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Medical Forum / General / Alternative / May 2008Obama Climbs On The Vaccine Bandwagon
Obama Climbs On The Vaccine http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-kirby/obama-climbs-on-the-vacci_b_97969.html Posted April 22, 2008 | 11:29 AM (EST) Breaking Home News Note from Ilena Rosenthal: First McCain ... now Obama ... thank you to the brave vaccination awareness advocates who have refused to be silenced ... www.ilenarose.blogspot.com Barring some big Clinton blowout in Pennsylvania today, the next President of the United States will unequivocally support research into the growing evidence of some link between vaccines and autism. Republican John McCain has already expressed his belief that vaccines and the mercury containing preservative thimerosal could be implicated in what he has rightly termed an "autism epidemic." Yesterday, at a rally in Pennsylvania, Barack Obama had this rather surprising thing to say: "We've seen just a skyrocketing autism rate. Some people are suspicious that it's connected to the vaccines. This person included. The science right now is inconclusive, but we have to research it." So there you have it, our next President will share the views of such radical fringe crazies as, well, me, Democrat Robert Kennedy, Jr., Republican Joe Scarborough, former NIH and Red Cross chief Bernadine Healy, and several researchers at Harvard, Johns Hopkins, the Universities of California and Washington and elsewhere. All of us agree: Current evidence suggests that vaccines could be a contributing factor in some cases of autism, and more research is immediately required. And yes, now the comments to this piece will come flying in, repeating the tired mantra that "this case is closed," that vaccines and thimerosal have been "completely vindicated," and that people like me are just trying to scare the public and drive them away from vaccines, leaving their children vulnerable and sick. Of course, none of the above is true. So stay tuned. To begin with, government researchers are currently looking into a number of factors that may trigger autism, including vaccines, their ingredients and the crowded vaccine schedule itself. Secondly, on April 11th, I attended a top-level meeting in Washington where vaccine safety officials discussed all of the above issues, and more. Included on the Federal Draft Research Agenda for vaccine safety are now questions such as: Can vaccines cause neurodevelopmental disorders, such as autism? Can vaccines in children with mitochondrial dysfunction cause significant "neurological deterioration?" Can the combination live-virus measles, mumps and rubella vaccine cause seizures and long term damage in children? Can vaccines cause autoimmune disease? Can thimerosal cause tics or Tourette syndrome? Can attenuated viruses in vaccines cause asthma in children? So, no matter who is President next year, top government researchers will be examining the role of vaccines in autism and other childhood illnesses. Thus, the declarations of both McCain and, now, Obama, make good scientific sense. But there is more. Dozens of autism cases (and perhaps more) currently filed in so-called Vaccine Court will almost certainly be compensated this year. Why? Because a little girl named Hannah Poling with a supposedly rare mitochondrial condition was recently compensated for her own vaccine injuries, including autism and epilepsy. But I have personally identified at least a dozen (and there are reports of many more) children with cases in the court who meet the exact same medical criteria as Hannah, and whose cases will almost surely be compensated as well -- each time with the attendant media fanfare. My prediction is that, by Election Day, few Americans will still believe there is absolutely no evidence to link vaccines to at least some cases of regressive autism. So the remarks by McCain and Obama not only reflect good science, they reflect good politics as well. Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not likely to be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is so completely unncessary and without scientific basis. > Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not likely to > be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is so completely > unncessary and without scientific basis. While I agree with the uselessness and unscientific basis for vaccines and the practice of ritual immunization, provide us with another causative agent or agents that have the capacity to do the harm to a developing infant that mercury, aluminum, and the other toxoids in vaccines have been shown to be able to do. I suggest that the injected ethylmercury from thimerosal has the capacity to do much more harm than the methylmercury from ingested fish, particularly since the level of mercury intoxication is nearly 1000 times greater in concentration. I further suggest that aluminum can and does do similar harm. The synergism of aluminum and mercury is again at least 100 times more toxic that either alone. The toxoids in the DPT shot are the same toxoids used to study encephalopathy in lab animals. The high pitched screaming of the kids is due to the huge migrane headache caused by the brain swelling from the toxoids. The MMR toxoids have been shown to be involved in the terrible gut problems of the autistic. Would a 2x4 upside your head convince you that being hit with a piece of wood swung with force hurts or would you need some more convincing? DrCee You cannot secure nor restore health with pus or poisons. > Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not likely to > be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is so completely > unncessary and without scientific basis. Really? Ever notice all those kids coming down with polio? Staying home from school from measles? Having birth defects from rubella? Not anymore. Vaccines completely eliminated polio in the Western hemisphrere, nearly completely stopped measles (with all cases from sources outside the US), decreased invasive Hib disease, nearly eliminated rubella-related birth defects, decrease the incidence and severity of chicken pox, decreased the rates of diptheria, tetanus and purtussis. If you want to decrease the chances of your kid from getting sick or dying, then vaccines are necessary. Jeff > > Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not likely to > > be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is so completely [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Jeff Most intelligent folks have figured out the enormous benefit seen from vaccines, have far outweighed any small risk vaccinations present. People who would promote an anti vaccination agenda in this day and age, are either too young to remember the world with Polio, Rubella, Whooping Cough, Mumps, etc.; OR they are too old and senile to remember it! On Apr 22, 5:09 pm, Jeff <kidsdoc2...