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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Alzheimer's / April 2006

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Lesanne - 18 Apr 2006 00:59 GMT
Here is a news flash. Mom does not know me any more, but she remains in pretty good health. I am probably going to go back to work. I applied for a faculty position at the local nursing school. So that will either go, or not. If not I will look for something else. Anyway, I am trying to decide whether to hire more people here, or go the nursing home route. I will be going back to work in August or September.

I have a daughter, and a nephew. My daughter lives very close to us, nephew about 6 hours North. Daughter pretty much said "whatever you want, Ma" when I told her my plan. Nephew went nuts. "you can't put Grandma in a nursing home!" He is a nurse also, and knows what they are like here, which is basically why we care for her at home. Anyway, I have a friend who has a friend from church whose mom is in a small and very exclusive home in Matamoros Mexico, so I told him I was going to look at that. He really freaked. I told him that he was certainly free to come get her if he wanted and move her into his house with their family. Ha. You could have heard a pin drop.

This is all very interesting, will let you guys know about the Mexico establishment. One of my friends who has a rather black sense of humor suggested putting her on a bus. And no, that is a joke Dennis :).

Signature

Lesanne

Alan Meyer - 18 Apr 2006 04:10 GMT
I fervently hope that Alzheimer's never happens to me.
It is my single biggest fear about old age.  But if it does,
then what I want is for the sad end of my own life not to
be sad, destructive, and burdensome to the people
closest to me.

Perhaps I will have the will and the presence of mind to
do away with myself.  If not, then I want to be placed in
a home where I can lead the simple life left to me, and
where my family can live the full lives still offered to
them, rather than the restricted one left to me.

It's not that I wouldn't prefer to live with people who care
about me than with paid strangers.  Rather it's the
thought of what caring for me would do to the people
I love that is intolerable to me.

Maybe, ten years ago, when your Mom had all her wits
about her, she might have said the same thing.

   Alan
Evelyn Ruut - 18 Apr 2006 15:37 GMT
>I fervently hope that Alzheimer's never happens to me.
> It is my single biggest fear about old age.  But if it does,
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
>    Alan

Exactly my thoughts.   I wouldn't want my kids to go through the nearly
complete giving up of their own lives and agendas for me.   I would feel
that my dignity would be more intact if I were in a professional facility.
I say that having seen what professional facilities are like.
Signature


Best Regards,

Evelyn
(to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')

Beth Cole - 18 Apr 2006 16:15 GMT
> Exactly my thoughts.   I wouldn't want my kids to go through the nearly
> complete giving up of their own lives and agendas for me.   I would feel
> that my dignity would be more intact if I were in a professional facility.
> I say that having seen what professional facilities are like.

Having done the caregiving, my dad and his sister both say that if
either of them is diagnosed, that their kids are not to bother with
taking them home.  They are to go straight from the doctor's office to a
care home.  They lived through some of the worst things the disease can
cause in terms of rages and mood swings, and neither wants their kids &
grandkids to have to live through it as a caregiver who cannot walk away.

My dad is serious enough about it that he has given written instructions
to his doctors, his lawyer & his accountant, in addition to telling my
mom, my brother & me.

Beth

Signature

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you
nothing. It was here first. ~Mark Twain

Evelyn Ruut - 18 Apr 2006 17:08 GMT
>> Exactly my thoughts.   I wouldn't want my kids to go through the nearly
>> complete giving up of their own lives and agendas for me.   I would feel
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> Beth

Hi Beth,

Yes, and that being said, I must honestly admit I don't regret having cared
for Ida here, I just regret having done it for as long as I did.

I should have listened to my friends here, who told me it was time to start
moving towards finding placement.   They were right.   (thank you Dennis,
you were one)

I didn't have the sense to realize how much it wore us down, how much it
restricted our own lives, and that she could indeed get not only decent,
adequate care elsewhere, but actually that it could have been better for all
concerned.

We only realized that once she was already in a nursing home, and someone
else was getting up with her in the middle of the night, watching her 24/7,
365.

