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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Alzheimer's / September 2008Brother-in-law
Hello, Thanks to all of you for your answers. My sister decided not to take him home on the train. She had taken him to the dentist and he wanted to talk to the dentist alone. He proceeded to tell him my sister steals from him and on and on. They finally called the sheriff so they could calm him down. In the meantime, my sister had dropped me off at the doctor's office. (I just had arthroscopy surgery and have experienced diffuculty) Someone from the dentist office called me to tell me what had happened. (my sister told them to call me) I in turn called my nephew to pick me up. Lucky me! Here I was in a wheelchair and knew no one in the area. We got home about the same time my sister and her husband got here. In a short time, he calls the sheriff to come because he was being abused. They came and tried to talk to him. Everything seemed to go back to normal but at night I saw some flashing lights outside my bedroom. I looked out and saw the sheriff, fire department, paramedics all wanting to come in. We let them in and they said someone had called and mentioned they had a stroke and was in a wheelchair. So now we have to take the phones away. He continues to call the police and of course they come out to check each time. My sister has gotten on the phone with the 911 operator and tells them it isn't an emergency but he has Alzeheimer's. They said they have to come out anyway. Thank you for your replys and for listening. I do print your letters for my sister so she can read them. Bri > Hello, > Thanks to all of you for your answers. My sister decided not to take him [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > sister so she can read them. > Bri Bri, he sounds like he is really advancing in his illness rather a lot lately. I don't know how you sister feels about this, but that sort of paranoia can be very stressful on the family, on the person themself, and on the 911 operators and the police dispatchers. I believe I have mentioned to you that my mother in law got like that and the doctor gave her an antipsychotic drug called Risperdol, which stopped it and made her a lot calmer and more relaxed. In fact she seemed almost "normal" when she was on it. Without it the paranoia returned. I believe I also mentioned that my aunt used to call the police rather often to help her pick her husband off the floor when his disease advanced to that degree that he was unable to stand very well. One day they just brought the ambulance and put him in the hospital and refused to release him back home with her. They put him in a nursing home and that was that. I hate to say it, but it might be a good thing for your poor sister, bringing her some relief, if that happened. Evelyn > Hello, > Thanks to all of you for your answers. My sister decided not to take him [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > sister so she can read them. > Bri Bri: It's tough, no question. In a strange way, maybe it will provide some comfort to you to know that this happens to others as well. My Mother, was suffering from dementia that was probably brought on by mini-strokes, also called 911 to report that we were poisoning her. At that point, I was close to my witts end and I was ready to throw in the towell and start looking for a place to put her that specialized in caring for patients with dementia related illnesses. Luckily, right after that, we finally got her on the correct medications and had a couple more months of quality time with her before she died. Your brother-in-law is lucky to have your sister and you. It's hard. No question, it's very hard. It puts a strain on everybody involved. Take care, and remember that you're not alone. Charles R. Whealton Charles Whealton @ pleasedontspam.com >> Hello, >> Thanks to all of you for your answers. My sister decided not to take him [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >Charles R. Whealton >Charles Whealton @ pleasedontspam.com Thank you, Charles. It certainly does help to get feedback and realize we are not the only ones going through this. Sometimes it seems like we are all alone. Last night he fell and now his hip hurts him. We are going to take him to the ER but she has to bathe him first. He refuses to take a bath. I will go with her in spite of me having to walk with a cane or walker. I sure hope my doctor doesn't see me there, LOL My knee has been hurting so much because of the fall I took just out of surgery. That causes a set back and i just have to wait until it heals. Bri > Thank you, Charles. > It certainly does help to get feedback and realize we are not the only ones [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Bri Why bathe him first? If he has really damaged his hip or another joint, he should be moved as little as possible. If you are worried about the ER staff's opinion -- it won't be the first time they have seen an elderly patient who refuses to bathe. Where is his primary care physician in all this? Songbird >> Thank you, Charles. >> It certainly does help to get feedback and realize we are not the only ones [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > >Songbird His primary physician does as much as possible for him. We take him in for blood test and for follow up exams as often as he request it. I am sure the ER has seen it all but it is a matter of pride to have a bath. We took him in and they x-rayed his hip and found nothing wrong. We have taken him before when he hurts and they do as much as possible for him. I have written in before about him hurting in different parts of the body but we do not neglect him and take him in right away. Bri >>> Thank you, Charles. >>> It certainly does help to get feedback and realize we are not the only ones [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Bri Sorry, Bri, I didn't mean to imply you were neglecting him by not taking him in pre-bath. It's just sometimes we let our own sense of embarrassment