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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / AIDS / April 2008

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Retarded HIV scientist working together

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Martin - 19 Apr 2008 15:25 GMT
HIV science is running scared.  Retarded HIV scientists are now having
to group together to keep their dream alive.

Death, you asked in another thread about who says HIV kills.  This
article also contains this: "Haynes said the new mission is an old
one: Tackle basic questions about the virus, which killed 2.1 million
people worldwide last year."

The phrase "back to basics," which is mentioned here, seems to be
appearing in quite a lot of HIV articles now.  It's an obvious
recognition by HIV science that it's got things wrong and that the
past 25 years have been a waste of time, money and life.  I suspect
these boffins know they've made a dreadful mistake and have began on a
course that will eventually see the link between HIV and AIDS broken.

<http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1042765.html>:

----- Begin Quote -----

The world's hope of beating HIV centers on a team of Triangle-based
scientists.

The Center for HIV/AIDS Vaccine Immunology, headquartered at Duke
University and drawing on researchers at Duke, UNC-Chapel Hill and
more than 30 other universities, formed in 2005. This week, the center
announced it will add even more brainpower with the addition of an
international research consortium, signaling the mounting pressure to
discover a vaccine.

The center and a privately funded research group, International AIDS
Vaccine Initiative, agreed to cooperate, saying that the moral
obligation to find a vaccine is too pressing for anyone to work alone.

"...retards work in this field," said Dr. Barton Haynes, the center's
director and professor of medicine at Duke University Medical Center.

[...]

Such collaboration is unprecedented. It's also imperative, Haynes
said.

"The science is daunting," said Haynes. "The bug had escaped and
eluded us so many times. It's pretty audacious."

For nearly 25 years, HIV has outwitted scientists trying to stop the
spread of the virus that causes AIDS. The latest setback: a vaccine
that not only didn't work, it appeared to make otherwise healthy
patients more likely to contract HIV.

Two trials tested the vaccine, drawing on participants in North and
South America, the Caribbean, Australia and South Africa.

Each was to have 3,000 participants. When researchers noticed the
troubling results in one of the trials last fall, clinicians halted
the other study.

For nearly 25 years, HIV has outwitted scientists trying to stop the
spread of the virus that causes AIDS. The latest setback: a vaccine
that not only didn't work, it appeared to make otherwise healthy
patients more likely to contract HIV.

Two trials tested the vaccine, drawing on participants in North and
South America, the Caribbean, Australia and South Africa.

Each was to have 3,000 participants. When researchers noticed the
troubling results in one of the trials last fall, clinicians halted
the other study.

Back to basics

Haynes said the new mission is an old one: Tackle basic questions
about the virus, which killed 2.1 million people worldwide last year.

[...]

Scientists at the center are working to better understand what's
happening in the initial hours when HIV invades a healthy person. They
are exploring genetic differences between those whose immune systems
thwart the virus and those infected. Scientists have tried to get a
picture of the virus in its native form so they can create antibodies
to spot it.

Dr. Myron Cohen, a center leader and director of the Center for
Infectious Diseases at UNC-CH, said the scientific work being done now
is essential for breakthroughs to come. "It's been like putting
glasses on," Cohen said. "We can finally see the face of our challenge
specifically."

Even before Merck & Co. announced last month it would halt its vaccine
trial, many HIV researchers were aware of the drug's shortcomings. Yet
the failure still stung. Researchers mourned the money spent and the
lives lost while scientists chased medicine that didn't work.

"The HIV vaccine is our holy grail," Cohen said. "We spend $1.3
billion a year. It hurts when it doesn't work."

----- End Quote -----
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4,845 days and counting...

Death - 20 Apr 2008 18:05 GMT
> HIV science is running scared.  Retarded HIV scientists are now having
> to group together to keep their dream alive.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> one: Tackle basic questions about the virus, which killed 2.1 million
> people worldwide last year."

http://gaylife.about.com/od/hivaid1/HIV_AIDS.htm?iam=momma_100_SKD&terms=hiv
Martin - 20 Apr 2008 18:40 GMT
>http://gaylife.about.com/od/hivaid1/HIV_AIDS.htm?iam=momma_100_SKD&terms=hiv

----- Begin Quote -----

The latest scoreboard has over 40 million people infected and 0 cured!