Signature

Best Regards,

Evelyn
(to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')

lesanne - 18 Apr 2006 21:54 GMT
We had a really good time up until about a year ago. Then it became work. I am a professional nurse. People forget that. This place has been a good nursing home, I am just done now. The local ones are horrible. I may choose to hire a couple more nursing assistants and rent myself a nice apartment. And yes, Mom would not want me to be doing this now. And if I wake up some morning in my 80's and cannot remember how to reconcile my bank account I am going swimming in the Gulf.

The problem about giving advice about when it is "time" is that it is never going to exactly fit the situation that you are imagining when you read about other people. Sometimes it is right, sometimes it is not. I don't regret one single moment of what we did so far. It fit our situation like a glove. I won't regret the change I make now.

And I did not come anywhere near "complete giving up of life and agenda". I did some things I had been wanting to do that fit into our living situation. When it got bad a year ago I hired live in help. We are not your average caregiving family. Still, I don't expect to go through this next change without a lot of turmoil. It is not fun.

Research reports seem to indicate that placing a loved one does not relieve any of the sense of responsibility felt by the caregiver, it just spreads the blame a little. In my case it will free me up to work at something I want to do now.

Signature

Les


 "Beth Cole" <eacole@gmail.com> wrote in message
 news:4ake4eFtkqsrU1@individual.net...
 >> Exactly my thoughts.   I wouldn't want my kids to go through the nearly
 >> complete giving up of their own lives and agendas for me.   I would feel
 >> that my dignity would be more intact if I were in a professional
 >> facility. I say that having seen what professional facilities are like.
 >
 > Having done the caregiving, my dad and his sister both say that if either
 > of them is diagnosed, that their kids are not to bother with taking them
 > home.  They are to go straight from the doctor's office to a care home.
 > They lived through some of the worst things the disease can cause in terms
 > of rages and mood swings, and neither wants their kids & grandkids to have
 > to live through it as a caregiver who cannot walk away.
 >
 > My dad is serious enough about it that he has given written instructions
 > to his doctors, his lawyer & his accountant, in addition to telling my
 > mom, my brother & me.
 >
 > Beth

 Hi Beth,

 Yes, and that being said, I must honestly admit I don't regret having cared
 for Ida here, I just regret having done it for as long as I did.

 I should have listened to my friends here, who told me it was time to start
 moving towards finding placement.   They were right.   (thank you Dennis,
 you were one)

 I didn't have the sense to realize how much it wore us down, how much it
 restricted our own lives, and that she could indeed get not only decent,
 adequate care elsewhere, but actually that it could have been better for all
 concerned.

 We only realized that once she was already in a nursing home, and someone
 else was getting up with her in the middle of the night, watching her 24/7,
 365.

 --

 Best Regards,

 Evelyn
 (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')
ladylove77 - 18 Apr 2006 22:46 GMT
Lesanne, you're right.  You still feel the responsibility even if your loved one is in a nursing home or assisted living, or any facility.  But you don't have the 24 hr. seven day a week thing hanging over your head all the time.  And someone else is responsible for seeing that medicines are given,
baths are taken, etc.  It makes a big difference.  I looked after Grayson for 6 or 7 years; he was in a nursing home for 8 months.  I was in the Rehab Hospital when he went there but after I went home, I think I missed one day going to the NH.  But then I went home to sleep at night without being disturbed.
Gwen
 We had a really good time up until about a year ago. Then it became work. I am a professional nurse. People forget that. This place has been a good nursing home, I am just done now. The local ones are horrible. I may choose to hire a couple more nursing assistants and rent myself a nice apartment. And yes, Mom would not want me to be doing this now. And if I wake up some morning in my 80's and cannot remember how to reconcile my bank account I am going swimming in the Gulf.

 The problem about giving advice about when it is "time" is that it is never going to exactly fit the situation that you are imagining when you read about other people. Sometimes it is right, sometimes it is not. I don't regret one single moment of what we did so far. It fit our situation like a glove. I won't regret the change I make now.

 And I did not come anywhere near "complete giving up of life and agenda". I did some things I had been wanting to do that fit into our living situation. When it got bad a year ago I hired live in help. We are not your average caregiving family. Still, I don't expect to go through this next change without a lot of turmoil. It is not fun.

