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Medical Forum / General / Alternative / June 2008

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The LYING Wakefield and Thimerosal!

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Citizen Jimserac - 29 Jun 2008 14:25 GMT
Comment from Mark Probert:

" No, they did not, and the reason was quite simple (I keep it simple
for simpletons). There was no need to. Thimerosal removal was based on
the concerns that there would be a decrease in uptake, like that in
England caused by the corrupt and lying Wakefield, which would cause a
resurgence of the diseases. In England, that did happen, and the CDC &
FDA were justly concerned. "

Does anyone know what this is about before I start
googling?

Thanks
Citizen Jimserac
Peter Parry - 29 Jun 2008 20:08 GMT
>" No, they did not, and the reason was quite simple (I keep it simple
>for simpletons). There was no need to. Thimerosal removal was based on
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>Does anyone know what this is about before I start
>googling?

Andrew Wakefield, a Canadian trained surgeon, was employed as a reader
in experimental gastroenterology at London's Royal Free Hospital.  He
was lead author on a 1998 study which reported bowel symptoms and the
presence of measles virus in a selected sample of twelve vaccinated
children diagnosed with autism spectrum disorders and other
disabilities.  Although it was not mentioned in the study Wakefield
called a press conference at which he announced, rather to the
surprise of his co-authors,  that the cause of autism was possibly MMR
and individual vaccines rather than MMR should be given.  

The inevitable furore caused a significant drop in MMR uptake.
Subsequently it was revealed that Wakefield was being paid large sums
by solicitors for parents in the process of suing the manufacturers of
MMR vaccine and the children concerned were children of some of those
parents.  He had also patented a "safer" single measles virus vaccine
a short time before the report was published.

10 of the reports 13 authors subsequently withdrew their names from
the study and the Lancet, which had published the study, withdrew it
when they became aware of the conflict of interest.

Later it was proven that actually no measles virus had been detected
during the study so its conclusions were unjustified.  The samples
used for  tests carried out by Dr O'Leary in Dublin were contaminated
in his laboratory (which has since closed) and  this contamination
mislead the researchers.

In his study Wakefield also suppressed evidence from Dr. Stephen
Bustin, probably the worlds leading expert on work of the type carried
out at O'Learys commercial laboratory, which showed an absence of
measles virus in gut samples he analysed for Wakefield.  Only after
Bustins negative findings did Wakefield use O'Leary (who was also
carrying out work for the same solicitors paying Wakefield).

In 2001 Wakefield resigned from the Royal Free and moved to America
where he worked at the self-styled International Child Development
Resource Center in Melbourne, Florida, as "director of research".
ICDRC sell various "nutritional supplements" which "supports brain
health at a cellular level" as treatments for autism.  

Subsequently he participated in starting the Thoughtful House Center
for Children in Texas where he is currently Executive Director, still
selling "nutritional supplements" and earning considerably more than
he ever did in London.

He is currently subject to and part way through a disciplinary hearing
by the UK General Medical Council for suppressing and falsifying data
in his study as well as mistreating the children in the initial study.
Mark Probert - 29 Jun 2008 20:54 GMT
> On Sun, 29 Jun 2008 06:25:42 -0700 (PDT), Citizen Jimserac
>
[quoted text clipped - 57 lines]
> by the UK General Medical Council for suppressing and falsifying data
> in his study as well as mistreating the children in the initial study.

Good summary, Peter. You negelcted to mention that Wakefield was told
that the samples had been contaminated, and theefore useless, before
he had the press conference, but, went ahead anyway with it.

Further, Jimmy is none too bright, and I do not know if he realizes
that 'solicitor' is the English version of 'lawyer'.

Wakefield also admitted that he paid kids for samples.
Citizen Jimserac - 30 Jun 2008 00:01 GMT
> > On Sun, 29 Jun 2008 06:25:42 -0700 (PDT), CitizenJimserac
>
[quoted text clipped - 66 lines]
>
> Wakefield also admitted that he paid kids for samples.

This is a complete disgrace.

I can't understand why he hasn't
been summarily kicked out immediately.

And yes I knew what solicitor is.

Citizen Jimserac
Jan Drew - 30 Jun 2008 03:18 GMT
On Jun 29, 3:08 pm, Peter Parry <pe...@wpp.ltd.uk> wrote:
> On Sun, 29 Jun 2008 06:25:42 -0700 (PDT), Citizen Jimserac
>
[quoted text clipped - 57 lines]
> by the UK General Medical Council for suppressing and falsifying data
> in his study as well as mistreating the children in the initial study.

Good summary, Peter. You negelcted to mention that Wakefield was told
that the samples had been contaminated, and theefore useless, before
he had the press conference, but, went ahead anyway with it.

Further, Jimmy is none too bright, and I do not know if he realizes
that 'solicitor' is the English version of 'lawyer'.

Wakefield also admitted that he paid kids for samples.

http://www.niaid.nih.gov/facts­heets/thimerosalqa.htm

Infectious Diseases (NIAID); The American Academy of Pediatrics; and vaccine
manufacturers agreed that thimerosal should be reduced or eliminated in
vaccines as a precautionary measure and to reduce exposure to mercury from
all sources. This decision was based on the various Federal guidelines for
methyl mercury exposure and the assumption that the health risks from methyl
and ethyl mercury were the same. More research is needed to determine if the
guidelines for methyl mercury are also appropriate guidelines for
thimerosal. NIAID thimerosal research focuses on better understanding what
happens to thimerosal once it is introduced in the body and how this
compares to current knowledge of methyl mercury pathways.

http://www.anomalous-images.com/news/news473.html

Thursday July 8 5:49 PM ET
Mercury to be removed from vaccines
NEW YORK, Jul 08 (Reuters Health) -- The US Public Health Service (PHS) and
the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) have asked vaccine manufacturers to
phase out a mercury-containing preservative that has been used in some
vaccines since the 1940s.
The preservative, thimerosal, has not been shown to harm children, but some
infants under age 6 months may be exposed to mercury levels in excess of
federal guidelines with the current recommended immunization schedule.
However, ``children who have received thimerosal-containing vaccines do not
need to be tested for mercury exposure,'' according to a joint AAP/PHS
statement.
Health officials advise parents to continue their children's immunization
programs, because the risk of not immunizing children far outweighs the
small risk posed by thimerosal.
``Terrible childhood diseases like whooping cough, bacterial meningitis,
polio and diphtheria are waiting for us to let our guard down,'' according
to a statement issued by Dr. David Satcher, the US. Surgeon General. ``The
risk of devastating childhood diseases from failure to vaccinate far
outweighs the minimal, if any, risk of exposure to cumulative levels of
mercury in vaccines.''
The joint AAP/PHS statement on thimerosal in vaccines appears in the July
9th Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report (MMWR), the weekly publication of
the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) in Atlanta, Georgia.
Stories from the MMWR are available at the CDC website, www.cdc.gov.
The report's authors note that European regulatory community reached similar
conclusions earlier this year.
In a statement, the Pharmaceutical Research and Manufacturers of America
(PhRMA) note that while there is currently ``no clinical evidence that the
use of thimerosal has caused adverse health consequences, there is general
consensus that it would be preferable to eliminate thimerosal from vaccines
whenever possible. The vaccine industry is working closely with FDA and
other government agencies to meet this objective.''

http://www.vaccinationnews.com/DailyNews/2003/June/10/ENewsSafeMindsR...