----- End Quote -----

Is the rest of the 'information' on that page just as inaccurate?
Signature

<http://www.hiv-poz.co.uk/>
Moible: +447804573139
4,846 days and counting...

Death - 20 Apr 2008 20:32 GMT
>>http://gaylife.about.com/od/hivaid1/HIV_AIDS.htm?iam=momma_100_SKD&terms=hiv
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> Is the rest of the 'information' on that page just as inaccurate?

Do you know of hiv being cured?
Perhaps you doubt that over the past 25 years
40 million have been infected.

Do share the accurate information you have
Martin - 20 Apr 2008 22:25 GMT
>>>http://gaylife.about.com/od/hivaid1/HIV_AIDS.htm?iam=momma_100_SKD&terms=hiv
>>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>>
>> Is the rest of the 'information' on that page just as inaccurate?

>Do you know of hiv being cured?

There are cases of people being diagnosed HIV antibody positive, and
sometime later testing HIV antibody negative.  Are they cured?

I don't know of anyone having HIV, which explains why cleaver HIV
boffins constantly fail to develop a treatment for, or vaccine
against, their virus.

A big problem with the HIV theory is that if you believe in it, you
must also believe I have HIV  Given my remarkable good health record,
and the failed predictions of doom from my HIV doctors, I think that's
extremely unlikely.

>Perhaps you doubt that over the past 25 years
>40 million have been infected.

I more than doubt it.  I know it's a lie.  I'm surprised anyone who's
been reading the messages I post here would question my disbelief in
HIV.

>Do share the accurate information you have

I've been writing about, and discussing the failure of, HIV science
here for over a year.

"Accurate information" about HIV is impossible to find, unless you
choose to believe thief and liar Robert Gallo.  For it's his research
that's the basis of the HIV fantasy.

Or, perhaps, you choose to believe the HIV random number generator
used by the WHO and UNAIDS to predict their HIV pandemic?

I've posted hundreds of articles here about HIV failures and lies.  Do
you have any HIV success stories to tell us about?
Signature

<http://www.hiv-poz.co.uk/>
Moible: +447804573139
4,846 days and counting...

Death - 21 Apr 2008 04:25 GMT
>>>>http://gaylife.about.com/od/hivaid1/HIV_AIDS.htm?iam=momma_100_SKD&terms=hiv
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> There are cases of people being diagnosed HIV antibody positive, and
> sometime later testing HIV antibody negative.  Are they cured?

No, they just took a shitty test, one time or the other.

> I don't know of anyone having HIV, which explains why cleaver HIV
> boffins constantly fail to develop a treatment for, or vaccine
> against, their virus.

So the articles you posted saying some of the meds were actually
causing HIV was bullshit?

> A big problem with the HIV theory is that if you believe in it, you
> must also believe I have HIV

Well now.......are you saying you are not and have not been HIV
positive 4,846 days and counting..........?
That is your claim is it not?

>Given my remarkable good health record,
> and the failed predictions of doom from my HIV doctors, I think that's
> extremely unlikely.

Your good health is great, but that has what to do with the millions
who do not enjoy good health? Is it your argument that you feel
fine so it follows they are all full of sh.t?

>>Perhaps you doubt that over the past 25 years
>>40 million have been infected.
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> I've been writing about, and discussing the failure of, HIV science
> here for over a year.

Indeed you have. Your mainstay has been, I don't have a cold
therefore colds don't exsist.
Millions suffer colds, there is no cure for the virus that causes
colds but the cold buffons keep sticking meds down peoples throat
and giving them colds to keep the cold lie going.........blah blah blah

> "Accurate information" about HIV is impossible to find, unless you
> choose to believe thief and liar Robert Gallo.  For it's his research
> that's the basis of the HIV fantasy.

No, as an undertaker I see with my own eyes.
I hear from the family how a 210 lb male melted to 105 lbs
with my own ears.

> Or, perhaps, you choose to believe the HIV random number generator
> used by the WHO and UNAIDS to predict their HIV pandemic?

Random as far as predicting the future numbers.
Behavior can off-set that tremendously.

> I've posted hundreds of articles here about HIV failures and lies.  Do
> you have any HIV success stories to tell us about?

There are none, which is exactly the point of the article
you questioned.............
Martin - 21 Apr 2008 15:28 GMT
>>>Do you know of hiv being cured?

