Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Alzheimer's / October 2006
Namenda/memantine hcl- any experiences out there??
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Sue Burnham - 20 Sep 2006 20:30 GMT My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has recommended Namenda over other drug treatments.
WE ( daughters ) are willing to follow his advice, but are just wondering if there are others out there who have anectodal experience.
Sue In Maine
Beth Cole - 20 Sep 2006 21:13 GMT > My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has > recommended Namenda over other drug treatments. > > WE ( daughters ) are willing to follow his advice, but are just wondering > if there are others out there who have anectodal experience. In the early/mid-stages, it held my MIL fairly steady, as if she were falling out of the sky with a parachute instead of unrestrained.
Now that she's in the final stages (bed-bound in a nursing home, hospice care, etc), it isn't supposed to be helpful, but she's receiving the maximum dosage, and it seems to be helpful about once every 10 to 14 days, so that she recognizes her husband (my FIL), and is somewhat coherent.
Beth
 Signature Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first. ~Mark Twain
Sue Burnham - 20 Sep 2006 21:37 GMT > > My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has > > recommended Namenda over other drug treatments. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Beth bless you Beth, that was QUICK!!!
I'm not expecting major improvements with Mom's cognition, but even minor improvement would be a gift.
She is still up, dressed, eating without a lot of assistance, but emotional outbursts, aggressiveness and stubbornness are becoming problematic. The psych doc thinks memantine will possibly boost her daily short term cognition/coherence, but not more than that.
I'd be pleased if she recognized me as her daughter again, but thats a lot to hope.
Thanks for your input, Beth.
Sue
Easter Stephens - 22 Sep 2006 22:39 GMT I take Namenda..aricept and Avandia....I have had Alzhiemers for 6 years.... Have a memory problem now and then but it is usually something some one tells me and I don't write it down....
Easter Stephens - 22 Sep 2006 22:41 GMT O I forgot....I also have type 2 diabetes...they tell me the medaformin is protecting my brain from the alzhiemers...
Easter Stephens - 02 Oct 2006 17:48 GMT I take both....The Namenda at noon and the aricept in evening....
Tumbleweed - 20 Sep 2006 21:19 GMT > My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has > recommended Namenda over other drug treatments. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Sue > In Maine Its been used in germany for the last 10+ years. Its in use in the UK, and my father is currently taking it* as part of a trial to establish whether it is any use in later stages.
From what I've read, best results are achieved if it is taken in conjunction with aricept and my father definitely had better results on aricept rather than memantine when he was in early stages (he never had both at the same time).
 Signature Tumbleweed
*trial is in two stages, part 1 is double blind for 6 months, part 2 you get the drug for 6 months, he has just started part 2
email replies not necessary but to contact use; tumbleweednews at hotmail dot com
Sue Burnham - 20 Sep 2006 21:51 GMT > > My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has > > recommended Namenda over other drug treatments. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > *trial is in two stages, part 1 is double blind for 6 months, part 2 you get > the drug for 6 months, he has just started part 2 Tumbleweed,
If wishes were horses........ I'd wish we'd had a heads up about memantine in trial. Oh well.
WE'll just be watching as IF this were a drug trial, as it truly IS for this patient-- our Mom.
I'm feeling better about this round of medication.
WE've fired/been fired by her former doc and now have seemed to strike a lode of same-locality doc's who freely network, communicate intensively, return calls, INITIATE calls about lab results, and WILL see their ALF patients IN the ALF on a schedule related to the patients needs, not demand the patients be transported to the office for evaluation.
Who'd a thunk it possible??
Had to kiss a few frogs along the way, I guess.
Thanks Tumbleweed. Best wishes for your Dad. Sue
Mary_Gordon@tvo.org - 20 Sep 2006 22:54 GMT I'd definitely be looking at the combination namenda/aricept. Very little to lose and lots to gain.
Mary G.
Sue Burnham - 21 Sep 2006 00:52 GMT > I'd definitely be looking at the combination namenda/aricept. Very > little to lose and lots to gain. > > Mary G. Mary, at this point, the Geriatric Psych is adamant that he wants nothing else administered to cloud the memantine treatment. Not even PRN xanax or valium for agitation, anxiety or aggressiveness.
Of course I know what this means, this is between Forest Pharm and the doc, Mom is just a Medicaid Paid guinea pig.
At least this drug does not have the menace of Seroquel's Black Box Warning, she will be closely monitored for 8 weeks, and both docs look at this as a "trial".
I can live with that because the docs are open and communicating, nothing is hidden, and they expect and propose to evaluate her IN her living situation, not drag her to an office situation where she WILL behave diffferently.
I'm going with the flow, have to try, even if it becomes anecdotal evidence for others down the road.
Thanks for your input, Mary. This is a long road .