E-NEWS FROM THE NATIONAL VACCINE INFORMATION CENTER

Vienna, Virginia                                    http://www.909shot.com

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

   UNITED WAY/COMBINED FEDERAL CAMPAIGN

                #9119

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

"Protecting the health and informed consent rights of children since 1982."

=============================================================

The American Academy of Pediatrics has issued a critique of the Geiers'

paper on thimerosal. It can be accessed at

http://www.cispimmunize.org/pro/pdf/Geiersummary.pdf .

-------------------------------------------

Safe Minds Commentary on AAP Critique of Geier & Geier Thimerosal Paper

The American Academy of Pediatrics negative response to the Geier &

Geier article linking thimerosal in DTPs to autism and speech disorders

(http://www.cispimmunize.org/pro/pdf/Geiersummary.pdf) is not surprising

given the AAP's central role in promoting childhood immunizations.  In

an effort to clear thimerosal in vaccines of any role in

neurodevelopmental disorders when studies establishing thimerosal's

safety do not exist, the AAP relies on a number of distortions and

inaccuracies. Many points made in the response would need to be answered

by Drs. Geier & Geier, but several should be addressed immediately.

(a) The AAP paper asserts that the VAERS data base is only valid for

hypothesis generation. If so, then at the very least the Geiers' paper

should be viewed by the AAP as advancing a strong hypothesis. If they

were truly unbiased, the AAP should be asking for follow up controlled

trials to be initiated immediately to see if the hypothesis is true

rather than dismissing it out of hand.  Moreover, it is the AAP's own

members who do such a poor job of reporting adverse events to VAERS. If

the AAP were sincerely interested in vaccine safety investigations, they

could improve the quality of VAERS dramatically by requiring their

members to report.

(b) The AAP paper says "(Note: neither the original preliminary VSD

study of thimerosal and neurodevelopmental disorders nor any of the

follow-up expanded studies identified a "signal" indicating any

association between thimerosal and autism.)" This is simply not true.

The first VSD analysis gave a relative risk for autism of 2.48. The VSD

thimerosal study protocol, written by the authors before results were

in, clearly states that a RR higher than 2.0, even if not statistically

significant, constitutes a signal which should be investigated in a

phase II study that would confirm or not confirm the association. This

phase II study has never been initiated by CDC. In fact, there are no

"expanded" VSD studies - the CDC merely divided up the data sets from

the HMOs studied, which resulted in insufficient numbers of cases to

reach statistical significance for any given HMO.

(c) The AAP says: "Research to date involving refined, controlled

studies in large populations of patients has failed to demonstrate any

association between vaccines that may have used thimerosal as a

preservative and neurodevelopmental disorders including autism." Again,

this statement is false. There are no large controlled studies which

have investigated thimerosal and developmental disorders. (The VSD

analysis was a retrospective cohort study.)

(d) The AAP critique explains that any study on this topic "must be

published in respected and widely read journals because of the great

general interest today in vaccine safety." Yet they go on to cite the

recently published review by Nelson and Bauman in their own newsletter

which they assert "casts doubt on the biologic plausibility of symptom

similarities between mercury poisoning and autism." The Nelson and

Bauman commentary was an invited article and was not subjected to peer

review.

(e) In what appears to be a Freudian slip, the AAP says "the Centers for

Disease Control and Prevention, American Academy of Pediatrics, National

Institutes of Health, and US Public Health Service have continued to

investigate this issue to put theoretic concerns about this

mercury-containing compound to rest." It is hoped that these agencies

would be investigating this issue to find out the truth, not to lay the

issue to rest. The fact that these agencies have every reason to conduct

research with a hidden agenda is the reason why investigations of

thimerosal and vaccine safety need to be conducted by unbiased

researchers with no conflicts of interest.

(f) The AAP does admit that "Comparing the occurrence of late onset,

chronic conditions like autism by using acute vaccine reactions like

fever, pain, and vomiting...as controls makes no sense as a measure of

relative adverse event rates." Given that late onset, chronic conditions

are very different from immediate, acute ones, perhaps the AAP could

voice support for requiring vaccine safety trials by manufacturers to

extend beyond the current practice of 60 days and to include monitoring

of chronic conditions. Then parents might have more confidence in the

never-ending assurances by the public health authorities that vaccines

are indeed safe.

Sallie Bernard

Safe Minds

http://www.autismwebsite.com/ari/vaccine/thimerosalreferences.htm

The Vaccine-Autism Connection - Part I (Thimerosal)
Read and download an Adobe Acrobat (pdf) file

BERNARD RIMLAND, Ph.D., Director

April, 2004

Partial list of studies linking thimerosal to Autism

The Centers for Disease Control and the American Academy of Pediatrics have
issued a statement asserting that "the available scientific evidence has not
shown thimerosal-containing vaccines to be harmful."   Their statement is
false.   Following are some of the scientific studies that demonstrate
thimerosal, a mercury-containing substance that is used as a preservative,
to be harmful and to be a highly probably causal factor in autism.  Note
that these studies are consistently ignored in the medical establishment's
publications claiming that there is no evidence for vaccine-caused autism.

Bernard S, Enayati A, Redwood L, Roger H, Binstock T.   Autism: a novel form
of mercury poisoning. Med. Hypotheses. 2001 Apr;56(4):462-71. PMID: 11339848

Geier DA, Geier MR. An assessment of the impact of thimerosal on childhood
neurodevelopmental disorders. Pediatr Rehabil. 2003 Apr-Jun;6(2):97-102.
PMID: 14534046

Geier MR, Geier DA.   Neurodevelopmental disorders after
thimerosal-containing vaccines: a brief communication. Exp Biol Med
(Maywood). 2003 Jun;228(6):660-4.    PMID: 12773696

Geier & Geier. Parents' worries about thimerosal in vaccines are well
founded! http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/eletters/112/6/1394

David Baskin, M.D. et al.   Thimerosal induces DNA breaks, caspase-3
activation, membrane damage, and cell death in cultured human neurons and
fibroblasts. Toxicol Sci. 2003 Aug;74(2):361-8. Epub 2003 May 28.   PMID:
12773768

Mady Hornig, M.D Etiologic factors and pathogenesis of autism: evidence from
clinical studies and animal models. IOM presentation, Feb 9 2004 Audio only:
http://www.iom.edu/view.asp?id=19108

Richard C. Deth, Ph.D. Effects of Mercury on Methionine Synthase:
Implications for Disordered Methylation in Autism   DAN! 2003 Philadelphia -
paper

Richard C. Deth, Ph.D.   A Link Between Thimerosal and the Brain: Can
Vaccines Affect Central Nervous System Function?   Molecular Psychiatry
2004, Volume 9.