@hotmail.com> wrote: > PeterB wrote: > > Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not likely to [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Jeff Most intelligent folks have figured out the enormous benefit seen from vaccines, have far outweighed any small risk vaccinations present. People who would promote an anti vaccination agenda in this day and age, are either too young to remember the world with Polio, Rubella, Whooping Cough, Mumps, etc.; OR they are too old and senile to remember it! So Myrl, how's that bridge buying thing working out for you? vaccines, have far outweighed any small risk vaccinations present. Tell that to a mother who watched her child go into a seizure and died. > On Apr 22, 5:09 pm, Jeff <kidsdoc2...@hotmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > - Show quoted text - > vaccines, have far outweighed any small risk vaccinations present. > > Tell that to a mother who watched her child go into a seizure and > died. How about you telling a mother of a child who died from Hib meningitis that the Hib vaccine is dangerous? The fact is that there is risk in everything we do. Vaccines and refusing to get vaccines is no different. The risk from vaccines is far less than the risk of the diseases they prevent. Unfortunately, your emotional argument will convince some parents not to vaccinate their kids. Sadly, those kids are more likely to get very serious illnesses. >> On Apr 22, 5:09 pm, Jeff <kidsdoc2...@hotmail.com> wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] >> >> - Show quoted text - Pure Pharma Propaganda Bullsh*t! We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By the same people I might add. > > vaccines, have far outweighed any small risk vaccinations present. > [quoted text clipped - 46 lines] > > - Show quoted text - > Pure Pharma Propaganda Bullsh*t! Actually, that is my opinion. What the pharma companies say is not my concern. > We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By > the same people I might add. Really? And what people are these? >>> vaccines, have far outweighed any small risk vaccinations present. >>> Tell that to a mother who watched her child go into a seizure and [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] >>>> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >> - Show quoted text - > > We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By > > the same people I might add. > > Really? And what people are these? Well, lets see we are in Iraq for oil, so who is behind oil? Corporate America. How do they get that oil, They use our government. > > Pure Pharma Propaganda Bullsh*t! > [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > > - Show quoted text - >>> We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By >>> the same people I might add. >> Really? And what people are these? > > Well, lets see we are in Iraq for oil, so who is behind oil? Corporate > America. How do they get that oil, They use our government. Corporate America! ROTFL! >>> Pure Pharma Propaganda Bullsh*t! >> Actually, that is my opinion. What the pharma companies say is not my [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] >>>> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >> - Show quoted text - > >>> We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By > >>> the same people I might add. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > ROTFL! And what do you find so humorous, Jeff? You dont think Corporate America had anything to do with Iraq? You do realize its Corporate America that decides what vaccines to inject into our babies. Corporate America= GREED! > >>> We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By > >>> the same people I might add. [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > > - Show quoted text - >>>>> We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By >>>>> the same people I might add. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > And what do you find so humorous, Jeff? Your paranoia about corporate America. And your poor ability to think. > You dont think Corporate America had anything to do with Iraq? > [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] >>>> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >> - Show quoted text - > > And what do you find so humorous, Jeff? > > Your paranoia about corporate America. And your poor ability to think. Fine, Now its my turn......ROTFL @ Jeffy! :o) > >>>>> We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By > >>>>> the same people I might add. [quoted text clipped - 71 lines] > > - Show quoted text - >>>>>> We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By >>>>>> the same people I might add. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Your paranoia about corporate America. And your poor ability to think. Nice personal attack. >> You dont think Corporate America had anything to do with Iraq? >> [quoted text clipped - 72 lines] >>>>> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >>> - Show quoted text - > > Pure Pharma Propaganda Bullsh*t! > [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Yep, Iraqi expatriot, Chalabi, who sold the whole WMD scheme to the current administration, has controlling interest in the companies that make vaccines. . .LOL! However, I'll give Kevysmom this. . .It is true that some in this administration, had a considerable amount of investment in the Anthrax vaccine. I think Rumsfeld especially did. Remember the Anthrax scare we had immediately following 9-11??? It turns out it was likely a domestic terrorist threat/attacks. And the strain of Anthrax used in those attacks, apparently came from a military base right here in the USA. What ever happened to that "person of interest" (Stephen Hatfill) anyway??? > However, I'll give Kevysmom this. . .It is true that some in this > administration, had a considerable amount of investment in the Anthrax > vaccine. I think Rumsfeld especially did. See, I didnt know Rummy had his greedy hands in the Anthrax vaccine! > Remember the Anthrax scare we had immediately following 9-11??? It > turns out it was likely a domestic terrorist threat/attacks. And the > strain of Anthrax used in those attacks, apparently came from a > military base right here in the USA. What ever happened to that > "person of interest" (Stephen Hatfill) anyway???