 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
Medical Forum / General / Alternative / February 2008Vitamin B-17
Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat the kernel that inside the pit. It is the size and shape of a small almond. I do this to get the vitamin B17 also known as Laetril. My question: what health benefits am I getting from taking (this small dose of) Vitamin B-17? Please no replies about: "quack cancer cure"...blah blah. I've heard all that, and do not have cancer, not taking it for that reason. > Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat the > kernel that inside the pit. It is the size and shape of a small almond. I do [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Vitamin B-17? Please no replies about: "quack cancer cure"...blah blah. I've > heard all that, and do not have cancer, not taking it for that reason. You are getting NO benefits from it. laetrile is useless, and, you would get the same benefits if you ate beach sand. It is a pure QUACK substance. > > Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat > the [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > It is a pure QUACK substance. And once again Mark, aka attorney, opens his completely wrong mouth. > > > Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and > eat [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > > And once again Mark, aka attorney, opens his completely wrong mouth. OK. Post proof of all your claims. Any medical claims of benefit from consuming this substance should be back up by appropriate clinical studies. Of course, you cannot. > > > > Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and > > eat [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > Of course, you cannot. Ok, First, you ARE called an attorney by some. Do you mean that you need an appropriate clinical study to tell you that apricot pits contain many more components than sand? My, you are slow today. > > > > > Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed > and [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > > > Ok, First, you ARE called an attorney by some. With absolutely no proof thereof. You should learn the difference between an allegation and proof. Mere coincidence proves mere coincidence. > Do you mean that you need an appropriate clinical study to tell you > that apricot pits contain many more components than sand? My, you are slow > today. Why not read what I wrote for understanding? I left it above just as I wrote it. >> Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat the >> kernel that inside the pit. It is the size and shape of a small almond. I do [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >It is a pure QUACK substance. oh is it beach sand? well tell that to the hunza tribe thats been cancer free 900 years cause b-17 is a staple,peaches during and dried when not,36 othr tribes,western cures as well man in stage 3 was ready to give up his wife had suggested b-17 from the start,but against his drs wishes of course did not bother,given 2 weeks,he figured what did he have to lose? slowly within days sore around groin area dissappeared,then clouds on ultra sound,then total remission,dr said just 1 of those miricles,probably had nothing to do with the 17,and probably by the sounds so are you,but give a ...... anyway would go into much more detail,but no doubt would do 0 so wont waste my time.toxic effects are gone in b-17 asrhodanese which has the ability to detoxify cyanide,is present in normal tissues but deficcient in cancer cells.these two factors supposedly combine to effect a selective poisoning of cancer cells by the cyanide released from the laetrile,while normal cells and tissues remain undamaged.??/??// >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat the >kernel that inside the pit. It is the size and shape of a small almond. I do >this to get the vitamin B17 also known as Laetril. It's not a vitamin. You don't need it in your diet. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT) > >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat the > >kernel that inside the pit. It is the size and shape of a small almond. I do [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants > were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT) So, David, tell us what, exactly, is in the pit? How much of it? what else is there? >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat >the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >So, David, tell us what, exactly, is in the pit? How much of it? what else >is there? Who cares? I was merely commenting on the idiocy of referring to laetrile as "vitamin B-17." -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT) > >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat > >the [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants > were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT) Laetrile is commonly called vitamin B17. While it may not be so, matters not. You were just being your usual self. > > >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and > eat [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > Laetrile is commonly called vitamin B17. While it may not be so, matters > not. Actually it is commonly *promoted* as B17. That matters in that it says much about the the "scientific" credentials/ pretences and trustworthiness of the promoters. Peter Moran > > > >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed > and [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > Peter Moran Might be that one bunch wants to say it is a vitamin, and the other