Vojdani A, Pangborn JB et al.   Infections, toxic chemicals and dietary
peptides binding to lymphocyte receptors and tissue enzymes are major
instigators of autoimmunity in autism. Int J Immunopathol Pharmacol. 2003
Sep-Dec;16(3):189-99. PMID: 14611720

Jeff Bradstreet, M.D. A Case-control Study of Mercury Burden in Children
with Autistic Disorders and Measles Virus Genomic RNA in Cerebrospinal Fluid
in Children with Regressive Autism.   IOM presentation, Feb 9, 2004
Slides: http://www.iom.edu/CMS/3793/4705/17047/18065.aspx

Valsamakis A et al. style='mso-bidi-font-style:italic'>Altered virulence of
vaccine strains of measles virus after prolonged style='mso-bidi-font-style:
italic'>replication in human tissue. J Virol.  1999 73(10): 8791-7. PMID
10482633 http://jvi.asm.org/cgi/reprint/73/10/8791.pdf

The CDC's original findings before the CDC began to manipulate the data,
obtained via the Freedom of Information Act: High risk values for thimerosal
injections and a range of neurologic problems, including ADHD, tics,
language problems, and autism.
http://factsformedia.com/factsformedia/thimerosalstudy.pdf

Excerpts from CDC's in-house conference: Thimerosal sequelae
http://www.nationalautismassociation.org/library/IOM%20Simpsonwood%20in%20bold.pdf

Congressman, Dr. Weldon's letter to the CDC director, available at:
http://momsonamissionforautism.org/Autism_Central/Dr_Weldon_Responds.shtml

Institute of Medicine presentation of Congressman Dave Weldon, M.D.
 http://www.nationalautismassociation.org/pdf/Weldon.pdf

Geier MR, Geier DA. Autism and thimerosal-containing vaccines: analysis of
the Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System (VAERS). IOM presentation, Feb
9, 2004.
 Slides: http://www.iom.edu/view.asp?id=18392
Audio: http://www.iom.edu/view.asp?id=19120

David Baskin, M.D. Relation of Neurotoxic Effects of Thimerosal to Autism.
IOM presentation, Feb 9, 2004.
Audio only: http://www.iom.edu/view.asp?id=19124
D. C. Sessions - 29 Jun 2008 20:15 GMT
> Comment from Mark Probert:
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> Does anyone know what this is about before I start
> googling?

Of course we do.  The difference is that we find out about
a subject *before* lecturing on it.

| "Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against |
|  unintelligible propositions. Ideas must be distinct   |
|  before reason can act on them" -- Thomas Jefferson    |
+-------- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---------+
Citizen Jimserac - 30 Jun 2008 00:00 GMT
> In message <ea3a8982-ed7a-4930-a20c-c8e2fc22d...@k37g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, CitizenJimseracwrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> Of course we do.  The difference is that we find out about
> a subject *before* lecturing on it.

I wasn't lecturing on it, merely asking.

Unless, that is, you have made YOURSELF
watchdog of the entire newsgroup and consider
yourself the self-appointed monitor?

I assure you no such position exists and you
need to curb your delusions of grandeur,
o great paragon of well-informedness.

Citizen Jimserac
Mark Probert - 29 Jun 2008 20:56 GMT
> Comment from Mark Probert:
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> Does anyone know what this is about before I start
> googling?

studying a Google U?

I guess this is acknowledgement on your part that you are not
officially hunting me. That has always been a mistake.
Citizen Jimserac - 30 Jun 2008 00:03 GMT
> On Jun 29, 9:25 am, CitizenJimserac<Jimse...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> I guess this is acknowledgement on your part that you are not
> officially hunting me. That has always been a mistake.

HUNTING YOU???

Are you daft?

Don't get carried away with delusions of self
importance.  Your posts occasionally have
some elements of interest in them, sometimes,
as in this case, even are correct.

Citizen Jimserac
Peter Bowditch - 29 Jun 2008 21:44 GMT
>Comment from Mark Probert:
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>Does anyone know what this is about before I start
>googling?

If you mean "what was Wakefield about", look at
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/ausscience0404.htm

>Thanks
>Citizen Jimserac

Signature

Peter Bowditch aa #2243
The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au
Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au
To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

Citizen Jimserac - 30 Jun 2008 00:04 GMT
> CitizenJimserac<Jimse...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Comment from Mark Probert:
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> --

Yes, found out from Proby's en passant mention
and Parry's explanation.   Completely disgraceful.

One would think there was enough wrong with
vaccinations without needing to invent nonsense.
Perhaps Wakefield should go into anti-Homeopathy,
he'd fit right in there.

Citizen Jimserac
Jan Drew - 30 Jun 2008 03:36 GMT
III. MECHANISMS, SOURCES & EPIDEMIOLOGY OF EXPOSURE

>> Sallie Bernard*, Albert Enayati, B.S., Ch.E., M.S.M.E., Heidi Roger,
>> Teresa
>> Binstock, Lyn Redwood, R.N., M.S.N., C.R.N.P., Woody McGinnis, M.D.

>> Given that ethylmercury is equally neurotoxic as methylmercury (Magos et
>> al,
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
>> to its inorganic irreversibly-bound form, which has greater
>> neurotoxicity.

>> Peter replied:

>> LadyLollipop" <LadyLolli...@insightbb.com> wrote:
>>>Take a good look at the references here.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>>>Teresa
>>>Binstock, Lyn Redwood, R.N., M.S.N., C.R.N.P., Woody McGinnis, M.D.

>> Take a good look at the list of anti-vaccination liars above and then
>> you can safely ...

>> <snip remaining bullshit>

>> ===

>> Peter skipped right over the***** references of the facts******.

>> The list of people merely put these facts together. They did NOT write
>> them.

>> Peter calls them anti-vaccination liars.

>> The facts also prove Peter is wrong and DR Boyd Haley is correct.