- I sure hope everyone is smart enough to be voting for Obama. > > > Pure Pharma Propaganda Bullsh*t! > [quoted text clipped - 64 lines] > > - Show quoted text - > > However, I'll give Kevysmom this. . .It is true that some in this > > administration, had a considerable amount of investment in the Anthrax [quoted text clipped - 80 lines] > > - Show quoted text - I think most anyone would be better running the White House than what we have! At one point I had more hope for McCain, but he doesn't seem to have a plan for the ailing economy. His stance is leave it alone! I think 8 years of the existing policies would all but ruin us. . .and that's what I see McCain as perpetuating. Like Obama, I was totally against going into Iraq from the very beginning. The archives of this newsgroup will prove that. But, I disagree with him now. We have totally broke it over there, and we should not just get up and leave. I think we have a moral obligation to stabilize the situation that we created by unilaterally impossing pre-emptive action on a country, which had absolutely nothing to do with 9-11. The terrorists flying the planes that day were from Saudi Arabia and Pakistan - Not Iraq, or Iran! I like what Hillary says about Health care, I also agree, that there should be benchmarks for leaving Iraq - and those benchmarks should not be publicized! Myrl, I think this is your best post, Ever! Obama doesnt plan on just leaving Iraqis to deal with the situation that we caused. He is planning on leaving troops to help keep peace in the region. Hillary has always been for the Iraqi war, she changed her stance on the war when she decided to run for the nomination. I also worry about her stance regarding Iran. I actually like McCain's wife. I think McCain is a real war hero and has some good qualities in him, that I admire. But he would be another puppet for the GOP. And thats the last thing our country needs. > > > However, I'll give Kevysmom this. . .It is true that some in this > > > administration, had a considerable amount of investment in the Anthrax [quoted text clipped - 101 lines] > > - Show quoted text - > Myrl, > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > has some good qualities in him, that I admire. But he would be another > puppet for the GOP. And thats the last thing our country needs. There is an interesting documentary on the ramp up to the Iraq War. It goes into depth about the politics and the business interests which caused this administration to display so much exhuberance and glee at the possibility of invading Iraq. And to find such a welcome friend in Iraqi ex-patriout, Chalabi, who was whispering sweet nothings into administration ears. One of the men involved in writing the intelligence report ultimately presented to Congress to extract their approval for the invasion was continually met with interference from the Administration (mainly in Cheney's realm), to black out or rewrite entire segments of the report to provide a more agressive reasoning for our going to war. Afterall, they were writing a marketing piece to sell this war to congress, rather than providing real facts! Once completed, it was enormous with many hundreds of pages. The report was put on a conference room table in a Congressional meeting room, shortly before Congress was to break for a long Thanksgiving holiday. So the question remains - How many Congressional members actually sat at that table and read that report with any considered thought, or depth??? In order for Obama to "keep the peace" in Iraq, we will first need to first stabilize the country. Stabilizing the country will not allow Obama to do what he has said - which is to immediately bring the military home! What we may wish that he be able to do, morally isn't an option! And that is not his fault! I watch many documentaries. These were some of the more interesting ones regarding the Iraq War. I'm certain there were others, but their titles escape me right now. If you belong to Netflix (like I do), you can obtain them that way. But, I suspect Blockbuster may have some of them. Several were produced by the History Channel, PBS, etc. (1) WMD: Weapons of Mass Deception (2) Uncovered: The War on Iraq (3) The Whole Truth About the Iraq War (4) The Iraq War: The War Profitteers Hi Mryl, Another GREAT post of yours, thanks! > (1) WMD: Weapons of Mass Deception > (2) Uncovered: The War on Iraq > (3) The Whole Truth About the Iraq War > (4) The Iraq War: The War Profitteers Im not sure if I watched those...But on PBS they have a documentary still up on its web sire(No wonder the Bush Administration wants to cut funds!) These documentaries should be seen by everyone.. I hope that when we get a new president they will investigate all of this, But Im sure every bit of evidence will be shredded, and all new computers in place before Bush leaves office. In "The Dark Side," FRONTLINE tells the story of the vice president's role as the chief architect of the war on terror, and his battle with Director of Central Intelligence George Tenet for control of the "dark side." Drawing on more than 40 interviews and thousands of documents, the film provides a step-by-step examination of what happened inside the councils of war. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/darkside/view/ > > Myrl, > [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > (3) The Whole Truth About the Iraq War > (4) The Iraq War: The War Profitteers > Hi Mryl, > [quoted text clipped - 83 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Yes, I saw that one too. Tenet was skeptical, but was heavily presured by the Vice President's Office, and staff. At the end of the day, Tenet's "slam dunk" comment, helped cock the trigger on Iraq. I just opened a link that a person on another group I belong to posted. This is NOT good. This makes me so upset. Havent we done enough damage in the ME? Joint Chiefs Chairman Says U.S. Preparing Military Options Against Iran 25/04/08 "Washington Post" -- - The nation's top military officer said today that the Pentagon is planning for "potential military courses of action" against Iran, criticizing what he called the Tehran government's "increasingly lethal and malign influence" in Iraq. Adm. Michael Mullen, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said a conflict with Iran would be "extremely stressing" but not impossible for U.S. forces, pointing specifically to reserve capabilities in the Navy and Air Force. > > Hi Mryl, > [quoted text clipped - 87 lines] > presured by the Vice President's Office, and staff. At the end of the > day, Tenet's "slam dunk" comment, helped cock the trigger on Iraq. > I just opened a link that a person on another group I belong to > posted. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > for U.S. forces, pointing specifically to reserve capabilities in the > Navy and Air Force. Dingbat, listen, military preparedness is for those people who can think. You are obviously not one of them. However, being the ever helpful person I am, I wil lpoint out that the military prepares multiple scenarios all the time, and this is merely routine. It is a real bitch if you have to wait for the last minute. >> I just opened a link that a person on another group I belong to >> posted. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > Dingbat, listen, military preparedness is for those people who can > think. Mark, while I disagree with Kevy's mom about vaccines, and I believe she is acting with emotions and not logic or facts when it comes to vaccines, your dismissal of her comments on another matter is also without basis. At least she was able to quote someone who should know what he is talking about. And even if you were correct, that is not reason to attack Kevy's mom. Jeff > You are obviously not one of them. However, being the ever > helpful person I am, I wil lpoint out that the military prepares > multiple scenarios all the time, and this is merely routine. It is a > real bitch if you have to wait for the last minute. > >> I just opened a link that a person on another group I belong to > >> posted. [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > And even if you were correct, that is not reason to attack Kevy's mom. I am sorry---not. She gratuitously attacks me, and I give her back what she dishes out. When she stops, I stop. Not before. > Jeff > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > - Show quoted text - <...> >> And even if you were correct, that is not reason to attack Kevy's mom. > > I am sorry---not. She gratuitously attacks me, and I give her back > what she dishes out. > > When she stops, I stop. Not before. The Golden Rule: Treat others as you want to be treated. Lt. Gen. Kuribayashi: Do what it right because it is right. Jeff >>> And even if you were correct, that is not reason to attack Kevy's mom. >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > The Golden Rule: Treat others as you want to be treated. Mark is Jewish, and Hillel's formulation is a better fit anyway: "What is hateful to you, do not do to others. That is the entire Torah, everything else is commentary. Go, and learn." | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ > "What is hateful to you, do not do to others. Hello! Isnt that the same thing as "The Golden Rule"? > >>> And even if you were correct, that is not reason to attack Kevy's mom. > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | > +--- D. C. Sessions <d...@lumbercartel.com> ---+ >> "What is hateful to you, do not do to others. > > Hello! Isnt that the same thing as "The Golden Rule"? No. One is positive, the other negative. The difference comes up when you consider the things that you *would* like done to you despite the possibility that others wouldn't. In present context, "colon cleansing." >> >>> And even if you were correct, that is not reason to attack Kevy's mom. >> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >> | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | >> +--- D. C. Sessions <d...@lumbercartel.com> ---+ | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ The clean up crew was here. > <...> > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Lt. Gen. Kuribayashi: Do what it right because it is right. I tried that. It resulted in slanderous webapges, and a dimwit delving into my twoenty year old personal history. I do not walk into a minefield twice. When did *I* attack you? > > >> I just opened a link that a person on another group I belong to > > >> posted. [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > - Show quoted text - > When did *I* attack you? The hand in the cookie jar routine is old. You have attacked me, and negatively referred to me. "Marky" is condescending. You lie with the war mongers and junk yard dog. 'nuf said. > "Marky" is condescending. You lie with the war mongers and junk yard > dog. "Marky" wasn't meant to be taken as offensive, sorry. And I do not lie with war mongers, just the opposite! > > When did *I* attack you? > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > 'nuf said. On Apr 26, 11:19 am, Jeff <kidsdoc2...@hotmail.com> wrote: > Mark Probert wrote: > > On Apr 25, 11:49 pm, Kevysmom <bluebun...@gmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > And even if you were correct, that is not reason to attack Kevy's mom. I am sorry---not. She gratuitously attacks me, and I give her back what she dishes out. When she stops, I stop. Not before. So, tell us, when will you advance beyond 15 years old? > On Apr 26, 11:19 am, Jeff <kidsdoc2...@hotmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > > So, tell us, when will you advance beyond 15 years old? I know counting is hard for you. Live with your limitations. >> On Apr 26, 11:19 am, Jeff <kidsdoc2...@hotmail.com> wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > I know counting is hard for you. Live with your limitations. > Also, tell us, did you mommy make you an a.s or was it you daddy? > >> I just opened a link that a person on another group I belong to > >> posted. [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > vaccines, your dismissal of her comments on another matter is also > without basis. Sure it is. I have a basis. Called reality. She has no clue as to what she is whining about. At least she was able to quote someone who should know > what he is talking about. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > - Show quoted text - On Apr 26, 11:19 am, Jeff <kidsdoc2...@hotmail.com> wrote: > Mark Probert wrote: > > On Apr 25, 11:49 pm, Kevysmom <bluebun...@gmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > vaccines, your dismissal of her comments on another matter is also > without basis. Sure it is. I have a basis. Called reality. She has no clue as to what she is whining about. At least she was able to quote someone who should know > what he is talking about. And you do? Bwahahahaha, oh crap! you caused me to spill my coffee. Hehehehehehe, Damn, you are one funny dude. Thanks, Jeff. > >> I just opened a link that a person on another group I belong to > >> posted. [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > > - Show quoted text - > Pure Pharma Propaganda Bullsh*t! > > We were also told the Iraq had WMD and we are in imminent danger. By > the same people I might add. No Dear - It wasn't the "same" people who told us there were WMDs in Iraq, and presenting scientific proof that vaccines work! I know you may wish to see conspiracies everywhere! As an aside, on Monday in Phoenix, UFO(s) were sited. Pictures were taken and they hit the media. Then the next day, a guy comes forward and states that he strung a bunch of balloons together, with flares attached to them, which provided the "UFO" effect. However, there are those that now say it's the "official" explanation - and extrateresterials are out there! The people seeing that report will fall into 3 categories: (1) People who will believe the guy's story. (2) People who will believe his story is an official coverup story. (3) But, the third group of people, will say maybe it is, maybe it's not - and either continue