 Research reports seem to indicate that placing a loved one does not relieve any of the sense of responsibility felt by the caregiver, it just spreads the blame a little. In my case it will free me up to work at something I want to do now.

 --
 Les
   "Evelyn Ruut" <mama-lionsox@hvc.rr.com> wrote in message news:na81g.32906$cY3.20983@news-wrt-01.rdc-nyc.rr.com...

   "Beth Cole" <eacole@gmail.com> wrote in message
   news:4ake4eFtkqsrU1@individual.net...
   > Evelyn Ruut wrote:
   >> Exactly my thoughts.   I wouldn't want my kids to go through the nearly
   >> complete giving up of their own lives and agendas for me.   I would feel
   >> that my dignity would be more intact if I were in a professional
   >> facility. I say that having seen what professional facilities are like.
   >
   > Having done the caregiving, my dad and his sister both say that if either
   > of them is diagnosed, that their kids are not to bother with taking them
   > home.  They are to go straight from the doctor's office to a care home.
   > They lived through some of the worst things the disease can cause in terms
   > of rages and mood swings, and neither wants their kids & grandkids to have
   > to live through it as a caregiver who cannot walk away.
   >
   > My dad is serious enough about it that he has given written instructions
   > to his doctors, his lawyer & his accountant, in addition to telling my
   > mom, my brother & me.
   >
   > Beth

   Hi Beth,

   Yes, and that being said, I must honestly admit I don't regret having cared
   for Ida here, I just regret having done it for as long as I did.

   I should have listened to my friends here, who told me it was time to start
   moving towards finding placement.   They were right.   (thank you Dennis,
   you were one)

   I didn't have the sense to realize how much it wore us down, how much it
   restricted our own lives, and that she could indeed get not only decent,
   adequate care elsewhere, but actually that it could have been better for all
   concerned.

   We only realized that once she was already in a nursing home, and someone
   else was getting up with her in the middle of the night, watching her 24/7,
   365.

   --

   Best Regards,

   Evelyn
   (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')
Lesanne - 19 Apr 2006 03:42 GMT
I really don't have 24/7 here, just because she lives here at home. I have live in help, like I mentioned. I don't get up at night. I do her bathing, because that is when I check her for skin problems etc, but it is my choice. I could have someone else do it. Still, I am wanting to have a place that is just my own now, especially if I am working a regular job out of the home. It is time for someone else to do all the caregiving. That is going to include my granddaughter as well, I plan to have her when I want her, as opposed to being available as an unpaid babysitter whenever they need one.

I'm Done. I am going to change my role from nurse to case manager.

Signature

Lesanne

 Lesanne, you're right.  You still feel the responsibility even if your loved one is in a nursing home or assisted living, or any facility.  But you don't have the 24 hr. seven day a week thing hanging over your head all the time.  And someone else is responsible for seeing that medicines are given,
 baths are taken, etc.  It makes a big difference.  I looked after Grayson for 6 or 7 years; he was in a nursing home for 8 months.  I was in the Rehab Hospital when he went there but after I went home, I think I missed one day going to the NH.  But then I went home to sleep at night without being disturbed.
 Gwen
   "lesanne" <larnimnot@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:wmc1g.64304$_26.37958@tornado.texas.rr.com...
   We had a really good time up until about a year ago. Then it became work. I am a professional nurse. People forget that. This place has been a good nursing home, I am just done now. The local ones are horrible. I may choose to hire a couple more nursing assistants and rent myself a nice apartment. And yes, Mom would not want me to be doing this now. And if I wake up some morning in my 80's and cannot remember how to reconcile my bank account I am going swimming in the Gulf.

   The problem about giving advice about when it is "time" is that it is never going to exactly fit the situation that you are imagining when you read about other people. Sometimes it is right, sometimes it is not. I don't regret one single moment of what we did so far. It fit our situation like a glove. I won't regret the change I make now.

   And I did not come anywhere near "complete giving up of life and agenda". I did some things I had been wanting to do that fit into our living situation. When it got bad a year ago I hired live in help. We are not your average caregiving family. Still, I don't expect to go through this next change without a lot of turmoil. It is not fun.

   Research reports seem to indicate that placing a loved one does not relieve any of the sense of responsibility felt by the caregiver, it just spreads the blame a little. In my case it will free me up to work at something I want to do now.