>> This is an excellent example of exactly how organized medicine and
>> dentistry works.

>> They LIE and claim others and lying.

>> They trash. They have NO regard for anything except protecting the LIES
>> that have been believed for years.

>> Causing much SUFFERING.

>> This is E. V. I. L.

>> Jan

http://dir.salon.com/story/news/feature/2005/06/16/thimerosal/index_np.html
*A professor of chemistry deliberately talks about two different chemical
compounds (ethylmercury and methylmercury) as if they are interchangeable
and have identical properties*.

That is a LIE.

Dr Haley said NO such thing.

He said:

(methylmercury, ethylmercury, thimerosal dental amalgams, Hg vapor, Hg2+,
etc.) have been reported to be extremely toxic.

He is absolutely correct.

Ethylmercury has also been shown, like methylmercury, to accumulate in the
brain and causes tissue damage methylmercury, to accumulate in the brain and
causes tissue damage

Like methylmercury, ethylmercury is toxic to the brain and crosses the
blood-brain barrier. (9)  "Higher-dose exposure to ethylmercury from
Thimerosal results in toxicity comparable to that observed after high-dose
exposure to methylmercury."

Dr. Haley wrote:

Ethylmercury is extremely neurotoxic, killing neurons at 10-25 nanomolar
levels. For your information the vaccine is 125,000 nanomolar in thimerosal
and injecting one vaccine (12.5 micrograms) into one 4-6lbs infant would
represent a very toxic exposure. Furhter, unlike many elements (N,O,C, etc.)
Hg has no known usefulness in biological systems, being toxic to them all.
Also, all occurring forms of Hg (methylmercury, ethylmercury, thimerosal
dental amalgams, Hg vapor, Hg2+, etc.) have been reported to be extremely
toxic.

Here is what Peter Said:

A professor of chemistry deliberately talks about two different chemical
compounds (ethylmercury and methylmercury) as if they are interchangeable
and have identical properties.

That is a LIE.

Dr Haley said NO such thing.

He said:

(methylmercury, ethylmercury, thimerosal dental amalgams, Hg vapor, Hg2+,
etc.) have been reported to be extremely toxic.

He is absolutely correct.

Ethylmercury has also been shown, like methylmercury, to accumulate in the
brain and causes tissue damage methylmercury, to accumulate in the brain and
causes tissue damage

Like methylmercury, ethylmercury is toxic to the brain and crosses the
blood-brain barrier. (9)  "Higher-dose exposure to ethylmercury from
Thimerosal results in toxicity comparable to that observed after high-dose
exposure to methylmercury."

http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/thi-table.htm

Thimerosal is approximately 50% Hg by weight

http://www.fda.gov/cber/vaccine/thimerosal.htm#thi

Thimerosal, which is approximately 50% mercury by weight

http://www.talkinternational.com/

     Report on Mercury Toxicity from Dental Amalgams and Thimerosal
     Presented to Congressional Hearing 8 May 2003

     Presented By Boyd E. Haley, Ph.D.
     Professor and Chairman of the Department of Chemistry
     University of Kentucky
     Lexington, KY 50606-005

     In developing an opinion on mercury toxicity from exposures to dental
amalgam and thimerosal I have reviewed toxicologic data relevant to animal
and human studies to environmental mercury, methylmercury, thimerosal and
exposure to mercury from amalgam fillings. I have reviewed literature
searches conducted on various computerized databases; evaluated published
literature on primary studies as referenced in part herein. I have reviewed
relevant unpublished reports, consulted review articles, where appropriate,
and held working meetings with experts in the field. I have also conducted
experiments in my laboratory at the University of Kentucky with regards to
the enzyme and cellular toxicity of both dental amalgams and thimerosal,
including vaccine with and without thimerosal added as a preservative. In
addition, I have reviewed evaluations and conclusions of various
governmental agencies, including the International Agency for Research on
Cancer (IARC), the World Health Organization (WHO), the National Institute
of Health (NIH), the United States Environmental Protection Agency (EPA),
and other groups regarding this issue. I have come to the following
conclusions.

     1. Mercury is the most toxic, non-redioactive elements known to man.
Virtually every industry has either reduced or banned the use of mercury
with the exception of dentistry. Dental amalgam is approximately 50% mercury
by weight. Each amalgam typically has between half of a gram to a gram of
mercury. A typical person having between 5 and 15 amalgams, would have
several grams of mercury implanted in his or her mouth. This amount is
colossal using any standard. I am aware of no other situation today where
grams of mercury are implanted in any human being. In fact, in the
healthcare industry, mercury has been all but banned.

     2. The concentration of thimerosal in vaccines that contain this agent
as a preservative is approximately 125,000 nanomolar. In our studies pure
thimerosal shows toxicity to neurons in culture at 10 to 20 nanomolar, a
12,500 to 6,250 dilution factor. Calculations, using a conservative
approach, demonstrate that vaccinations of infants exposed them to
concentrations of thimerosal that could biologically injure them, especially
if they were exceptionally susceptible to mercury toxicity due to genetic
predisposition, other concurrent toxic exposures (e.g. to lead, elemental
mercury, cadmium, etc.) further, our research has shown that thimerosal,
which releases the toxic agent ethylmercury, inhibits the same brain enzymes
as does Hg2+. Therefore, multiple exposures from dental amalgams, food, and
vaccines are all capable of adding to the toxic load of these infants.

     3. Further, we need to emphasize that humans are not rats in a
pristine cage, being fed chow that is tested to be free of other toxic
agents. Humans are exposed to numerous toxic agents that may act in a
synergistic fashion to enhance the toxicity of other toxicants. That is, and
this is well established, low levels of lead will greatly enhance the
toxicity of mercury. It is well known that levels of lead previously thought
to be non-toxic are now associated with decreased mental abilities in
children. Could it be that this lead is enhancing the toxicity of mercury
exposures from dental amalgams and vaccines?

