made good
suggestsions about getting her the help she needs.

>seem to be able to provide all the advice I need for free.
>Wish I could contribute but being in the early
>stages of the thing you all already know it all.

This is how most of us have found alt.support.alzheimers!!!

Take care,
Darryl.
Dennis P. Harris - 22 Feb 2004 20:41 GMT
> I've half a mind to not even
> go see a neurologist since you people
> seem to be able to provide all the advice I need for free.

Are you being sarcastic, or do you really believe this?
Greg - 22 Feb 2004 23:30 GMT
not even sarcastic  .. I'm just so amazed at this group and the help I get
here .. thx to everyone again.

> On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 13:38:12 GMT in alt.support.alzheimers,
> > I've half a mind to not even
> > go see a neurologist since you people
> > seem to be able to provide all the advice I need for free.
>
> Are you being sarcastic, or do you really believe this?
Evelyn Ruut - 23 Feb 2004 00:58 GMT
> not even sarcastic  .. I'm just so amazed at this group and the help I get
> here .. thx to everyone again.

Greg, you really need to get some diagnostics in place.  We are just
caregivers and all have been through this with our loved ones, but it is not
a substitute for real medical information.  Remember there are a lot of
different causes of dementia, and the treatment for one is not the same as
for all.   The caregiving may be similar but the treatment and medication
may differ.
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Greg - 23 Feb 2004 09:21 GMT
Yes, after hearing everyone I realize our primary care doctor didn't do all
he could have done. Don't worry, if the neurologist
was open at this hour we'd be there.

> > not even sarcastic  .. I'm just so amazed at this group and the help I get
> > here .. thx to everyone again.
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> (To reply to me personally, remove sox)
turkey tracker - 25 Feb 2004 04:31 GMT
Hello,I don't post very often but my mom is driving me nuts.Every night
she is ranting about where her kids are and no answer is good enough.Or
where is her husband?When we tell her he passed she tells us we are damm
liars and she's going home in the morning and never coming back.I have
tried every answer you can imagine including loving deception.It does no
good to tell her her kids are anywhere cause she wants to know why she
wasn't asked if they could go there.I tell her she was and her answer is
"bullshit"no one asked me.Please i am desperate,i need some
suggestions.I tell her to go back to sleep and she says i am laying down
but i won't go to sleep.She seems to just be very ornery but i am sure
its because she never gets the answers she wants.BUT what are the
answers?Sorry so long but i am losing it.Barb


Tumbleweed - 25 Feb 2004 07:02 GMT
> Hello,I don't post very often but my mom is driving me nuts.Every night
> she is ranting about where her kids are and no answer is good enough.Or
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> its because she never gets the answers she wants.BUT what are the
> answers?Sorry so long but i am losing it.Barb

There may be no answer to this other than time, when she gets worse she'll
stop asking.
Or if you can't cope any more, she'll have to go into care.

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Dennis P. Harris - 25 Feb 2004 07:41 GMT
On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:31:08 -0600 (CST) in
alt.support.alzheimers, barbfrombethel@webtv.net (turkey tracker)
wrote:

> Please i am desperate,i need some
> suggestions.I tell her to go back to sleep and she says i am laying down
> but i won't go to sleep.She seems to just be very ornery but i am sure
> its because she never gets the answers she wants.BUT what are the
> answers?Sorry so long but i am losing it.

barb, talk to her doc about some meds to help reduce the
delusions.  
Evelyn Ruut - 25 Feb 2004 11:58 GMT
> Hello,I don't post very often but my mom is driving me nuts.Every night
> she is ranting about where her kids are and no answer is good enough.Or
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> its because she never gets the answers she wants.BUT what are the
> answers?Sorry so long but i am losing it.Barb

Oh Barb, do I EVER know what you are going through!   My mother in law was
like that for two of the three years she has been here.   We thought we were
going to go crazy.

Our doctor got her on antidepressants first (Zoloft) to make her less
anxious and more comfortable in her own skin.   This was increased on a
regular basis each time the symptoms resurfaced, and for a while they made
it bearable, but the illness/anxiety got worse and the symptoms continued to
increase.

Then he put her on an antipsychotic medication which has helped ENORMOUSLY.
I have no idea whatsoever what we would have done without it.   She would
have definitely ended up in a care facility without her meds.

She is still on these medications and every now and then her delusions still
resurface.  You need to get to a doctor about this stuff.   You have my
sympathy, as I really do know what you are going through.