>> There are cases of people being diagnosed HIV antibody positive, and
>> sometime later testing HIV antibody negative.  Are they cured?

>No, they just took a shitty test, one time or the other.

More than one shitty test in some cases.

Would you explain why you believe having particular antibodies, in
this case those allegedly associated with HIV, is something that needs
to be "cured?"

>> I don't know of anyone having HIV, which explains why cleaver HIV
>> boffins constantly fail to develop a treatment for, or vaccine
>> against, their virus.

>So the articles you posted saying some of the meds were actually
>causing HIV was bullshit?

I don't believe HIV drugs cause HIV.  Sometimes I adopt a
tongue-in-cheek writing style to highlight how HIV drugs cause
symptoms and problems they are suppose to prevent.

>> A big problem with the HIV theory is that if you believe in it, you
>> must also believe I have HIV

>Well now.......are you saying you are not and have not been HIV
>positive 4,846 days and counting..........?
>That is your claim is it not?

I'm drawing attention to the fact that I was diagnosed HIV+ nearly
five thousands days ago; during that time I have not had ONE SINGLE
symptom related to HIV.  Don't forget this is the amount of time I've
been diagnosed HIV+.  If you believe I have HIV, you have to accept
that I've had it at least six months longer than that.

>>Given my remarkable good health record,
>> and the failed predictions of doom from my HIV doctors, I think that's
>> extremely unlikely.

>Your good health is great, but that has what to do with the millions
>who do not enjoy good health? Is it your argument that you feel
>fine so it follows they are all full of sh.t?

Is HIV really making millions of people around the world sick?  A
constant stream of HIV data predictions tell us the virus is so
innocuous that millions of the infected don't even realise they have
it.

As I've mentioned before, there are incentives, such as free health
care and social security benefits, to encourage HIVers to talk up the
virus and talk down their health.

>> I've been writing about, and discussing the failure of, HIV science
>> here for over a year.

>Indeed you have. Your mainstay has been, I don't have a cold
>therefore colds don't exsist.
>Millions suffer colds, there is no cure for the virus that causes
>colds but the cold buffons keep sticking meds down peoples throat
>and giving them colds to keep the cold lie going.........blah blah blah

>> "Accurate information" about HIV is impossible to find, unless you
>> choose to believe thief and liar Robert Gallo.  For it's his research
>> that's the basis of the HIV fantasy.

>No, as an undertaker I see with my own eyes.
>I hear from the family how a 210 lb male melted to 105 lbs
>with my own ears.

Your previous analogy suggests my personal experience is of no worth,
however you put forward your own to justify your belief in HIV.

I wouldn't feel too sorry for these family members.  They're often the
very people who persuaded the deceased to pop the HIV wonder pills
that lead to his death.

>> Or, perhaps, you choose to believe the HIV random number generator
>> used by the WHO and UNAIDS to predict their HIV pandemic?

>Random as far as predicting the future numbers.
>Behavior can off-set that tremendously.

LOL.  Even the past and current numbers are only estimates.  How many
people worldwide have been DIAGNOSED HIV+?

>> I've posted hundreds of articles here about HIV failures and lies.  Do
>> you have any HIV success stories to tell us about?

>There are none, which is exactly the point of the article
>you questioned.............

So it's "back to basics."  I think we're being prepped for the
revelation that HIV does not cause AIDS.
Signature

<http://www.hiv-poz.co.uk/>
Moible: +447804573139
4,847 days and counting...

Death - 21 Apr 2008 17:18 GMT
"Martin" <martin@hiv-poz.co.uk> wrote in message

>"Death" <Death@yourdoor.net>
>
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> this case those allegedly associated with HIV, is something that needs
> to be "cured?"

A cure for anti-bodies, I never made that comment.
The development of antibodies to a particular antigen (infectious organism)
in this case HIV...........

Seroconversion......... a part of the immune response.
People develop antibodies to HIV, when they "seroconvert"
from antibody-negative to antibody-positive.

>>Well now.......are you saying you are not and have not been HIV
>>positive 4,846 days and counting..........?
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
>
> Your previous analogy suggests my personal experience is of no worth,

You have mis-under-stood completely.
I allow much weight to your comments.

I just can't let you speak to the millions
from just personal experience.

> however you put forward your own to justify your belief in HIV.