     4. The position of organized dentistry, primarily the American Dental
Association (ADA), that "no valid scientific evidence exists that dental
amalgam poses any health risk-other than rare, localized allergic
reactions," is, in my opinion, indefensible in the light of huge amounts of
published science. The major basis I have heard for the ADA stand is the
finding of "expert committees" within the dental branch of the FDA and WHO.
I looked up the members of these committees and have serious concerns about
who the ADA classifies as "expert" that served on these committees. In my
opinion, there was a severe paucity of relevant research publications on
mercury toxicity by members of these committees. The ADA stand is especially
weak if one considers the recent National Academy of Sciences and EPA
reports implying that 8 to 10% of American women of child bearing age have
blood levels of mercury that put any child they give birth to at risk for
having neurological problems. Also, a plethora of peer reviewed, published,
scientific studies and articles completely refute the evaluation of the ADA
regarding amalgam safety. Frankly, outside of the Journal of the American
Dental Association or JADA, the ADA's trade journal, which is not a refereed
scientific journal, but solely a trade journal, scientific consensus is
completely contrary to the ADA's position (note that the ADA escapes
adjudication by claiming to be a trade organization with no responsibility
to public health.) The fact is that there are no solid, refereed
publications showing that mercury is not significantly emitted from dental
amalgams. On the contrary, there are several showing significant emissions
of mercury from dental amalgams. In the one JADA article (Saxe, et al. JADA
Alzheimer's Disease, Dental Amalgam and Mercury, V130, p191, 1999) it is
claimed that amalgams are not related to brain Hg levels. I have several
design and scientific criticism of this paper, which I will not go into
here. However, in this same paper there is a histogram that shows that about
6% of the subjects had mercury brain levels above 1 micromolar levels and
about 15% had brain levels above 0.5 micromolar levels. Therefore, roughly 6
to 15% of Americans, on the day they die, have what any competent
neurologist or neurochemists or toxicologist would call severely toxic
levels of mercury. These levels are about 1,000 times that needed to cause
neurons to die in culture. Therefore, one needs to ask the questions "where
does this mercury come from and why does it exist in brain tissues at such
high levels." I seriously doubt that the major cause is eating seafood for
85 year old AD subjects. The cause is obvious exposures from known sources
(amalgams, food and vaccines) and the reason it collects in certain
individuals is because they cannot effectively excrete mercury due to
genetic susceptibilities or presence of other toxicants (lead, pesticides,
etc.) or loss of cellular protection due to advanced age or disease. Perhaps
this same phenomena accounts for the 22,000 times normal level of mercury in
the heart tissues of children who die with Idiopathic Dilated Cardiomyopathy
(Frustaci et al., J. American College of Cardiology, v33#6, p1578, 1000.)
This latter issue alone should make Congress consider a ban on mercury in
dentistry and medicine.

     5. Dental amalgam emits dangerous levels of mercury. In fact,
according to a 1991 WHO report, dental amalgam constitutes the major human
exposure to mercury.1 Grams of mercury are in the mouth of individuals with
several amalgam fillings. Also, the level of blood and urine mercury
positively correlates with the number of amalgam fillings.2 It would be
quite informative to require that the American Medical Association (AMA) be
required to evaluate the state of mercury toxicity caused by dental amalgams
and make a report regarding this issue. The lack of AMA support for the ADA
contention on amalgam safety says something.

     6. Careful evaluation of the amount of mercury emitted from a commonly
used dental amalgam in a test tube with 10 ml of water was presented in an
article entitled "Long-term Dissolution of Mercury from a
Non-Mercury-Releasing Amalgam."3 This study showed that "the overall mean
release of mercury was 43.5 ± 3.2 micrograms per cm2 /day, and the amount
remained fairly constant during the duration of the experiments (2 years.)"
This was without pressure, heat or galvanism as would have occurred if the
amalgams were in a human mouth. To be fair, this amalgam contained about 66%
mercury compared to about 50% in most amalgams in use. The importance of
this publication is that the discovery of the tremendous amount of mercury
released from this amalgam material was not discovered by NIDCR, FDA, ADA,
CDC or any other American research group. It came from the University of
Singapore. Why hasn't the ADA or FDA or DCD done similar studies on every
amalgam preparation used in the USA today? In my laboratory we have done
this on several aged amalgams made from one conventional, widely used
amalgam company. The results indicated that about 4.5 micrograms Hg/cm2/ day
was released without abrasion, but this increased to about 47
micrograms/cm2/day with two 30 second brushings with a toothbrush.
Therefore, the question remains, who is protecting the American public from
adverse exposures to mercury? It appears as if those who should be doing
this job are failing to do so. Having an unbiased research group repeat the
study above on all ADA approved amalgam materials would be very informative
and I strongly recommend that this be done even though doing this is was not
supported by the ADA spokesperson at a past Congressional hearing on this
issue.

     Recent research has shown that the birth hair of normal children
increase in mercury content with increasing dental amalgams in the birth
mother (A. Holmes, M. Blaxill and B. Haley, Reduced Levels of Mercury in the
First Baby Haircuts of Autistic Children, in press, International J.
Toxicology v22#4, 2003.) In contrast, autistic children have much lower
levels of mercury in their birth hair, yet due to numerous reports have
elevated mercury in their bodies on mercury challenge testing. This strongly
indicates that a subset of the population does not have the ability to
excrete mercury even if it is from low chronic daily exposure from dental
amalgam.

     7. Furthermore, due to the substantial amounts of mercury in amalgams,
it is the number of amalgams that controls the amount of mercury exposure
and this is likely not significantly affected by the length of time each
amalgam is in the mouth.4 Put another way, since each large amalgam (i.e.
those with 0.5 and 1.0 grams of mercury) contains between 500,000 to
1,000,000 micrograms of mercury, and if mercury were estimated to be
released at a high rate of 10 micrograms a day from each amalgam, it would
take between 137 and 274 years before any individual amalgam is completely
depleted of its mercury content. A small amalgam with 0.1 grams of mercury
would take 27.4 years for depletion at this rate. Also, there is a high
variance which is influenced by the surface area of the amalgam, its copper
content, its location and the individual's eating and grinding habits, and
rate of acidity, as noted herein. However, even at very conservative
estimates, these figures equate to a substantial amount of chronic
(continuous, daily) mercury exposure over a sustained, prolonged period of
time. I think it is imperative that the ADA provide detailed research that
demonstrates that amalgams MADE OUTSIDE THE MOUTH DO NOT RELEASE MERCURY ON
REASONABLE ABRASION AS WOULD BE EXPECTED ON CHEWING FOOD OR DRINKING HOT
DRINKS. The ADA and other supporters of amalgam refuse to do these studies
or fund these studies even though several refereed journal reports list
solutions in which amalgams have been soaked as "severely cytotoxic."