Sue
Dennis P. Harris - 21 Sep 2006 04:29 GMT > Mary, at this point, the Geriatric Psych is adamant that he wants nothing > else administered to cloud the memantine treatment. Not even PRN xanax or > valium for agitation, anxiety or aggressiveness. > > Of course I know what this means, this is between Forest Pharm and the > doc, Mom is just a Medicaid Paid guinea pig. i would let them experiment on someone else, and INSIST that your mother get the treatment the government is supposedly paying for: both drugs, which is the currently approved regime.
your mother is a person, not a guinea pig, and if the doc she has won't do what you want, find another.
Dennis P. Harris - 21 Sep 2006 04:27 GMT > From what I've read, best results are achieved if it is taken in conjunction > with aricept and my father definitely had better results on aricept rather > than memantine when he was in early stages (he never had both at the same > time). that seems to be the prevailing wisdom. the OP might consider asking the doc to prescribe both, though there apparently can be some digestive problems.
the OP should also be aware that sometimes a partial or incremental restoration of cognitive abilities can make a person who had become somewhat passive more aggressive or paranoid. if the cause is AD rather than a frontal lobe dementia or lewy body disease, anti-psychotics can help with paranoia, delusions, and obsessive behavior.
she might want to google the archives for this group at groups.google.com for terms like "medication", "namenda", and "aricept".
Sue Burnham - 02 Oct 2006 02:10 GMT > > From what I've read, best results are achieved if it is taken in conjunction > > with aricept and my father definitely had better results on aricept rather [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > groups.google.com for terms like "medication", "namenda", and > "aricept". Dennis, forgive me, this was all about off the cuff treatment of a profoundly demented patient ( who could not give her own informed consent for treatment) with an off label use of a rx drug with an FDA "black box warning " absent consent or consultation with her HCPOA.
! HAND! ( talk to)
Sue
Sue
Dennis P. Harris - 02 Oct 2006 04:48 GMT > Dennis, forgive me, this was all about off the cuff treatment of a > profoundly demented patient ( who could not give her own informed consent > for treatment) with an off label use of a rx drug with an FDA "black > box warning " absent consent or consultation with her HCPOA. IMHO, no one should EVER give ANY medication to a patient without the patient's doctor knowing and approving AND the consent of the patient or the person with the right to make the patient's health care decisions. PERIOD.
Whoever did so should be immediate removed the the presence of the patient, barred from visiting the patient, and told that if they do so they will be arrested for trespassing, and then sued.
Sheesh.
Sue Burnham - 04 Oct 2006 00:45 GMT > > Dennis, forgive me, this was all about off the cuff treatment of a > > profoundly demented patient ( who could not give her own informed consent [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Sheesh. Not to worry, Dennis, the Maine Board of Medical Licensure will be taking this up in their October session.
Sue
Bud - 20 Sep 2006 22:54 GMT > My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has > recommended Namenda over other drug treatments. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Sue > In Maine I had my wife put on Memantine/Namenda (with Aricept) before it was approved in the US. I had to get it from the UK. She calmed down with easier redirection and seemed happier. I think the combination did wonders. She is now so far advanced and Hospice doubts either are doing anything but while it worked it did her well.
Bud
Sue Burnham - 21 Sep 2006 01:02 GMT > > My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has > > recommended Namenda over other drug treatments. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Bud "Calmed down with easier redirection and seemed happier"
that would be a MAJOR improvement for my Mom, sorry if I seem jaded. You do give me some hope.
I'm sorry you are also losing a loved one to this disease, and I thank you for taking your time to reply out of your discomfort.
Sue
meg - 21 Sep 2006 02:41 GMT > My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has > recommended Namenda over other drug treatments. Hi Sue, ,
My mother had what I think is a fairly rare reaction to the Namenda.
Her doctor cut down her dosage of aricept, because of stomach problems and added Namenda, gradually increasing the dosage of Namenda to the recommended levels. My mom had a contrary reaction, within a month, her confusion increased profoundly, she had delusions, significant weight loss and ended up sleeping most of the time. There were also other events which probably contributed to my Mom's severe decline, including a colonoscopy and having to have her dog euthanized. But once we took her off Namenda, she improved greatly. Unfortunately, she never improved to pre-Namenda levels so we had to move her from her home to assisted living.
Even with that experience, I couldn't advise someone to not try Namenda, because, as I mentioned, my mother's reaction was rare, but does occur. By the way, my mother's behavior/jtemperment improved greatly when she was prescribed zoloft.