   --
   Les
     "Evelyn Ruut" <mama-lionsox@hvc.rr.com> wrote in message news:na81g.32906$cY3.20983@news-wrt-01.rdc-nyc.rr.com...

     "Beth Cole" <eacole@gmail.com> wrote in message
     news:4ake4eFtkqsrU1@individual.net...
     > Evelyn Ruut wrote:
     >> Exactly my thoughts.   I wouldn't want my kids to go through the nearly
     >> complete giving up of their own lives and agendas for me.   I would feel
     >> that my dignity would be more intact if I were in a professional
     >> facility. I say that having seen what professional facilities are like.
     >
     > Having done the caregiving, my dad and his sister both say that if either
     > of them is diagnosed, that their kids are not to bother with taking them
     > home.  They are to go straight from the doctor's office to a care home.
     > They lived through some of the worst things the disease can cause in terms
     > of rages and mood swings, and neither wants their kids & grandkids to have
     > to live through it as a caregiver who cannot walk away.
     >
     > My dad is serious enough about it that he has given written instructions
     > to his doctors, his lawyer & his accountant, in addition to telling my
     > mom, my brother & me.
     >
     > Beth

     Hi Beth,

     Yes, and that being said, I must honestly admit I don't regret having cared
     for Ida here, I just regret having done it for as long as I did.

     I should have listened to my friends here, who told me it was time to start
     moving towards finding placement.   They were right.   (thank you Dennis,
     you were one)

     I didn't have the sense to realize how much it wore us down, how much it
     restricted our own lives, and that she could indeed get not only decent,
     adequate care elsewhere, but actually that it could have been better for all
     concerned.

     We only realized that once she was already in a nursing home, and someone
     else was getting up with her in the middle of the night, watching her 24/7,
     365.

     --

     Best Regards,

     Evelyn
     (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')
Evelyn Ruut - 19 Apr 2006 14:26 GMT
 I really don't have 24/7 here, just because she lives here at home. I have live in help, like I mentioned. I don't get up at night. I do her bathing, because that is when I check her for skin problems etc, but it is my choice. I could have someone else do it. Still, I am wanting to have a place that is just my own now, especially if I am working a regular job out of the home. It is time for someone else to do all the caregiving. That is going to include my granddaughter as well, I plan to have her when I want her, as opposed to being available as an unpaid babysitter whenever they need one.

 I'm Done. I am going to change my role from nurse to case manager.

 Hi Lesanne,

 I applaud your decision, and also your ability to know when the time is right to do this.   Like I mentioned before, I waited too long.

 --

 Best Regards,

 Evelyn
 (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')
Lesanne - 19 Apr 2006 21:07 GMT
Thanks Evelyn. Hopefully I will be able to find a place I can stand. One that is good is not going to happen, but if I can find one that I can stand I can possibly coerce them into taking good care of Mom.
   I'm Done. I am going to change my role from nurse to case manager.

   Hi Lesanne,

   I applaud your decision, and also your ability to know when the time is right to do this.   Like I mentioned before, I waited too long.

   --

   Best Regards,

   Evelyn
   (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')

   
meg - 19 Apr 2006 04:00 GMT
> We had a really good time up until about a year ago. Then it became work. I am a professional nurse. People forget that. This place has been a good nursing home, I am just done now. The local ones are horrible. I may choose to hire a couple more nursing assistants and rent myself a nice apartment. And yes, Mom would not want me to be doing this now. And if I wake up some morning in my 80's and cannot remember how to reconcile my bank account I am going swimming in the Gulf.
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> --
> Les

Hi Lesaane,

I really agree with you about giving advice about the right time to
place a loved one.  Although  there are many similiarities that people
with Alz. and their caregiver's share, family dynamics and individual
personalities make each case unique.