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turkey in the straw - 25 Feb 2004 15:21 GMT
I have my mom on zoloft.I started her on 25 mgs.and increased to 50.But
i thought thats what was causing her problems.I took her off but have
her back on them now.Could the zoloft be the problem?What kind of drugs
did you have your MIL on Evelyn?What is the name of it?I do plan to talk
to her doc also.I can deal with it but yesterday was a bad day.I wasn't
aware that this is what you call dilusions.She also started wetting the
bed.Does anyone have any suggestions as to what she could wear to
bed.She wears depends but there not cutting it.Also would namenda help
her dilusions or just prolong them?THX,Barb


turkey in the straw - 25 Feb 2004 18:38 GMT
I talked to my moms doctor today and she started her on a low dose of
zyprexa.Evelyn is this what your MIL takes?I hope and pray it helps in
even a small way.I also wanted to say that i don't think because someone
vents on here means we need to immediatly consider placing our loved
ones.We are going to be moving soon as we have to sell my moms place.I
will have much more help then and a better quality of life for all of us
concerned.My mom and i spend much time alone here and she loves
company.I have a sister near(3 miles)who is filled with advice but thats
it.She's also full of SH_T.And won't help at all.Most family is only
concerned about her money.Her place is selling for 700,000.They have
given us nothing but trouble.Oh the vicious circle.Thanx,Barb


Darryl - 25 Feb 2004 19:44 GMT
>I talked to my moms doctor today and she started her on a low dose of
>zyprexa.Evelyn is this what your MIL takes?I hope and pray it helps in

Olanzapine or Zyprexa is one of the frontline atypical neuroleptics
(which sounds much nicer than anti-psychotic).  It's considered
superior to haloperidol (old-school but still preferred by some
neurologists) and has a slightly better side-effect profile than
respiridone.  

I'm sure your doctor talked to you about the drug but if you notice a
sudden change in the delusions/hallucinations, make another
appointment immediately.  It may be difficult to picture at this point
but delusions can often spiral out of control to the point of
violence.  For instance, my Loving Dad, may he rest in peace, punched
me about 200x and threatened to shoot me on his last day of
consciousness.  Unfortunately, delusions are a very good reason to
place a loved one in a home.

Take care,
Darryl.

>even a small way.I also wanted to say that i don't think because someone
>vents on here means we need to immediatly consider placing our loved
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>concerned about her money.Her place is selling for 700,000.They have
>given us nothing but trouble.Oh the vicious circle.Thanx,Barb
Tumbleweed - 25 Feb 2004 21:17 GMT
> I talked to my moms doctor today and she started her on a low dose of
> zyprexa.Evelyn is this what your MIL takes?I hope and pray it helps in
> even a small way.I also wanted to say that i don't think because someone
> vents on here means we need to immediatly consider placing our loved
> ones.

Indeed, and if that was directed at me, I didnt mean to suggest that. Just
to point out that we all have our point of tolrenace/of being abel to cope,
and there is no shame in acknowledging when you heave reached it. And
hopefully not getting so as you do reach it, but being prepared before hand,
though I suspect most do reach it, we certainly did.

> We are going to be moving soon as we have to sell my moms place.I
> will have much more help then and a better quality of life for all of us
> concerned.

Glad to hear it, IMHO its the 24x7 on one person that becomes insufferable
(literally)

> My mom and i spend much time alone here and she loves
> company.I have a sister near(3 miles)who is filled with advice but thats
> it.She's also full of SH_T.And won't help at all.Most family is only
> concerned about her money.Her place is selling for 700,000.They have
> given us nothing but trouble.Oh the vicious circle.Thanx,Barb

Are there legal issues there that your sister might raise?

Anyway, good luck.

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turkey in the straw - 27 Feb 2004 04:19 GMT
Tumbleweed,
  Yes,the 24-7 is the worst.My other sister is the POA so i am hoping
my sister doesn't start anything.Barb


Evelyn Ruut - 25 Feb 2004 19:28 GMT
> I have my mom on zoloft.I started her on 25 mgs.and increased to 50.But
> i thought thats what was causing her problems.I took her off but have
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> bed.She wears depends but there not cutting it.Also would namenda help
> her dilusions or just prolong them?THX,Barb

Barb, my mother in law started out with 50 mg of Zoloft.   It worked a tiny
bit, but then he increased it to 75 mg.   Then it went to 100 mg, and then
to 150.   At each increase she seemed to be a bit more comfortable and less
anxious, but the delusions got worse.