exploring for the truth, or go on to other things in their lives. > No Dear - It wasn't the "same" people who told us there were WMDs in > Iraq, and presenting scientific proof that vaccines work! I know you > may wish to see conspiracies everywhere! Corporate America is just that Corporate America. It doesnt matter if its Oil or Pharma, they are all the same. The "Proof" that vaccines work is bought and paid for by Pharma. > > Pure Pharma Propaganda Bullsh*t! > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > people, will say maybe it is, maybe it's not - and either continue > exploring for the truth, or go on to other things in their lives. > Tell that to a mother who watched her child go into a seizure and > died. Seizures from haemophilus influenzae are terrifying, and indeed the neurological damage is crippling even when the patient survives. The same, of course, is true of meningococcal disease. Fortunately, neither is remotely as common today as they were 15 years ago. | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ >Really? Ever notice all those kids coming down with polio? Staying home from school from measles? Having birth defects from rubella? Not anymore. No, we just traded those diseases for cancer, asthma, autism, diabetes, epilepsy, etc...ALL of these diseases are now epidemic in our country. 1 out of 6 children have some form of developmental disorder. How did this happen? > > Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not likely to > > be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is so completely [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Jeff > No, we just traded those diseases for cancer, asthma, autism, > diabetes, epilepsy, etc...ALL of > these diseases are now epidemic in our country. > > 1 out of 6 children have some form of developmental disorder. How did > this happen? Have you considered, fast food restauraunts, additives in food, chemicals in the environment, the drug usage of the parents, etc.? I can understand you may wish the vaccine industry is to blame, because you can more readily target their deep pockets for litigation dollars. But the fact remains that autism continues to increase at alarming rates, inspite of the fact that thimerosol has been removed from childhood vaccines since 2001, with the exception of the flu vaccine. Most children don't get the flu shot. Also keep this in mind. About a week ago, settlement for all those Ford Explorer roll-overs came to an end. Guess the outcome - $25 MILLION dollars went to the attorneys. But, the Explorer owners get only a $500. coupon to use when buying a new Ford car - with the caveat that they redeem the coupon within 30 days! Folks need to rethink the logic of spending years in litigation that only makes attorneys rich! >> Really? Ever notice all those kids coming down with polio? Staying home > from school from measles? Having birth defects from rubella? Not [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > diabetes, epilepsy, etc...ALL of > these diseases are now epidemic in our country. Yet vaccines have nothing to do with any of the diseases you mention. If I am incorrect, please cite your scientific evidence. > 1 out of 6 children have some form of developmental disorder. How did > this happen? You tell me. And if you want to implicate vaccines, please provide the scientific evidence. Coincidence is not causation. Jeff >>> Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not likely to >>> be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is so completely [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >> >> Jeff > > 1 out of 6 children have some form of developmental disorder. How did > > this happen? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Coincidence is not causation. Why dont YOU prove it isnt. How many vaccines are we injecting into babies now from the time they are one day old? 22 vaccines is it? How many vaccines did you get when you was an infant? Dr Jeff, you do know that a baby doesnt have a full blood brain barrier until 6 months old, right? How many babies will suffer and die from vaccines? How many more will cry and have heart ache knowing their baby was injected with these toxins that have taken their child's life. Have you ever seen a baby suffer from life threatening seizures, Dr Jeff? Do you know any parents that have lost a child due to these seizures? You do realize that vaccines cause seizures in babies. You do realize that the number one cause for lawsuits against the vaccine courts is because of seizures and death. I know these parents. I know the stories on a personal note, Not just from reading it. Donna > >> Really? Ever notice all those kids coming down with polio? Staying home > > from school from measles? Having birth defects from rubella? Not [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > > - Show quoted text - > > Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not > > likely to be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > home from school from measles? Having birth defects from rubella? > Not anymore. Timeline data for all of these proves conclusively that vaccine had nothing to do with them. Look it up. When a child contracts a case of measles these days, it's almost certain that it won't be reported due to vaccine bias based on a child's vaccine status, but the best vaccine does is to limit or reduce the severity of a viral infection (and sometimes it produces symptoms not unlike the disease itself.) Since parents nowadays don't suspect a communicable disease, a child is rarely presented to a doctor for evaluation. He or she stays out of school for a day or two with a "flu bug." Even if the child is presented for evaluation, a doctor rarely orders blood work. Again, that is based on vaccine bias. You probably don't know that measles mortality had already declined by 95% before the vaccine was even introduced, and for that to happen, severe morbidity had to be declining, as well. > Vaccines completely eliminated polio in the Western hemisphrere, > nearly completely stopped measles (with all cases from sources > outside the US), decreased invasive Hib disease, nearly eliminated > rubella-related birth defects, decrease the incidence and severity > of chicken pox, decreased the rates of diptheria, tetanus and > purtussis. One of my cousins died at age 3 within an hour of receiving her pertussis vaccine. This was before I was born and people rarely sought legal remedy against medical providers in those days. Both her mother and my mother (who had not yet had children of her own)were devastated by this loss. It's true that such diseases today are not the problem they once were, but vaccine was far too late in the game to explain those declines. Nowadays, we chalk most of our "mystery" bugs up to that "weird flu" going around, but you