I am not convinced that residential care is the "best" care for someone
with Alz..  Unfortunately it is often the only option.  About a year
ago, we placed my mother in assisted living, then memory care.  Since
then,  I have been waiting for that sense of relief people talk about
because they know their loved ones are well cared for, but I haven't
experienced it yet.  I worry about her all the time.  The aides are
underpaid and overworked, there is a high turnover rate, and most don't
have the level of skill that is required for managing difficult
behaviors or soothing anxious souls.   We have her in a facility that
comes highly recommended.  I hate to think about what other facilities
are like.
Unfortunately, I just do not feel equiped to take care of my mother
myself because of our own personal dynamics, my work, the strain it
would put on my marriage, and my family's limited funds.  Residential
care is our only option but not an ideal one.
Lesanne - 19 Apr 2006 21:05 GMT
> Hi Lesaane,
>
> I really agree with you about giving advice about the right time to
> place a loved one.  Although  there are many similiarities that people
> with Alz. and their caregiver's share, family dynamics and individual
> personalities make each case unique.

**True**

> I am not convinced that residential care is the "best" care for someone
> with Alz..  Unfortunately it is often the only option.  About a year
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> comes highly recommended.  I hate to think about what other facilities
> are like.

**There are no highly recommended facilities here. I love my home an don't
want to move away. My friends are here. I have a real good chance of getting
a position as nursing faculty at the local University. There is certainly no
perfect solution to this. I can hire people to take care of her here for
about what the nursing home will cost. I just need to decide. My feel today
is that the situation here is going to get out of hand pretty soon. I am
touring the rotten choices of facilities here.  With my contacts I could
certainly influence her care.

> Unfortunately, I just do not feel equiped to take care of my mother
> myself because of our own personal dynamics, my work, the strain it
> would put on my marriage, and my family's limited funds.  Residential
> care is our only option but not an ideal one.

**We were fine as long as she was receiving any benefit at all from me doing
it myself. Now that she no longer really knows me, it has become rather
pointless for me to do it. It is not making her any happier. The activities
we used to do, pretty much irritate or frighten her now. I think anyone who
has a sense of relief after placing a parent is probably in denial, or in
full retreat from reality, or maybe just does not understand the situation.
There is nothing about the end of this disease that will give me a sense of
relief other than her being done with it.
Evelyn Ruut - 20 Apr 2006 00:06 GMT
> **We were fine as long as she was receiving any benefit at all from me
> doing it myself. Now that she no longer really knows me, it has become
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> understand the situation. There is nothing about the end of this disease
> that will give me a sense of relief other than her being done with it.

Hi Lesanne,

Yes, I can relate to that.

There was a small sense of relief, but there was also a lot of concern and
even guilt.   It wasn't something done lightly, that's for sure.   We were
both so torn about it.

And I have to admit, we had her in a really excellent facility with
wonderful people who really loved the old folks and the staff took great
care of her.   She had clean clothing on every day, was kept well fed,
physically clean.   There were nice activities, and a whole team of people
who evaluated each patient deciding what kind of treatment and therapies
would help them best.   They consulted with us on each step.   They would
call us if there was the tiniest thing.   I don't think all facilities are
like that, maybe we were just lucky.   But I honestly couldn't fault them
for a thing.

I was relieved only to get a full night's sleep for a change, but true
relief only came when she went truly home and was finally at peace.

She will be gone one year this coming Sunday.
Signature


Best Regards,

Evelyn
(to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')

Alan Meyer - 20 Apr 2006 00:11 GMT
I am curious Lesanne, how did you go about finding
someone to live in to take care of your mom?  The
question is academic for me at this time, but I remember
my father attempting to hire someone to take care of my
mother during the day.  The first one quit after a few weeks.
The second one stole my Mom's jewelry before quitting,
though there was no way to prove it.  The third one was
wonderful, a woman whose own mother had had AD
and who was honest, sympathetic and easygoing.  But
finding her was just good luck.

Do you have any advice to share with the group on this
question?
Lesanne - 20 Apr 2006 01:53 GMT
>I am curious Lesanne, how did you go about finding
> someone to live in to take care of your mom?