get in the way. If getting him a bath first was going to be a major hassle -- skip it. It is hard to know what Alz patients are really feeling -- their descriptions are often vague and may actually be recollections of years-ago injuries. Mom will say her back hurts and that can be anywhere from shoulders to nether regions, anything from a sore muscle from sleeping wrong to a kidney infection, and she cannot give any more specific info. It's a game of 20 Questions where the person who is "it" cannot remember what the item was they chose in the first place. My concern with your primary care physician is that your BIL certainly seems belligerent and could be aggressive, depending on his physical abilities. I want to be sure you and your sister are safe. Does your doc know about these episodes? Is there any medication that might calm him? I am certainly not one to recommend that a pill solves everything, but with someone with Alz who cannot be reasoned with or their stress dealt with in other ways, medication can make a big difference in quality of life for the patient and family. Hang in there. I wish I could say things will get better, but we both know that would be a hopeful fiction. I'm glad you are there to give your sister some support. Songbird >>>> Thank you, Charles. >>>> It certainly does help to get feedback and realize we are not the only ones [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > >Songbird My BIL was admitted to the hospital yesterday. We took him in because he had 2 huge bruises in the abdomen area and we were not sure what it was. He does take coumadin and his blood was very thin. They had to give him blood tranfusions. His primary physican does know of his agressivenes and abuses. He has prescribed medication for him. Sometimes it calms him down and sometimes it doesn't. The doctor was there last night because the ER doctor called him about his condition. We thought it was very nice of him to come to the hospital being it was Sunday evening. My sister went to see him today and he was sound asleep. I hope he does rest because he sure needs it as my sister does too. In the meantime, I went to see my doctor about the pain in my knee. Gave me a cortisone shot but will probably have to have another MRI if the pain continues. Thank you so much for your reply. It helps us to keep in touch with people who are going through the same thing. By the way, my sister has started to read "36 Hour Day." She wished she would have read it sooner was her comment. Bri > carolinasongb...@gmail.com wrote: > >>>> Thank you, Charles. [quoted text clipped - 60 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Bri, Tell your sister to take advantage of the time he is in the hospital.I can remember a few times my mom was in the hospital i just did nothing but relax. >> carolinasongb...@gmail.com wrote: >> >>>> Thank you, Charles. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >hospital.I can remember a few times my mom was in the hospital i just >did nothing but relax. My BIL is out of the hospital and it seems like he has suffered another stroke. We cannot understand what he is telling us part of the time. Seems to sleep a lot, doesn't want to eat. He is resting and not really saying much. He cannot stand nor sit up. Their son has to pick him up to put him on the potty and back in bed. The visiting nurse is coming today to evaluate a few things. It is sad to see him like that. Bri > deerwoodflo...@hotmail.com wrote: > >> carolinasongb...@gmail.com wrote: [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Bri Hi Bri, Yes, I am sure it is sad to see him so helpless. Keep us posted on what the visiting nurse says. But it occurs to me that if he has had a stroke, maybe he should be re-evaluated in the hospital right away. Best Regards, Evelyn >> deerwoodflo...@hotmail.com wrote: >> >> carolinasongb...@gmail.com wrote: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >had a stroke, maybe he should be re-evaluated in the hospital right >away. Hi Evelyn, He must have had the stroke while in the hospital and probably evaluated while there. the hospital doesn't give us too much information because of the privacy act. It is very sad to see someone in that condition. Bri >> deerwoodflo...@hotmail.com wrote: >> >> carolinasongb...@gmail.com wrote: [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >Best Regards, >Evelyn Today is something different. He keeps saying this house is just like his and it is very nice of Stan to let us live here. We don't know who Stan is. Is this typical for person suffering from Alzheimer's Bri > >> deerwoodflo...@hotmail.com wrote: > >> >> carolinasongb...@gmail.com wrote: [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Hi Brianna, My mother in law had a lot of crazy delusions similar to that. She imagined that the daycare bus driver was a lady who owned a store back in her childhood in Estonia. It made no sense of course, because that lady she remembered from her childhood was probably either long dead or over a hundred! This might be the perfect time for me to interject a thought. Don't try and correct him. It doesn't work in the first place, and it just becomes an exercise in futility and aggravation for you and for him too. Just go along, after all it hurts no one and he will forget about it in five seconds anyway. When he says that it is nice of Stan to let you all live there, say something like "yes, isn't Stan nice...." We tried correcting my mother in laws notions and delusions and all it did was get us all confused and upset. So whenever it was a delusion that hurt nobody, we just agreed with her. She was happier and so were we. Evelyn >>> deerwoodflo...@hotmail.com wrote: >>>>> carolinasongb...