     8. About 80% of the mercury vapor from amalgams is readily taken up by
the human body and distributed to various organs. Very little, if any, of
the mercury vapors are exhaled; the vapors as well as mercury particles are
absorbed into the lungs and body tissues. Through the lungs, for instance,
mercury enters the bloodstream where it has access to all of the major
organs; of particular concern are the kidneys and the central nervous
system.5 For example, studies have been performed where amalgams containing
radioactive mercury were placed in sheep and monkeys, showed the
radioactivity collecting in all body tissues and especially high in the jaw
and facial bones.6 Human studies are also supportive.7

     9. Even more concerning is the synergistic toxicity effects of other
elements in amalgams, which increase the toxicity of mercury. For example,
Zinc (or Zn) is a needed element for body health and is found in very low
percentages in dental amalgams when compared to mercury. However, Zn+2 is a
synergist that enhances mercury toxicity. Studies have shown that solutions
in which amalgams have been soaked were "severely cytoxic initially when Zn
release was highest."8 (see also, Lobner & Asrari, Neurotoxicity of Dental
Amalgam is Mediated by Zinc. J. Dental Research v82#3, 243, 2003.) We have
repeated similar amalgam soaking experiments in my laboratory. Cadmium (from
smoking), lead, zinc and other heavy metals enhanced mercury toxicity as
expected. This is a well know phenomena in toxicology as it has been
reported many years ago in a study on determining the lethal dose (LD) that
"the administration of an essentially no-response level (LD-1) of a mercury
salt together with a 1/20 of the LD-1 of a lead salt killed all of the
animals." If the toxicity were additive only 1 to 2 rats of 100 should have
died, instead 100% died. (J. Shubert, E. Riley & S. Tyler. Combined Effects
in Toxicology--A Rapid Systemic Testing Procedure: Cadmium, Mercury and
Lead. J.Toxicology and Environmental Health v4, p763, 1978.) What the data
from several studies clearly shows is that no one can state what is a "safe"
level of mercury exposure without knowing the concentration of all other
factors that may synergistically exacerbate mercury toxicity.

     10. Synergistic effects on ethylmercury is demonstrated by the
dramatic enhancements of thimersosal toxicity against neurons in culture by
aluminum cation (Al3+), antibiotics and testosterone. Al3+ is another
component of vaccines and dramatically increases the killing of neurons by
thimerosal. Testosterone, at low nanomolar levels is not noticeably toxic to
neurons. However, if testosterone is present with low nanomolar levels of
thimerosal the rate of neuron death is greatly enhanced, more so than with
Al3+. This likely explains the 4 to 1 ratio of boys to girls that become
autistic and the fact that most of the severe cases of autism are boys. This
involvement of testosterone in autism is further supported by the work of
Dr. Baron Cohen of England who studied the amniotic fluid of mothers who
gave birth to autistic children. The only abnormality he found was that
their amniotic fluid contained elevated testosterone. It is likely that this
early elevated testosterone level rendered these children at enhanced risk
for ethylmercury neurotoxicity.

     11. There are two common misconceptions fostered by pro-amalgam
supporters concerning mercury amalgam filings: (1) that the mercury in
dental amalgam is all chemically bound and not released at significant
rates; and (2) that amalgam mercury is in a form that is biologically
inactive. We have tested this in a direct fashion in my laboratory by
soaking amalgams in distilled water and then testing these solutions for
toxicity in a manner similar to our testing of solutions known to contain
specific amounts of Hg2+. The results were unequivocal, solutions in which
amalgams were soaked for only one hour gave very similar effects on
inhibiting the activity of tubulin and creatine kinase, two enzymes
previously reported to be greatly inhibited in Alzheimer's diseased brain as
compared to age-matched normal brain (B. Haley, The Relationship of the
Toxic Effects of Mercury to Exacerbation of the Medical Conditions
Classified as Alzheimer's Disease, Nordisk Tidsskrift for Biologisk Medisin,
2003.) Therefore, amalgams likely created a cytotoxic environment in situ as
report by others also.

     12. By definition, an amalgam is a mixture of uncharged metal powders
in elemental form that is mixed with liquid mercury to form an emulsion that
hardens with time. Amalgams are not an alloy similar to steel or bronze.
Furthermore, in the case of dental amalgam, all of the elements that are
used to form amalgam have totally filled electron shells and form what is
known as metallic bonds. Mercury is a liquid because it makes very weak
metallic bonds, even with other metals, and this bonding is reversible
allowing bound mercury to become unbound and escape as a vaporous atom, Hg0,
at a rate that is significant. As such, there does not exist an irreversible
covalent bond between mercury and the other metals that is caused by two
elements binding to fill in shells with missing electrons. This means that,
unlike most chemically bound molecules, the elements that are mixed in an
amalgam do not lose their individual elemental properties on release from
the amalgam, unless this release is caused by electro-galvanism. Simply put,
mercury vapor emitting from amalgams does not lose any of its toxicity
because it was at one time inside of a dental amalgam. As shown in study
after study, mercury vapor is emitted from amalgams at substantial and toxic
amounts, and is then distributed within the human body. The claims made by
ADA spokesperson, even by one past director for the NIDCR, that mercury in
amalgams is like sodium in table salt, or like hydrogen in water, represent
what would be considered as preposterous by anyone knowledgeable in freshman
level general chemistry.

     13. As to the second misconception, all of the metal elements in
amalgam, including mercury, are not biologically inactive. As noted in
numerous studies, some of which are cited herein, mercury emits from
amalgams on a 24 hour a day basis.9 The emissions are increased based on the
introduction of hot substances, such as beverages (coffee and the sort),
with chewing (such as chewing gum or food) and with galvanism as Hg (the
simple electrical current set up between different metals in the mouth and
ionic saliva.) Additionally, numerous interactions cause the scratching of
the amalgams, again causing an increase in mercury vapor emissions. This
includes the grinding of teeth. Once the mercury vapor is emitted it enters
the body and is converted to toxic Hg2+ inside of cells by a specific enzyme
(catalyase). In the blood it is carried to various organs, including, but
not limited to, the brain as supported by various studies, some of which are
cited herein. Based on this, mercury vapor from dental amalgams cannot be
said to be biologically inactive as it is rapidly converted to a toxic form
once inside a cell.

     14. Equally unsupportable, scientifically, is any "estimate" that
amalgams emit mercury at minute amounts under a tenth of a microgram per day
as suggested by an ADA pro-amalgam spokesperson at the last congressional
Hearing. Applying simple math to this "estimate" of 0.1
micrograms/day/amalgam confirms this inaccuracy. If one would divide the 0.1
microgram/day amount by 8, 640 (24 hours/day X 60 minutes/hour X 6 ten
second intervals/minute) to calculate the amount of mercury in micrograms
available for a ten second mercury vapor analysis. This equals 1.16 X 10-5
micrograms total. Assume the oral cavity is somewhere between 10cm3 to 100
cm3 volume (note that 1 milliliter equals 1 cm3) then 1.16 X 10-6
micrograms/cm3 or 1.16 X 10-7micrograms/cm3 would be obtained from a single
amalgam. Note that the conventional vapor sniffer reads at its lowest
setting about 10 micrograms/meter3 or 10 micrograms/ 1,000,000 cm3 or
0.000001 or 10-6 micrograms/cm3. Therefore, the readings from 0.1 microgram
mercury released/day/amalgam in a 10 second reading would give values in a
10 cm3 oral volume that are barely if at all detectable. In a 100 cm3 oral
volume it would take about 8-9 fillings to get a minimal reading on a vapor
sniffer. This indicates that it would almost be impossible to detect mercury
emitting from one amalgam or several if the "estimate" of the ADA
spokesperson were accurate.