Imagining anything that isn't true is a delusion.   Like thinking people who
are long dead are alive and coming home any minute, for instance.   Or in my
mother in law's case, she imagined that she had a baby, or that she had
multiples of the little dog that was put to sleep.   She will tell you even
today (when it comes into her head), that "I have had many Pelli's, not just
one"

My mother in law is on 10 mg daily of Aricept, 150 mg daily of Zoloft and .5
mg twice a day of Risperdol.    This dosage may not be the same for
everybody, by any means.   Everyone is different.

I would say that if your mother is restless and angry and imagines herself
to be in another place and time, that she probably would be helped by fine
tuning her meds.

If you go to the Dr. and tell the Dr. that everything is "just fine" he
isn't going to know.   If you go there and tell him you think YOU are going
to go crazy if she doesn't calm down, maybe he will get the idea to increase
or fine tune her meds.   Terminology is important with doctors.  You have to
tell the doctor specifically that she is having delusions about people and
time frame and experiencing great anxiety from them.
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Dali - 25 Feb 2004 19:41 GMT
There have been trials which truly helped dementia. Check drmirkin.com
and look for alzheimers. This is not spam he does not treat
alzheimers. he only brings to light published material.
If you can't find it I'll post it for you.

>> I have my mom on zoloft.I started her on 25 mgs.and increased to 50.But
>> i thought thats what was causing her problems.I took her off but have
[quoted text clipped - 32 lines]
>tell the doctor specifically that she is having delusions about people and
>time frame and experiencing great anxiety from them.
Dennis P. Harris - 26 Feb 2004 08:09 GMT
On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:21:28 -0600 (CST) in
alt.support.alzheimers, barbfrombethel@webtv.net (turkey in the
straw) wrote:

> I have my mom on zoloft.I started her on 25 mgs.and increased to 50.But
> i thought thats what was causing her problems.I took her off but have
> her back on them now.Could the zoloft be the problem?

i hope that this was done in consultation with the psychiatrist
the prescribed it.  it is hardly ever beneficial to suddenly
start or stop most psych meds.  many of them take several weeks
to reach an effective level, and sometimes it's necessary to test
the amount of the drug in the blood.

if what she's taking doesn't appear to be working, or appears to
be causing a problem, talk to her doc!
Greg - 26 Feb 2004 09:15 GMT
> I have my mom on zoloft.I started her on 25 mgs.and increased to 50.But
> i thought thats what was causing her problems.I took her off but have
> her back on them now.Could the zoloft be the problem? >

remember, the very day my mother took her first Exelon antidepressant pill
she had her most terrible dillusion.
I can understand how people can be afraid or confused when they actually
think, feel things are happening to you.
I have the Exelons now in a safe place. She herself says she'll never take
another. We don't know if THAT pill
was the cause but, no more for a while.  Perhaps it was just coincidence.
Patty - 26 Feb 2004 04:15 GMT
Hi Everyone. Excuse me...hope you do not mind me "butting" in.

My name is Patty and I live in R.I. I work in a beautiful Nursing Home.
I work on the Special Care Unit...It is a 43 Bed Closed Alzheimer's
Unit. I am the Activity Coordinator...and I am a Med Tech...(Do the Med
Passes as needed) 2 for the price of one...LOL..I have worked with
Alzheimer Residents for 10 years, and on April 1st....Been a Med Tech
since 1980.

I LOVE the Alzheimer Residents. My heart goes out to the Famiy Members
for they knew them when....

Barb...We call our "lies" Fiblets. Tell them anything that sounds
good...so they will stay calm. For example....:

Where are my children? The had to go shopping, Mom. They'll be home
soon.

Where is your Dad? He's working over-time, Mom. Let's keep his supper
warm for him. He'll be hungry when he gets home.

I want to go home....Look at your watch.....Okay let's wait until I can
get us a ride. Why don't we have some Supper now...etc. Hope this
helped...

On Aricept...I'm not an expert, but what I was taught about the Med
is....Starting on Aricept is to maintain their present level of
functioning for as long as possible.
But like someone has already stated, medication does NOT necessarily
work to the same degree on everyone. Each person is an idividual.
Stay Safe.....Patty:-)  
Greg - 26 Feb 2004 09:15 GMT
> Where are my children? The had to go shopping, Mom. They'll be home
> soon.
>
> Where is your Dad? He's working over-time, Mom. Let's keep his supper
> warm for him. He'll be hungry when he gets home.