** It is like that old saying "location, location...." I live right on the
border of Texas/Mexico, in Brownsville. There are all sorts of people here
who are wonderful with elders and willing to work, live in or otherwise. The
poverty in Matamoros is awful. Many women get "green" cards to work in the
U.S. An ad in the local bargain book will get a person so many applicants
that it is just a job interviewing them all, and they all want to work for
someone who has just "one" person to care for. The housekeeper lives in for
$160. a week, is excellent with Mom, cleans, does the laundry.... She is
considered very wealthy by her family in Matamoros, they are buying a home
down there with the money she contributes. Then I have a couple of students
who fill in when I need more skills, one is in phlebotomy school but has
nurses aid training, the other is in school to be a special education
teacher and has nurses aid training. They work as needed for $6 an hour.
That is just a small part of the benefit of living here.  I have a lovely
four bedroom brick home that sits on a double lot that cost us a fraction of
what it costs to buy a house anywhere else I know of. It is just how it is
:). We get a lot of visitors in the winter because of the economy, but you
have to get used to the summer to be able to survive it.

> The
> question is academic for me at this time, but I remember
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> Do you have any advice to share with the group on this
> question?
Alan Meyer - 20 Apr 2006 20:50 GMT
> >I am curious Lesanne, how did you go about finding
> > someone to live in to take care of your mom?
>
> ** It is like that old saying "location, location...." I live right on the
> border of Texas/Mexico, in Brownsville.

That explains it.

On the few trips we've made to Mexico, it seemed like we
met a lot of people who were very poor by U.S. standards
but were hard working, decent, friendly and gracious people.

I had feared that people would hate us as "rich" (by Mexican
standards) gringos.  But it didn't turn out that way at all.
We saw very little hostility.

   Alan
lesanne - 20 Apr 2006 21:23 GMT
That explains it.

On the few trips we've made to Mexico, it seemed like we
met a lot of people who were very poor by U.S. standards
but were hard working, decent, friendly and gracious people.

I had feared that people would hate us as "rich" (by Mexican
standards) gringos.  But it didn't turn out that way at all.
We saw very little hostility.

   Alan

There are a few members of the predominantly Hispanic population who
are bigots. It is most interesting to see the Anglo transplants who
express Horror and Amazement at being the focus of discrimination.
I found that somewhat hilarious after having grown up in Houston
where there is a large group of bigoted Anglo folk.

The vast majority of the people here are hard working, decent, friendly
and gracious. Even to some of the elderly who are bigoted Anglo folk
who speak in the hearing of the Hispanic help about the "lazy Mexicans".
I frankly don't know ANY lazy Mexicans. I do see them pace themselves
because it is easier to work the back breaking hours that they expect
to work. My housekeeper was flabbergasted when I told her to take
a rest period between three and six each day. She told me the last place
she worked, she was expected to rise at 6 with the children, and was
allowed to go to her room at 10 when they were in bed and the
kitchen was clean.

She thinks it is "cute" when Mom acts out, although she does not
laugh at her. She thinks cleaning up pee off the tile is no big deal.
She thinks Mom is her own personal "abuelita".
Evelyn Ruut - 20 Apr 2006 22:46 GMT
 

 She thinks it is "cute" when Mom acts out, although she does not
 laugh at her. She thinks cleaning up pee off the tile is no big deal.
 She thinks Mom is her own personal "abuelita".

 You are lucky to have such kind person caring for your mom.   We were lucky too, in that my next door neighbor, who had never taken care of an elderly person, became very close and dear to us, caring for my mother in law as though she was her own relative.   Ida loved her, and so did we.

 In fact, she has since made it her new "profession" and has been doing this ever since.   She has often thanked us for the opportunity, when is really the other way around, for her having been so kind.  
 --

 Best Regards,

 Evelyn
 (to reply to me personally, remove 'sox')
meg - 20 Apr 2006 03:37 GMT
>We were fine as long as she was receiving any benefit at all from me doing
> it myself. Now that she no longer really knows me, it has become rather
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> There is nothing about the end of this disease that will give me a sense of
> relief other than her being done with it.

Yes, it's a long, slow anguished way to go, with no real relief.
The Turd Burglar - 20 Apr 2006 03:28 GMT
LESANNE.  THEY'RE ALL TURDS AS FAR AS I'm CONCERNED!!!!!

TURDS< TURDS AND MORE TURDS

SO TAKE YOUR CRAP ELSEWHERE.  EVELYN DOESN'T GIVE A CRAP ANYWAY.
 
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