@gmail.com wrote: [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Bri Definitely. Disorientation to people, place and time are all to be expected. Bri, You mentioned in another post that the hospital personnel didn't tell you and your sister much due to privacy laws. I assume you mean HIPAA. Did your BIL ever sign a permission form with his doctor allowing him to discuss his health with his wife? This is a standard form that for the last 10 years or so has been a standard part of every patient's file. If he did so, the doc should be totally forthcoming with your sister. Or if she has his health care POA, she needs to be fully informed in order to make decisions for him. If she has neither a durable POA or a health care POA for him, she needs to immediately take whatever steps are necessary in your state to get conservatorship and guardianship over him. If she doesn't, eventually someone will get Adult Protective Services involved and a guardian will be appointed for him. That guardian may or may not share your sister's values and he/she will have no responsibility to consider her interests. You have no time to waste getting this part straightened out. Songbird Bri, let me say that Evelyn is completely correct in that you should not correct your BIL about Stan. In his brain's reality, Stan is letting you folks live there. Since he is completely unable to join your reality, you just have to go along with his -- unless it will be harmful to him or to someone else. In that case, you have to try to get his attention shifted to something else. Just going along with him will make it so much easier on him and on both of you. Also, Songbird is right in that your sister needs to take steps to protect herself in the future. I cannot imagine a doctor knowing the condition of your BIL not discussing him with his wife, however. When my husband went into the hospital after surgery that went bad, even though he had signed no papers as to who his case could be discussed with, the doctor freely discussed his case with me and my daughter-in-law. He didn't like what I said (would not let him put in a feeding tube which Grayson had stated in his will he didn't want) so he didn't return to the hospital; sent his partner who totally agreed with me! But your sister certainly needs to see that she, not someone decided by the state, makes all decisions. Do you have the visiting nurse's opinion yet? Gwen brianna_1938 via MedKB.com wrote: > Evelyn wrote: >>> deerwoodflo...@hotmail.com wrote: [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Bri Definitely. Disorientation to people, place and time are all to be expected. Bri, You mentioned in another post that the hospital personnel didn't tell you and your sister much due to privacy laws. I assume you mean HIPAA. Did your BIL ever sign a permission form with his doctor allowing him to discuss his health with his wife? This is a standard form that for the last 10 years or so has been a standard part of every patient's file. If he did so, the doc should be totally forthcoming with your sister. Or if she has his health care POA, she needs to be fully informed in order to make decisions for him. If she has neither a durable POA or a health care POA for him, she needs to immediately take whatever steps are necessary in your state to get conservatorship and guardianship over him. If she doesn't, eventually someone will get Adult Protective Services involved and a guardian will be appointed for him. That guardian may or may not share your sister's values and he/she will have no responsibility to consider her interests. You have no time to waste getting this part straightened out. Songbird >Bri, let me say that Evelyn is completely correct in that you should not >correct your BIL about Stan. In his brain's reality, Stan is letting you [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > >Songbird Hi Songbird, I don't know if brother-in-law has signed anything. Usually the doctor visits him when we are not there. All we do know is that he is a bundle to handle while in the hospital. Sometimes they have to move him closer to the nurses station and keep him medicated. While he was at another hospital, they did a CAT scan and told my sister he had suffered a stroke but they couldn't tell when that was. My sister is rather shy about asking too many questions. She feels if the doctor wants her to know something he will come right out and say it. Bri Bri, your sister needs to learn to be bold and ask lots of questions when she sees the doctor. The more she knows, the better prepared she will be to handle whatever comes up. Because she doesn't ask questions, the doctor may think she doesn't want to know anything. Gwen sweetpickleNO@SPAMknology.net wrote: >Bri, let me say that Evelyn is completely correct in that you should not >correct your BIL about Stan. In his brain's reality, Stan is letting you [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > >Songbird Hi Songbird, I don't know if brother-in-law has signed anything. Usually the doctor visits him when we are not there. All we do know is that he is a bundle to handle while in the hospital. Sometimes they have to move him closer to the nurses station and keep him medicated. While he was at another hospital, they did a CAT scan and told my sister he had suffered a stroke but they couldn't tell when that was. My sister is rather shy about asking too many questions. She feels if the doctor wants her to know something he will come right out and say it. Bri >Bri, your sister needs to learn to be bold and ask lots of questions when >she sees the doctor. The more she knows, the better prepared she will be to >handle whatever comes up. Because she doesn't ask questions, the doctor may >think she doesn't want to know anything. >Gwen I agree, Gwen. I keep telling her to ask all kinds of questions. She does take real good care of him and makes sure he takes his medications, bathes, doctors visits. She doesn't like to ask the questions in front of the doctor because he might get angry, which he does 90% of the time. I will keep bugging her about it. Bri >sweetpickleNO@SPAMknology.net wrote: >>Bri, let me say that Evelyn is completely correct in that you should not [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > >Bri >>Bri, your sister needs to learn to be bold and ask lots of questions when >>she sees the doctor. The more she knows, the better prepared she will be [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Bri Bri, please share this with your sister. I had the same problem. I had to take my mother in law to the doctor but when the doctor would ask her questions, who knows WHAT sort of craziness she would answer? She knew less about her own health than I did!!!! So what I did was this; I made MYSELF an appointment right after hers. I would get her sitting out in the waiting room with my husband and I would have MY exam, during which we would discuss not only my issues but certainly hers. That way the doctor could know what was going on and if need be, give me prescriptions for her medications without me having to go into graphic descriptions of her delusions in front of her face. It worked out well for us.  