Now for what Rich said:

Please humor me and give the definition again

That is a LIE. If it existed, you could post it. Your statement that it has
been posted eight times, or even once, is not true until you PROVE IT. No
peer-reviewed research necessary. Just post it here, and I'll admit I'm
wrong. But that won't happen, because THE DEFINITION DOES NOT EXIST!

(As all can Rich,  is NOT capable of that, he also skips right over the fact
it he couldn't find it, and the fact it was post eight tines, just as I
said. He said, I was lying) Now watch him get ridiculous with questions.

Now for what was said, and what Marvin said, and there most certainly is an
*organization* and Rich has made a false statement that has been repeated,
repeatedly. And He KNOWS it.

     Jan   Aug 24 2004, 10:16 pm     show options

     Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
     From: jdrew63...@aol.com (Jan) - Find messages by this author
     Date: 25 Aug 2004 02:16:08 GMT
     Local: Tues,Aug 24 2004 10:16 pm
     Subject: Re: We've Been Here Before
     Reply to Author | Forward | Print | Individual Message | Show original

Orac failed to answer this time also. Just believe Rich's lies, but never
back
up any claims.

Subject: Re: "lies" vs "errors"

- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

From: Jan (jdrew63...@aol.com)
Subject: Re: Why Amalgam?
Newsgroups: sci.med.dentistry
Date: 2003-09-01 22:27:29 PST

You must not be aware of my posts of MHA. It is *organized* medicine that is
evil, not conventional. I know quite a few good dedicated doctors and Thank
God
for them. Here are a few of my posts that will hopefully help you to
understand
my position.

From: Jan (jdrew63...@aol.com)
Subject: Re: Medical Errors Kill up to 98,000 Hospitalized Americans per
Year/
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Date: 2002-02-15 18:15:56 PST

Someone asked :

It's the organization itself that is evil. Going way back you'll learn how
they
operate. How they control using politics. Controlling what is taught in
medical
schools. Suppressings of alternatives. Ye good ole boy club EGO thing. There
are many good and dedicated medical people in conventional medicine, that
are
NOT members of the organization.

We have a few examples of organized members right here. Take a look at how
Peter B. lied in his article on Ben Kolb. Then there are those who defend
his
lies. Another is Peter Moran. He denies anything that doesn't come from
organized medicine. The NCAHF and Stephen Barrett play a big role. Who
suffers
from all of this? The American people.

From: Jan (jdrew63...@aol.com)
Subject: Re: Re Why are people turning to alt. medicine?
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Date: 2002-02-02 19:24:24 PST

That's where everyone takes me wrong. I have often explained that I
appreciate the many dedicated doctors we have and the wonderful technology.
NOT all doctors or medical people are a part of the organization. As a
matter of
fact many fight against it and can tell some whoppers.The*organization*
itself
is where the evil lies. Read about it in Racketeering in Medicine.

What is so strange about that? I have stated many times the evils of
organized medicine, I have also stated that there are many good dedicated
doctors who carry a huge responsibility, and THANK GOD for them. My young
doctor is very dedicated as is my CRA's hubby who just graduated from med
school. Both will tell you the evils of organized medicine.

My heart goes out to the dedicated medical people, God Bless them.

I can see how you would get that idea for just one post. However previously
I have made it plain that I appreciated the great responsibility of
dedicated doctors. It is the *organization* that is the problem. Many
doctors
are NOT apart of it, and they will tell you of even more of the evils.

Bad doctors? To answer your question. Yes I would either call 911 or rush
the
child to the ER room. And I would greatly appreciated the doctor who could
help  my child. Where do you get the idea that I think all doctors are bad?
I
have often said there are MANY dedicated doctors who carry a great
responsibility,,,,,,,,,and THANK GOD for them.

! It is organized medicine that I believe is relentless NOT individual
doctors! I happen to know and APPRECIATE many dedicated doctors.

