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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / Alzheimer's / January 2005

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Many older people under-nourished

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tj - 22 Dec 2004 11:42 GMT
 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4115461.stm
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Mary_Gordon@tvo.org - 22 Dec 2004 15:47 GMT
I think its a multipronged problem - its not just money. Its about the
difficulties involved in shopping and food preparation and cooking and
wash-up for one - which can seem like an overwhelming amount of bother,
particularly if you aren't feeling particularly hungry or interested in
food (often the case if your sense of taste or smell is impaired). I
was single into my 30's, and rarely could be bothered to make myself a
proper dinner that would meet with a dietician's approval.

I've seen elderly relatives who were quite well off slip into the tea
and toast syndrome - or tea and chocolate bars, like my husband's late
Auntie Kay! We had meals on wheels for my MIL while we were still
maintaining her in her own apartment. The housekeeper got her breakfast
and made a lunch for her, and then meals on wheels delivered a hot
supper. Even when she would claim she wasn't hungry, and wouldn't have
made an effort on her own, she would eat well if you put a prepared
meal in front of her.

I wonder if it will be any easier when we all get to that point in
life, what with microwave ovens and the plethora of good premade frozen
meals. You'd think frozen meals would make it easier to keep reasonably
fed with limited effort (i.e. you go to the store, you buy seven "TV"
dinners and shove them in the freezer, and there you go for the week,
with no preparation work and no wasted food).

Mary G.
tj - 22 Dec 2004 19:36 GMT
> I think its a multipronged problem - its not just money. Its about the
> difficulties involved in shopping and food preparation and cooking and
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> was single into my 30's, and rarely could be bothered to make myself a
> proper dinner that would meet with a dietician's approval.

    I think being on your own is a definite negative factor when it
comes to eating properly. When my wife was in hospital for three months
being assessed  i found it hard to motivate to cook for myself.All that
 effort preparing and cooking just for me?- nah don't think so.

Also when i was struggling to cope with my wife, pre to getting through
to the appropriate people that she was having major problems the stress
of trying to ger her to eat and rink properly played havoc with my  own
eating habits.

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Songbird - 23 Dec 2004 03:47 GMT
> I wonder if it will be any easier when we all get to that point in
> life, what with microwave ovens and the plethora of good premade frozen
> meals. You'd think frozen meals would make it easier to keep reasonably
> fed with limited effort (i.e. you go to the store, you buy seven "TV"
> dinners and shove them in the freezer, and there you go for the week,
> with no preparation work and no wasted food).

Actually that's what dietitian suggested my parents do. They are diabetic
and have other health-related diet restrictions as well. This way they know
exactly what size portion and what they are consuming. I think the goal is
to get Dad fixing some simple meals eventually, but this is a way for them
to learn what affects them, portion sizes, etc.

Songbird
Jo Ann Malina - 24 Dec 2004 08:33 GMT
Mary_Gordon@tvo.org is alleged to have said:
> I wonder if it will be any easier when we all get to that point in
> life, what with microwave ovens and the plethora of good premade frozen
> meals. You'd think frozen meals would make it easier to keep reasonably
> fed with limited effort (i.e. you go to the store, you buy seven "TV"
> dinners and shove them in the freezer, and there you go for the week,
> with no preparation work and no wasted food).

Unless you have dementia, and then even if someone brings you a
refrigerator full of food, you can't remember how to prepare it, or
imagine how a frozen box turns into a warm tray of food.

I wonder how many of those people in the BBC article had some level
of dementia.  Especially the over-85's.

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Live all you can; it's a mistake not to.  It doesn't so much matter what
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had that, what have you had?   -- Henry James, _The Ambassadors_

Mary_Gordon@tvo.org - 24 Dec 2004 12:41 GMT
I have many relatives who ate poorly as seniors, even with no signs of
dementia, although I'm sure there are many people for whom that is a
factor. My late great Aunt Margaret died a year ago - fiercely
independent, completely intact mentally right to the end - a real holy
terror who never married - she lived alone (in her parents home), had
osteoporosis and terrible back pain, tired easily and found shopping
very difficult, wouldn't ask for help, couldn't be bothered to cook and
had a limited appetite. She lived out of tins for a long time....by the
time my cousin Doug finally insisted on some changes, she was like a
skeleton. What she was eating was not just nutritionally poor, but
insufficient quantity...no wonder she was tired all the time. No fuel
in the tank! When you look at what happened, it was a pernicious
spiral. Gradually, she fell into habits that meant she wasn't eating
well or enough, she started to get tired and unwell, she got weaker,
she got more isolated because she was weak, she got depressed, she ate
even less. She never owned a microwave oven in her life, but frozen
dinners would have been 1000% improvement over the tins of soup or
spagetti she lived on.

