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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / AIDS / April 2004Some of You May Be Interested to Know...
"Horus and Seth contended for the throne of Egypt for many years, their antagonism culminating in Seth undertaking a homosexual assault on Horus, who later tore off Seth's testicles. The former unpleasant episode relates to the concept of poisonous semen, which was a recurring feature in the supernatural causation of disease in ancient Egypt (see Westendorf, 1992). The Egyptian word metut means both semen and poison, in each case with a phallus as biliteral phonetic for m+t, and a second (discharging) phallus as a determinative. This double meaning accords with the act of the malign incubus who could inseminate and thereby poison a sleeping victim." John F. Nunn, Ancient Egyptian Medicine, p. 98 ** Those who have been paying attention will of course know already of the theory that the immunosuppressive effects of semen may play a role in the development of AIDS, which makes the above really fascinating, don't you think? I don't say it proves anything, but it does put modern theories about the possible dangers of semen in an interesting light. So true. Sex kills people which is why there are no human beings on Earth.....or is it because they all walked over the edge....or was it that fire breathing dragon? Let me think about it. In article <715392fbb5e1412e4ff9bac79565a0b5@localhost.talkabouthealthnetwork.com>, > So true. Sex kills people which is why there are no human beings on > Earth.....or is it because they all walked over the edge....or was it that > fire breathing dragon? > > Let me think about it. The only point I was making was that theories about semen as a cause of disease go back a very long way. It's historically and psychologically very interesting, and certainly something to keep in mind when one reads about how semen is immunosuppressive and so on. Do you, incidentally, take that seriously at all? The Perth Group do. > The only point I was making was that theories about semen as a cause of > disease go back a very long way. It's historically and psychologically > very interesting, And do you have any cites from a peer-reviewed publication regarding links to myths, legends, folklore and reality? B/ > > The only point I was making was that theories about semen as a cause of > > disease go back a very long way. It's historically and psychologically [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > B/ I'm not sure what you're trying to say. >> > The only point I was making was that theories about semen as a cause of >> > disease go back a very long way. It's historically and psychologically [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >I'm not sure what you're trying to say. You need to spell out clearly what conclusion you think follows from your comments, or people will make erroneous assumptions about what you're trying to prove.  SignatureDavid Canzi "Efforts to make it more difficult for users to set envelope return path and header "From" fields to point to valid addresses other than their own are largely misguided." -- RFC2822 > > > The only point I was making was that theories about semen as a cause of > > > disease go back a very long way. It's historically and psychologically > > > very interesting, > > > > And do you have any cites from a peer-reviewed publication regarding > > links to myths, legends, folklore and reality? > I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Lemme try it again. Can you produce any cites from a peer-reviewed publication that links myths, legands, and folklore to the real world? B/ Followup to myself: That is, we know about the link from the folk medicine use of foxglove and heart disease is one example. Willow bark and aspirin. George Bush and willful stupidity. Can you produce a verified link from "poison sperm" myths and folklore to reality? B/ > Followup to myself: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > B/ No, I wasn't trying to. I merely thought it was interesting, in view of the discussion among AIDS dissidents about the immunosuppressive effects of semen and its possible role in AIDS, that there is a long history of superstitious beliefs about the nature of semen and its role in disease. The psychoanalyst Casper Schmidt in his article on the Group-Fantasy Origins of AIDS (first published in the Journal of Psychohistory, Summer 1984, and reprinted in John Lauritsen and Ian Young's book 'The AIDS Cult') does not mention the ancient Egyptian myth, which is a particularly interesting one since it has a homosexual context, but does mention several others: 'In epidemics of "Dhat syndrome" in India and South East Asia, men's semen became spoiled through their being libertines, and this spoiled semen (fantasy of poison sperm) had to be countered by celibacy and other restrictions on sexual activity." p. 17 of 'The AIDS Cult.' 