wants to say it's not. Most people do not care. You guys need to do something about the rampant anal retentiveness that you share. > "Peter Moran" <moringa@gil.com.au> wrote in message news:41168a0b$0$18334$61c65585@uq-127creek-reader-03.brisbane.pipenetworks.com.au... > > > > >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed > > and [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > say it's not. Most people do not care. You guys need to > do something about the rampant anal retentiveness that you share. The promotors should do something about proving it has value. > "Peter Moran" <moringa@gil.com.au> wrote in message news:41168a0b$0$18334$61c65585@uq-127creek-reader-03.brisbane.pipenetworks.com.au... > > > > >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed > > and [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > Might be that one bunch wants to say it is a vitamin, and the other wants to > say it's not. Most people do not care. Presumably why so many people get scammed mercilessly, even when they have serious illnesses? Peter Moran, >> >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and >eat [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >Laetrile is commonly called vitamin B17. While it may not be so, matters >not. You were just being your usual self. Yeah, giving the needle to stupidity. It's one of the reasons I respond to you, too, although in your case, it's like shooting a clay pigeon six feet high. And now, a little new material: did you know that MedTools actually died (while he wasn't in Texas)? He was such a tall fellow that there was no coffin available locally that would hold him. So they gave him an enema and buried him in a shoebox. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT) >>> >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and >>eat [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >Yeah, giving the needle to stupidity Hey! You're infringing upon *MY* racket! >>>> >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and >>>eat [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > >Hey! You're infringing upon *MY* racket! I thought you gave the needle to acupuncture points? -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT) >>>>> >> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed >and [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > >I thought you gave the needle to acupuncture points? I do, but at the risk of sounding G*staldo-esque, treating disorders of qi may require removing blockages that exist outside the meridian system. By using a "reducing" technique, needling can reduce the frequency & intensity of Med(S)Tools attacks on the sum of human knowledge. > -- David Wright :: > > >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat > the [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > So, David, tell us what, exactly, is in the pit? How much of it? what else > is there? Cyanide for one thing. It is the most active ingredient there. > > > >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and > eat [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Cyanide for one thing. It is the most active ingredient there. How much of this most active ingredient is there? And how much of what others? > > > > >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and > > eat [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > How much of this most active ingredient is there? And how much of what > others? Read for yourself: http://tinyurl.com/6cpaj http://tinyurl.com/53c4g Laetrile (B17) isn't cyanide, neither does it contain cyanide, when it is split by enzymes then you might get a cyanide style compound.. Anth >> > >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and > eat [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Cyanide for one thing. It is the most active ingredient there. Even assuming you are correct, it provides as much benefit as eating beach sand. > Laetrile (B17) isn't cyanide, neither does it contain cyanide, when it is > split by enzymes then you might get a cyanide style compound.. [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > > > Cyanide for one thing. It is the most active ingredient there. > Even assuming you are correct, it provides as much benefit as eating beach > sand. [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > > > > > Cyanide for one thing. It is the most active ingredient there. So......... you had beach sand and apricot pits tested against each other. And, the results were that they were the same? Amazing! How much did you spend and how long did you labor at this test? We all know that you would not support any thing that lacks proper testing. > > Even assuming you are correct, it provides as much benefit as eating beach > > sand. [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > How much did you spend and how long did you labor at this test? > We all know that you would not support any thing that lacks proper testing. I do not have to jomp off the Brooklyn Bridge to know that it is not a good thing to do. > > > Even assuming you are correct, it provides as much benefit as eating > beach [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > I do not have to jomp off the Brooklyn Bridge to know that it is not a good > thing to do. True, you do need to be careful about your "jomping" (I am correct) Laetrile hasn't been tested properly (I.V) Anth > Even assuming you are correct, it provides as much benefit as eating beach > sand. Why have the proponents of it refused to test it? What are they afraid of? BTW, there has been IV testing. It has a serious problem