Mary G.
Sarah Kanary - 02 Jan 2005 01:01 GMT
I don't know if this can happen with Alzheimer's patients, but is it
possible that as the plaques and tangles kill the brain, they can start to
affect the part that tells a person when to be hungry?

My mother is quite advanced in the disease, my father's progression is much
slower.  He regularly sits her down to a good meal, but she just picks at
her food.  She has nutritious meals set before her regularly, but just
doesn't seem interested in eating well.

Sarah Kanary

> I have many relatives who ate poorly as seniors, even with no signs of
> dementia, although I'm sure there are many people for whom that is a
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Mary G.
Mary_Gordon@tvo.org - 02 Jan 2005 01:18 GMT
Whats known is that quite early they do lose a significant amount of
their sense of smell, and thus their ability to taste food. Its so
common, researchers are actually working on diagnostic tests for AD
that involve testing the person's sense of smell. Here is an article on
the proposed test
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=17776

Dramatic weight loss is usually associated with damage to the sense of
smell or taste, no matter what the cause of the loss of ability to
smell (also called anosmia)
Here is a good article on anosmia and what it means for appetite
http://hubel.sfasu.edu/courseinfo/SL99/anosmia.htmll

And yes, I do strongly believe that ultimately they lose their
understanding of the sensation of hunger. They may still feel it, but
it doesn't appear to trigger a connection with the action  of eating. I
expect its similar to what goes on with elimination or urination later
in the illness. They probably feel the physical sensations but have no
clue what they mean or what to do about them.

Mary G.
Beth - 02 Jan 2005 03:22 GMT
Sarah,  What you see depends on where the damage is affecting the brain.
 While loss of appetite/interest in eating is classic-for my MIL she is
literally unable to recognize what to do with her food (or most any
other object for that matter).  She doesn't know what a glass handed to
her is for and verbal directions are often not understood at all.  We
and the staff at her ALF have learned ways to handle her behaviors-but
sometimes we have to pen her in (to keep her from "going home to her
mother") with chairs (aides are sitting in them feeding others) and
sometimes actually feed her.  Some days are better than others-usually
once she is started she will go into "automatic" mode and finish on her
own.  She pretty much won't eat except at the dining room table, because
she doesn't trust her interpretations.  So we've long ago stopped taking
in cookies and candy.

Early on she lost recognition of familiar people and she cannot
understand photographs now.  Yesterday, she refused a piece of her
birthday cake (87!) but was intrigued by the purple icing.  The activity
director fed her 1 mouthful and Marion finished it up herself with no
problem.  But she is unable to recognize food as something to eat.
She'd just as soon carry it around in her purse,if they let her.  For
most things- we try to get her "into automatic".  That's most successful
for things like brushing teeth, pulling up underwear after toileting,
etc.  She pretty much is unable to think of these things herself, but
often will function without thinking.

Anyway, I just wanted to point out that this whole area is multi-faceted.

Beth
Lee - 02 Jan 2005 04:36 GMT
wish I could find a switch to "get her into automatic" ... my MIL, I mean
.... she CAN still do things... just as long as she doesn't think too much
about it.... once she's thought about it, we haven't been very successful in
finding a way to switch her back...  she gets so frustrated and stressed
out.  *sigh*

Re: the eating issues....  I know with my MIL, and from what I've read,
often there's a real preference for sweets ....   when all else fails here,
I jumpstart her eating again with ice cream, or waffles with syrup .... both
things she'd NEVER refuse ....   have, on occassion, poured a bit of maple
syrup on other foods too .... not something I'd want to eat, but she's
happy.  The other thing is that we try to be very careful re: keeping her
stuff either bland or sweet....   if she gets something that she perceives
as too spicy, she's less likely to eat whatever we offer next

> Sarah,  What you see depends on where the damage is affecting the brain.
>   While loss of appetite/interest in eating is classic-for my MIL she is
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
>
> Beth
 
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