     However, the mercury vapor sniffer has been used by numerous
individuals to detect mercury vapor in a human mouth or oral volume, and in
my opinion the levels reported would underestimate the amount of mercury
emitting from a single amalgam because of the following. Consider that
somewhere between one-half to five-sixths of the mercury released would
enter the body through the tooth (that area of the amalgam that exists below
the visibly exposed amalgam surface) and not into the oral air. While the
margins between a tooth and an amalgam filling are small they are large
compared to an atom of mercury vapor. So mercury does enter readily through
this route. In addition, some mercury in the oral air would be rapidly
absorbed from the air into the saliva and oral mucosa since mercury is a
lipophilic (or hydrophobic) vapor. This mercury would not be measured by the
mercury analyzer and yet would enter the body. Further, as the mercury
analyzer pulls mercury containing oral air into the analysis chamber,
mercury free ambient air rushes into the oral cavity decreasing the mercury
concentration.

     Taking all of this into account one can calculate that most mercury
analyzers could not detect this "estimated" 0.10 micrograms/day level of
mercury even if the test subject had several amalgams. However, it is quite
easy to detect mercury emitting from one amalgam using these analyzers.
Therefore, it is impossible for daily emissions from amalgam to be anything
less than the detection limits of an analyzer in a 10 second test.
Separately, if amalgam is gently rubbed with a toothbrush the amount of
mercury emitted, as measured by a commercial mercury vapor sniffer,
increases dramatically. As I have cited herein, mercury emissions from
amalgams increase substantially when hot liquids are introduced or when the
individual is chewing.10

     15. Additionally, it is also important to note that measurement of
mercury emissions by a mercury vapor analyzer in the human mouth tends to
greatly underestimatethe amount of mercury exiting the amalgam as it does
not measure much of the mercury that is rapidly absorbed in saliva and oral
mucosa. Also, as the analyzer pulls mercury contaminated air out of the
mouth, mercury concentrations are also decreased as mercury free ambient air
rushes in the oral cavity.

     16. It is also important to note that when it comes to amalgam
fillings, the concern is chronic, not acute, exposures. Basically, in the
case of an acute exposure, one would be exposed to a large amount of mercury
in a single dosage that, in and of itself, may or may not be toxic. In the
case of chronic exposures, while an individual exposure may not be toxic,
the concern is the sum of the exposures. With amalgams, the exposure is
constant, 24 hours a day (chronic), and increases with the introduction of
various elements, such as chewing and the like, and also the introduction of
other chemicals which may act synergistically with mercury. Furthermore,
mercury accumulates within the human body in various organs and remains
there for prolonged periods of time as a "retention toxicity." A "retention
toxicity" from mercury differs from most conventional toxicities as the
toxin is not removed, but remains and builds up. For example, getting drunk
or alcohol toxic one night, the toxicity is cleared by the body as it
metabolizes the alcohol to other compounds. Mercury, being an element cannot
be metabolically changed and, most importantly, forms a long-term attachment
(or covalent bond) with proteins inside of cells and organelles, causing
what is called retention toxicity as the level of mercury can build up with
continuous chronic exposure.

     In fact, mercury has been shown to remain in human organs for years
after initial exposure accumulating in the brain, kidney, and lung.11
Specific to amalgam and the central nervous system, low doses of mercury
vapor enter and remain within motor neurons for prolonged periods of time.
According to various studies, these are levels well within the WHO
guidelines for occupational exposure.12 Simply put, these published studies
show that amounts of mercury that are considered within safe limits reaches
the central nervous system, and accumulates to toxic levels via "retention
toxicity." Mercury can be lodged in various organs causing toxicity for a
prolonged period of time. This is of particular concern with amalgams, as
mercury continuously accumulates in a given subject for years, adding up to
potentially toxic levels in many individuals, including, as noted below, the
developing fetus.

     17. Any claim on the part of the ADA or established dental
organizations that a zinc oxide layer is formed on the amalgams that
decreases mercury release can only be true if an individual is not using his
or her teeth. Note that zinc is listed at "trace levels" in amalgams. How
can trace levels cover the 50% mercury? However, in the real world, any zinc
oxide layer is easily removed by slight abrasion such as chewing food or
brushing the teeth. Further, my laboratory has confirmed that solutions in
which amalgams have been soaked can cause the inhibition of brain proteins
that are inhibited by adding mercury chloride, and these are the same
enzymes inhibited in AD brain samples.

     18. Even more concerning is that at least some of the inorganic
mercury that is emitted from amalgams is converted to methylmercury, a more
toxic, organic form of mercury.13 This strongly indicates that "organo
mercury species" are indeed capable of being made in the human body and
likely explains the appearance of methylmercury in the blood and urine of
individuals who do not eat seafood, but do have amalgam fillings.

     19. The bottom line is that amalgams emit significant levels of
neurotoxic mercury that are injurious to human health and would exacerbate
the medical condition of those individuals with neurological diseases such
as Amyotrophic lateral sclerosis ("ALS" or "Lou Gehrig's Disease") 14 ,
Multiple Sclerosis ("MS"), Parkinson's, autism and Alzheimer's Disease
("AD"). For example, mercury inhibits the same enzymes in normal brain
tissues as are inhibited in Alzheimer's Disease.15 AD is pathologically
confirmed post-mortem by the appearance of neuro-fibillary tangles (NFTs)
and amyloid plaques in brain tissue. Published research, within the past
year, has shown that exposure of neurons in culture to sub-lethal doses of
mercury (much less than is observed in human brain tissue) causes the
formations of NFTs,16 the increased secretion of beta-amyloid protein and
the hyper-phosphorylation of a protein called Tau.17All three of these
mercury-induced aberrancies are regularly identified by world class scholars
as the major diagnostic markers for AD. Yet the ADA states there is no
scientific data published to indicate that mercury from amalgams could
contribute to these diseases.

     20. Furthermore, mercury from amalgams is transferred from a pregnant
mother to the developing fetus, causing increased mercury body burden in
children solely based on the presence of amalgams in the mother.18 Mercury
exposure is even more devastating to the developing brain than to an adult
brain. This has been shown in study after study culminating with the recent
publication by Dr. Lorscheider, et al., showing brain neuron degeneration
from small amounts of mercury and conclusively proving that such
degeneration does not occur with the introduction of any other element,
including lead.19 The research mentioned above on the levels of mercury in
the birth-hair of children increasing with the mother's amalgam clearly
demonstrates that mercury from dental amalgams enters the child in utero as
has been previously reported.