I've had people tell me that before .. go along with them, don't dispute or
argue with them.
Does that really work?  Sometimes I seem to spend to much time trying to
argue with my
mother, tell her Austin is NOT Houston, that only I live here in my home,
etc.  If I just
start agreeing with her going

"Yes, they did rename Houston to Austin back in ought"

does that not simply reinforce false beliefs OR
does it make things so much eaiser to deal with?
It seems you support people know, in some areas, more than the doctors about
some things. My bosses wife has worked with Alzheimers patients for years.
Excellent resource.
Evelyn Ruut - 26 Feb 2004 12:21 GMT
> > Where are my children? The had to go shopping, Mom. They'll be home
> > soon.
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
> some things. My bosses wife has worked with Alzheimers patients for years.
> Excellent resource.

Dear Greg,

About telling them anything that will keep them calm and happy.......
Sometimes it is the best way and sometimes it is not.     In my mother in
law's case we drew the line at certain things because they might be
dangerous or cause her to do something that might be harmful.   Other than
that ALL IS FAIR as long as it keeps them happy and calm!

You cannot possibly bring a person with Alzheimers into your reality.
Their reality is all that counts to them, and you cannot convince them that
any delusion, any mistaken belief, is not real or true no matter how much
you argue, plead, or reason with them about it.   It is better to keep them
happy and calm no matter what you have to tell them to do that.

I would have had a lot easier time of the last few years if I had realized
this one fact earlier in the game.
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Lee - 26 Feb 2004 12:53 GMT
> You cannot possibly bring a person with Alzheimers into your reality.
> Their reality is all that counts to them, and you cannot convince them that
> any delusion, any mistaken belief, is not real or true no matter how much
> you argue, plead, or reason with them about it.   It is better to keep them
> happy and calm no matter what you have to tell them to do that.

problem, of course, comes up when other people... family members,
especially, don't ~get~ it...... and accept those ideas as reality ....
doesn't matter, in some cases, how often one explains.... their first
instinct is to BELIEVE (insert rolling eyes here!)
Greg - 27 Feb 2004 13:54 GMT
happy and calm ... sounds intriguing, I might experiment with that. Plus,
tension and
stress, the opposite, probably makes things worse.

 About telling them anything that will keep them calm and happy.......
> Sometimes it is the best way and sometimes it is not.     In my mother in
> law's case we drew the line at certain things because they might be
> dangerous or cause her to do something that might be harmful.   Other than
> that ALL IS FAIR as long as it keeps them happy and calm!
>
> You cannot possibly bring a person with Alzheimers into your reality.
Glenfiddich - 26 Feb 2004 12:51 GMT
>> Where are my children? The had to go shopping, Mom. They'll be home
>> soon.
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>does that not simply reinforce false beliefs OR
>does it make things so much eaiser to deal with?

You have to remember that your mother's remembering is broken.
She can NOT remember new or different information, so insisting  
that she try to do so is unproductive.
Since she has no choice but to live in her own world - one which is
confused and scary - we can only try to make her as comfortable as
possible in that world.
As long as it doesn't lead to more trouble, accept her view of the
world - which is not the same as yours.

When my wife insisted that she wanted to go home (since "home" was
her childhood one, what she wanted was impossible), instead of telling
her she WAS home I'd agree to go, but tell her we had to wait for her
new passport.  Since she well remembered some hassles with getting
passorts, that satisfied her.
I lied - but it made her happy, and did no harm.

>It seems you support people know, in some areas, more than the doctors about
>some things. My bosses wife has worked with Alzheimers patients for years.
>Excellent resource.

We may not have the deep understanding of the causes of the disease,
but collectively we've got years and years of practical AD nursing
experience and have found *some* coping techniques that work.
Greg - 27 Feb 2004 13:56 GMT
Lots of good information on this topic. Plus, when you tell them something
like that, say
"we have to wait for the passport",  sometimes later they forget about the
whole incident,
going home.

When my wife insisted that she wanted to go home (since "home" was
her childhood one, what she wanted was impossible), instead of telling
her she WAS home I'd agree to go, but tell her we had to wait for her
new passport.  Since she well remembered some hassles with getting
passorts, that satisfied her.
I lied - but it made her happy, and did no harmthat work
Tumbleweed - 26 Feb 2004 18:36 GMT
> > Where are my children? The had to go shopping, Mom. They'll be home
> > soon.
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> does that not simply reinforce false beliefs

No, because she wont remember what you said, so you cant reinforce anything.

