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Medical Forum / General / Alternative / March 2008Germany to double benefits for thalidomide victims
Germany to double benefits for thalidomide victims Posted : Wed, 27 Feb 2008 14:37:05 GMT Author : DPA Category : Health The Earth Times Berlin - After a public outcry against Germany's limited help for aging thalidomide victims, the country's two ruling parties agreed Wednesday to double the monthly stipend paid to people disabled by the drug. Put on the market in October 1957 by the Gruenenthal company of Germany, the sedative caused an estimated 10,000 unborn children around the world to develop without full arms, legs and other organs. Victims say that as they near the age of 50 and their parents die off, they need extra help to relieve sore joints and compensate for a life of poor earnings. Volker Kauder, head of the Christian Democratic Union (CDU) federal caucus, said talks with the Social Democatic Party (SPD) had produced agreement to appropriate 15 million euros (22 million dollars) annually to increase the state-backed stipends. Currently the 2,870 victims in Germany receive a stipend of up to 545 euros monthly depending on their degree of disability from a trust fund set up by Gruenenthal and the German government. The children were born disabled after their mothers took the drug as a remedy for morning sickness. The over-the-counter remedy was taken off the market and better drug regulation introduced round the globe. German victims have demanded a tripling of the stipend, saying victims in Britain and elsewhere were compensated better. Spanish victims have only recently begun a legal fight for compensation. Article : Germany to double benefits for thalidomide victims © 2008 www.earthtimes.org The Earth Times > Germany to double benefits for thalidomide victims > Posted : Wed, 27 Feb 2008 > 14:37:05 GMT > Author : DPA > Category : Health > The Earth Times Isn't this interesting? And just think, big pharma is trying to get thalidomide back in use. I wonder what the compensation will be for all the millions of kids who have become autistic from thimerosal and other toxic ingredients in vaccines? You know: The MMR can cause painful enteritis, and inflammation of the intestines. The diptheria toxoid causes encephalitis, brain swelling, and gives the kids the world's worst migraine where they cry and scream for hours. The thimerosal and mercury? How knows how much harm occurs? Perhaps 1 in 6 US kids suffer a neurological disorder? ( CDC data ) DrCee You cannot secure nor restore health with pus or poisons. > Isn't this interesting? And just think, big pharma is trying to get > thalidomide back in use. "Back" is the wrong word, since the same FDA that you insist is so in the pockets of the pharmaceutical companies never allowed it to be used in the USA. It's also quite a ways past being patentable -- so according to your dogma the pharmaceutical companies should be uninterested. Which, as it happens, they are. The ones interested in using it are actually clinical practitioners. It seems that it's about the only pain control that works in some kinds of terminal cancer and a few rare geriatric conditions. Despite this being known for the last 30+ years and pressure from medical groups, the FDA has been quite adamant. There is research going on right now for its use in chemotherapy, but chemo and pregnancy don't get along anyway. Thalidomide is the least of the issues there, and as it happens thalidomide doesn't harm fetuses unless the mother is also B-vitamin deficient (imagine that -- a nutritional solution used by mainstream medicine. That's another violation of MHA dogma -- three in one post!) If you're worried about the birth defects in the unplanned child borne by a 73-year old man with terminal cancer, let me know -- contraception may be an option, but it might not work in the face of supernatural opposition. | The most important exclamation in science isn't "Eureka!" | | The most important exclamation is "What the BLEEP?" | +---------- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ----------+ >If you're worried about the birth defects in the unplanned >child borne by a 73-year old man with terminal cancer, let >me know -- contraception may be an option, but it might not >work in the face of supernatural opposition. One of the "deaths" screeched about by the opponents of HPV vaccine was a 77 year old man, so some anti-medicine people seem to believe that elderly men have child-bearing capability. Thalidomide is being tested for the treatment of multiple myeloma, among other diseases. Saying that patients in the trials are severely discouraged from falling pregnant is an understatement.  