with cyanide poisoning. > (I am correct) > Laetrile hasn't been tested properly (I.V) > Anth > > > Even assuming you are correct, it provides as much benefit as eating beach > > sand. > Why have the proponents of it refused to test it? > > What are they afraid of? The Oasis of Hope welcomed testing it - they were blocked by outspoken mainstream docs from testing it. > BTW, there has been IV testing. It has a serious problem with cyanide > poisoning. If this were true the Oasis hospital would be reporting cyanide poisoning on a regular basis which they do not. The molecule is split in the gut - that's where the trouble lies when you eat it. Anth (Also assuming your assertion that it has been tested I.V. can you please post the study/reference?) Anth [2] This article swaps and changes names so much you don't know what they were testing. So you are _right_ amygadalin' has been tested I.V (phase 1 + II studies on the assumptions that) (1) Was the correct type (2) The protocol was the same as used in the Mexico clinics, this was not the case) Questions I would ask are do animals that eat these compounds get cancer in the same rates as humans? Anth (1) http://www.navi.net/~rsc/nitrilo1.htm 1-mandelonitrile-beta-diglucoside (amygdalin) (2) http://www.medhelp.org/NIHlib/GF-478.html > (Also assuming your assertion that it has been tested I.V. can you please > post the study/reference?) Search Medline like I did. Laetrile intravenous Thanks - I don't have an ID for medline, got pubmed and google.. http://cis.nci.nih.gov/fact/9_3.htm What clinical trials (research studies in humans) been conducted with laetrile? Findings from only two clinical trials with laetrile have been published. These trials, sponsored by NCI, were conducted in the late 1970s and early 1980s. The first trial, a phase I study tested the doses, method of administration, and schedule of administration of amygdalin in six cancer patients. Researchers found that amygdalin caused minimal side effects. However, two patients who ate raw almonds while taking amygdalin developed symptoms of cyanide poisoning. In 1982, a phase II study with 175 patients looked at which types of cancer might respond to treatment with amygdalin. Most of the patients in this study had breast, colon, or lung cancer. Amygdalin was administered by injection for 21 days, followed by oral maintenance therapy using doses and procedures similar to those evaluated in the phase I study. Vitamins and pancreatic enzymes were also given as part of a metabolic therapy program that also included dietary changes. One stomach cancer patient showed a decrease in tumor size, which was maintained for 10 weeks while the patient was on amygdalin therapy. In 54 percent of the patients, there was a measurable progression (growth) of cancer at the end of the treatment. All of the patients showed cancer progression 7 months after completing treatment. Some patients reported an improvement in their ability to work or do other activities, and other patients said their symptoms improved. However, these improvements did not last once treatment ended. On the basis of this study, NCI concluded that no further investigation of laetrile was necessary. No controlled clinical trials (trials that include a comparison group of patients who receive no additional treatment, a placebo, or another treatment) of laetrile have been conducted. 46% of the people had no progression of their disease while on the therapy, 7 months _after_ the therapy was stopped 100% had progression. (In other words, the people were given the drug for 21 days, in which time 46% of them had no progression of their cancers) Anth >> (Also assuming your assertion that it has been tested I.V. can you please >> post the study/reference?) > > Search Medline like I did. > > Laetrile intravenous > Thanks - I don't have an ID for medline, got pubmed and google.. > > http://cis.nci.nih.gov/fact/9_3.htm Try: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi and get your own answers. > What clinical trials (research studies in humans) been conducted with > laetrile? [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > > > Laetrile intravenous >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >From: "Anth" anon@anon.com >Date: 8/11/04 8:52 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <sJSdnWvE_oxN3YfcRVn-jA@nildram.net> >If this were true the Oasis hospital would be reporting cyanide poisoning on >a regular basis which they do not. >The molecule is split in the gut - that's where the trouble lies when you >eat it. >Anth Anth, I have a question. Ruminent animals often die from eating ruffage high in nitrile content because the bacteria in their guts convert the nitrile to the poisonus cyanide. For B17 to act as a cancer killer, it must be absorbed intact, transported to the cancers, where the cancer cells can canvert the nitrile to the cyanide. Since the cancer cells do not have the enzyme needed to neutralize the cyanide, the cyanide kills them. Normal healathy cells, you see, have the needed neutralizing enzyme. I am confused by your comment about the molecule being split in the gut. This only happens with the ruminants. If this were the case with humans, the molecule would be worthless as a cancer treatment. DrC PhD > >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >>From: "Anth" anon@anon.com [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > because > the bacteria in their guts convert the nitrile to the poisonus cyanide. Well I was thinking since some people drink wheat grass juice then they should be dieing of cyanide poisoning or at least