SignatureBest Regards, Evelyn “Like the light of the sun moon and stars, may the love, compassion and wisdom shine forth. May they strike every single living being and dispel the darkness of ignorance, attachment and hatred that has lurked for ages in their being. When any living being meets with another may it be like the reunion of a mother and child who have long been separated. In a harmonious world such as this may I see everyone sleep peacefully to the music of non-violence. This is my dream.” -- 17th Gyalwa Karmapa Orgyen Trinley Dorje Evelyn, that was very smart! Gwen > sweetpickleNO@SPAMknology.net wrote: >>Bri, your sister needs to learn to be bold and ask lots of questions when [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Bri Bri, please share this with your sister. I had the same problem. I had to take my mother in law to the doctor but when the doctor would ask her questions, who knows WHAT sort of craziness she would answer? She knew less about her own health than I did!!!! So what I did was this; I made MYSELF an appointment right after hers. I would get her sitting out in the waiting room with my husband and I would have MY exam, during which we would discuss not only my issues but certainly hers. That way the doctor could know what was going on and if need be, give me prescriptions for her medications without me having to go into graphic descriptions of her delusions in front of her face. It worked out well for us. SignatureBest Regards, Evelyn "Like the light of the sun moon and stars, may the love, compassion and wisdom shine forth. May they strike every single living being and dispel the darkness of ignorance, attachment and hatred that has lurked for ages in their being. When any living being meets with another may it be like the reunion of a mother and child who have long been separated. In a harmonious world such as this may I see everyone sleep peacefully to the music of non-violence. This is my dream." -- 17th Gyalwa Karmapa Orgyen Trinley Dorje > Evelyn, that was very smart! > Gwen Necessity is the mother of invention! LOL Evelyn >> sweetpickleNO@SPAMknology.net wrote: >>>Bri, your sister needs to learn to be bold and ask lots of questions when [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > medications without me having to go into graphic descriptions of her > delusions in front of her face. It worked out well for us. >> Songbird > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Bri DO NOT expect the doctor to tell you everything you need to know. Even a great doctor who understands the need for information is usually too busy to explain everything unless you ask questions. He will assume you understand because you don't ask. And if he is less than a great doctor... My mom's doctor never told her she was diabetic. He just gave her a prescription. So for two years she merrily ate ice cream, drank alcohol, etc etc until *I* asked why she was taking a diabetic medication. It is true that they can't always tell how recent a stroke occurred from the CT scan. So the next questions should be: Is he at risk for more? What symptoms should we be looking for? What danger signs mean "call the doctor NOW"? I know your sister has her hands full, but she needs to be MUCH MORE aggressive. No one is going to advocate for her husband or for her like she is. Songbird >>> Songbird >> [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > >Songbird I agree with you Songbird but there is only so much I can coax her into doing. Re: Brother-in-law Group: alt.support.alzheimers Date: Sat, Aug 30, 2008, 8:27pm (PDT+7) From: u35594@uwe (brianna_1938 via MedKB.com) Evelyn wrote: deerwoodflo...@hotmail.com wrote: carolinasongb...@gmail.com wrote: [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] Bri Hi Bri, Yes, I am sure it is sad to see him so helpless. Keep us posted on what the visiting nurse says. But it occurs to me that if he has had a stroke, maybe he should be re-evaluated in the hospital right away. Best Regards, Evelyn Today is something different. He keeps saying this house is just like his and it is very nice of Stan to let us live here. We don't know who Stan is. Is this typical for person suffering from Alzheimer's Bri SignatureMessage posted via MedKB.com http://www.medkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/alzheimer/200808/1 HI Bri: I'm sorry to hear the BIL hasn't improved from his hospital stays. My heart goes out to all of you. If BIL was coherent, or even partly coherent before he was admitted to the hospital but not when he returned home, something happened to him. Wrong medication perhaps? Your entitled to answers. If you don't get them, contact the hospital's commissioners. As I've been trying to warn this newsgroup from time to time, doctors DO NOT KNOW how to treat facial-cranial (neurological) diseases, and because of it, they are putting people's lives at risk. I've seen it with my own eyes, research at the nation's largest research center is a sham. Pathetic, I might add. If anyone believes a cure for AD is soon coming, let me assure you, your in for a long wait unless people remember, "We the People" are the government. We no longer ask, but DEMAND serious research on AD. EddyJean |
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