> OR
> does it make things so much eaiser to deal with?

IT can do, but obviusly it depends. If she kept saying teh house was on fire
and you agreed, that presumably would make her rush out!

> It seems you support people know, in some areas, more than the doctors about
> some things.

I dont think doctors have to deal with this day in day out minute by minute.
Its one thing to hear a silly question once, and another entirely to hear it
100 times!

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Joyce - 26 Feb 2004 22:39 GMT
>> Where are my children? The had to go shopping, Mom. They'll be home
>> soon.
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>some things. My bosses wife has worked with Alzheimers patients for years.
>Excellent resource.

For me, what it all boiled down to was one question ... does it even matter?  So
what if it reinforces false beliefs ... does it matter?  If it makes mom happy,
then I'm happy.  If she wants to think that I'm the world traveler, just returning
from a trip to switzerland (one day) or london (changed the next day) and still
had time to do her laundry and bring it to her ... in the grand scheme of things,
does it really matter?  Now, if she wants to wear shorts when I venture to take
her out to lunch, and the temps are sub-zero ... she does have to be told that it
is too cold for that attire.  THIS does matter.  It's for her safety and
well-being.  But these are also things we don't seem to argue over, she happily
takes my word for.  It seems that most of the falsehoods, whatever you want to
call them have only been about issues of lesser importance.  

By eliminating the arguments, I found I was much calmer.  See, in effect, I was
the only one to be upset or frustrated by the arguments.  I accepted the fact that
she isn't going to get better and no amount of insistence by me was going to
change that.  I could make her write a street name down 100 times ... only to have
her tell me it was something else.  

Joyce
Greg - 27 Feb 2004 14:01 GMT
A side benefit I just thought of, reading this, it could make life a little
fun, interesting .. in your case
especially where you get to be a world traveler.  In my case, for instance,
I could come home, she's
telling me children have been in the house I could, instead of arguing again
that there ARE no children, go
"Really?  Let's go track them down. There better NOT be any lollipops in m
vcr."
It could make life an adventure. Pull US into a new reality of make believe,
a break from the sometimes reality
of this world.

> For me, what it all boiled down to was one question ... does it even
matter?  So
> what if it reinforces false beliefs ... does it matter?  If it makes mom happy,
> then I'm happy.  If she wants to think that I'm the world traveler, just returning
> from a trip to switzerland (one day) or london (changed the next day) and still
> had time to do her laundry and bring it to her ... in the grand scheme of things,
> does it really matter?
Dennis P. Harris - 27 Feb 2004 06:16 GMT
> I've had people tell me that before .. go along with them, don't dispute or
> argue with them.
> Does that really work?

yes
Gwen Love - 26 Feb 2004 21:55 GMT
Patty,. nice to have your input.
Gwen

Signature

===========================================================================
====
Laughing at our mistakes can lengthen our own life. Laughing at someone
else's can shorten it.
-  Cullen Hightower
===========================================================================
=====

| Hi Everyone. Excuse me...hope you do not mind me "butting" in.
|
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
| work to the same degree on everyone. Each person is an idividual.
| Stay Safe.....Patty:-)
Mare - 10 Mar 2004 16:25 GMT
Hi Patty,
St. Elizabeth's?
Mare
mfcoleman@THEOLEmindspring.com
http://www.muggsmulcher.com/kstuff/a.s.a/intro.htm
alt.support.alzheimers' FAQs and Stuff Pages

> Hi Everyone. Excuse me...hope you do not mind me "butting" in.
>
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> work to the same degree on everyone. Each person is an idividual.
> Stay Safe.....Patty:-)
Greg - 26 Feb 2004 09:08 GMT
Hello,I don't post very often but my mom is driving me nuts.Every night
> she is ranting about where her kids are and no answer is good enough.Or
> where is her husband?

My mother used to do that. They were delusions I think .. asking how she got
here, me trying to explain, asking for
people that didn't even live anymore. It can be frustrating. For some reason
that has not happened in quite a while.
We are wondering if it was the new antidepressant the doctor gave her. Or
her sudden doubling of Aricept dosage.
Anyway, it's been at least 5-6 days since any incident. Even SHE now wonders
how she could have thought
such things. Other problems remain but at least there's some relief if only
temporary from that frustrating issue of
which you speak.  Someone here did mention problems with dosages that are
too high.
 
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