     21. Also, low level exposures like those associated with amalgam
fillings and the resultant increase in the mercury body burden are toxic to
the central nervous system.20 These can cause from severe to subtle
neuropsychological functions such as depression of performance, intellectual
functioning, impairments of attention, impairment of short-term memory
function, visual judgment of angles and directions, psychomotor retardation
and personality changes. As further proof that these are mercury related,
scientists have shown that in some cases, the effects can be reversed simply
by removal of the source of mercury intoxication, together with proper
medical treatment. 21 Mercury from fillings also leads to "considerable
concentrations of [mercury] in the olfactory bulbs."22 This may also explain
the phenomena of Alzheimer's patients losing their sense of smell in the
early stages of the disease. (Kovacs, T., Cairns, N.J., Lantos, P.L.
Olfactory Centres in Alzheimer's disease: Olfactory bulb is Involved in
Early Braak's Stages. Neuroreport 12(2): 285-288, 2001 and Gray, A.J.,
Staples, V., Murren, K., Dahariwal, A. and Benthan, P. Olfactory
Identification is Impaired in Clinic-Based Patients with Vascular Dementia
and Senile Dementia of Alzheimer's type. Int. J. Geriatr. Psychiatry 16 (5):
513-517, 2001.)

     22. Mercury from dental fillings has also been associated with adverse
effects in the cardiovascular system, including high blood pressure, low
heart rate, low hemoglobin, and low hematocrit. 23

     23. Many of the experiments that show mercury emission and exposure
from dental amalgams are so simple and inexpensive to do that they could
have should have been completed many years ago, in the 1950's and 60's. Yet,
they have not been done, or at least not reported on, despite numerous
requests by concerned citizens by the agencies and bureaucracies that today
testify that amalgams are safe. This includes the ADA and dental branch of
the FDA. It is important to note that I do not hold the entire FDA
responsible for the actions of the dental branch of the FDA. Other
researchers also doing these tests do not find amalgams safe based on the
continuous, chronic release of mercury. The fact that both the national
Academy of sciences and the EPA warn the government of the dangers of the
level of mercury found in Americans and the NIH and WHO studies that
amalgams are the major contributor to the mercury body burden of humans.
Couple this with the certain fact that mercury, and only mercury of the
toxic metals, can mimic the aberrant biochemistry and produce the components
of the widely accepted diagnostic hallmarks of Alzheimer's disease and it
should be obvious that all exposures to mercury should be held to the lowest
levels.

     24. Finally, science has produced compelling evidence at the
biological level that mercury can cause the aberrancies found in Alzheimer's
disease. Recent research has shown both strong biological plausibility and
epidemiological studies regarding ethylmercury exposure from thimerosal in
vaccinations being the cause of the devastating disease of autism and
related disorder. Yet, our organizations and bureaucracies formed to protect
us deny even the possibility that mercury or organic mercury is involved in
the causation or exacerbation of these diseases. One only needs to know the
history of Pink disease (acyrodynia) to understand that proving mercury
involvement in disease is quite difficult due to genetic susceptibility.
However, all of the scientific and biomedical facts together emphasizes the
need for congressional action to stop the exposure of Americans to mercury
and organic mercury compounds.

>>Comment from Mark Probert:
>>
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>>Thanks
>>Citizen Jimserac
Jan Drew - 30 Jun 2008 03:00 GMT
> Comment from Mark Probert:
>
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> Thanks
> Citizen Jimserac

Mark cannot remember what he has posted in the past.
He claimed thimerosal was removed for political reasons.

From: Mark_ProbertBLOC...@hotmail.com (Mark Probert)
Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 02:43:12 GMT
Local: Sat, Mar 2 2002 10:43 pm
Subject: Re: Vaccinations

http://groups.google.com/group/misc.health.alternative/msg/e0354af96f3359b6

>Mark_ProbertBLOC...@hotmail.com (Mark Probert) writes:
>   John Bain wrote
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>>into 3rd world areas where disease was rampant, and routinely received
>>vaccines and boosters for over twenty years.

>And you believe the dosage of mercury from those vaccines will cause you to
>react more than someone with a high sensitivty to mercury.
>Do explain why.

Wrong. I do not believe that at all. If the fearmonger claims that
mercury is baaaaaaaaad has any real validity, then, someone who has
had as much as Ihave should have some for of reaction by now.

>   >>1 do you accept that different people respond in different ways to the
>same
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>   >>vaccinations than others.*****
>>See above.

>Nope, you are just guessing.   You have no way of knowing what your
>sensitivity
>is to mercury.   You have not been tested and do not know what the
>distribution
>is likely to be.
>Your comments are just your beliefs.

When I said see above, I was referring to that part of your question
which I have added the emphasis. I have had far more vaccinations than
the average individual. I have had no reactions. The people I worked
with also maintained their vaccinations as I did. They had no
reactions. Some of them traveled with their kids, and their kids had
no reactions.

>>>>Tsu was engaging in a bit of hyperbole. If thimerosal was as dangerous
>>>>as it is portrayed to be, I should have had a severe reaction to it a
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>>Yes! It was done! That is why this is a bullshit strawman issue of the
>>anti-vac fearmonger/liars.

>Bit posters in this thread said it was not necessary, just a political
>exercise.

That was my comment. AFAIAC, there was no medical basis for removal,
as there was no demonstration that there was a problem due to it.
Thus, the only basis for removal was political, just to stop the
whining.

BTW, the whining has not stopped, and, since they removed it for the
wrong reason, the whiners are louder now. Whining is never a good
reason to do anything.

>Are you stating here that that is not the case, removing thimerosal was a
>reasonable action?

See above.

>If so, then why agree with TDN's remark
>"> If the anti-vac "ekk it's got thimerosol" group were right, Mark and I
>should be dead."

See the word 'if'? IF there was a problem with thimerosal in vaccines,
I should be dead, with two heads.

>>There have been reformulations where it has been safely  removed from
>>the vaccines which had contained it. From what I understand, only
>>those vaccines where it is necessary still contain it.

>Not the case, AFAIK.   New vaccines are being produced without thimerosal,
>but
>there has not been a policy of withdrawal of existing stock.

Ack! Remember the whining I mentioned? That is one of the whines....

>And who decides whether it is "necessary".

People who understand these things.

>And necessary to do what, keep the price down?

To maintain its efficacy and safety.

>Best wishes
 
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