showing signs of it. It takes approx 1kg of wheat grass to produce 1 pint of wheatgrass juice, that's a lot of nitrilosides, and yet wheatgrass juice is safe. > For B17 to act as a cancer killer, it must be absorbed intact, transported > to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > the cyanide kills them. Normal healathy cells, you see, have the needed > neutralizing enzyme. What _exactly_ is B17 - the chemical name? In theory that how it is explained, I'm not sure if this is entirely true, have you any links that show cancer cells do not have the enzyme to split the nitriloside? > I am confused by your comment about the molecule being split in the gut. > This > only happens with the ruminants. If this were the case with humans, the > molecule would be worthless as a cancer treatment. The cyanide poisoning was probably down to people eating the raw pits, which contain more than just the nitriloside.. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstra ct&list_uids=356691 > DrC PhD Anth >I am confused >DrC PhD 'That' is almost the an intelligent pestilence that you have spewed upon MHA. Just noting it for future erudition. -- W_B wubbabubbazG@RBAGEyahoo.com Take out the G'RBAGE >From: W_B no_one@nowhere.net Chicken troll > >From: W_B no_one@nowhere.net > > Chicken Jan you are the intellecutal coward who refuses to engage in serious discussion and hides behind a killfile. (Tapioca also contains B17) Anth > >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >>From: "Anth" anon@anon.com [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > DrC PhD > >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 > For B17 to act as a cancer killer, it must be absorbed intact, transported [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > the cyanide kills them. Normal healathy cells, you see, have the needed > neutralizing enzyme. (and you are right - eating B17 with almonds is not a good idea) Anth Ann Intern Med 1978 Sep;89(3):389-97 The current status of laetrile. Dorr RT, Paxinos J Amygdalin at various concentrations and with numerous impurities is the most common cyanogenic glycoside found in laetrile samples. Its chemical properties were first described in 1837, and pharmacologic studies have shown that ultimately it is broken down to HCN, benzaldehyde, and glucose by enzymes found in gut bacteria but not intracellularly in humans. Fatal and nonfatal toxicities to orally ingested cyanogenic glycosides have been reported worldwide. We review here the signs and symptoms of acute cyanide toxicity and its treatment. Substantial in-vitro and in-vivo testing in animal tumor systems has shown that amygdalin is entirely devoid of significant anticancer activity. Control animals often have lived longer than those treated with various doses and schedules of amygdalin. Acceptable clinical studies in humans are lacking, but such ventures would appear to be contraindicated from animal studies and observed human toxicities. We also discuss current legal-judicial aspects of laetrile therapy for cancer. Publication Types: Historical article PMID: 356691, UI: 78255119 Pediatrics 1986 Aug;78(2):269-72 Cyanide poisoning from laetrile ingestion: role of nitrite therapy. Hall AH, Linden CH, Kulig KW, Rumack BH A 4-year-old child ingested laetrile and almost died of cyanide poisoning. Treatment with the Lilly cyanide antidote kit resulted in rapid, complete recovery. Extremely high whole blood cyanide levels were documented. The necessity for use of the antidote kit in serious cyanide poisoning has recently been questioned. This case demonstrates benefit from antidotal treatment. PMID: 2942834, UI: 86286401 So it can be poisonous? Anth >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >From: "Anth" anon@anon.com >Date: 8/12/04 3:24 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <SOWdncplK68c2IbcRVn-hA@nildram.net> >Ann Intern Med 1978 Sep;89(3):389-97 The current status of laetrile. Dorr >RT, Paxinos J First, be very suspicous of any data reported by main stream medicine about laetrile. The powers that rule such things have decided that laetrile is toxic and of no value. No credible scientist or medical person will publish anything to the contrary, nor would they be allowed to publish anything positive about laetrile. The FDA and the NIH are so stupid that that they spent nearly millions trying to get their chemists to show that the amyglalin would yield cyanide with acid or base treatment. It didn't and can't. Yet, they have convinced the public that it can. >So it can be poisonous? >Anth If you injest an excess even water can be considered poisonous. I doubt that human digestive enzymes can touch the amygdalin. Human digestive enzymes do their job by inserting a water molecule into our food to convert proteins to amino acids, carbohydrates to sugars, and fats to glycerol and free fatty acids. If the amygdalin is converted in the human gut, the human would first have to have the correct bacteria to do this in the gut. Secondly, the whole basis for the published book and the published research concerning laetrile is that normal healthy cells have rodenase ( dehydrogenase ? ) which detoxifies cyanide in the cells. Cancer cells, operating by fermentation routes, do not have this enzyme active. You will realize that these statements are in opposition to your quoted medical work. But then, I do not have the gold and I do not make up the rules of the game. DrC PhD Enjoyed your comments DrC. Again, lately I have been swallowing one peach pit (it is the size and shape of a thin almond) a day. I take it as a vitamin and for Vit B-17. I do