don't really know. > If you want to decrease the chances of your kid from getting sick > or dying, then vaccines are necessary. Care to back that up with risk-adjusted scientific evidence from a published source? >>> Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not >>> likely to be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Timeline data for all of these proves conclusively that vaccine had > nothing to do with them. Look it up. Really? Until the measles vaccine came out, most children got measles. Now, in the US and other countries where the vast majority of kids do, almost no kids get measles. Polio was wiped out of the western hemisphere by vaccines. Get a clue, man. > When a child contracts a case > of measles these days, it's almost certain that it won't be reported > due to vaccine bias based on a child's vaccine status, but the best > vaccine does is to limit or reduce the severity of a viral infection > (and sometimes it produces symptoms not unlike the disease itself.) Bull. Already this year, cases of measles have been reported in California and the New York City Area. These cases were from people outside the country. Measles is reported. > Since parents nowadays don't suspect a communicable disease, a child > is rarely presented to a doctor for evaluation. He or she stays out [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > introduced, and for that to happen, severe morbidity had to be > declining, as well. Will you please provide evidence to back your claims? You seem to be totally ignorant. >> Vaccines completely eliminated polio in the Western hemisphrere, >> nearly completely stopped measles (with all cases from sources [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > to explain those declines. Nowadays, we chalk most of our "mystery" > bugs up to that "weird flu" going around, but you don't really know. Get a clue man. The vaccines wiped out the diseases. >> If you want to decrease the chances of your kid from getting sick >> or dying, then vaccines are necessary. > > Care to back that up with risk-adjusted scientific evidence from a > published source? I suggest you look at the evidence at www.cdc.gov. > >>> Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not > >>> likely to be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine > >>> is so completely unncessary and without scientific basis. > >> Really? Ever notice all those kids coming down with polio? > >> Staying home from school from measles? Having birth defects [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > majority of kids do, almost no kids get measles. Polio was wiped > out of the western hemisphere by vaccines. And I colonized Pluto once with a brew of ferrets. You can't see them from here, but I promise, it's true. Here's the kicker. Despite ferrets now living on Pluto, I can't prove that I put them there myself. Remind you of anything? > Get a clue, man. We don't need "clues," dude, we need facts. Got any? > > When a child contracts a case > > of measles these days, it's almost certain that it won't be [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > California and the New York City Area. These cases were from people > outside the country. You aren't paying attention. I said children *already* vaccinated would be unlikely to receive virus-specific IgM evaluation because of their vaccination status. No one said measles no longer exists, and no one said it can't be detected. > Measles is reported. > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Will you please provide evidence to back your claims? Refer to the chart in Myrl's post about measles earlier. You can also find scientific reviews of these data in many published books on the subject. If you need some relevant titles, I'll be happy to supply them. > You seem to be totally ignorant. I will ignore your ad hominems for now. > >> Vaccines completely eliminated polio in the Western hemisphrere, > >> nearly completely stopped measles (with all cases from sources [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Get a clue man. The vaccines wiped out the diseases. Have you seen one of my Plutonian ferrets by chance? > >> If you want to decrease the chances of your kid from getting > >> sick or dying, then vaccines are necessary. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > I suggest you look at the evidence at www.cdc.gov. Gee, that's a problem. CDC's governance is largely comprised of former pharmaceutical executives, and for my money, that's not an unbiased source or information. Got anybody remotely independent? > Have you seen one of my Plutonian ferrets by chance? No, at last word they'd caught a ride with Chuckles to Uranus. | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ > In message <1a873489-5abf-435e-8568-57b70dd5c...@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, PeterB wrote: > > > Have you seen one of my Plutonian ferrets by chance? > > No, at last word they'd caught a ride with Chuckles to > Uranus. If that's anything like a black hole, we can talk about the evidence for vaccine effectiveness or safety, both of which appear to have been sucked into another universe. >> In message ><1a873489-5abf-435e-8568-57b70dd5c...@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >for vaccine effectiveness or safety, both of which appear to have been >sucked into another universe. The mere fact that you are impervious to evidence does not mean that evidence is lacking. You've never come up with a plausible explanation for the near- disappearance of polio, measles, mumps, etc from the US. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." -- John Dolan > You've never come up with a plausible explanation for the near- > disappearance of polio, measles, mumps, etc from the US. Sure he has. They didn't. No explanation needed. | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ Troll cleaning. . > You've never come up with a plausible explanation for the near- > disappearance of polio, measles, mumps, etc from the US. Ok, they all just got tired of living here and moved on to another country? They saw your photo, and ran out of the U.S.? They were treated with Accutane by a health professional in N.C., and vanished into thin air? Anyone got any other ideas? Maybe we could go on a measles, mumps and polio hunt to see if we can find them. Where in the world is Carmen ala MeaslesMumpsPolio? >> In message <1a873489-5abf-435e-8568-57b70dd5c...