Recall that I said, hiv is no killer.
There is more at work than hiv.
Now we came full circle to what I do say........
hiv plus and oi equates to aids, and that kills.
Martin - 21 Apr 2008 21:46 GMT
>"Martin" <martin@hiv-poz.co.uk> wrote in message

>A cure for anti-bodies, I never made that comment.
>The development of antibodies to a particular antigen (infectious organism)
>in this case HIV...........

HIV is diagnosed solely based on the presence of antibodies to a
particular antigen.  Does it not follow that the absence of these
particular antibodies demonstrates the absence of HIV?  Or do you
question the accuracy and validity of the, so called, HIV test? :)

>Seroconversion......... a part of the immune response.
>People develop antibodies to HIV, when they "seroconvert"
>from antibody-negative to antibody-positive.

That's the crux of the argument.  Are the antibodies identified by
the, so called, HIV test the immune system's response to a virus which
causes AIDS?  I do not believe they are.

>> Your previous analogy suggests my personal experience is of no worth,

>You have mis-under-stood completely.
>I allow much weight to your comments.
>
>I just can't let you speak to the millions
>from just personal experience.

That's a fair point.  However, few would argue there isn't an
abundance of people and publicity pushing the HIV=AIDS=Death (HIV
causes AIDS, which leads to premature death) line.  I'm just one
person, speaking from personal experience, giving an alternative
viewpoint.

I'm incredibly careful about identifying quoted material and my own
comments, and always provide links to documents I quote from.

Unfortunately the checks and balances have disappeared from this
newsgroup.  Most of those who were here previously to keep people like
me in our boxes have gone.  Do you think it was something I said?

>Recall that I said, hiv is no killer.
>There is more at work than hiv.
>Now we came full circle to what I do say........
>hiv plus and oi equates to aids, and that kills.

I suspect the new 'back to basics' approach to the HIVAIDS problem
will begin dismantling the link between HIV and AIDS.  I believe HIV,
and in particular the 'HIV test,' will be redefined as an indicator
that someone will develop AIDS, rather than the cause of the
condition.
Signature

<http://www.hiv-poz.co.uk/>
Moible: +447804573139
4,847 days and counting...

Death - 22 Apr 2008 00:25 GMT
"Martin" <martin@hiv-poz.co.uk>

>  "Death" <Death@yourdoor.net>
>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> particular antibodies demonstrates the absence of HIV?  Or do you
> question the accuracy and validity of the, so called, HIV test? :)

Antibodies are proteins which are produced by the immune system
to defend against antigens, or foreign substances, entering the body
such as viruses. Someone who has been in contact with HIV will
produce antibodies specific to the disease. One problem with antibody
tests is that a person may be HIV positive but antibody tests are
only able to detect the virus about 22 days after infection.

This means the virus may be passed on before the patient is aware
they have the disease. Another problem is that some infections such as
the flu, malaria or herpes may have similar antigens to HIV and so may be
diagnosed as having the virus when, in fact, they do not.

Antigen tests are not used for general diagnostic purposes as they
only work for a certain period after infection. They are used to detect
the p24 protein which is a major component of the HIV virus.

Your word solely is strange at best.

>>Seroconversion......... a part of the immune response.
>>People develop antibodies to HIV, when they "seroconvert"
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> the, so called, HIV test the immune system's response to a virus which
> causes AIDS?  I do not believe they are.

see above, I covered that not expecting you to ask about aids.

>>> Your previous analogy suggests my personal experience is of no worth,
>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> person, speaking from personal experience, giving an alternative
> viewpoint.

.......and I enjoy your comments.
Your humor is almost as dry as my own.

> I'm incredibly careful about identifying quoted material and my own
> comments, and always provide links to documents I quote from.
>
> Unfortunately the checks and balances have disappeared from this
> newsgroup.  Most of those who were here previously to keep people like
> me in our boxes have gone.  Do you think it was something I said?

No, many of those people have posted here for years.
Some were qualitified in the field of hiv research, some
are like me and you, dumb f.cks just trying to make
some sense of the bullshit being fed.

I see David Canzi popped in for a quickie.
I read his article but didn't post a reply.

>>Recall that I said, hiv is no killer.
>>There is more at work than hiv.
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> that someone will develop AIDS, rather than the cause of the
> condition.

now, there is something I agree with as my statement above shows.
I used the word equates, not causes.
I too pick my words carefully.................
 
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