not have cancer. I just wonder what other health benefits this may have. I'm sure it does no harm, esp in such small quantity. > Enjoyed your comments DrC. > > Again, lately I have been swallowing one peach pit (it is the size and shape of > a thin almond) a day. I take it as a vitamin and for Vit B-17. I do not have > cancer. I just wonder what other health benefits this may have. I'm sure it > does no harm, esp in such small quantity. R.I.G.H.T ... that little bit of cyanide has got to be good for you. To summerize: There is no such thing as Vitamin B-17. Laetrile has no use... and can be toxic. People who have ingested it have been shown to suffer from cyanide poisoning. To be sucked into ingesting poisonous pits shows a dearth of intelligence. > > Enjoyed your comments DrC. > > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > To be sucked into ingesting poisonous pits shows a dearth of intelligence. How bout you go into your lab, and extract this stuff from some pits. At least then you will be talking about something you KNOW, rather than what you have read. > > > Enjoyed your comments DrC. > > > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > least then you will be talking about something you KNOW, rather than what > you have read. http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/b/benjaminfr125395.html Experience is a great teacher... and for fools it is the ONLY teacher. http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/laetrile http://cis.nci.nih.gov/fact/9_3.htm > > > > Enjoyed your comments DrC. > > > > [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > > http://cis.nci.nih.gov/fact/9_3.htm Since you are so qualified, tell us what you found in your lab. >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >From: "HCN" hcn@nospam.com [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >R.I.G.H.T ... that little bit of cyanide has got to be good for you. R.I.G.H.T. A bit of mercury vapours are good for you. <snip> >People who have ingested it have been shown to suffer from cyanide >poisoning. People who have inhaled and swallowed mercury and vapours have been shown to suffer from mercuy poisoning. AND,,,,,,,,,, Peripheral neuropathy. >To be sucked into ingesting poisonous pits shows a dearth of intelligence. To be sucked into the LIES of organized medicine and dentistry, who believe the only safe place for mercury is IN the mouth is to be a fool. Jan http://www.navi.net/~rsc/cancer/121497.txt In one case discussed by Moertal during trials with an iso-amygdalin, a patient was eating sweet almonds while taking oral tablets, and suffered low order toxicity suggesting cyanide poisoning. This is because the sweet almonds are especially rich in beta-glucosidase, though lacking completely in amygdalin. They are probably the most highly hybridized food in the world, having been selected out thousands of years ago from the bitter almond. They used iso amygdalin in the trials which is useless! Anth > Enjoyed your comments DrC. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > it > does no harm, esp in such small quantity. > http://www.navi.net/~rsc/cancer/121497.txt > In one case discussed by Moertal during trials with an iso-amygdalin, a [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > They used iso amygdalin in the trials which is useless! > Anth As far as the human toxicity of laetrile is concerned, consider this posting on the web: The dosage levels and toxicity of amygdalin (laetrile) in laboratory animals and humans is well established and documented. No evidence of acute or accumulative toxicity was observed in any animals giving doses in excess of 100 times the maximum intravenous dose usually given in humans. These findings coincide with that mentioned by Otto Jacobsen in 1887, Davidson in 1944 and Dr. Dean Burk ( National Cancer Institute) in 1968: "Amygdalin is impressively nontoxic from the pharmacological point of view", and "non-hydrolyzed amygdalin is less toxic than glucose". The oral toxicity of amygdalin was found to be 39 to 44 times greater than the intramuscular route, and more toxic than intravenous route (parentenal route). Amygdalin is less tolerable by oral administration because of the hydrolysis of amygdalin by the gastric juices. On the other hand, amygdalin, in dosages of 20-40/mg/kg orally (for a 200 lb human this would translate to 16 - 500mg laetrile/B17 tablets, daily), used in humans, is 10 to 20 times less than the minimum toxic dosage in dogs. The biological half life of amygdalin is only 80 minutes. Over 80% of the amygdalin administered is excreted from the body in 4 hours. The usual metabolic approach to amygdalin (laetrile) therapy is to provide the patient with adequate nutritional support, with relatively nontoxic high doses of vitamins and minerals, and other active natural substances. Amygdalin (laetrile) has been administered in dosages of up to 70 grams (70,000 miligrams-mg) per day in adult humans by combined oral and parentenal routes without adverse effects. DrC PhD (and also the Hunza tribe eat apricot pits, drink its oil) That does it for me.. none toxic. Anth >> http://www.navi.net/~rsc/cancer/121497.txt >> In one case discussed by Moertal during trials with an iso-amygdalin, a [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > DrC PhD http://www.navi.net/~rsc/cancer/121497.txt [benzaldehyde-HCN-O-glucuronic acid] "I then proceeded to check up on this formula. There is no free Hydrocyanic acid or free cyanide present. It is firmly bound in the molecule. "I then hydrolyzed (broke up) the compound by boiling with HCl under a reflux. On