Easter Stephens - 21 Sep 2006 18:06 GMT I have been on Namenda for a good while I can't tell any difference...also on avandamet....But still can't notice any difference in my Alzhiemers.....I have heard so many good things about Avandia...the Dr gave me Avandamet...when I ask for it ....still it isn't helping that I can tell.. she told me next time she will give me the real thing....so I'm waiting.....I once had a life... could paint pictures and scenery ...now I can do very little....I have lots of doll parts fired and ready to put together and don't have sence enough to get started...But the DR told me after I take all of the avandamet...she will give me the avandia....I heard on the News The other morning that they think Avandia might do away with Diabetes....can't wait to see if it works.....My Webtv got Fried when we had a storm and it came through the telephone line...i had pulled the plug on this when I heard a storm was coming ...didn't have sense enough to unplug the phone line and I lost my webtv....Took a while to find this it is suppose to be a new webtv plus but it doesn't feel like my old one that died...Ok I'll get off just in case I have bored you to death...
Dennis P. Harris - 22 Sep 2006 03:05 GMT > I have been on Namenda for a good while I can't tell any > difference Easter, there are two reasons for that:
1) Namenda can't reverse the progress of the disease, only slow it down; and 2) It's the nature of the illness that those who have it are unable to perceive that their memory is impaired (although other people *do* notice).
Alan Meyer - 22 Sep 2006 03:56 GMT > ... > 2) It's the nature of the illness that those who have it are > unable to perceive that their memory is impaired (although other > people *do* notice). I have read that that is true for most patients, but not for all. My mother and father both suffered from dementia, and both were conscious of it - my mother very much so. My mother- in-law had it and was totally unconscious of the fact.
Easter seems to be one of the conscious ones.
Incidentally Easter, my hat is off to you. I have tremendous admiration for the way that you are fighting this disease and even, through this newsgroup, trying to help others.
I am myself getting to the age where Alzheimer's is becoming a serious risk. I sincerely hope that, if I get it, I can fight it with as much strength and dignity as you have shown.
Best of luck.
Alan
Easter Stephens - 22 Sep 2006 23:03 GMT I think there must be 2 kinds...I have Diabetes also...and learned a while back that the diabetes medecine metforim'' actually helps preserve the brain of the alzhiemers patient...I have short term memory loss but can remember my life from years ago...But If my husband tells me something important and I shouldn't forget I write it down or like a telephone call...But I can't get my life back and do the beautiful dolls I made or Paintings...
Easter Stephens - 06 Oct 2006 21:57 GMT Tumbleweed - 22 Sep 2006 08:21 GMT >> I have been on Namenda for a good while I can't tell any >> difference [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > unable to perceive that their memory is impaired (although other > people *do* notice). my father very occasionally says that he knows he has ' a memory problem', and he once memorably said, in what was probably the last lucid thing he ever said, that he knew he had a serious memory problem, but it didnt bother him as he knew he'd forget that!
:-) He said this with a smile.
I think it would be generally truer to say that people with Az usually arent able to connect their faulty memory to their behaviours, eg rather than say my memory is really bad, thats why I cant recall where I put my money, they'll (for example) accuse someone of stealing, since they 'know' they didnt spend it or put it anywhere. At the same time, they may know that they have a bad memory! So there is a disconnect between knowing memory is bad, and understanding the consequences.
 Signature Tumbleweed
email replies not necessary but to contact use; tumbleweednews at hotmail dot com
ladylove77 - 22 Sep 2006 19:35 GMT My husband never took Namenda, just Aricept. He was aware that he had a memory problem. The kids teased him one Christmas that they had started not to get him a Christmas present, but just tell him he had already gotten it and he wouldn't know the difference. He just laughed with them (but I didn't!). Gwen
>>> I have been on Namenda for a good while I can't tell any >>> difference [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > that they have a bad memory! So there is a disconnect between knowing > memory is bad, and understanding the consequences. Easter Stephens - 22 Sep 2006 22:53 GMT Thanks Dennis You are so smart...
Easter Stephens - 23 Sep 2006 14:16 GMT It sounds like yours is a little impaired...maybe you should try it...
Easter Stephens - 25 Sep 2006 23:00 GMT That sounded pretty Stupid.....If you can't remember you know it and learn to write things down....Like Cooking...You use a little wind up clock that hollers when your food is finished...or what ever your waiting on...I have problems with my memory but learning to live with it....If My husband gets a phone call and is gone i take messages on post-it-notes and put the message where he can find it...Not much of a cook anymore....I forget to use my timer..
Alan Meyer - 21 Sep 2006 20:47 GMT > My mom has just been " worked up" by a geriatric psychiatrist, and he has > recommended Namenda over other drug treatments. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Sue > In Maine If you haven't seen it, you might want to look at the Alzheimer's Association fact sheet for Memantine (Namenda is the brand name for it) at:
http://www.alz.org/Resources/FactSheets/FSmemantine.pdf
A more technical explanation can be found in the FDA approved drug label at:
http://www.fda.gov/cder/foi/nda/2003/21-487_Namenda_Prntlbl.pdf
Best of luck.
Alan
Easter Stephens - 04 Oct 2006 16:37 GMT Sue I am taking Aricept , namenda, and avandiamet...I have had Alzheimers for 6 years...
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