SignaturePeter Bowditch aa #2243 The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles Australian Council Against Health Fraud http://www.acahf.org.au Australian Skeptics http://www.skeptics.com.au To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com > Thalidomide is being tested for the treatment of multiple myeloma, > among other diseases. Saying that patients in the trials are severely > discouraged from falling pregnant is an understatement. As I understand it, the original problem was that there are two possible outcomes of the process that produce thalidomide. The approved process selects only one, which is quite safe and nonteratogenic. The knock-off process used in Eastern Europe in the 60s (that Bob Finkbine brought home, for instance) has both, and it's the secondary one that limits angiogenesis. Well, again as I understand it, the primary variant is the one used for pain control and the secondary is now being studied for blocking tumor vascularization. If not for the culpable sloppiness of the knock-off production and its tragic effects, there's no telling how long it would have been before the therapeutic effect would have been found. Another faintly-silver lining is that we learned a LOT about fetal development from that episode. By no means worth the suffering but there it is anyway, sort of like the medical advances that come out of wars. | The most important exclamation in science isn't "Eureka!" | | The most important exclamation is "What the BLEEP?" | +---------- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ----------+ > In message <lqces3lrfqsagf0djecab7ihh1qb00h...@4ax.com>, Peter Bowditch wrote: > Another faintly-silver lining is that we learned a LOT about > fetal development from that episode. By no means worth the [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > | The most important exclamation is "What the BLEEP?" | > +---------- D. C. Sessions <d...@lumbercartel.com> ----------+ So tell us, what medical advances came from the Nazi's medical research in the death camps? DrCee You cannot secure nor restore health with pus and poisons >> In message <lqces3lrfqsagf0djecab7ihh1qb00h...@4ax.com>, Peter Bowditch wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > So tell us, what medical advances came from the Nazi's medical > research in the death camps? Thank you Dr. Godwin. | The most important exclamation in science isn't "Eureka!" | | The most important exclamation is "What the BLEEP?" | +---------- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ----------+ On Feb 28, 8:03 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > > In message <lqces3lrfqsagf0djecab7ihh1qb00h...@4ax.com>, Peter Bowditch wrote: > > Another faintly-silver lining is that we learned a LOT about [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > So tell us, what medical advances came from the Nazi's medical > research in the death camps? Ha! Ha! Ha! Schmuckie, the "medical" advisor of the the Merchants of Disease, Diability and Death, is desperate. He has run out of drivel. On Feb 28, 5:23 pm, Peter Bowditch > Thalidomide is being tested for the treatment of multiple myeloma, > among other diseases. Saying that patients in the trials are severely > discouraged from falling pregnant is an understatement. Indeed it is but I am INTRIGUED, my dear Bowditch, by a system of science that develops a drug for morning sickness in pregnant women which eventually produced thousands of horribly deformed babies and then this drug gets reconsidered for myelomas and other diseases. Now if Homeopathy had produced such deformities you would have screamed bloody murder, YOU WOULD HAVE screamed for the total abandonment and even outlawing of this system of medicine. And YET, here... we see the tacit acceptance of this perfidious and unscientific trialism at the expense of human life so matter of factly that I'll bet NOBODY even notices. Well YOU certainly don't. "Oh yes everyone", Bowditch might say, "Thalidomide is being tested and developed for other useful purposes, SEE HOW USEFUL IT MIGHT STILL BE??" OH NO, Bowditch, we DON'T QUITE see that usefulness, NOR THE INCREDIBLE PRICE IN HUMAN SUFFERING THAT SUCH "DEVELOPMENTS" ENTAIL. Citizen Jimserac > Indeed it is but I am INTRIGUED, my dear > Bowditch, by a system of science that [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > and then this drug gets reconsidered > for myelomas and other diseases. It wasn't a morning sickness drug. It was a tranquilizer, and in fact it's a good one. The antiangiogenic factor is a side-effect of a manufacturing impurity which isn't present in the originally tested and marketed drug, and which doesn't manifest unless the mother is also B-vitamin deficient. Please recall that this was half a century ago. There have been a few things learned in the meantime, not a few motivated by the desire to avoid repetitions. > Now if Homeopathy had produced such deformities > you would have screamed bloody murder, > YOU WOULD HAVE screamed for the > total abandonment and even outlawing of > this system of medicine. Citing your own speculations as evidence? Sorry, I call BS. | The most important exclamation in science isn't "Eureka!" | | The most important exclamation is "What the BLEEP?" | +---------- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ----------+ > It wasn't a morning sickness drug. It was a tranquilizer, > and in fact it's a good one. The antiangiogenic factor is > a side-effect of a manufacturing impurity which isn't present > in the originally tested and marketed drug, and which doesn't > manifest unless the mother is also B-vitamin deficient. Oh so? Here is what the FDA web site says: from http://www.fda.gov/cder/news/thalidomide.htm Thalidomide (tha-lid-o-mide) was first marketed in Europe in the late 1950's. It was used as a sleeping pill and to treat morning sickness during pregnancy. At that time no one knew thalidomide caused birth defects. > Please recall that this was half a century ago. There have > been a few things learned in the meantime, not a few > motivated by the desire to avoid repetitions. Yes and no Sessions. I understand the import of what you say that there have been numerous improvements in testing procdures and so forth, yes of course agreed. BUT... I can't help thinking that the fundamental procedures of drug discovery and testing, the basic philolsophy of it, have not changed all that much in the last half century - ELSE there would not still be Vioxx and Fen Fen and all these other HUNDREDS of drugs with BAD side effects that MUST be withdrawn. > > Now if Homeopathy had produced such deformities > > you would have screamed bloody murder, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Sorry, I call BS. NO PROBLEM Sessions because there is a lot of BS going around in this newsgroup on one side or another. Now to the key point -> how can the anti-Homeopathists, SUCH AS BOWDITCH, raise a hell and hoopla about the possiblity of deleterious effects from Homeopathic remedies with NO MOLECULES of an active substance in them, and YET REMAIN QUIET ABOUT THE TERRIBLE EFFECTS CAUSED BY SOME DRUGS. Are people somehow expendable so long as its standard medical pharmaceuticals being developed? JUST BLIND AND QUIET acceptance of the status quo with regards to standard drug development. AND, astoundingly, after killing or maiming thousands of babies, the attitude is, OH WELL, LOOK IT MIGHT STILL BE GOOD FOR THIS OTHER CONDITION, SO LONG AS PREGNANT WOMEN DON'T TAKE IT(!!). I OBJECT. I object to this double standard which allows almost any bad effect on people for one system of medicine but yells bloody murder for the slightest deleterious effect from another system. THAT is A DOUBLE STANDARD and THAT is UNACCEPTABLE. If the anti-Homeopathists WANT TO CONVINCE US OF THEIR UNMITIGATED CONCERN FOR HUMANITY, THEN THEY MUST CONDEMN STANDARD PHARMACEUTICAL TESTING PROCEDURES AND PHILOSOPHIES THAT HAVE LED TO THE LIKES OF THALIDOMIDE. I don't think the anti-Homeopathists are going do this AT ALL... but they SHOULD. Eh? Citizen Jimserac On Feb 28, 3:29 pm, drcee...@insightbb.com wrote: > > Germany to double benefits for thalidomide victims > > Posted : Wed, 27 Feb 2008 [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Isn't this interesting? And just think, big pharma is trying to get > thalidomide back in use. Once again, Not-A-docotor of Anything Schmuckie shows his stupidity. Thalidomide has been shown to be effective against Leprosy and is being used to treat Multiple Myeloma. The use in pregnancy will never return. What an a.shole. > I wonder what the compensation will be for all the millions of kids > who have become autistic from thimerosal and other toxic ingredients > in vaccines? In the rare case, expenses, etc. And the attorney make a mint, along with the experts. > You know: > The MMR can cause painful enteritis, and inflammation of the > intestines. Sure, Not-A-Doctor. > The diptheria toxoid causes encephalitis, brain swelling, and gives > the kids the world's worst migraine where they cry and scream for > hours. > The thimerosal and mercury? How knows how much harm occurs? None has, none will. Perhaps > 1 in 6 US kids suffer a neurological disorder? ( CDC data ) > > DrCee > You cannot secure nor restore health with pus or poisons. Dr.Schmuckie, "medical" advisor to the Merchants of Disease, Disability and Death. >> Germany to double benefits for thalidomide victims >> Posted : Wed, 27 Feb 2008 [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >who have become autistic from thimerosal and other toxic ingredients >in vaccines? The number of such kids is tiny, not in the millions. >You know: >The MMR can cause painful enteritis, and inflammation of the >intestines. Measles can kill. Mumps can leave males sterile. >The diptheria toxoid causes encephalitis, brain swelling, and gives >the kids the world's worst migraine where they cry and scream for >hours. >The thimerosal and mercury? How knows how much harm occurs? Perhaps >1 in 6 US kids suffer a neurological disorder? ( CDC data ) Oh, the thimerosal that's out of the childhood vaccines (except flu). Gee, it'll have a hard time hurting anyone when they don't receive it. -- David Wright :: alphabeta at copper.net These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "Without Bush, what will America's schoolchildren have to look down on?" -- Bill Maher >>The thimerosal and mercury? How knows how much harm occurs? Perhaps >>1 in 6 US kids suffer a neurological disorder? ( CDC data ) > > Oh, the thimerosal that's out of the childhood vaccines (except flu). > Gee, it'll have a hard time hurting anyone when they don't receive it. This is MHA: the less there is of it, the more effect it has. | The most important exclamation in science isn't "Eureka!" | | The most important exclamation is "What the BLEEP?" | +---------- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> ----------+ |
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