testing for the components produced, I found Hydrocyanic acid, glucuronic acid and an aglycon moiety which seemed to be benzaldehyde. My analysis checked the formula given. "The compound can also be hydrolyzed by the enzyme B glucuronidase found in malignant tissue, thus liberating HCN at the site of the tumor. I hope this will answer your inquiry. Alexander A. Gettler, Ph.D." In other words they didn't find any free cyanide when they boiled Laetrile in HCL. Anth > >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >>From: "Anth" anon@anon.com [quoted text clipped - 53 lines] > > DrC PhD >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >From: "Anth" anon@anon.com >Date: 8/15/04 5:27 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <zPednaAappcky4LcRVn-vw@nildram.net> >"I then hydrolyzed (broke up) the compound by boiling with HCl under a >reflux. On testing for the components produced, I found Hydrocyanic acid, >glucuronic acid and an aglycon moiety which seemed to be benzaldehyde. Uhmmm, Anth, there seems to be problem here. First, HCN in a water solution is hydrocyanic acid. This is an acidic cyanide solution. Secondly, boiling the compound with HCL under a reflux would release all the HCN as a gas and none would be present in the water solution, provided it was even produced. Refer to how cyanide gas is produced in the death chamber. Sodium Cyanide, a solid, NaCN, is dropped into an acid solution and the HCN produced is released to kill the individual. > On testing for the components produced, I found Hydrocyanic acid, >glucuronic acid and an aglycon moiety which seemed to be benzaldehyde. To test for HCN, he would have had to test the distillate, not the mother liquor. Benzaldehyde smells like maracino cherries and is easily identified. >My >analysis checked the formula given. This does not read well to a chemist at all. Basically, you can boil an RCN, a true nitrile, with any acid you choose, and you will never get HCN, hydrocyanic acid. >"The compound can also be hydrolyzed by the enzyme B glucuronidase found >in malignant tissue, thus liberating HCN at the site of the tumor. I >hope this will answer your inquiry. Alexander A. Gettler, Ph.D. This is the key point. Only enzymatic hydrolysis liberates the HCN. Only those cells which can metabolize the HCN will survive. Cancer cells cannot, normal healthy, cells can. DrC PhD Looking through google groups, I noticed you posted :- http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=20010717051709.18389. 00003891%40ng-fl1.aol.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fq%3DNo,%2Bany%2Bacid%2Bwill%2Bdo %2Bthe%2Bjob.%2B%2BIt%27s%2Brather%2Bas%2Bin%2Bthe%2Bgas%2Bchamber.%2BNitriles%2 Bare%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26selm%3D20010717051709.18389.00003891%2540n g-fl1.aol.com%26rnum%3D1 Well, I can see why you are an MD. You would never have made it as a chemist. R-CN + HCL under normal physiological conditions will result in nothing, nada, no reaction. The R-CN bond is covalent and not ionic. Hydrolysis of this compound, if possible, would yield an amine at most. The R-CN bond in the body can only be broken by the action of enzymes. The use of the word cyanide when nitrile chemistry is involved is just more trickery on the part of those who wish to practice mind control, not to mention just plain stupidity. Dr. C. PhD. I noticed Dr Harris didn't answer your rebuttal, but posted a day later and continued the onslaught. Now this could be evidence that your argument is sound, who knows I have no way of verifying this? How can I verify this? (It would be nice if people actually admitted they were wrong in a post, just so people can have quick access to the truth) Cheers, Anth http://groups.google.com/groups?q=g:thl2674880611d&dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=9 j20gu%248lm%241%40slb7.atl.mindspring.net&rnum=51 It appears Dr Harris did rebute the comment, but I have no way of verifying yours or his rebuttal. Are there any organic chemists out there that can answer this (Other than Dr Cee?) ? Anth In theory if Dr Harris is correct I should be able to smell cyanide if I mix Laetrile with HCL. Alas I have neither... Anth > Looking through google groups, I noticed you posted :- > [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > Cheers, > Anth (Which I think is a moot point, surely I would suffer cyanide poisoning from mixing wheat grass juice with orange juice?) I'd appreciate a clear answer on this. Thanks Anth > In theory if Dr Harris is correct I should be able to smell cyanide if I > mix Laetrile with HCL. [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] >> Cheers, >> Anth http://www.navi.net/~rsc/nitrilo1.htm According to this article, HCN is rendered inert by the action of an enzyme in the body. Still would appreciate clarity on this. Anth > (Which I think is a moot point, surely I would suffer cyanide poisoning > from mixing wheat grass juice with orange juice?) > I'd appreciate a clear answer on this. > Thanks > Anth >(Which I think is a moot point, surely I would suffer cyanide poisoning from >mixing wheat grass juice with orange juice?) >I'd appreciate a clear answer on this. >Thanks >Anth No, you wouldn't die, but you'd still be a top-posting twit. >> In theory if Dr Harris is correct I should be able to smell cyanide if I >> mix Laetrile with HCL. >> Alas I have neither... >> Anth >> >>> Looking through google groups, I noticed you posted :- >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >From: "Anth" anon@anon.com >Date: 8/9/04 9:11 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <b8idnf2o4YW1P4rcRVn-vA@nildram.net> >Laetrile (B17) isn't cyanide, neither does it contain cyanide, Quite true. However, try to educate some of the goons here as to what a nitrile is. A nitrile is chemically, R-CN. A cyanide is chemically, M-CN R is an organic compound of your choice. M is any metal of your choice. R-CN is a nutrient. M-CN is a cyanide and will kill you. Totally different chemistry. DrC PhD ( and a PhD chemist ). Recently, porcine proteolytic enzymes were unequivocally demonstrated to have anti-cancer effects in mice with _transplanted_ tumours [1]. If you notice that on pages like Quackwatch, in the mice experiments where they used PPE in conjunction with Laetrile this is posted as proof Laetrile doesn't work! This proves that the experiments were either fraud or flawed. Also, Dr Manner quoted as trying the Laetrile + enzymes in mice from the NCI and SK with transplanted tumours and getting no effect. [2] This adds credence to the theory that the experiments were flawed, and also contradicts the PPE study done on Gonzalez enzymes (which were oral enzymes ) Also noted that Manning used the same protocol in spontaneous tumours (from non NCI and SK mice) and got an effect. (ebid) He also raises the hypothesis that the mice are to blame. DR MANNERS No. We decided to repeat what we had done, using their animals and their tumours, the laetrile and the doses they used, we repeated the experiments. And when we were done....and I don't know why it surprised me...we found exactly the same thing they had found....that laetrile when used in the experiments that were done by Sloane Kettering and NCI...was worthless. DR MANNERS We stopped and talked about it for several weeks. Two things emerged. One, there was the type of tumour we were using. We would buy the mice from Jackson laboratory up in Maine. These were healthy mice. They dined on Purina Lab-Chow formulated by nutritionists. I'm convinced if the American public ate like my mice we would have far less disease in this country. (1) http://www.dr-gonzalez.com/mice04_txt.htm (2) http://www.whale.to/cancer/manner.html Anth > >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >>From: "Anth" anon@anon.com [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > DrC PhD ( and a PhD chemist ). you wont get cancer from vitamin B17 deficiency but haven't read the other benefits of B17 > Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat the > kernel that inside the pit. It is the size and shape of a small almond. I do [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Vitamin B-17? Please no replies about: "quack cancer cure"...blah blah. I've > heard all that, and do not have cancer, not taking it for that reason. I know that it is used in the Oasis of Hope Hospital via IV drip along with other things. Anth > Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat > the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > I've > heard all that, and do not have cancer, not taking it for that reason. >Subject: Vitamin B-17 >From: melbatatum@wmconnect.com (MelbaTatum) >Date: 8/8/04 6:24 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <20040808092436.04880.00001844@mb-m24.wmconnect.com> >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat the >kernel that inside the pit. It is the size and shape of a small almond. I do >this to get the vitamin B17 also known as Laetril. For myself, I follow the old addage of "an apple a day keeps the money grubing doctor away." However, when I eat that apple, the only thing left is the woody stem that held it to the tree. I eat the skin, the pulp, the core and the seeds. >Please no replies about: "quack cancer cure"...blah blah. Epidemiology studies indicate that societies that ingest B-17 daily with their normal dietary develop less cancer to no cancer, depending upon what society you are looking at. However, on this site you will be cruely criticized, and hurt by whatever means the quack squad can find since the pharmaceutical industry has not found a way to commercialize B-17. DrC PhD. >Epidemiology studies indicate that societies that ingest B-17 daily >with their normal dietary develop less cancer to no cancer, depending >upon what society you are looking at. Reference? >However, on this site you will be cruely criticized, and hurt by >whatever means the quack squad can find since the pharmaceutical >industry has not found a way to commercialize B-17. Let's see your evidence that it's a vitamin. What are the deficiency symptoms? -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT) > >Subject: Vitamin B-17 > >From: melbatatum@wmconnect.com (MelbaTatum) [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > normal dietary develop less cancer to no cancer, depending upon what society > you are looking at. Try posting proof. > However, on this site you will be cruely criticized, and hurt by whatever means > the quack squad can find since the pharmaceutical industry has not found a way > to commercialize B-17. > > DrC PhD. >>Subject: Vitamin B-17 >>From: melbatatum@wmconnect.com (MelbaTatum) [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >normal dietary develop less cancer to no cancer, depending upon what society >you are looking at. Please post a URL for these epidemiological studies. >However, on this site you will be cruely criticized, and hurt by whatever >means >the quack squad can find since the pharmaceutical industry has not found a >way >to commercialize B-17. In other words, those forementioned studies exist only in Charles' Chalupa Infested mind. >DrC PhD. >on this site you will be cruelly criticized Yes, I instantly