@c65g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, PeterB wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > for vaccine effectiveness or safety, both of which appear to have been > sucked into another universe. Oh, the Francis study is a good start. | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ Troll removal >Troll removal Not that I mind seeing you make a fool of yourself (it seems to be your primary reason for being on m.h.a), but there are two things you should know: 1) empty postings (a reflection of your empty skull) give no context about what it is you're objecting to, and are thus vacuous 2) empty postings do not cause whatever it is you're replying to to disappear -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." -- John Dolan I find him to be kinda cute and funny. Better than your post that are always insulting. > In article <ye-dnUIZUdfSiorVnZ2dnUVZ_q6mn...@giganews.com>, > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." > -- John Dolan >I find him to be kinda cute and funny. Better than your post that are >always insulting. Versus yours, which are merely usually insulting? -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." -- John Dolan >> In article <ye-dnUIZUdfSiorVnZ2dnUVZ_q6mn...@giganews.com>, >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >> 2) empty postings do not cause whatever it is you're replying to to >> disappear Awwwww, now I'm blushing. >I find him to be kinda cute and funny. Better than your post that are > always insulting. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >> "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." >> -- John Dolan > Awwwww, now I'm blushing." "Mission Accomplished!" :o) Im on a mission accomplished kick today.... > >I find him to be kinda cute and funny. Better than your post that are > > always insulting. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > - Show quoted text - > I find him to be kinda cute and funny. Better than your post that are > always insulting. Support > Support LOL, You weren't joking!!! You are so funny. > > I find him to be kinda cute and funny. Better than your post that are > > always insulting. > > Support >>Troll removal > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." > -- John Dolan And the best part is that it bothered you enough that you just had to "comment" about it. AHHHH sweet success! >>>Troll removal >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >And the best part is that it bothered you enough that you just had to >"comment" about it. AHHHH sweet success! Tools, I could tell everyone you're a troll, but it's so much easier to have you just come out and admit it, as you just did. Thanks. You're a peach. (Figures, really. He accuses others of what he does. Classic projection.) -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." -- John Dolan >>>>Troll removal >>> [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > to have you just come out and admit it, as you just did. Thanks. > You're a peach. OK, perhaps you cannot get as high as being a troll. How does azzole fit? > Really? Until the measles vaccine came out, most children got measles. > Now, in the US and other countries where the vast majority of kids do, > almost no kids get measles. Polio was wiped out of the western > hemisphere by vaccines. He denies it -- everyone still gets measles, and since it was never a serious disease nobody thinks twice about it. Or so he says. | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ >> Really? Ever notice all those kids coming down with polio? Staying >> home from school from measles? Having birth defects from rubella? [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > vaccine does is to limit or reduce the severity of a viral infection > (and sometimes it produces symptoms not unlike the disease itself.) And as for the patients with polio-induced respiratory paralysis, well, we just pretend that they don't exist and call it a car wreck or something. The Neuralizer does wonders for the family and friends who don't remember them getting sick. Measles? Indeed -- the memory of parents and doctors in the 1960s was amazingly short. Within three years they completely forgot what that rash reminded them of. Without all the anxiety, kids didn't go blind, deaf, or have other neurological impairment either. All that, and it was just their imaginations. The rubella birth defects, of course, never happened. Pay no attention to the cripples behind the curtain. > Since parents nowadays don't suspect a communicable disease, a child > is rarely presented to a doctor for evaluation. He or she stays out [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > introduced, and for that to happen, severe morbidity had to be > declining, as well. Since this was all just a coincidence, you won't have any trouble at all finding just ONE example from hundreds of combinations where mass vaccination didn't immediately precede a three-sigma drop in the disease it targeted for one of: * polio * diphtheria * pertussis * tetanus * measles * mumps * rubella * Hib * HepB * Meningococcal disease In a country where they've kept reasonably complete records for at least the ten years before and afterward. | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ > > Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not > > likely to be the sole trigger. What's tragic is that vaccine is [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > home from school from measles? Having birth defects from rubella? > Not anymore. Not any more? Did you know that timeline data for all of these proves conclusively that vaccine had nothing to do with those declines? Look it up. When a child contracts a case of measles these days, it's almost certain that it won't be reported due to vaccine bias based on a child's vaccine status, yet the best vaccine can do is to limit or reduce the severity of a viral infection (and sometimes it produces symptoms not unlike the disease itself.) Since parents nowadays don't really suspect a communicable disease, a child is rarely presented to a doctor for evaluation. He or she stays out of school for a day or two with a "flu bug." Even if the child is presented for evaluation, a doctor rarely orders blood work. Again, that is based on vaccine bias. You probably don't know that measles mortality had already declined by 95% before the vaccine was even introduced, and for that to happen, severe morbidity had to be declining, as well. > Vaccines completely eliminated polio in the Western hemisphrere, > nearly completely stopped measles (with all cases from sources > outside the US), decreased invasive Hib disease, nearly eliminated > rubella-related birth defects, decrease the incidence and severity > of chicken pox, decreased the rates of diptheria, tetanus and > purtussis. One of my cousins died at age 3 within an hour of receiving her pertussis vaccine. This was before I was born and people rarely sought legal remedy against medical providers in those days. Both her mother and my mother (who had not yet had children of her own)were devastated by this loss. It's true that such diseases today are not the problem they once were, but vaccine was far too late in the game