. Just reading the history of *organized* medcine is an eye opener.
That certainly doesn't mean that we don't have very good dedicated doctors
that carry a great responsibility. Thank God for them. My concerns are that
there are many good alternative methods that are working, but are not being
accepted because they didn't come from the organization. In reading the
history
The AMA tried to buy the methods they knew were working and when the seller
refused, he was told his method would never see the light of day. Then they
set
out to ruin him personally One of these stories is about Dr Semmelweis who
introduced hand washing. He got the same treatment. One fair and honest
doctor
said, let's give this young man a chance. After taking away his privileges
and
trying to ruin him, he was later considered to be one of the best surgeons
in
the world. The hesitation on the part of organized medicine cost some lives.

God Bless those many dedicated doctors who carry a great responsibility and
do their best by their patients.The problem is, there is *organized*
medicine.
They would like to stop anything alt. and call it BS WITHOUT any proof.

Organized medicine does not mean we don't have very dedicated doctors. It
is much the same as politics. Anyone one who believes it isn't organized
should talk to a new dcotor who has just graduated. Medicine is indeed
organized mainly for control.

That's correct, never have. I know a lot of doctors who are NOT a
part of organized medicine. They can tell you even MORE of the evils. And
thank
God for dedicated doctors. Perhaps you overlooked that in my posts?

Not by me they're not. I respect good doctors. Many have certainly
earned respect. I have a neighbor who is in his third year of med school. He
is working very hard and is a great guy. He also believes in alternative.
That's what I like to see.

Agreed! I just hope that both can keep an open mind. Both my Aunt and Uncle
have had back and neck surgery and they are doing fine. The surgeon is a
great
guy and took time with the family after each operation.

Well you are wrong. I have never said I despised doctors, quite the
contary. Both my Aunt and Uncle recently had necessary surgery and the
surgeon
was a wonderful man who did a wonderful job.

How very true. For example one might think that I hate all MD's. Not so, I
am grateful for the good ones. My Aunt had back surgery this week. Her
surgeon
was wonderful! He drew us a diagram of what he did, and took time for all
our
questions. Next day, I called and someone answered.  We were cutting up as
he
told me he was Bubba.(I didn't know I was talking to the doc) He then said,
Oh
yeah this is Jan who is going to clean her house for the next two months.
He had picked up on the teasing of the day before when I told my uncle, that
I DIDN'T do dishes. A really nice guy who did a great job and very down to
earth. Wouldn't it be great if we could know the thoughts behind the words
here??
====

****Now, I will expect you to correct your mistake.******

******At this present time, May 23, I am happy to say HE was MY
surgeon!!!!!*******

===

From Marvin:

Jan,

  I agree this is often true. However, inasmuch as you note that there are
good doctors who are NOT a part of the problem, and there is nothing you can
do
to change the rest of them, I believe your efforts would be more productive
in
praising the good ones than in condemning the bad ones. God knows they need
our
support!

I replied:

Oh I do. Thank God for them. However just praising the good ones does
nothing
for the DENIAL of many REAL diseases. People need to be informed. My new
young
doctor didn't roll her eyes at me when I told her I was seeing an
alt.practitioner. *I* made the decision to remove the metal from my mouth,
AFTER doing my own research. Then I asked her to test my mercury level, and
she
monitored it all along. When I first told her I thought it might be the
problem, she said she had heard of it. After seeing my mercury level drop,
she
is now a believer that it can and does happen.I was lucky, because many
times
the mercury doesn't even show if it is deeply embedded in the tissue. People
need to know, NOT to stop searching. Many accept whatever the doctors tell
them,,,,,,,,,,,we can't find anything wrong. So they give up! Some of these
people have peripheral neuropathy. The doctors just say, live with it. Some
of
these people are now on morphine pumps.
====

You see, Rich is DISHONEST, he didn't tell it all, he didn't apologize, he
further LIED saying this is no organization, and there was no definition.

So much for Rich Shewmaker.

LL/Jan