see who the big kooks are on these NGs (Probert, Anth, Wright, etc). Intrusive folks, like starlings in a puddle, seeking to butt into every Thread with their "received wisdom". > >on this site you will be cruelly criticized > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > every > Thread with their "received wisdom". Tee hee! Anth I'm only voicing my opinion that the substance may be toxic. Dr C has not posted one bit of evidence to state that the substance is safe orally, I have looked for safety, I even asked a few chemists if the substance could be split by the acids in the stomach and they said no. (His is an appeal to authority - his) Fair enough doctors do use the substance orally, but they also use a special diet which is designed to avoid toxicity. What can I say, it's your choice, if you want to take Laetrile, poke your fingers in your ears and believe what you want to believe then that's up to you, have you actually looked whether the substance is safe or potentially dangerous, if so you could post some material on here to accelerate other peoples decisions on the matter?. Anth > >on this site you will be cruelly criticized > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > every > Thread with their "received wisdom". >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >From: "Anth" anon@anon.com >Date: 8/14/04 3:44 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <W6OdnfMOGaODcIDcRVn-gg@nildram.net> >I'm only voicing my opinion that the substance may be toxic. >Dr C has not posted one bit of evidence to state that the substance is safe >orally, That is probably because I do not have specific and incontravertable data to support the statement. It is clear that many, many people, eat nitrile containing compounds daily as a part of their normal dietary. It is clear that many people injest nilrile containing compounds for cancer remision. It is clear that some people have had the nitriles put into their veins. All of this with no fatalities. This suggests that the compounds are not all that toxic, especially when consumed in their natural state. The concept of toxicity relates to the ability to metabolize any CN released. As long as the eater does not exceed his ability to metabolize any CN released, there is no toxicity. DrC PhD DrC PhD well then whats the big deal? check the study on the hunza,and all those that have been cured ,if you want data let me know? >>Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >>From: "Anth" anon@anon.com [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > >DrC PhD >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >From: "Anth" anon@anon.com >Date: 8/14/04 3:44 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <W6OdnfMOGaODcIDcRVn-gg@nildram.net> >Subject: Re: Vitamin B-17 >From: "Anth" anon@anon.com >Date: 8/14/04 3:44 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <W6OdnfMOGaODcIDcRVn-gg@nildram.net> >I'm only voicing my opinion that the substance may be toxic. >Dr C has not posted one bit of evidence to state that the substance is safe >orally, I I just happened to think, what is the published toxicity data? What is the LD50 for example? Surely this must have been studied. DrC PhD >>on this site you will be cruelly criticized > >Yes, I instantly see who the big kooks are on these NGs (Probert, >Anth, Wright, etc). Intrusive folks, like starlings in a puddle, >seeking to butt into every Thread with their "received wisdom". Ooh, aren't we touchy? I merely commented that there is no such thing as B-17, which is true. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT) > >on this site you will be cruelly criticized > > Yes, I instantly see who the big kooks are on these NGs (Probert, Anth, Wright, > etc). Intrusive folks, like starlings in a puddle, seeking to butt into every > Thread with their "received wisdom". I do not butt into every thread. Just the ones where the lies are. Do not blame me if alt medi is founded on a pile of lies. >Each day, I eat one peach (minus the skin). Then I crack the seed and eat the >kernel that inside the pit. It is the size and shape of a small almond. I do [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Vitamin B-17? Please no replies about: "quack cancer cure"...blah blah. I've >heard all that, and do not have cancer, not taking it for that reason. hi just joined this site and noticed your question,and your going to get positive on the health food end and negative on the medical end,the reason for the medical end being pesamistic is that it dosent pay to cure cancer,its more profit to have sombody with cancer than with out,they did studies on the hunza that represent a poulation that has been cancer free for over 900 years, there nateral diet which supplies on the average between 50-and 75mgs of b-17 a day,hunzaland is a land where described as a place where apricot is staple, 4 3 months during the grow season,then dried for the rest,the proof is in the pudding,also dozens of people in the western end,at stage 1 and 2 have completley been cured,not going into detail isnt probably the best thing i could do,but i would be writing all day,belive what you want,but the medical and pharmisutical proffessions have gone as far as lying about b-17 because they dont want you to know?would you with billions of dollars at steak?with a cure,or at very least a prventative?how long have we been able to do without fossil fules?you decide my friend,let the dollars be your guide,like for them all,allways have..curt. |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2009 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.