to explain those declines. Nowadays, we chalk most of our "mystery" bugs up to that "weird flu" going around, but you don't really know. > If you want to decrease the chances of your kid from getting sick > or dying, then vaccines are necessary. Care to back that up with risk-adjusted scientific evidence from a published source? > Did you know that timeline data for all of these proves > conclusively that vaccine had nothing to do with those declines? No, and you're going to avoid presenting anything resembling real data to support your claim too. Instead, it will all be insults directed at distracting from your total lack of facts. (Measles, United States) Year Cases Deaths 1950 319,124 1951 530,118 1952 683,077 1953 449,146 1954 682,720 1955 555,156 1956 611,936 1957 486,799 1958 763,094 1959 406,162 1960 441,703 380 1961 423,919 434 1962 481,530 408 1963 385,156 364 1964 458,083 421 1965 261,904 276 1966 204,136 261 1967 62,705 81 1968 22,231 24 1969 25,826 41 1970 47,351 89 1971 75,290 90 1972 32,275 24 1973 26,690 23 1974 22,094 20 1975 24,374 20 1976 41,126 12 1977 57,345 15 1978 26,871 11 1979 13,597 6 | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | +--- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ---+ > In message <e5187787-2f0b-4919-aa68-912a82ae2...@b64g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, PeterB wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > real data to support your claim too. Instead, it will all be > insults directed at distracting from your total lack of facts. Is that supposed to be an argument? The table of data you yourself provided to your buddy Myrl was incomplete and fails to show measles progression prior to introduction of vaccine. I'm sure it was an "honest" mistake, right Dougie? > (Measles, United States) > Year Cases Deaths [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > | sh.t happens. Sometimes it happens to you. | > +--- D. C. Sessions <d...@lumbercartel.com> ---+ >Vaccine is certainly implicated in autism even if it's not likely to >be the sole trigger. Accused is not the same as implicated. >What's tragic is that vaccine is so completely >unncessary and without scientific basis. So you keep claiming. Since you're immune to evidence, so you'll go on claiming. In your spare time, please explain whatever happened to measles in the US. Without resorting to self-invented concepts like "subclinical measles," I mean. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." -- John Dolan > In article > <abc261d3-5935-4d19-b9f0-661da814d6f4@59g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > US. Without resorting to self-invented concepts like "subclinical > measles," I mean. David, how bout YOU take as many vacs as you please and leave the other people alone? Don't start with that BS about it only works if everyone takes it. Such a plan worked out well for Jim Jones now didn't it? >> In article >> <abc261d3-5935-4d19-b9f0-661da814d6f4@59g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >David, how bout YOU take as many vacs as you please and leave the other >people alone? You're free to not read my posts. I invite you to start immediately if they bother you so much. > Don't start with that BS about it only works if everyone takes >it. Such a plan worked out well for Jim Jones now didn't it? You must have spent your time away from m.h.a taking a course in how not to make any sense. You apparently finished at the top of your class. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." -- John Dolan >> Don't start with that BS about it only works if everyone takes >>it. Such a plan worked out well for Jim Jones now didn't it? > > You must have spent your time away from m.h.a taking a course in how > not to make any sense. You apparently finished at the top of your > class. David, you should not take more than one stupid pill a day. >>> Don't start with that BS about it only works if everyone takes >>>it. Such a plan worked out well for Jim Jones now didn't it? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> >David, you should not take more than one stupid pill a day. I'll follow your advice, since I see you're speaking from direct personal experience (when you wrote your previous posting). The Jonestown massacre has nothing to do with vaccination, and your silly attempt to generate the analogy doesn't change that. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." -- John Dolan >>>> Don't start with that BS about it only works if everyone takes >>>>it. Such a plan worked out well for Jim Jones now didn't it? [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." > -- John Dolan So how bout this. You take all the vaccines that my family has not taken. That way you can be really safe! >>>>> Don't start with that BS about it only works if everyone takes >>>>>it. Such a plan worked out well for Jim Jones now didn't it? [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >So how bout this. You take all the vaccines that my family has not taken. >That way you can be really safe! I know that even you are not dumb enough to mean that seriously, so I assume you're trying to be funny. You're not succeeding. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "There are two kinds of Republicans: millionaires and suckers." -- John Dolan > >> Don't start with that BS about it only works if everyone takes > >>it. Such a plan worked out well for Jim Jones now didn't it? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > David, you should not take more than one stupid pill a day. Speaking from personal experience, I see. On Apr 25, 8:41 am, "news" <tool...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Don't start with that BS about it only works if everyone takes > >>it. Such a plan worked out well for Jim Jones now didn't it? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > David, you should not take more than one stupid pill a day. >Speaking from personal experience, I see. >In your dreams Boo Boo. > On Apr 25, 8:41 am, "news" <tool...@gmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > David, you should not take more than one stupid pill a day. > >Speaking from personal experience, I see. > In your dreams Boo Boo. (Attributions corrected). No, I do not dream of you. Reading your illogic is a "daymare." And, do not take any more stupid pills. You have more than a lifetime supply in you. And, short of cephalectomy, cleansing will not work. >> On Apr 25, 8:41 am, "news" <tool...@gmail.com> wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > And, do not take any more stupid pills. You have more than a lifetime > supply in you. And, short of cephalectomy, cleansing will not work. So, Mark, have you been talking to the mirror for a long time? Or is it something you only do while on the internet? |
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