'A third group of etiological ideas are fantasies of poison sperm: John of Gaddesden warns that a man who sleeps with a woman who has previously had intercourse with a leper will still contract the disease. Bernard Gordon adds that the man will become leprous only if the woman still retains the seminal fluid of the leper.' p. 31 of 'The AIDS Cult.' Schmidt does mention theories about immunosuppressive semen (p. 32), but sneers at them as "sophisticated." He does not discuss the evidence for the possible role of semen in AIDS, which might show that the 'fantasy' actually corresponded, even to a limited extent, with reality. It seems to be axiomatic for Schmidt that anything that shows semen in a bad light must be wrong (he was gay, incidentally). If one took Schmidt seriously about bad semen being only a fantasy, his views should be more effective as a criticism of some of the dissident theories than they are against HIV (which I mention only in the interests of fairness, since I am generally sympathetic to the dissidents). The Perth Group do discuss the evidence about immunosuppressive semen, which is problematic for some of their gay followers (http://www.virusmyth.net/aids/data/fcanal.htm). snip... >The psychoanalyst Casper Schmidt in his article on the Group-Fantasy >Origins of AIDS (first published in the Journal of Psychohistory, Summer >1984, and reprinted in John Lauritsen and Ian Young's book 'The AIDS >Cult') does not mention the ancient Egyptian myth, which is a >particularly interesting one since it has a homosexual context, but does >mention several others: Casper was a psychiatrist. Neat guy. Died of AIDS, unfortunately, years ago. From Namibia, did you know? The sperm as immune suppressive was better articulated by Robert Root-Bernstein. I think there may be some small contribution in terms of facilitating transmission of HIV to this aspect of sperm. But otherwise, I don't think it's really much of a contributor. This kind of went with the notion that the only people that got AIDS had had LOTS and LOTS of sex, thousands of men. Indeed, many such guys in the 80s died, but it is little wonder since such a high exposure will result in pretty much guaranteed infection. By contrast, many individuals with far more limited sexual activity develop AIDS when infected with HIV (but not otherwise). George M. Carter > snip... > > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Casper was a psychiatrist. Neat guy. Died of AIDS, unfortunately, > years ago. From Namibia, did you know? Schmidt was a psychoanalyst. That's what it says in the book. As for his being from Namibia, why do I get the idea that you're only telling me that so that you can show you know it? Kind of weird. > The sperm as immune suppressive was better articulated by Robert > Root-Bernstein. I think there may be some small contribution in terms > of facilitating transmission of HIV to this aspect of sperm. But > otherwise, I don't think it's really much of a contributor. This kind > of went with the notion that the only people that got AIDS had had > LOTS and LOTS of sex, thousands of men. I don't know who had that notion. Most of us have heard of hemophiliacs and drug users. They're not necessarily that promiscuous. > Indeed, many such guys in the > 80s died, but it is little wonder since such a high exposure will [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > George M. Carter They're the ones who get stuffed full of AZT and god knows what else. >> snip... >> Casper was a psychiatrist. Neat guy. Died of AIDS, unfortunately, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >being from Namibia, why do I get the idea that you're only telling me >that so that you can show you know it? Kind of weird. Just sharing. >> The sperm as immune suppressive was better articulated by Robert >> Root-Bernstein. I think there may be some small contribution in terms [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >I don't know who had that notion. Most of us have heard of hemophiliacs >and drug users. They're not necessarily that promiscuous. Nor are gay men necessarily that promiscuous. >> Indeed, many such guys in the >> 80s died, but it is little wonder since such a high exposure will >> result in pretty much guaranteed infection. By contrast, many >> individuals with far more limited sexual activity develop AIDS when >> infected with HIV (but not otherwise). >They're the ones who get stuffed full of AZT and god knows what else. Currently, people get "stuffed" with a lot of drugs. Instead of dying immediately as such a theory as "AZT causes AIDS" might predict, most improve dramatically. CD4 counts INCREASE. Side effects? Yes. Toxicities? Yes. For the majority of people that DON'T have access to ARV, the outcome is grim. Another brain dead theory of what causes AIDS that has no support whatsoever. Indeed, AZT CAN cause some blood dyscrasias. Persistent decline in CD4 count to zero, however, is not one of them. George M. Carter |
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